JimGant

Am I the only one confused here?

Thanks, Sheryl, for that question. Its answer will, hopefully, stop my head scratching as to the OP's real question....

Just to put US retirees at ease, if the DTA says Thailand has first/exclusive taxation rights on US income remitted to Thailand, then you have an "out" to the Tax Code, where it says credits are only against taxes paid on Thai income. Nope. If that remitted income is subject to the DTA, for the purposes of eliminating double taxation, then that US income taxed by Thailand will be treated as if it were Thai, not US, income. Thus, any credits banked (under Form 1116) are applicable to future US remitted income, since such remittances are treated the same as Thai income. Form 8833 applies, which points out how the DTA trumps the US Tax Code.

Depends on the bank, I guess. My banks' credit cards, Cap One, BofAmerica, and USAA, charge no fees; use the network (Visa) FX rate, which approximates the excellent Interbank Exchange Rate (what WISE gives); and give me a 1.5% reward credit. Can't beat that (well, USAA used to be 2.5%). Years ago on this forum DCC was discussed heavily, pointing out which merchants automatically used it (while the networks, visa, mc, require the merchant to divulge whether DCC was being used, or not). And the added cost, around 3%, can add up (with both the merchant and the bank, who defines the FX rate to reach a profitable spread from what he pays Visa, splitting the profit). We got to the point, with Home Pro, that we had to tell the checkout gal to hit "button 2", as "button 1" was the DCC rate. Haven't used Home Pro in awhile, but recently Bangkok Hospital has, on several occasions, asked, "Dollars or baht?" They'd even print out, at request, a comparison of the two rates -- and 3% seems to still be the rip off rate. (Oh, baht is the correct answer.) Don't know if DCC has entered the QR world yet, as I refuse to learn how to pay for something on my phone, while trying to see tiny numbers and keys -- while my plastic credit card is still very functional, thank you very much. (Had to get that rant in -- new technology isn't all that swell for old farts.)

Bingo! A little common sense would show that all arriving monies will be considered "income," and maybe have withholding taxes -- is completely bonkers. You think the Thais are stupid enough to shoot FDI in the foot (rhetorical question). Or that banks will now be surrogate RD agents to address all incoming wires......... And I thought the Swiss were keen on financial matters......

Another cavalier comment. By the way, what's your nationality? I've kind of got it narrowed down....

Lemme see. If I had the choice between an attractive, soft, curvy, nice smelling creature -- and a hairy, booze breathed neanderthal-like body -- what would I do?

Excellent point. If Thai taxes exceed US taxes, then, yes, your total tax bill will equate to the higher of whichever country's tax bill is higher. Here's the language from the DTA: This is unclear as to which country has "primary" taxation authority. But it doesn't matter when it comes to your total tax bill. If my US cap gain tax is $1000, and my Thai tax is $1200, if I have to pay full fare to the US, but give that $1000 as a credit against the Thai tax bill of $1200 -- then I end up paying the US $1000, and Thailand $200. Total bill: $1200. Reverse that, paying Thailand full fare of $1200, but using $1000 of that as a credit to cancel out my US tax bill -- again, total bill between the two countries is $1200. But, point well taken -- Yanks may now have situations where having to file Thai taxes makes total tax bill between both countries higher than just paying US taxes.

Prayuth wasn't all that bad. Granted, many won't forgive his illegitimate rise to power. So be it. But his intentions were honorable; so too his hard work; and his legacy will probably be deemed "very acceptable", except Covid's curse prevented many of his good intentions from flowering. Good news and good reports are nice to hear; sadly, we have to suffer the naysayers . Thailand's certainly on the mend, but many miles to go. Sadly, we can't have a parallel gov't, like that of Yingluck, to match performances, and good intentions, with that of Prayut. I think many critics of Prayuth's governing would then be forced to shut up.

I can just see me in the drive thru, with the clerk scratching his head and calling higher authority -- while ten cars behind me are warming up their horns... I've got a few months to decide about Star Visa. They're a lot closer to me than Imm, plus no parking problem or streets to cross. Beside, hey, I'm a Wealthy Pensioner -- why worry about 1000 baht 😉

Not true for the US-Thai tax treaty. Yes, gov't pensions and social security are specifically restricted to taxation only by the paying country. However, private pensions, annuities, and IRAs *are* mentioned as being exclusively taxable by country of residence, i.e., Thailand. (But the US still maintains taxation rights on these payments, per the "saving clause.") But, yes, other DTAs are less specific. The UK one makes no mention of private pensions

I have to agree with Mike on this one, but mainly as it impacts Thai citizens/fat cats, rather than we expats. Heretofore, the fat cat could just wait until a later year to bring in his foreign earnings to escape taxation. But that loophole appears to be closed. Certainly the powers-that-be aren't now going to allow fat cats to take extended vacations that negate their tax residency -- to use that year to remit all their overseas income..... But, wait -- maybe there's some interpretation that says, if no tax return is required to be filed for a year in which you weren't a tax resident, then no taxes on remittances received in that tax year. Yeah, doesn't pass the sniff test -- but maybe a deliberate "out" to accommodate the fat cats, who certainly would of had a say in all of this. But, who cares -- no extended vacations on my horizon. Plus, Yanks aren't affected by any of this (yes, I know -- you Old World folks get tired of hearing this).

No. You've already met any tax obligations. Money gifted to your wife in the US is exempt from gift taxation. Gift to wife in Thailand is below the 20m threshold.

I don't see any of your scenarios that would require you to file a Thai tax return and pay Thai taxes: If income is not remitted, it's not assessable. If monies from pre 2024 are remitted, they're not assessable. If income remitted, otherwise assessable but remitted in a year when you're not a tax resident -- not assessable. Thus, no situations where you're paying Thai taxes, and thus no situations requiring a tax credit of Thai taxes against US taxes. But, your question is a good one for future use, i.e., when you pay Thai taxes on US income because the DTA says that's the way it is. Normally, under US Tax Code, tax credits against your US tax return are for taxes paid only on foreign income. But, there's an exception for taxes paid under treaty (DTA) situations, such as paying taxes to Thailand on US income that they have primary taxation rights on. As such, you DO get a tax credit against your US tax return, requiring you to file a Form 8833. But, all the scenarios you indicate aren't yet in that situation. Bottom line, as a Yank -- all this gobbly gook about the new tax situation doesn't really affect us, as our total tax bill, between the two countries, will, in most scenarios, be the same, with maybe Thailand finally getting more taxes, and the US less, as Thailand finally employs the language of the US-Thai DTA to their benefit.

Just quoting a couple of Thai legal sites that -- hopefully -- know more than I do. Makes no difference on the direction I've given my wife. She'll be in no jeopardy as administrator of my estate -- and sole beneficiary. As administrator appointed in my Will, she needs no court to bless that appointment:

Ah, I see. Running a red light is in the same category as not filing taxes when no taxes are due. Get a grip, man.

Show me that law. Here's what a quick Google finds: So, it looks like my bank manager didn't need to wink and nod -- she (the manager) can determine what amounts to release to my wife -- the sole beneficiary and executor in my Will. Think I won't have the wife bother her with a death certificate, but just go ahead and transfer the money, per her guidance. If there's nobody out there claiming to also be a beneficiary, who's going to file charges...? Sometimes common sense greases the skids -- and is particularly gratifying when it denies greedy lawyers their fees. Oh, Mike -- I told my maid, who earns more than 120k in assessable income, that she now needs to file taxes according to this farang that moderates a forum. Clazy falang was her reply. Yep, wisdom from the working class.

This subject arises regularly on this forum. You've got the 'holier than thou' types who swear your bank accounts must go through probate, and absolutely cannot be touched outside of this process. BS. If you have a single beneficiary (usually a wife, but a GF will do), who's also your executor in your Will -- and you have no outstanding bills nor anyone likely to contest your beneficiary -- set up a plan to transfer your money to beneficiary upon death. And, yes, online transfers will work just fine, tho' she might be restricted to 500k per day. Also, make her a co-signatory on your accounts, which allows her to take your passbook to the bank and withdraw (nice backup, should online method somehow break). As a co-signatory, her name only appears under UV light, thus it is not, and does not, appear as a joint account, which Immigration wouldn't normally allow. (If you break up, cancel the co-signatory account and go back to a single.) Banks have no legal obligation to freeze accounts -- if they have not been notified of your death. And, there is no one obligated to tell the bank of your death. So, have the GF briefed on how to remove your money. With no aggrieved party, no one is going to make an issue of it. But do make a Will. You can find templates for doing it yourself, and if hand written, witnesses aren't even required (although recommended, complete with Thai ID numbers). Thus, should your GF hit a speed bump, and she knows where your Will is, then the burdensome probate process can take place. If that happens, then your Will can be, and will need to be, translated into Thai. But, doubtful it will ever get to this stage. Heck, even our bank manager, with a wink and a nod, advised us to use this method (of course, not all bank managers are so pragmatic).

LMG is the cheapest. You can get a policy up to age 80, with previous medical conditions. Premium is 36700 baht. Renewable up to age 100, but premium is upped to mid 60k for ages past 80. This is a throwaway policy, with its huge deductibles. But since you already have excellent insurance from the US, no big deal. Like you, I have excellent insurance from the US (Tricare). But I needed the LMG policy for O-A extensions. However, last year I switched to an LTR WP visa, and they allowed my Tricare policy to meet the insurance requirement. If you meet the financial requirement for an LTR visa, something to consider -- plus many other benefits as well.

Ah, a little serendipity when you poke the Bear in the eye. But, if you think US and EU sanctions against oil were mainly for profit reasons, and not to protect Ukraine -- well, I'll let the readers assess where you're coming from.

Stupid statement. Sanctions by the US don't benefit the US -- their intent is to thwart the Soviet Union, er Russia, from taking over Ukraine. And the EU is onboard for most of these sanctions, as they have a lot more to lose if Russia becomes their new neighbor. Thailand is playing its cards close to the vest, which is wise. There are probably some interesting discussions behind diplomatic closed doors. But the US, and EU, are smart enough to realize Thailand's dependency on tourism would be jeopardized if Russian airlift was restricted. Actually, the EU has a lot more reason to get everybody onboard with sanctions, so I'd be a lot more interested in hearing about any EU displeasure towards Thailand on this jet fuel episode.... Anyway, it's always fun to hear members of the Old World find fault with the US. Just pay us back for the Marshal Plan, and pay all the costs for NATO, as we certainly could use all those funds we provide for EU's defense to, instead, address our domestic problems. But, maybe come November, the EU won't have the US to bad mouth anymore -- and will be building school houses to teach Cyrillic.

I doubt anybody working the drive through window has ever seen a TM 95.

Good point, and one I missed. Article 15 of the US-Thai DTA seems to say that self-employment income earned in the US, and then remitted to Thailand, "may be taxed" by the US. "May be taxed" is code language in all the model tax treaties for which country has primary taxing authority ("first dibs"). Thus, in this case, the US has primary taxation authority, meaning, it gets to keep all the taxes collected, but has to issue a tax credit to Thailand for the avoidance of double taxation. But, the total taxation in this example would still be $1086 -- $769 paid to the US, and $317 paid to Thailand, after the tax credit is netted out. Hopefully, this whole mess will be simplified by what we heard early on in this new tax situation, i.e., if you pay taxes in your home country on subject income, subject income will not be taxable in Thailand. This certainly would tamp down the complexities inherent in DTAs.

Whoops. Single standard deduction is 14600, for those under 65. Thus, US taxes would be $769 -- but Thai tax credit covers that, so you're still out of pocket $1086 between the two countries.

Thai taxation: 150 + 60 = 210 allowances 780 - 210 = 570 taxable income Taxes on taxable income: 38000 baht -- $1086 @ 35 FX rate US taxation: Single standard deduction: $16200 Adjusted gross income: $22286 @ 35 FX rate Taxable income: $6086 Taxes: $609 Thailand, per DTA, has first dibs. Thus, they get to keep the full $1086 in tax collection. But, they have to give a tax credit to the US, to cover the full $609 in US tax obligation. Bottom line: You end up paying $1086 in taxes between the two countries. But, since Thailand has first dibs, per DTA, you end up paying $477 (1086-609) more in taxes than if you lived in America full time, and Thailand.