Just Weird Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 17 hours ago, Just Weird said: He ran legal massage businesses. How do you think he acquitted his wealth? S hit, didn't notice that Thaivisa autocorrect, should be, "How do you think he acquired his wealth"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 12 hours ago, Thian said: Drive a motocy through the city while wearing a new white blouse...it's grey after one day. You'd have the same problem with your white blouse in any city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 10 hours ago, Wiggy said: Could you point out where I said Pathumwan is Klong Toey? I fail to see how a mall (or similar) will promote a more clean-air environment over a park. I didn't say that you said that, my comment meant that you were comparing Pathumwan with KT, andwhy should the separate districts adopt the same policy. When construction is completed how will a mall particularly produce dirtier air than a park with the same number of people using them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anon537687643 Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Highlights what an utterly boring city Bangkok is!Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thian Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Just Weird said: You'd have the same problem with your white blouse in any city. Tokyo has clean buses and trucks, in BKK they are extreme old and blow huge black fumes... And in Europe we also have much cleaner air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 1 minute ago, Thian said: Tokyo has clean buses and trucks, in BKK they are extreme old and blow huge black fumes... And in Europe we also have much cleaner air. "Tokyo has clean buses and trucks, in BKK they are extreme old and blow huge black fumes..." The majority of Bangkok buses and trucks run on LPG, "blowing huge black fumes" is a thing of the past that uninformed Thai-bashers like to bring up. A number of fairly recent surveys proved that Bangkok's air quality is a lot better than many cities worldwide. But I suppose that you live in a European city where it is possible that after riding around all day on a motorbike in a new white blouse it would still be beautifully white. Lucky you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metisdead Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 A post containing a link to Bangkok Post has been removed: 26) The Bangkok Post and Phuketwan do not allow quotes from their news articles or other material to appear on Thaivisa.com. Neither do they allow links to their publications. Posts from members containing quotes from or links to Bangkok Post or Phuketwan publications will be deleted from the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thian Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 30 minutes ago, Just Weird said: "Tokyo has clean buses and trucks, in BKK they are extreme old and blow huge black fumes..." The majority of Bangkok buses and trucks run on LPG, "blowing huge black fumes" is a thing of the past that uninformed Thai-bashers like to bring up. A number of fairly recent surveys proved that Bangkok's air quality is a lot better than many cities worldwide. But I suppose that you live in a European city where it is possible that after riding around all day on a motorbike in a new white blouse it would still be beautifully white. Lucky you. How can the old bkk buses sound like diesels and blow huge black fumes if they run on LPG?? I have never seen a LPG motor blowing huge black fumes or it's almost dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Thian said: How can the old bkk buses sound like diesels and blow huge black fumes if they run on LPG?? I have never seen a LPG motor blowing huge black fumes or it's almost dead. Well, they sound like diesels because they are diesel-engined and most of them do not emit black diesel smoke because they cannot! They've been converted to run on LPG/NGV! Edited January 19, 2018 by Just Weird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thian Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Just Weird said: Well, they sound like diesels because they are diesel-engined and most of them do not emit black diesel smoke because they cannot! They've been converted to run on LPG/NGV! They converted the diesel engines to run on LPG?? I still see them blowing huge black fumes and stay far away from them. I bet the ones in my area are still diesels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 14 hours ago, Thian said: They converted the diesel engines to run on LPG?? Yes. Sort of messes up your claim a bit, doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thian Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 1 hour ago, Just Weird said: Yes. Sort of messes up your claim a bit, doesn't it? Not really, they can still smoke like a chimney even when they run on LPG. They are the same ancient dieselmotors but adapted to run on lpg. Also there are loads of other buses in the area plus loads of ancient trucks. BKK has filthy air and downtown is the worst. Especially if you live at a busy road, i'm glad i live between tree's now far away from the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimShorts Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 (edited) Bangkok has done an amazing job of reducing the air pollution over the last 20 years. The BTS, converting cities busses, converting motor bikes and taxis. However, there is still a lot that needs to be done as the average pm2.5 amount was 73 over the duration of last year. Some months are great and air is well below 50. Other months, mostly from Nov-Feb air is very unhealthy. The last few weeks have been very bad. Today the reading are 218 PM2.5 in some areas of bangkok. Facts about Bangkok busses can be read on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bangkok_Mass_Transit_Authority_fleet However, my understanding is that old diesel busses are often auctioned off and then driven by privates parties. Facts about Thailand Natural Gas can be read on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_gas_vehicle Another interesting thing is a previous Thailand incentive to buy cars, which is part of the reason there are so many cars here (seems it did not work out as planned). However a new incentive is be implemented for "greener" cars which is good: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-thailand-autos/car-buyers-incentive-plan-backfires-in-southeast-asias-detroit-idUSBRE98L0JJ20130922 According to Greenpeace, over 50% of all air pollution (PM2.5) in Thailand comes from burning (crops, garbage, etc.): https://greenpeace.or.th/s/right-to-clean-air/PM2.5CityRankingsREV.pdf Outlaw and enforce burning and the air quality would be better then many European countries. IMO, the other issue in Bangkok is mindstate. People here do not want to walk or ride bikes, they want to drive. Most areas of the city are not even built to support walking and bike riding. Edited January 22, 2018 by JimShorts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaikahuna Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Just what downtown needs, another bloody damned mall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimShorts Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 (edited) On 1/19/2018 at 6:21 PM, Just Weird said: I didn't say that you said that, my comment meant that you were comparing Pathumwan with KT, andwhy should the separate districts adopt the same policy. When construction is completed how will a mall particularly produce dirtier air than a park with the same number of people using them? 1. The construction of the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 2. Removing the trees and plants will cause more air pollution. 3. Producing the materials used to make the mall will cause more air pollution. 4. Transporting materials used to make the mall will cause more air pollution. 5. The material used to make the mall will give off a lot of VOC for years to come causing more air pollution. 6. The electricity needed to power the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 7. Producing all the consumer goods being purchased at the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 8. Transporting all the consumer goods to the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 9. All the cars being driven into and parked in the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 10. Sadly, more people will visit the mall then park, increasing cars and traffic. 11. Air quality indoors is generally worse then outdoors. Edited January 22, 2018 by JimShorts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 9 minutes ago, JimShorts said: 1. The construction of the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 2. Removing the trees and plants will cause more air pollution. 3. Producing the materials used to make the mall will cause more air pollution. 4. Transporting materials used to make the mall will cause more air pollution. 5. The material used to make the mall will give off a lot of VOC for years to come causing more air pollution. 6. The electricity needed to power the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 7. Producing all the consumer goods being purchased at the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 8. Transporting all the consumer goods to the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 9. All the cars being driven into and parked in the mall will cause a lot of pollution. 10. Sadly, more people will visit the mall then park, increasing cars and traffic. 11. Air quality indoors is generally worse then outdoors. Good grief...the question that I asked was about the extra pollution caused by the mall over a park when it was completed but your Greenpeaced eyes didn't want to see that, did they? Anyway... 1. It may cause some dust but regulations that enforce the covering of the building in construction reduces that to an insignificant amount. There's a construction going on right now on the corner of Soi 6 with no complaints of pollution or evidence of it. If there was, the BTS station that could not be any nearer to the site would be filthy and it isn't. 2. Removing some of the trees and plants will cause significant pollution? How, exactly? 3. Not in the area of the construction, it won't, and that is what is being discussed. 4. Ridiculous. If this was not being constructed there would still be transportation. 5. From this one construction minute amounts of VOCs will be given off in amounts so insignificantly small as to be considered harmless. 6. You really think so? How much pollution will be produced by the electricity needed for this one building? 7 - 10. You're desperately grasping at straws now. 11. So what? How does that detrimentally affect the environment which is the subject here? But, if the outside environment is cleaner than the inside, as you claim, that appears to be justification for more construction! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimShorts Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Just Weird said: Good grief...the question that I asked was about the extra pollution caused by the mall over a park when it was completed but your Greenpeaced eyes didn't want to see that, did they? Anyway... 1. It may cause some dust but regulations that enforce the covering of the building in construction reduces that to an insignificant amount. There's a construction going on right now on the corner of Soi 6 with no complaints of pollution or evidence of it. If there was, the BTS station that could not be any nearer to the site would be filthy and it isn't. 2. Removing some of the trees and plants will cause significant pollution? How, exactly? 3. Not in the area of the construction, it won't, and that is what is being discussed. 4. Ridiculous. If this was not being constructed there would still be transportation. 5. From this one construction minute amounts of VOCs will be given off in amounts so insignificantly small as to be considered harmless. 6. You really think so? How much pollution will be produced by the electricity needed for this one building? 7 - 10. You're desperately grasping at straws now. 11. So what? How does that detrimentally affect the environment which is the subject here? But, if the outside environment is cleaner than the inside, as you claim, that appears to be justification for more construction! :) 1. Fact, building a mall causes more air pollution then a park. 2. Fact, trees absorb air pollution. 3. Ok fair enough. However PM2.5 can travel hundreds of miles, perhaps all materials are manufactured further away. 4. Fact, more large trucks will drive to the construction site then to the park. 5. Fact, new construction materials emit more VOC then a park. 6. Fact, more electricity is needed for a mall then a park. 7-10. Fact, more large trucks will drive daily to the mall to deliver goods then to a park. Consumer goods give off more VOCs then a park. People will drive more cars into a mall then a park. 11. Fact, air in a mall is often worse then air in a park. Air inside a building is often worse then air outside a building. Buildings do not make the air outside better (they make it worse) and building make the air inside worse, overall making the air worse. Edited January 22, 2018 by JimShorts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooHaa Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 On 1/19/2018 at 8:59 AM, Wiggy said: Could you point out where I said Pathumwan is Klong Toey? I fail to see how a mall (or similar) will promote a more clean-air environment over a park. you are aware that one of the largest green spaces in bangkok exists at the end of soi 10, the combination of benjakitti park and the new park on TTM grounds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anon537687643 Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 "Tokyo has clean buses and trucks, in BKK they are extreme old and blow huge black fumes..." The majority of Bangkok buses and trucks run on LPG, "blowing huge black fumes" is a thing of the past that uninformed Thai-bashers like to bring up. A number of fairly recent surveys proved that Bangkok's air quality is a lot better than many cities worldwide. But I suppose that you live in a European city where it is possible that after riding around all day on a motorbike in a new white blouse it would still be beautifully white. Lucky you.Wrong ! Where’s your stats ? The majority are non aircon red BMTA buses with the other private small orange buses and other privately owned companies running on gasoline! Facts!Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 4 hours ago, JimShorts said: :) 1. Fact, building a mall causes more air pollution then a park. 2. Fact, trees absorb air pollution. 3. Ok fair enough. However PM2.5 can travel hundreds of miles, perhaps all materials are manufactured further away. 4. Fact, more large trucks will drive to the construction site then to the park. 5. Fact, new construction materials emit more VOC then a park. 6. Fact, more electricity is needed for a mall then a park. 7-10. Fact, more large trucks will drive daily to the mall to deliver goods then to a park. Consumer goods give off more VOCs then a park. People will drive more cars into a mall then a park. 11. Fact, air in a mall is often worse then air in a park. Air inside a building is often worse then air outside a building. Buildings do not make the air outside better (they make it worse) and building make the air inside worse, overall making the air worse. 1. Can't you read the points I made about comparisons after construction? 2. I'm not disputing that, I asked you how removing trees causes pollution as you wrongly claimed. How many trees will be removed and how many will be replaced in this project, do you know? Of course, you don't. 4. See 1. 5. See 1. 6. Can't answer my question about this, then? 7 -10. See 1. 11. What has that got to do with anything that I posted? How does "a building make air worse"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toughlove Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Wrong ! Where’s your stats ? The majority are non aircon red BMTA buses with the other private small orange buses and other privately owned companies running on gasoline! Facts!Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile appErrm where are your stats.. Dated at least 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toughlove Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Guys a condo or mall is way better than nothing a mall would employ hundreds or thousands of thais . A park under lock and key is the same as a gogo bar that doesn't bar fine Completely useless! [emoji3] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 4 hours ago, markaoffy said: Wrong ! Where’s your stats ? The majority are non aircon red BMTA buses with the other private small orange buses and other privately owned companies running on gasoline! Facts! Wrong, the majority are LPG/NGV fuelled including the non-air buses. Where's your stats, you asked for mine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anon537687643 Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Wrong, the majority are LPG/NGV fuelled including the non-air buses. Where's your stats, you asked for mine?You never gave any stats and I see the buses every day and not LPG NGV Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimShorts Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 2 hours ago, Just Weird said: 1. Can't you read the points I made about comparisons after construction? 2. I'm not disputing that, I asked you how removing trees causes pollution as you wrongly claimed. How many trees will be removed and how many will be replaced in this project, do you know? Of course, you don't. 4. See 1. 5. See 1. 6. Can't answer my question about this, then? 7 -10. See 1. 11. What has that got to do with anything that I posted? How does "a building make air worse"? https://www.environmentalpollutioncenters.org/shopping-mall/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toughlove Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 You never gave any stats and I see the buses every day and not LPG NGV Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile appWrapping your mouth round an exhaust is the only way to prove it .. That's gotta hurt right?Never seen thick black smoke in years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimShorts Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Bangkok mass transit bus fleet: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bangkok_Mass_Transit_Authority_fleet This does not account for privately operated buses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janclaes47 Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 On 19/01/2018 at 6:13 PM, Just Weird said: S hit, didn't notice that Thaivisa autocorrect, should be, "How do you think he acquired his wealth"? Thaivisa doesn't have an auto correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 (edited) 47 minutes ago, JimShorts said: https://www.environmentalpollutioncenters.org/shopping-mall/ Is that the most creditable website you could suggest? Did you make it yourself? Edited January 22, 2018 by Just Weird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimShorts Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 aquired 31 minutes ago, Just Weird said: Is that the most creditable website you could suggest? Did you make it yourself? How about Harvard: http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2005AtmEn..39.7374T Or the EPA and NY Gov wesbites: https://www.epa.gov/indoor-air-quality-iaq/volatile-organic-compounds-impact-indoor-air-quality https://www.health.ny.gov/environmental/indoors/voc.htm More... https://home.howstuffworks.com/home-improvement/construction/materials/how-dangerous-are-vocs-in-paint.htm https://home.howstuffworks.com/home-improvement/household-safety/tips/paint-emit-vocs.htm https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24448884 Do you truly think that building and operating a shopping mall has zero negative impact on the environment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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