shotover

The published guidelines in the media reports do not seem to make the following situations clear, at least to me:

1. Will visitors from these 41 countries be permitted to enter Thailand more than 3 times annually on valid tourist visas obtained from Thai embassies/consulates outside Thailand?

2. Will visitors based in nearby countries (Singapore, HK, KL, etc>) who make frequent, short visits to Thailand be permitted to enter Thailand without visas for, say 7 days each month (84 total days stayed in a 12 month period)?

People that complain Immigration is messed up need not look any further than this bozo to find a cause.

Agree wholeheartedly with this conclusion, and with Sunbelt's early reading that the media frenzy about John Karr could be a prime reason for this discussion.

Out of curiousity, did anyone see definetively whether Karr was staying (and occasionally working) in Thailand on a valid visa (with or without a valid work permit), or simply making 30 day border runs?

Thanks Lopburi, I'll just fill out the TM7 form at Suan Phlu, and get a certified bank letter from my local branch.

I would have thought Immigration would not be concerned about bank balances if the income requirement is met through pension requirements.

The TM.7 form, pinned in this forum, prints out as a 3 page form on my printer.

1. Should the completed TM.7 form be printed front and back on a sheet of paper (double sided) prior to being submitted, or is it ok to submit it as a 3 page (single side) document, when applying for extension of stay based on retirement?

2. If your pension income, as certified by your embassy, is more than sufficient to meet the income requirements, do Suan Phlu Immigration officials still request a bank letter certifying the balance in your Thai bank account?

Appreciate any input, and will post my experiences when I renew my retirment visa.

Thanks

The last few times I took a taxi at from the arrival terminal at Don Muang, a security guard walked to the driver's window, had a short conversation, and handed the driver a form from a notebook.

Never saw money exchange hands, looked almost like it was a citation, but the drivers didn't seem plussed.

7-11s and minimarts like receiving small coins as they often have shortages, and don't mind counting them out late night / early morning when they are least busy.

My ex GF always hoarded all the coins either of us brought home, and got a kick of taking them to the neighborhood 7-11 for redemption.

I also have over 20 entry stamps to Thailand, and have been questioned twice by US Customs officers in my approximately 12 returns to the USA during the past 5 years. Both times the Customs officers' questions focused on drugs (I'm a normal looking guy in my 50s).

However, with media analysts annointing Thailand as the 'child sex capital' of the world in response to John Karr's arrest, the narrow-minded US Dept of Homeland Security will no doubt react accordingly, and presume all male visitors to Thailand are sex tourists and pedos.

Received the same notice myself several years ago. When questioned, they expounded on why they stamped it and it meant:

"Never darken this embassy door again, looking for a tourist visa!"

Yep. Nothing new. I got one from them in 1997.

So, do you get a non-Imm visa, or just visit other countries to get new tourist visas?

If the latter, wouldn't you think they would apply the same standards to providing new tourist visas regardless of which embassy/consulate provided them?

Did you ever try going back to the embassy who stamped the 'Con't come here again' warning?

The timeline in the following article indicates Karr spent nearly 6 months in jail on the porn charges.

http://cbs5.com/national/local_story_230184011.html

2001

_ January-March: Karr worked in four different school districts throughout Sonoma County, Calif., between January and March 2001.

_ April 13: Karr was arrested on five misdemeanor counts of possession of child pornography, the Sonoma County sheriff's office said.

_ April 17: Karr pleaded not guilty to the charges, according to court documents.

_ April: The Sonoma County School District where Karr sometimes substitute-taught received a letter from the county superintendent of education to say Karr had been taken off the list of acceptable substitutes, after the Sonoma sheriff's office notified school officials he had been arrested.

_ April 19: Karr's wife filed for divorce.

_ Oct. 5: After a series of court hearings, Karr was released from jail, but was ordered to report to a probation officer and avoid child pornography, children and places where children congregate, such as schools, beaches and parks. The court records in the case were sealed.

_ November: A judge issued a restraining order, compelling Karr to stay 100 yards away from his wife and three children for three years.

_ December: A warrant was issued for Karr's arrest after authorities said he violated the terms of his supervised release.

the sfgate article is inaccurate in several places including that Karr was being held in BKK on sex charges.

again ... Google will take you to YahooNews and ContraCosta etc etc etc etc stating he was convicted in absentia

Partial correction on my part. A google news search revealed 26 articles stating Karr was 'convicted in absentia' for child porn possession charges in California.

However, numerous other articles say he was charged, never tried nor convicted, and, at the Sonoma DA's option, would be brought back to California to be TRIED for these charges.

For example, per http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/15297434.htm

". . . Karr, a substitute teacher in four Sonoma County school districts between January and April 2001, was arrested and charged with five misdemeanor counts of possession of child pornography in Sonoma County in April 2001. He failed to show up for a court appearance in December 2001 and a warrant was issued for his arrest. The pornography charges are still pending.

Karr was initially jailed in April 2001 in Sonoma County in lieu of $100,000 bail but was released on Oct. 5, 2001. He violated the terms of that release and a warrant was issued for his arrest on Dec. 13, 2001."

Surprise, conflicting media reports! Maybe an attorney can explain how a person convicted in absentia would later be tried after being apprehended, or maybe there are other facts we don't understand.

Time will tell.

Show me where it is written that Mr. Karr was convicted of any crime, either in California, or anywhere in the world.

I think he was CHARGED, not convicted.

Again, we are presuming his guilt.

My understanding is that he was out on bail, and failed to show for his trial. You can convict someone in absentia? Perhaps, but again, where is it written that he was?

Also, again, these were not serious legal charges under the law, and he will not be doing serious time. I do hope he gets a judge who orders him to get psychiatric help. Along with the wealth advisor.

According to the Denver Post, Karr was arrested in 2001 in California for five counts of child pornography, said Sgt. Rob Giordano, spokesman for the Sonoma County Sheriff's Department. When he finally was released on bond, he disappeared and was convicted in absentia. California state records show a John Mark Karr lost his teaching credential in 2002.

http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,645193760,00.html

Or you could go back to the original stories posted here .....

or just google ....

But yes he jumped/skipped bond and was CONVICTED.

edit to use proper terminology and time/frame

The above news link stating Karr 'was convicted in absentia' is the only news source I've seen stating he was convicted. Many other sources I've seen, including the following quoting the same police Sgt. above, clearly state he was arrested, but NOT tried and therefore not convicted of the child porn possession charge. TV news legal analysts are stating California can request Karr be extradited back to California to stand trial for the misdemeanor child porn possession charges, thereby clearly indicating he has not YET been convicted.

". . . Karr was arrested in April 2001 in Sonoma County and charged with five counts of possession of child pornography, but he fled the county before he could be prosecuted, said Sgt. Robert Giordano of the Sonoma County Sheriff's Department.. . . "

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?...MNGR6KK6FL1.DTL

"Karr is wanted in Sonoma County on an arrest warrant after he was charged with five counts of possessing child pornography in 2001, but fled. Sonoma County Dist. Atty. Stephan Passalacqua said in a statement this afternoon: "We filed this case against Mr. Karr in 2001 and the same merits in proceeding with the case then still exist today." "

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/na...-home-headlines

If Karr had been convicted of the porn possession charges, there would be no need for a trial in California.

I'm not stating law enforcement should not be concerned about Karr given his sick obsession. However, after the fiasco by the Boulder DA office, do we have to keep being reminded that arrest warrants do not equate to formal charges, or convictions?

Hi Twin,

I'm in a similar situation with slightly different dates. My current retirement visa expiration date is September 21 2006, and my passport expiration date is June 30, 2007.

I'm returning to Thailand early morning September 8, and plan to go to Suan Phlu that morning (assuming I'm lucid) with my documentation for a visa extension. Assuming Thai immigration approves the retirement visa extension, I'll then apply for a new passport at the USA embassy.

Another person previously related to me the same process Higgy described, that you can return to Thai Immigration with the new passport, and they will stamp you in for the full year from the original date of extension application. The only problem it sounds too logical for Thai Immigration officials to follow, based on my prior experiences with them.

If I run into problems, no big deal, as I rarely stay in Thailand more than 60 days straight without leaving the country, and can easily suffice with tourist visas, though I prefer the non-Imm O visa.

I'll also relate my experience here, and probably personally to, you in a couple of weeks.

Desperately missing my humble abode in Bangkok; no weeds to pull. grass to mow. neurotic family members, and ignorant neighbors quizzing me about John Karr and pedophiles in Thailand!

. . . I am glad to answer any serious question regarding the Por Teck Tueng, or engage in a civil discussion. If no more is coming forward, i safe myself and everybody else the trouble and stay away for a while.

I hope you consider these as serious questions as intended.

1. Are farangs permitted to participate as paid or unpaid volunteers in either of the 2 primary rescue groups discussed in this thread?

2. Does each team (a group assigned to an individual truck) normally have at least one well-trained medical emergency volunteer?

Not meant to judge, but simply curious.

. . . Fights over corpses do not happen anymore in Bangkok since about 15 years, when the authorities and the two main rival organisations have sorted out territories and shifts. Nowadays Por Teck Tueng and Ruamkatanyu work on alternating days.

Things aren't perfect, of course. There are at times territorial fights happening. But one has to understand that the volonteers of the foundation have to have a certain amount of respect on the streets. These volonteers do have to pull dead and injured from the roughest neighborhoods in town, if people there don't fear them, their work cannot be performed because of the danger of being attacked by the gangs.

I don't understand how just 'respect' serves as a basis for these charitable organizations to fight each other for 'territory'. It seems that fighting over territory would cause them to lose much more respect than working together for the benefit of the neighborhoods.

Are these 2 organizations only supported by donations?

Do they ever request compensation from victims or their families?

I have no idea, so that's why I am asking. Money seems to be a much more logical reason for territorial disputes than respect.

Wonder why the author of the 1st article did not include the largest group of foreigners in Thai prisons, Nigerians and other western Africans who operate extensive drug rings.

I know local criminal gangs were not in the scope of the original article, but few foreign criminal groups can operate without the cooperation of the extensive Thai mafia (often the police and military).

I would think South American car burglary and theft gangs hardly rank a mention with European, African, Middle East, South Asian, Chinese, and Japanese criminal activities.

Maybe the guy was a good teacher?

Was he qualified?

I would like to see the visa amount substantially increased for those acquiring one year visas, a termination of the visa runs and government agencies established for those wishing to apply to stay in the Kingdom short term maybe excluding those on holiday.

I wouldn't.

Karr was qualified to teach at schools in Alabama and California, and also qualified to marry a 14 year old girl (when he was 19) and later impregnated a 16 year old girl when he was 25.

Have to congratulate the media from showing restraint at what a 'pedophile sex haven' the USA is.

BTW, I'm American. The hypocrisy and sensationalism is sickening.

This is what America thinks of Farangs living in Bangkok.

August 18, 2006 -- In his last days of freedom before his stunning admission that he drugged, raped and killed JonBenet Ramsey, John Mark Karr was shacked up at a seedy flophouse

can you name and shame the producer of this garbage, please?

ts from todays New York Post

That's August 18 2006

SEX SICKO'S SEEDY LIFE ON

THE RUN IN FOREIGN SLEAZE

DENS

By ANDREW DRUMMOND in Bangkok, JOANNE CLEMENTS in Petaluma, Calif., and LUKAS I. ALPERT in New York

I have met Mr. Drummond in Bkk. He has lived in Thailand for many years and should know better than to have his name associated with the sensationalist and inaccurate garbage written in this article. His contributions to the article may have been fair and accurate, but the article contained much false observations.

This is what America thinks of Farangs living in Bangkok.

August 18, 2006 -- In his last days of freedom before his stunning admission that he drugged, raped and killed JonBenet Ramsey, John Mark Karr was shacked up at a seedy flophouse in a rundown section of Bangkok popular with the lowest class of sex tourists.

Tipped off to his presence by Colorado officials, Thai investigators tailed the clean-cut Karr for weeks as he frequented the city's sleaziest sex emporiums - well known for nud_e girls who wear nothing but cowboy hats, dance bottomless atop glass floors, and put on lesbian shows.

Karr, a former used-car salesman who had two child brides, lived in a spare, ninth-floor room at the Blooms Hotel, a dingy establishment that rents rooms for as short a time as three hours - for only $8 - and offers monthly stays that start at a rate of $170.

Absolute crap reporting. This area, near the Malaysia Hotel, was known as a backpacker and drug user haven in the 1970s, but is now a normal Thai neighborhood with a number of farangs living there for the reasonable rents and access to the MRT.

Westerners used to western style housing might consider these apartments a 'seedy flophouse', but these apartments are on a par with many farang apartments in the Phrakanong, OnNut, BangNa, etc. areas.

Every reporter writing this crap about Thailand should be pulled by their ears to this area, and made to verify their junk.

Regarding Karr going to 'sleazy sex emporiums' the receptionist working at his apartment said he almost never went outside after 6 pm, per an interview just shown on CNN.

He was convicted in California of kiddie porn charges in absentia (he skipped out on bail) ... he'll be sent to Cali to serve out his time. They could charge him with extra crimes beyond fleeing prosecution etc etc ... So no matter what happens in Colorado this guy is screwed.

Maybe just a technicality, but a legal analyst on Court TV in the US stated his records indicated he had been charged with the child porn possession counts, but a trial and conviction on these charges never occurred due to his not appearing in court for the scheduled hearings. Failure to appear in court charges were added to the possession of child porn charges after he failed to appear for the hearing.

Hey Shotover, good to see you! . . . Anyway, I have a feeling that this guy is not the murderer. Yes, he looks the part, but something just does not seem right about the whole thing and his story . . .

And I also find it strange that after all this time, they finally find the suspect in Bangkok. A pedophile - in Thailand of all places? What a surprise! Just too convienient a story , if you ask me -

Hey Narachon, good to hear from you. I'm just now beginning to recover from all those chilled vodka shots we 'tested' at least a year ago at the TV party.

Agree with the huge holes appearing in the murder case several parties are trying to build against what seems to be a delusional mental case. Amazing how quickly the press condemned Karr for the little girl's murder AND Thailand for being a 'pedo's paradise'. The first one will fall through (though he will be jailed for skipping his court appearances on the child porn possession charges), but the stain on Thailand's reputation will deepen.

The Ramsey's attorney was quoted just after the arrest that there was a DNA match to Karr, and that Karr provided details that only the killer would know. He's since recinded the DNA match claim (specimens haven't yet been compared), and the few details provided by Karr in his 'confession' seem to contradict forensic evidence. Not to mention there is growing evidence that he was in Alabama during the time of the murder.

It's possible that he has dug himself so deeply into the fantasy that he actually believes he was with JonBenet when she 'accidentally' died from being garotted in the neck and bashed violently in the head with a blunt object.

Also legal questions with the USA Dept of Homeland Security presenting the Thai govt. with an arrest warrant charging Karr with murder, kidnapping and sexual assault, and the Boulder DA today saying in a news conference there are currently no charges for these acts against Karr.

I fully understand the need to have Karr arrested and sent back to the US to prevent him from teaching at a Thai elementary school. However, I would think that could have been accomplished by simply providing Thai authorities with evidence of his child porn possession charges and failure to make court appearances. Certainly this would be enough for the Thais to cancel his visa and allow US authorities to take him back to the US.

http://www.job4teacher.com/Candidates/JohnKarr.html

Here is his resume and I know I saw this back when I was hiring

teachers. Even made a comment then that I thought it was a bit odd:

This link no longer works. Did anyone save the link or copy the resume info, and if so, can post it here?

tomchamm,

"The former California school teacher has admitted to killing 6-year-old Ramsey..."

There goes your argument that he's innocent...

There have already been numerous people who confessed to this killing. At this point he's just another one. Innocent people confess to murders all the time; especially high profile cases.

Good point LDB. A strange thing about his confession is that the Thai Immigration Police General quotes Karr as confessing that he "he picked JonBenet up at her school and brought her to the family’s basement". Not consistent with the facts known about the case, as the murder occurred Christmas night (school holidays during this period).

Maybe a translation mistake, Thai police embellishment, or Karr's fantasy trip.

Police said Karr had been living in a dormitory-style hotel called The Blooms in a neighborhood of massage parlors and travel agents that cater to expatriate residents and sex tourists. The nine-story hotel offers rooms for as short as three-hour rentals.

anyone ever heard of this place? is it in kao sahn?

ThaiSpy and Taxout seem to have identified the correct hotel. I'm not that familiar with the neighborhood around the Blooms and Malaysia hotel, other than what I've read in travel books. The Malaysia Hotel formerly had a reputation as being popular for budget travelers, drug users, and gays, but that was years ago. This area preceded Khao San Road as a backpacker destination. No idea who stays there now.

Curious as to whether the neighborhood description of "massage parlors and travel agents that cater to expatriate residents and sex tourists" is currently accurate, or the sensationalism of naive journalists. I suspect the latter. This description was in an AP article written by Sutin Wannabovern.

I met a guy the other day who was 'sponsoring' a girl aged 12 to go through school/uni. with the purpose of marrying her in a few years time.

This, he said was quite common where he comes from - Roi Et.

It is called เลี้ยงต้อย líang-dtoi.

He is about 35 years old and has a wife already.

Any comments? Does anyone know if this is common in Thaiand?

How is it viewed by other Thais?

Just to clarify: Your post indicates the guy is Thai, not farang?

I think Thai people would certainly disapprove if a farang tried this. Cultures and practices vary throughout the world. What is practiced and accepted in rural Roi Et may seem very different to urban Thais. or westerners.

Astral's and Lopburi's comments are consistent with what Suan Phlu Immigration officials told me when I requested letter of residence.

Basically, if I am away from my rented condo for more than 24 hours, the building manager or juristic person is required to notify Immigration of my return. The juristic person at my condo building laughed when I informed him of this requirement, as he stated he has no idea when the foreign tenants take short trips or not.

You can understand Thai Immigration authorities wanting to keep tabs on the location of foreigners, but it's not very practical for apartment/condo managers to keep up with the comings and goings of customers who rent on a monthly basis.