thaibeachlovers

how does anyone have the energy to *hate* a shopping mall? <deleted> is wrong with you people???

Haters, thats what they are. They hate everything.

We don't "hate" everything. We love Pattaya the way it used to be, should be. We just hate crappy big malls that get built over nice bar complexes. Why don't all you people who like to buy expensive shirts move to expensive horrible places like Hua Hin. They have a big new mall there. You'll feel right at home.

Yeah, you just could not beat the lovely toilets in those "nice bar complexes"

Never had a problem myself, but then I don't go to Pattaya for the loos!

Incidentally, at least they have toilets, something that is becoming hard to find in London, a supposed "first world" city. More like a sick joke. I'd rather live in Thailand. Unfortunately there is the problem of those pesky employment restrictions.

am sure pattaya will be fine,the council want to make it more family friendly so maybe over time the beer bars between beach road and second road may be made to go and push back towards third road,leave walkin st. alone probably.but in my opinion these go go bars and bear bars should have better licencing hours and in return should be made to upgrade their facilities so that they do not remain a "hole in the wall"

I see from your username that you come from the once attractive and pleasant, but become a right sh** ho** island, completely destroyed by greedy ignorant developers and covered in expensive ugly concrete. if that's what you want for Pattaya, please think again. For the umpteenth time, we don't want families in Pattaya, they're bad for business.

The only thing that needs to happen to the bars is less regulation.

how does anyone have the energy to *hate* a shopping mall? <deleted> is wrong with you people???

Haters, thats what they are. They hate everything.

We don't "hate" everything. We love Pattaya the way it used to be, should be. We just hate crappy big malls that get built over nice bar complexes. Why don't all you people who like to buy expensive shirts move to expensive horrible places like Hua Hin. They have a big new mall there. You'll feel right at home.

To anyone who couldn't be bothered to trawl through that lot..... William is a backpacker with more money than most.

Regards.

Great synopsis. Thank you. I started to read William's post, got overwhelmed with information and thankfully found yours.

I don't mind backpackers, but wish they would

1. Bathe--Thai people are very hygienic. Backpackers with 3-4 days beard stubble, unwashed clothes, etc. are not going to endear them to the Thai people no matter how much money they spend.

2. Stop trying to dress like hippies. The '60's are over. Get over it.

cant say i can be assed to shave on the weekend, much less daily when i am in my house at the beach.

as for backpackers stinking, after a ride from bangkok to surat in a bus, van, or a train, or any other longish haul surface travel destination without a shower in sight, a bit of a pong is to be expected. not to mention the stench of fear clinging to anyone who sat up front and could watch the road on a bus trip, especially an overnighter.

as for those that dress like hippies (they may well actually be hippies), they are on the decline.

many backpackers travel light, discard clothing rather than cart it around from place to place, and purchase what is cheap and available when and as they need it. they are limited to what is availble, and all too frequently the choices are limited.

i can say that conversations i have with backpackers (travellers seems a more appropriate term) are generally quite cliche and uninspiring, but i understand what they are doing and often wish i could do it all again myself.

but for my responsibilties i would leave tomorrow, but i would stay in much nicer places this time.

i am muntered, so i will cease all posting here.

I would disagree most strongly about calling them travellers! IMO a traveller is one who seeks out new and less visited places to experience, while a backpacker is just a tourist with a bag on their back instead of a suitcase. I rarely see bagpackers out looking at places away from the flock, and they seem to mainly inhabit restaurants in bagpacker ghettos, sucking on a beer and watching B movies on TV. The highlight of their visit to Thailand would appear to be the FMP and seeing how many buckets they can swill.

Travellers, NOT.

Hmmmm, can't really speak for the situation in Thailand, but I would imagine causes of current problems are similar to those in the UK, namely, excessive use of debt to buy non essentials, and the housing bubble which has finally burst. I'm not even going to try and get into the banking fiasco, and the future impoverishment of the taxpayer to save the criminals from the consequences of their greed.

However, it is worth remembering that so far less than 1% of all workers in the UK have lost their jobs ( though that may increase by a % or 2 ). That means that 99% are still earning and spending. The biggest apparent ( to me ) effects are that anything to do with building has decreased, and that overpriced accomodation is not selling. Cars too, are not selling, though that may be as much to do with the fact that the new models are revolting, as with the credit crisis.

Actually, it all seems to be rather similar to what happened in Thailand in '97! Still see "skeleton" buildings around Bangkok!

Certainly it doesn't seem to have affected flying much, as the planes in early April are full, and the government still seems set on building another runway at heathrow.

Clothing stores in London are full of shoppers, teenagers still talk endlessly on mobiles, and there are plenty of drivers willing to pay the congestion charge to drive in central London.

If the Thai government is serious about making money, the exchange rate would be a good place to start. There must be many people put off visiting by the high baht. I myself have had to cancel my intended 6 month holiday there and carry on working to be able to afford a shortened holiday later in the year.

I know it is "just" a shopping mall but I truly believe yesterday was the biggest day in the history of modern Pattaya. It has crossed a bridge and there is no turning back. Not everyone is going to like what this really means in the long run.

Not necessarily, due to the recession. Although they could not have known when they started building it, they have opened at just the wrong time, and only those with deep pockets will survive.

In that event, a huge mall with lots of empty shops will only serve to emphasise that Pattaya is not the place to be building Bangkok style shopping centers. Jomptien would have been a much more suitable location, but there's no underestimating the stupidity ( and greed ) of developers.

The other thing in favour of those of us who love Pattaya as it is, is the traffic. If jams continue to be as bad as appears at present, it won't be long before those travelling from outside Pattaya will go to the other big places being opened elsewhere, like Sri Racha.

It is hard to understand the thinking behind opening a huge mall in it's present location, with all the traffic problems. It would only make sense if something like the rumoured elevated tram was actually going to be built, and there is no sign of that happening at present.

I'm presuming that the intention was to get customers from out of town, as ( IMO ) most Pattaya residents will do their main shopping in their usual places, especially if the prices in the new mall reflect what have to be high rents. Once the "thrill of the new" wears off, can't see locals fighting the traffic to pay higher prices for goods available cheaper elsewhere.

If for some strange reason, it does survive on local trade, it's going to be a disaster for the local small shopkeepers, who are already struggling to survive. Both of my trips in the last year have seen most shops bereft of customers.

I've got my fingers crossed for it to be a huge and expensive disaster. Long live "our" Pattaya!

I guess the big deal is that it is a Big Mall on a Beachfront????

With plenty of choices of restaurants AND cool airconditioning, unlike all the other shopping malls in Pattaya.

Wow, just like in the Royal Garden Mall!!!!!!

I am amazed that doesn't seem to be more traffic accidents with pedestrians in Pattaya

or do they happen but we don't hear about them?

When I was trying to cross second road last night the volume of traffic was unbelievable

and it would have to be just as busy if not more than some roads in Bangkok.

But the difference in Bangkok is that you know at periodic intervals the traffic will stop

and they have many pedestrian bridges and safe places to cross the road. Here in Pattaya the traffic

never seems to stop and drivers in Pattaya including farang drivers seem to

drive with much less care for pedestrians than in Bangkok

This is in a tourist based city.................. Something needs to be done

In a perfect world.......

Pattaya is a pretty good place to learn patience, as it's the only way to get across. Personally, I think that Chiang Mai, around the old wall was worse ( haven't been back for many years though, so it could have changed ).

As for a "tourist" city. I doubt that has any bearing on the minds of those at City Hall. Nothing they do seems to be for the benefit of tourists, eg. the beach walkway, which is a disgrace!

For myself, I hope the traffic and other problems get worse, as it's the only thing stopping Pattaya becoming a "family" destination, with extortionist prices. Just look at cr** ho** Hua Hin if you want to know what it could become.

re the visa renewal, would you please be able to tell me how much each extension is, is there a limit on the number of renewals and is it able to be done in Angeles?

Is there a better visa for staying a year or more?

Would I be able to live there for about the same cost as in Pattaya ( not including "entertainment")?

I have tried to find the answers on the 'net, but none of the websites I have found give very clear information.

Thanks for any info given.

The first renewal is P3,010. Subsequent renewals are more expensive but they can be done right at AC, no need to exit the country. Here is a link to PI Immigration http://immigration.gov.ph//index.php?optio...8&Itemid=43

Spending is subjective, one guy thinks AC is cheaper than Pattaya, the next insists that Pattaya is the better deal (and flame the hel_l out of any one daring to disagree, LOL!)

FYI, when I have a question, I simply "Google" the question and I've gotten some great info that way.

Good luck

To you and Maxjay, thanks for the replies

You get the visa and make the first entry getting 60 days you extend that 30 days at immigration (1900 baht). Then watching the use by date of visa (do entry the day before) leave and re-enter and do the 60 + 30 again.

Is it possible to extend the 60 day visa the day after arrival, or do you have to wait till near the end of the 60 days? Thanks.

What's the problem with the Russians? The Russian women on WS are, in the main, lookers, and dress to please.

We could do with a lot of them in boring ol' London, where most women wear trousers, and you're lucky to see a bit of leg.

Nice report MJD I live in Thailand but for the past three years I've been spending a couple of months per year in the Philippines, mostly in Angeles City (AC.) In addition to your good info my small contribution is:

1. According to XE currency, the USD/ Philippine Piso exchange rate is 47 pisos = $1 USD.

2. Budget hotels are in shorter supply than Pattaya but I stay in a Peremiter area hotel for around P 800 a night. Discounts are availble for stays of a week or longer. (Peremiter is the opposite way from Fields Avenue, the "Walking Street" of AC)

3. I have a three year old Buddy Sim that I laod up every time I return to the Phils and its always worked, even after an absence of 11 months

4. In AC I don't eat off the street like I do in Thailand but restaurant food is avaible to suit most budgets.

5 Most Peremiter are bars were selling San Miguel Light beer for P50, thats just over $1 USD for a beer in an air conditioned Go Go bar

6. The Filipinos are polite and usually address strangers formally as "Please come inside Sir, Welcome Sir."

7. I've received so many complimentary beers from bar managers; they've made me feel welcome and they seem to appreciate my business. FWIW, the best managers always seem to be Australians (I'm American.)

8. The punters are predominately older guys that actually own shirts and sport very few tatoos. There are bad apples everwhere, but -so far- AC has not attracted some of the riff raff that seem to be increasingly flosking to Pattaya.

9. 21 day free visa exemption stamp at the airport. Its east to extend your time in country at Immigration. They work on a 59 day system, in that when your time is up, you extend for another 59 days, no need to leave the country on "visa runs"

Down Sides?

1. Relatively poor infastructure.

2. Free lancer underage scams involving the police

3. Much smaller than Pattaya

4. Only a handful of "open air bars" if thats your thing.

5 Most filipinas want to marry you and get the f*&^ out of the Philippines :D:D

re the visa renewal, would you please be able to tell me how much each extension is, is there a limit on the number of renewals and is it able to be done in Angeles?

Is there a better visa for staying a year or more?

Would I be able to live there for about the same cost as in Pattaya ( not including "entertainment")?

I have tried to find the answers on the 'net, but none of the websites I have found give very clear information.

Thanks for any info given.

Now that the £ has reached a low not seen since '96, but with everything at least twice the price of then, is it having an effect in reality, more so than the last 3 months? Are lots of retired UK expats packing to return home? It's certainly stuffed any hope I had of spending the next 6 months there, sob, sob.

Well, thanks for the replies.

Was reading another post about how much needed to live well, and as most were saying it takes at least 60,000 baht a month that really leaves me out of the game.

I have calculated that at current exchange rate ( and who knows how much further it will fall ) I can only afford 30,000 per month, which is enough to get by, but eliminates the main reason for going there.

So guess it'll be the holiday in April, and keep working!

Oh well ,as they say, "life's a bitch and then....."

Well as I posted earlier, I went and had cataract surgery at Pattaya Eye Center. It did not go very well. First the good; well equipped office, very clean, staff seems very well trained. No pain at all and very little discomfort.

Now the bad; I had discussed with the doc about corrective lens and using different lens in each eye to eliminate the need for reading glasses. I told I did not want any of that and would be happy to continue wearing reading glasses and needed distance vision the most. I thought we both agreed. After the surgery I mentioned I thought everything was blurry through that eye and he replied of course the new lens is just for reading. He acknowledged we had agreed differently but he thought it would be better for me to do it his way. It did not work. Almost a week later and the vision in that eye is getting worse. I went to see him and he claimed everything is fine. I asked why I still have poor vision, he offered explaination. So it is off to get a 2nd opinion. I hope to be able to wear glasses to correct this condition (the wrong implants). He did indicate it would possible. Right now both far and near vision from that eye is the same as before the surgery and getting worse. I was told I had a 60% loss due to the cataract. Good luck in whatever you do.

I asked a consultant about having different lenses, and she said that is an accepted procedure. I shall ask again ( if I remember ) after normal service resumes next year re your situation. However, I would assume it will take time for the brain to accomodate to the difference. Your brain has been working with 2 equal lenses all your life, and is now struggling to accept the difference. It does sound bad that the Dr is deciding to do different things to what you agreed. Best solution, as someone else said, is to put everything in writing before the operation.

I don't understand what you mean by 60% loss of vision due to cataract. If you have had the lens replaced, there should be no loss of vision due to lens opacity.

I did remember to speak with the consultant, and she says it can take up to 1 year to adjust. So hang in there!

I don't see a problem with trashing failed Thaksin programs. I do see a problem with promising customers a lifetime benefit and then taking it away. There really ought to be a lawsuit for members to recover the cost of the cards as the visa program was a huge portion of the benefit sold, for many, the only thing they were spending the money for. At one time I considered it, and the only reason I wanted it was the visa feature. I didn't really expect it to be honored for life, but that is what they at least implied. Thaksin may now be a wanted fugitive but at one time he represented the government of Thailand and put the reputation of the government of Thailand behind this card, even though it was administered by a private company (how convenient).

Hmmmm, reminds me of the time the New Zealand government brought in "lifetime" driving licences, only for a later government to change it to 10 year licences ( no refund there either ). Nothing any government does is for ever.

Thanks for the replies. Given that the hotel prices are not coming down, I guess that I won't be rushing over soon

To all who want to "improve" Pattaya, please get lost. Why don't you spend your time in a nice "up market" resort town like Hua Hin. I spent the worst 3 days ever there, once, before greatfully returning to Pattaya. Do you not realise that Hua Hin is basically an "improved" Pattaya, and why any sane person would want that is beyond me.

If the price of keeping Pattaya cheap and cheerful is a crappy walkway, and smelly beaches, it's OK by me.

If this has already been covered, apologies.

Now that high season has arrived, are there really the reduced numbers that they were expecting after the airport closure, or is it business as usual?

If the former, have the hotel prices come down, or is it the usual "less people, put prices up" idiocy?

As I'm still trying to decide whether to retire now or later, the information would be appreciated, thanks.

It's artifically inflated.

Tourists don't want to come here cause the exchange rate is <deleted>.

It seems all currencies and economies are being devastated but Thailand is still maintaining itself... somewhat.

Discuss.

The Baht is being supported against USD, it's not being supported against GBP because there is no need.

(GBP/THB is determined via USD/THB and the relationship of GBP to USD)

Tourists do seem to still want to come to Thailand, only those that can't seem to afford it any longer don't want to come and that may not altogether be a bad thing.

GBP/THB was 35 for a long time then fell in 1997 after the Asian crisis - maybe the currency is now returning to it's old levels.

Whatever the baht was before is irrelevant now in being able to afford a holiday in Thailand, or not. When I started going to Thailand, the rate was 45 to £, but everything was half the price in baht. So, allowing for the fact that my wages have gone up very little due to low inflation rate in UK over past 10 years, I'd be better off at a rate of 45 and 1990s prices, than I am at 51 with todays baht prices.

There has been much said concerning the effect of the change, but does anyone know the REAL reason for bringing the change in? I gather it was brought in unanounced just in time to catch many tourists diverted to other countries by the airport closure as they entered Thailand overland. The fact they went ahead at that time would indicate to me that there must either be some really important reason for it, or the officials concerned must be some of the most ignorant, useless bunch of morons on the face of the planet!

Hmmm, I have given this subject much thought since my first contribution, and I do not think that it is possible to say that Thais brains work differently from any other human beings. However, is possible to say that a lack of expectation generally, and a belief in a fatalistic religion have combined to produce the effect that we are so frustrated with.

It is true that there are ignorant Thais, just as there are ignorant people in every country, just as there are good, evil, indifferent, cunning, dedicated people.

In the end, IMO, it all comes down to programming.

While accepting that neither culture/ persons is/ are better/ worse than the other, I have to wonder about some specific things in Thailand. ie.

the acceptance of shoddy workmanship in the public areas ( the beach walkway is a prime example ).

not bothering to maintain the existing infrastructure.

the idea that in a depressed market it is good business practice to RAISE prices.

the belief that because you work as a "bar girl" you don't have to make any effort ( read between the lines).

The list goes on and on.

I know there are plenty bad things about western countries, but this is about Thailand.

Some time ago, I started a post that the idea of Pattaya being a World Class resort is a bad joke; but I seem to remember being put down for it. Glad to see some more evidence for my viewpoint.

And just what is the point of those farang TP volunteers anyway? I presume they have no power of arrest, and I never see them actually do anything other than sit around at the entrance to WS.

Some time ago you started another litany of pointless Pattaya bashing. Probably some responders with better things to do chose to point out that in Pattaya, it aint ever been all about, nor ever will it ever be all about farangs opinions.

But it depends if you see the OP as a topic starter about bad traffic management or an attempt to bash the police volunteers.

I opted for the former and responded in kind. However, you maybe think it's about someone's knickers showing about their TPV opinions. So I will chuck my tuppence in on that as well.

Maybe you haven't noticed that the TPV group at the end of WS are a mix of Thais and farangs... so maybe it's just farang TPV's you really can't understand.

If you take some time to stop and ask them what they do, they will tell you since you haven't seemed to accept the oft stated case that their primary task is liaison between visitors and police. If someone gets busted for something bad, they liaise and translate. If someone lost their wallet, they liaise and translate. When U-Tapao was being used as an alternate to Bangkoks airports recently, they were there to liaise and translate. When they assisted the Highway Patrol at Sukhumvit traffic stops... do you see a trend here?

Next you will be stirring up the 'do they have a WP' worriers and the the paramilitary jackboots and crewcuts haters.

My my. Super sensitive, aren't we!

Why would I indulge in Pattaya bashing when I love the place? I just can't stand it when people try to promote it as a "World class resort", which it is patently not, and which I would do my utmost to prevent, were it within my power to do so.

As for bashing the farang TPVs, it's all in the interpretation. I meant it as a genuine question, but you have interpreted it as a negative.

Bye the way, I know there are Thai TPVs, but I wasn't asking about them, so why do you bring them up?

As this forum is almost entirely farang opinions, I wonder why you make the comment that it's not about our opinions. Were farangs not to proffer opinions there wouldn't be much to read!

As you did not attack the other poster for his negative comment about Pattaya being a World class resort, I can only assume your tirade against me is personal, not that I care, as you're just a bunch of pixels.

I was out on one of my now infrequent sojourns to Walking Street last nite to check out how low the high-season was turning out to be. For the week between Christmas and New Years, things were pretty quiet. Lucifer's Disco and The Hammer complex were pretty empty. The seating area around the boxing show under Marine Disco, usually filled with groups of Asian tour groups had at most 6-10 people there. The male and female barkers seemed more desparate than usual to attract anyone into their establishments. The Pattaya Beer Garden was full and doing a nice trade, however.

There were some new and notable changes since my last time on the street a few months ago. A couple new discos (Insomnia and one I can't remember) have both opened right on Walking Street. Also, a new sports bar cum pool hall called Goodfellas has opened up in 2nd story space across from Marine Disco. This used to be a somewhat run-down "locals" pool hall before but has been remodeled into a fancy new place with Italian, American, and Thai food, lots of TVs, and pool tables.

Also, at the front entrance to Don Joe Italian restaruant a new cafe space has been opened featuring some of the most expensive coffee I have seen in Pattaya. A latte was B 130 and a plain ole coffee was B 70 or B 80. They have a fancy espresso machine but my experience has been the Thai staff working as baristas can't get the full benefit of these machines and the espresso/coffee is so-so. However, there is also a "Turkish Icecream" vendor there constantly kneeding his icecream (I guess there is something about Turkish icecream that requires this) and who does a really funny "show" when presenting you your cone. I will leave it up to you to order one or watch someone receive theirs.

Finally, I noticed that the chicken doner kabab lady with the cart at the beginning of soi Diamond and Walking Street has raised the price from B 60 to B 70! This, I think, is the highest price I have seen around town. Not long ago, they were only B 50, and can still be found for this price around town.

I hope that Goodfellas has removed the really loud soundsystem that they installed to advertise their opening! It was so loud that I had to vacate my possy at the Lucky Star, and went into withdrawal symptoms from not having my usual eyeful of WS cuties!