JimGant

Yes, great for frequent fliers. For us old folks, who never travel, explain how I update the requirement for a one year permission of stay stamp....without having to go to Imm?

I'm sure they'll screw that one up too. Finally, online 90 day reports are a snap. If they go back and rewrite the software to accommodate one-year reporting, that'll certainly crash the system. So, instead of a 30 second 90 day online reporting requirement -- I'll probably be back to driving to Imm to do a one year report, which will probably confuse the clerk. Sigh.

A visa is not a permission of stay. It's just documentation that allows you to enter Thailand and be considered by Immigration for a period of stay -- 60 days, 90 days, 365 days (one year), as long as that visa is valid. For a LTR visa, that means you have a five year period to enter Thailand as many times as you'd like, receiving a one-year permission of stay stamp each time. For frequent travelers, this is ideal -- never ever having to visit Imm as long as you leave Thailand before that one year stamp expires. Otherwise, yep, you have to visit Imm to get an "extension of stay" off of that expiring "permission of stay" -- just like you would off of an expiring "permission of stay" stamp from an OA visa. Difference here: OA visa gives you only a one year time frame to exit and reenter Thailand for another one-year stay -- while the LTR visa gives you five years (with a renewable five year option). So, not as tidy as one might think -- I've got to go to Imm once a year now to renew my "permission of stay" (with an "extension of stay") off of my OA visa -- euphemistically a so-called "visa extension." But if my desire is to never see Imm again, an LTR visa (and Elite Visa) leave me in the same situation I'm in now, namely, must visit Imm once a year. So, what's the advantage, particularly after all the additional cost...?

Indeed. And it sounds like all must go to Bangkok (One Stop Service?) to get your LTR sticker visa. Then, you need your "permission of stay" stamp, which only comes from Immigration. And, "permission of stay" stamps only come in one flavor -- for ONE year (not five, meaning, a visit to Imm every year to get your new ONE year permission of stay stamp). What facility, then, would a LTR visa afford me, over my current "must visit Imm every year" for a one year stamp? Anyway, read the threads on folks getting the Elite Visas, and how they have to leave and reenter Thailand to cancel their current stays, and get a new Elite related permission of stay. Thus, right now, there's a lot of loose ends to sort out for LTR visas, and I would surmise this will take awhile -- and, like with other matters involving Imm, each Imm headquarters will have its own interpretation on how to deal with LTR visas. As I said in a previous post -- be prepared to get a loud "DUH" at your local, non major, Imm office. Best sit back, relax, until this all sorts out -- if it ever does.... as Thai gov't operations are individual fiefdoms, with no one entity in charge. Welcome to the Orient.

You can do a domestic wire to Bangkok Bank NY, which will then send the money to your Bangkok Bank account in Thailand. Mechanically, the same as the old days when ACH worked. Charges are the same, except you may have a wire fee from your originating bank.

This is what you get from Wise when you go to send money:

Well, Imm does issue Non Imm O visas, to folks entering on Tourist visas, or visa exempt, wanting eventual retirement extensions. But instead of having your one-time Non Imm O visa instantly "used," followed by a 90 day permission of stay -- a five year LTR visa stamp is stamped (affixed), followed by a one-year permission of stay stamp. Thus, you're now free to travel, receiving a new one-year permission of stay stamp upon each re-entry -- akin to receiving a one-year permission of stay stamp upon reentry with a still valid OA visa. Great for frequent travelers -- just travel often, return with a one-year permission of stay, and as long as you keep doing this, never ever have to visit Imm for a day's ordeal of paperwork. But, for us old, no longer traveling folks, I can only see I'll still have to visit Imm once a year to get a new one-year permission of stay. Even Elite Visa holders need to do this, if no longer actively traveling. But this is something I had hoped to avoid -- ever again having to visit Imm. I guess if they had a program, to come to my house once a year and pick up my passport, to deliver to Imm without my needing to accompany -- that would be nice. But, it sounds like this is not the case. So, even if they held my hand at Imm (which I could pay a legitimate agent to do for peanuts), it doesn't sound worth it -- if I have to go to Imm once a year anyway. (Well, yeah, if LTR allows me to void the in-country health insurance requirement -- I might do it, with the savings I'd get with no premiums for in-country insurance.)

You bet. The US Embassy is not going to certify my Tricare coverage, particularly since I can't provide them a Tricare policy (they don't issue them..) that verifies I'm covered by Tricare For Life, to include the necessary payment of Medicare premiums necessary for such coverage. So be it. Maybe a little hope on the horizon..... The new LTR visa program allows -- if you don't have health insurance from Thailand or elsewhere -- to self-insure by showing $100,000 in a bank account, for at least 12 months, in either a Thai or foreign bank. Wow. My savings account, loaded with cashed in CDs, would answer that requirement.... ... oh, never mind. That was an option developed by the BoI for their LTR plan. Little hope Imm or the Health Authorities would choose to piggyback on this requirement -- or, let alone, even know another agency even offered such a requirement...... Sigh.

Where'd you get that information from? But, it wouldn't surprise me that only major Imm offices (or just one) would warrant being brought up to speed by BoI.

I asked BoI, via email to their published address, the following question (which is probably answered earlier in this thread, but I missed it): They replied within 20 minutes (how refreshing!):

Or pensions or other deferred income payouts from previous working. For Yanks, if these payouts are government pensions, the tax treaty has Thailand completely hands off from taxation, regardless of what year they're sent to Thailand. Conversely, private pensions, to include 401ks and IRAs, if sent to Thailand in year paid out -- then, per treaty, Thailand has "first dibs" in their taxation -- and while you'd also have to declare these payouts in your US tax return, due to the "saving clause" found in the tax treaty -- you'd get a tax credit for these Thai taxes, in avoidance of double taxation. Surprisingly, maybe because it cost too much to enforce, Thailand doesn't take advantage of their "first dibs" tax rights under the US-Thai tax treaty (and most other tax treaties with Thailand).

I guess you didn't read my previous input....? Right now, stuck with OA extensions, that cost 70k baht a year in health insurance premiums, 'cause Imm can't figure out how to honor my Tricare insurance that would do away with the need for TGIA health insurance. Thus, ten years of premiums down the road is slightly more than chump change (700k baht). And, yeah, I could do a border hop and switch to an extension based on a Non Imm O visa. But, I'm sure, as soon as I did that, TGIA medical insurance would incorporate retirees on O extensions. Why take the chance, if I don't have to? No, since I can finance all the requirements, save 700k baht in health premiums, reduce trips to Imm from 10 to 2 -- that in itself makes it worthwhile. The rest doesn't add any benefit -- 90 day extensions take 20 seconds online these days; I don't travel, so free reentry permits don't resonate, as don't hand holding at airport Immigration; and I don't need to repatriate 800k to the US, since I'm planning to add more over here, re estate planning for my Thai relatives. So, one size doesn't fit all. And, right now, LTR looks pretty good to me. Fortunately, I just renewed my OA extension, so I've got time to see how this sorts out for others. BoI seems squared away, so that part of the equation doesn't worry me. It's when I arrive at Imm, with my BoI paperwork, and get greeted with a resounding "Duh" -- is what I worry about. Hopefully Imm will get sufficient marching orders to integrate this new visa into their operating orders. But, if past is prologue.....heads up.

Well, I guess not all tax professionals, as I would say KPMG employs some very high standard tax professionals: Just filter all foreign earnings through well established bank and savings accounts, that go back at least until last year. Then, bring to Thailand the amounts you wish, staying below last year's top balance. Fungibility of money is a wonderful thing.

Don't know. The Tricare Overseas Program, with Singapore servicing Thailand, are pretty professional and helpful in my experience. Now, if LTR only required a letterheaded one page, stating that I meet their insurance requirement -- maybe Singapore would cooperate. But, since Tricare doesn't issue policies, they and LTR folks might end up on different frequencies. And Singapore would punt if too much red tape. Anyway, that's why the option to self-insure, which fits nicely with me, was such welcomed news.

From a July 19 post by Mudcat, asking for clarification:

Because of the law requiring a "Required Minimum Distribution" (RMD) of those tax deferred dollars accumulated in your IRA, I was hoisted over the $80k threshhold. But, if I needed more than the RMD to meet this threshold, subtracting from the IRA whatever's needed should satisfy the BOI's requirement to meet the 80k.

Yeah, me too. Air Force pension for 20 years service, plus Social Security, in 2022 comes in $2000 short of the $80,000 requirement (so, with all the US military retirees in Thailand, this may be less a hurdle than at first glance). Now, I had to cash in $13,250, for the Required Minimum Distribution of my conventional (ie, non Roth) IRA. Thus, I've got two 1099-Rs, plus an SSA-1099, reporting my retirement income well in excess of $80k. Certainly acceptable by BOI ('tho it's historical, not current income, but certainly ways around that....). And for those with Roth IRAs, who needed to bridge the gap to $80k - I'm sure documentation of payout from those would be acceptable in lieu of a 1099. Anyway, Yanks, whatever your IRA -- this could bridge you to BOI's requirement. Anyway, just went thru the retirement extension goat rope, with an OA visa baseline, and thus the Thai medical insurance requirement, even tho' I have unlimited Tricare coverage. Thus, looking at paying 70k baht insurance premium, per year, for each of the next years' retirement extensions -- as I really don't think Tricare and the US Embassy will find an acceptable format for Tricare to be accepted for extensions.... .....but the LTR package allows self insurance, simply by showing my $100k savings account in the US, which is a no brainer for me. Thus, next 10 years -- 700K baht in premium savings(?) from that unnecessary OA extension health care. And, I guess, no more one year trips to Immigration -- now, every five years (worth something, at age 77-82). Other perks don't resonate -- no more 90 day reporting is no longer an issue, with the effective online reporting. And streamlined immigration at airport, plus no need for re-entry permits -- non player, as I don't travel. And being able to repatriate my 800k baht in retirement bank account -- again, a non player, as I plan to add more, not subtract. But, in sum, this looks like a good deal. And BOI comes across as very professional, with no hiccups in English translation, and with straightforward explanations, with their proviso that subsequent tweaks will occur, as required. Compared to other Thai gov't operations -- a breath of fresh air.

I always smile at this argument. My 800k to Thailand came from the left side of my retirement portfolio, ie, the mattress side, or the preservation of capital side. At USAA, it earns .08% in a savings account (my Bangkok Bank earns .25% -- but, hey, why quibble about nothing vs nothing...). I guess I could repatriate my 800k, and put it into CDs, paying slightly more than Bangkok Bank -- but why? My 35% of retirement portfolio in securities has, lately, bounced up and down $10,000/day (mostly down). Why would I worry about chump change earnings in regards to my 800k baht here, or there? The other aspect of this is, all of my estate is financial, and except for what's in Bangkok Bank, this is all in the US. Now, my American nephews and nieces are tabbed as beneficiaries for the IRA and insurance accounts, and as POD (Pay on Death) recipients for my other financial accounts. No lawyer needed, no probate -- easy peasy for the US relatives. But my Thai relatives? With no SSN or ITIN, there's no POD or beneficiary route to have designated assets sent their way upon my death. I'm not about to hire a US lawyer just for this aspect. Solution? Bring most of what I want to leave to those Thai relatives over to my bank accounts here in Thailand. No, I don't lay awake at night worrying about the soundnest of Thai banks. And I don't worry about .08% vs .25% in interest differences -- the daily FX change shatters that comparison. So, I guess I'll continue to chuckle when I read about folks who argue about all the money they're losing by parking 800k in a Thai bank. To me, this sounds like their entire retirement portfolio is in securities....... If that's the case, then, yeah, they're definitely not in a flexible situation -- to allow the left end of their retirement portfolio to reside in Thailand.

I thought we'd determined that the $80k annual income was gross. If so, why their need for income tax info? If the bottom line is, they want to know my disposable annual income, then, after three alimony payments, plus mortgage payments on homes that are unrentable due to collapsed roofs -- then my real annual income is zip. Anyway, not to be flip, this is a real question about gross vs net income. Years ago, on this forum, the discussion on income statements came out firmly on the gross side. Believe it only makes sense that this is the case in the LTR situation.....

So, is the permission of stay stamp I get in my passport good for 10 years -- or for only 5, at which time I need to requalify, and to visit Immigration for another, presumably 5 year, stamp? If so, this is really a 5 year visa extension program. But, so what -- beats going to Imm every year. Or, if it's a 10 year stamp, and I fail to requalify at the 5 year mark -- I then have to visit Imm to have the stamp cancelled -- and be told I'm now in the country illegally...... Hmmmm. Forget the 10 year stamp, as I just reread the following: An LTR will initially be granted for not more than five years, Thus, these are really 5 year permissions, not 10 year.

Doesn't have to be in Thailand, according to this quote (whose source I cannot find): Believe they also want an additional $25,000 in the account, if you are married (to cover, as they said, "one dependent"). I certainly could handle this, since my US savings account is flush, having cashed in rather than renew low paying CD's. My account is joint, so they might require twice the stipulated amount, which I could handle. Now, if they had this option to get me out of the OA extension health requirement, I'd probably stay with that option, since I have no great need to repatriate my 800k baht. But, only going to Immigration every five years vs one year sounds good. Doing away with 90 day reporting is a non factor, what with the easy online system now in effect. Anyway, just renewed my OA retirement extension, so plenty of time to ponder options and review experiences.

Would be for Tricare. They're not set up like private insurers, so you don't have a policy package and a membership card. And, Tricare and the US Embassy didn't seem too interested in bending the system so that the OA extension requirement could be met. Maybe they'll come around for this...l

..... so, since your permission of stay will suddenly expire, due to not meeting requirements, you'll then have the remaining time on your permission to pack your bags and exit the country. Or what.....?

Well, Norwegians who bring their Norwegian pensions (private and gov't) into Thailand in year paid, then declare this income as taxable by Thailand (IAW the tax treaty) -- don't have to pay the flat 15% withholding at source Norwegian taxes on this income. So, if the Thai tax is less than 15%, that's money in your pocket. BUT, you have to show you paid Thai taxes on all these pensions, if you want the Norwegian revenuers to forget the 15% on all these pensions (and the Norwegians don't prorate, ie, charge taxes on your windfall). Gosh, how's the average expat going to escape paying taxes to someone, if they keep revamping the rules (Norway's equivalent of the US "saving clause," meaning, you gotta pay someone.) Life ain't fair.

OJAS, further related info in my Aug 24 input in the following thread: https://aseannow.com/topic/1267342-oa-health-insurance-requireme/