mauGR1

I am extremely ignorant myself, so i can't really condemn ignorance. One thing leaves me baffled though, how some appear to be so proud in displaying it so relentlessly ????

Some people will attack you for no reason, but when asked for a logical explanation, will hide behind excuses. A popular excuse is "I'm not interested in this debate". .... intellectual honesty, and honesty in general, seems to be out of fashion these days ????

Possibly yes, but this thread is enough for my daily dose of tvf entertainment. Well, if there's some funny thread, like in the good old times, let me know old chap.????

Why blaming others for your lack of imagination? No one here ever talked about "God" as a vengeful old man with a beard, sitting in the clouds and persecuting and tormenting the innocent... and no one ever talked about mother Mary's virginity, except for a bunch of people which i can't define properly. In other words, there are no religious bigots here, but you may find some around churches and temples, if you really wish to talk to them. ????

I think this is normal for everyone, in various degrees, and accepting things as they are is normal too, in various degrees. So, what exactly are you complaining about ?

Perhaps "shim" or "she-male" or Ladyboy! works for ya! 555 The plot thickens ????

Imho, numbers and math too, the man has just " discovered " those, more or less in the same way Columbus discovered America, but America was already there, and would have existed with or without Columbus ????

I thought that "intelligent design " was quite modern, and covering lots of definitions ????

Oh, really? So, if you can explain, I'd like to know why it's false, i am all ears. PS I'm not interested in watching videos, but I'm interested in hearing people's opinions.

No, it's not. Either you think there's an intelligent design in the universe, or otherwise, you think it happened " by chance". Imho, this dilemma is worth investigating.

Well, I'm starting to realize that for you Americans, the religious zealots are playing an important part in politics and everyday's lives. It's just not the same in other countries which I've been, except Iran during the revolution in 79, but I just run away quickly. I guess I would detest them if I meet them, there are some "jehovah witnesses" in my home country, which can be a bit obnoxious, yet not really dangerous. Yet, the "divisive feeling " is becoming very deep, as much as I can see, in all modern societies, and i just disagree in putting all the blame on religion and spiritual theories and stuff.

Pot, kettle, black ????

Put down the bottle, is all that i can say to you. Hatred is bad for your health too ????

So you think that you deserve better, eh ???? Just be good Johnny, be good, being grateful for what you have, instead of complaining for what you don't have, will make your life better, i guarantee ????

Yeah, right, and Columbus discovered America. ...sometimes i suspect that education and indoctrination are dangerously close ????

That's what I'm doing hopelessly since many months here.. I understand very well what you are saying btw, and, in the limits of the material realm, it makes sense. Yet, i have to say once again, you cannot see the intelligent design, or the universal consciousness, or the source of existence with your physical eyes, and this is a fact.

Your faith is moving me, but I'm skeptical of your theory of settled science, and I'm trying to be polite. Hint : too much faith in materialism, combined with an over-exposure to TV and movies, can be seriously harmful, even lethal to critical thinking. As your nearly correct last paragraph is showing, you don't even understand what I'm saying.

I did a comparison, which went over your head. If you think that try to ridicule what you can't understand makes you smarter, just carry on, it's not my business ????

Almost everything. ????

What kind of evidence do you need, would you ask a molecule in your physical body to prove the existence of yourself? The laws of physics, geometry, maths etc are evidence of a design, and you know very well that you can't prove that all this originated from the man.. ..so, at least, a little skepticism is fair.

I would gladly argue your false assumptions, but tbh , i can't be bothered. What about getting some historical knowledge, just saying ????

Lol, I did the same with my younger brother, keeping him awake till my mother sneaked out of the room with the presents, and started playing noisily in the middle of the night, and waking up everyone ???? Rarely seen my dear mother so angry, and me and little brother so amused, thanks for bringing out this great memory. On a serious note, i'd ask you why you don't save some of your righteous skepticism for the consciousness dilemma. What is born first, the man or the consciousness ? Or, would consciousness exist without the man ?

Nope, skepticism, as opposed to blind faith, is a pillar of true science. So, now, while intelligent design seems to be unproven thus non existent, i think it's fair to be skeptical about that. .. or do you really believe that humans are the greatest form of intelligence in the vast universe ? As for religious belief, which is mindlessly vilified in these dark days, you might find out that, having got ridden of the superstition bit, it's just pure and simple common sense. The 10 commandments, for an easy example, it's just common sense for a peaceful cohabiting. So, the whole thing appears to be just a bit more complex that you appear to think ????

Yep, i would say that you would appear to be, in general, a quite unbiased observer, except for the "God question ", which is the main subject of this thread. Since the very beginning, you have not considered the possibility of the existence of some sort of intelligent design, whose rules govern the visible world, which some people call God; perhaps it's time, at least for those who have a truly scientific mind, to concede that this sort of attitude is unscientific.

Methinks you are a bit biased then ???? ..but I agree with your stance on climate warming alarmism.