Contract Abuse

[fairplay4all]

My common-law wife is employed by a Ministry of Education university. Her contract is a standard Ministry of Education "Agreement of Employment of Alien". The university has refused to pay her the regulation salary and housing allowance that is standardized by the MOE. Her first year contract they only paid her a salary of 9,000 baht per month and asked her to sign a separate agreement stating that she did not want the housing allowance. The contract housing allowance clause states that she should have received 8,000 baht per month. The second year the university again refused to pay her the standard foreign teacher salary of 19,020 baht per month. Instead they wrote the contract salary for 9,000 per month again. They also rewrote the standard MOE contract and changed the housing allowance figure to 3,000 baht per month. In short, the university has refused to follow any of the salary regulations of the MOE. As it is a government university; are they required to follow the MOE regulations and guidelines? Are they permitted to make changes to the standardized contract for the employment of a foreign teacher? If they have broken any laws or regulations, is it possible for my wife to take legal action to claim her money for the last year's contract and her current contract? Thank you kindly for your kind consideration of my inquiry.

[qualtrough]

You can forget about any legal remedy. The time and expense would eat up any money you might gain in the unlikely event you succeeded.

Two questions:

1. Why did she accept a dodgy contract like that not once, but twice?

2. Why in the world is she working for 9000 Baht a month!!

[lannarebirth]

Maybe one of the Mods can move this to the Teachers forum. I remember reading a post there, some months back, where a teacher got a very good court award for this very type of thing. I'm sorry, I forget the posters name.

[fairplay4all]

You can forget about any legal remedy. The time and expense would eat up any money you might gain in the unlikely event you succeeded.

Two questions:

1. Why did she accept a dodgy contract like that not once, but twice?

2. Why in the world is she working for 9000 Baht a month!!

The time and expense would eat up any money you might gain in the unlikely event you succeeded. The total calculated amount of lost money would equal 354,000 baht if the normal contract conditions were met. Thus, I feel it may be worth pursuing the issue.

Why did she accept the offer....not once but twice? Well, she is Filipino and we live in a small town in the south. Employment opportunities are rare at best. Furthermore, she has her six year old child with her and all of the visas are connected to the employment contract. As many of us already know, Thailand is very quickly refusing Filipinos and Farangs alike to make regular cross border visa runs. We have always worked legally and want this to remain so. As a Filipino she does not have the same options of mobility as most teachers here in Thailand. So we have done what we have had to do to stay here legally.

Why in the world is she working for 9000 Baht a month? Once again it comes down to an issue of race. In particular, one of her colleagues in the office stirred up a frenzy with many other Thai teachers claiming that it wasn't right that a Filipino teacher get paid more than them. This is a Rajamangala government university which is under the jurisdiction of the Ministry of Education. As such, the ministry has a very defined set of payment regulations for the employment of a foreign teacher, regardless of where that teacher comes from. Under the regulations a foreign teacher with a Bachelor Degree is paid 19,020 baht per month plus an 8,000 baht per month housing stipend. The university has broken the regulations for both contracts and we are trying find a way to resolve the issue.

I'm not sure exactly how many Farangs remain sympathetic to the injustices done to people who come to Thailand from the Philippinnes, Laos, Burma, etc. I would like to think that we are a tolerant and compassionate group that has the knowledge and acceptance that all people in this world deserve to be treated in a fair and equal manner. Those who arrive here legally and follow the laws and make sure they have legall visas and work permits can still suffer the abuse of prejudice in this society. I, for one, will not stand on the sidelines and allow this to continue. I have tried to resolve this politely with this university for a year and a half. We are now in a financial position to take the issue to a higher level. If we loose then so be it. But sometimes in life one must fight for what is right and pursue justice. Not everyone looses. Often people fail to win in Thailand because the Thais simply wear them out with the endless dance, run around and bureaucratic red tape. I've lived here for nine years and have won a number of battles that everyone told me I could never possibly win. In Thailand perseverence is the only path that will lead to success.

What I am hoping to find in this forum is some concrete leads as to how best to pursue this situation. Concrete facts and previous precidents are what I hoping for.

[paully]

If she's been working at the university for a couple of years, I'd advise her to go to the Ministry of Labour with her written contracts and complain. They have a reputation for being employee-friendly and helpful in cases of employer exploitation - even exploitation of foreigners.

[fairplay4all]

If she's been working at the university for a couple of years, I'd advise her to go to the Ministry of Labour with her written contracts and complain. They have a reputation for being employee-friendly and helpful in cases of employer exploitation - even exploitation of foreigners.

Thank you kindly for that sound advice. This is a lead that we can put to use. Can I ask you to clarify the "Ministry of Labour" details, please? Are you referring to our local provincial office that issues "Work Permits"? We are located in Southern Thailand and it would be difficult to deal with this issue in Bangkok. Thanks once again for taking some of your valuable time to offer us your assistance. We appreciate your help.

[Bottlerocket]

Look at the bottom of her contract and you will see that it says that all disputes concerning the said contract will be settled in the Bangkok Metropolitan Court. It might be an arbitration process or such. It's plainly racist and in the old constitution (the one we don't have anymore) it stated that no one shall be discriminated against on the basis of skin color, race, heritage, sex, religion, creed, etc. You get the point.

I would think that any fees which you incur for the cost of an attorney would be awarded along with back pay. I too worked at a Rajabhat a while back and, during my interview, one the 4 teachers there to scrutinize me says, "Well, foreign teachers are paid too much." He then stood up and walked out. He said it to me again a couple of months later and I let into him. I told him that foreigners don't get paid too much. Thais get paid too little. But as long as you stand around and take it like a bunch of helpless p_ssies, as long as you refuse to organize and/or demand more pay for your work and experience, then you'll never get anything but the misery you've already exhibited on two occasions. People from my country over the last century or so have sacrificed their lives picketing companies who exploited workers, paid colored people less, indiscriminately and systematically abused, cheated, and extorted workers of all colors. Our people formed unions and consistently fight for higher wages, better protections and safety, overtime/doubletime pay, and the rest. So don't tell me how overpaid we farang Rajabhat teachers are paid, just because you're getting the shaft. Do something for yourself.

And that's my advice to you. Do something for yourself. Do something for all of us and show them that you're not scared of their intimidation or their mystifying justice system. Your ladyfriend deserves to be treated equally and I would pursue it by first consulting a lawyer who agrees and understands it.

[fairplay4all]

Look at the bottom of her contract and you will see that it says that all disputes concerning the said contract will be settled in the Bangkok Metropolitan Court. It might be an arbitration process or such. It's plainly racist and in the old constitution (the one we don't have anymore) it stated that no one shall be discriminated against on the basis of skin color, race, heritage, sex, religion, creed, etc. You get the point.

I would think that any fees which you incur for the cost of an attorney would be awarded along with back pay. I too worked at a Rajabhat a while back and, during my interview, one the 4 teachers there to scrutinize me says, "Well, foreign teachers are paid too much." He then stood up and walked out. He said it to me again a couple of months later and I let into him. I told him that foreigners don't get paid too much. Thais get paid too little. But as long as you stand around and take it like a bunch of helpless p_ssies, as long as you refuse to organize and/or demand more pay for your work and experience, then you'll never get anything but the misery you've already exhibited on two occasions. People from my country over the last century or so have sacrificed their lives picketing companies who exploited workers, paid colored people less, indiscriminately and systematically abused, cheated, and extorted workers of all colors. Our people formed unions and consistently fight for higher wages, better protections and safety, overtime/doubletime pay, and the rest. So don't tell me how overpaid we farang Rajabhat teachers are paid, just because you're getting the shaft. Do something for yourself.

And that's my advice to you. Do something for yourself. Do something for all of us and show them that you're not scared of their intimidation or their mystifying justice system. Your ladyfriend deserves to be treated equally and I would pursue it by first consulting a lawyer who agrees and understands it.

Everything in due time and with due process. Patience and a well executed plan are what it takes to beat unscupulous employers. My nine years of experience in Thailand has taught me to be over-prepared and over-documented in every conflict situation. Thais love paper, beaurocracy and formality. As many of us know, they often will not fight a clean and fair battle. To lie is common. Thus, I am taking this step by step and making sure that I've thought of as many angles and possiblities as realistic to forecast. This should help me document against arguements that they are likely to make against us. When the research is completed and I have stacks of evidence and sound reputable advice from people that have precident setting examples that can teach me something about how to proceed....I will nail them hard and get the money that is owed. However, this has to be approached in manner that is logical....not emotional.

Yes, Thai people do need to consider taking responsibility for their own grievences regarding salaries and workplace abuse. This is a question of greater education, the development of a sense of the "Individual" and a general westernization of the culture. Thais do function very well in collective groupings as most of us know already. Some unions have fought hard and won collective agreements for the workers in such areas as auto workers, industrial agriculture, etc. While it may not be a widespread phenomena, Thais are willing and capable of taking on labour disputes in an effective class action strategy.

While many Thais do seem to begrudge the fact that Farangs make higher salaries than themselves, we must take all try to educate them politely about the realities of why we earn what we earn. An angry display of frustration benefits nobody. Thais are generally very reasonable people to discuss an issue with assuming that the "Jai Yen Yen" stay calm and speak politely rule is followed. And it makes sense. Who wants to listen to the rantings of some pissed off person.....whoever or where ever they may come from. Rather than berating them for their passive and nonconfrontational approach to the injustices they suffer, (ahhh....by the way.... kinda the very essence and basis of their entire religious teachings which are the very foundations of their culture and society) it may be wiser to open a dialogue that explains to them why we make the salary. IE: Schools have to pay to attract teachers that would otherwise go to Japan, Taiwan, Korea, etc. (Teacher Market Value), our cost of living is higher as we do not qualify for many Thai national's discounts (National Parks, Hotels & Resorts, etc), we cannot buy using credit thus we need large lump sums of cold hard cash for motorcycles, cars, furniture, etc., we must continue to make payments in our home country like student loans, mortgages, etc. I have found that once Thais are made aware of these realities they do seem to calm down about the salary issue. No...they usually do not fully change their attitude but it can offer them some perspective. Wise people listen and adjust to the realities of what they learn. Most conflicts seem to be born out of misunderstandings, a lack of information and preconceived ideas. As teachers and givers of knowledge we should hold ourselves to a higher standard and apply what it is that we do for a living to situations like this.....TEACH the facts, information and truth. It is up to the listener to choose what to do with it from there.

[DragonQuest]

she basically got ripped off cause shes a filipina and i feel sorry for her><

[geronimo]

I was that guy and yes I would definitely recommend taking legal action if you are talking about 300k and up. I did and won!!!

[legaleagle]

Hey Geronimo, I think I was following your story a while back. Congrats! I think the best advice you could offer to the OP right now would be to list the documentation that will be required. If I recall, the correct visa, a work permit and teacher's license were necessary? Isn't it the case that once you are legit then the Labour Code applies to you and shady employers will lose in a case like this?

[Ijustwannateach]

Actually, the Labour law covers and protects ALL employees, Thai national or foreign, legal or illegal.

You can win a case under the MOL even if you don't have a proper contract, etc.

However, if you admit in court that you don't have the proper visa, work permit, etc., you can still be charged for breaking the applicable laws.

"Steven"