Editor Removed For Mismanagement - Not junta Pressure: Bangkok Post

[jayboy]

I ask AGAIN - what would the junta do if the BP did not do as 'recommended'? There is nothing they could do without creating an international storm which could seriously damage Thailand and its economy. And, of course, the image they are so paranoid about.

So, I'm going with the reasons the paper gave for re-assigning - not firing - the editor. Even though that disappoints the junta bashers, who are merely speculating with absolutely nothing to support their argument.

You don’t understand the background.Nobody suggests the Junta instructed the BP to fire the editor.You would need to comprehend the shareholders/ directors and their relationship to the government - and you clearly don’t.


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[MrMuddle]

20 hours ago, KiwiKiwi said:

Formerly dominated by the Yoons, and now owned by a new organisation with more money; The Nation has a major readership sector of 'english-enabled' Thai middle classes. How critical of the junta would you expect them to be? How objective? How professional?

The reason I asked is because I haven't read it for 15 years or so. I don't like the crossword, it's too American, so I tend to buy the BP,  but only on the rare occasion that I'm in my local town.

[surfdog]

16 hours ago, tomta said:

This another case of the Bangkok Post's very low standards.

 

https://archives.cjr.org/behind_the_news/fry_in_thailand.php

 

Basically, the Post abandoned its reporter, Erika Fry, who exposed a major piece of academic plagiarism and a culture of plagiarism. Her work has ultimately been proved right in every respect. The plagiarist eventually had his PHD withdrawn by Chula (not easily though) and might even have lost his job at - get this - Thailand's Innovation agency. The point is the Bangkok Post caved in to pressure of the "Do you know who I am?" sort and abandoned its reporter . I don't think they've ever published a mea culpa as far as I know. A shameful matter.

yes I was waiting for somebody to bring up this.

[Eric Loh]

11 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

I ask AGAIN - what would the junta do if the BP did not do as 'recommended'? There is nothing they could do without creating an international storm which could seriously damage Thailand and its economy. And, of course, the image they are so paranoid about.

So, I'm going with the reasons the paper gave for re-assigning - not firing - the editor. Even though that disappoints the junta bashers, who are merely speculating with absolutely nothing to support their argument.

Is the Voice TV program that has been suspended few times for junta criticism is a good example on what the junta can do? There were condemnation that the junta just brush them off. What image you think they are paranoid about. It is no speculation that the junta can arbitrary suspend any media that they feel are overboard with editors that bash the junta. Bottomline at stake and the BP owners folded from threats. 

[KiwiKiwi]

1 hour ago, MrMuddle said:

The reason I asked is because I haven't read it for 15 years or so. I don't like the crossword, it's too American, so I tend to buy the BP,  but only on the rare occasion that I'm in my local town.

In my opinion,  you couldn't put a cigarette paper between them in terms of awfulness, and they're both a part of the apparatus that's been used to screw over the Thai working classes (mainly people from Isaan) for decades, I know it's Hobson's choice when it comes to English-language news, but honestly, I'd rather go without - plenty of online offerings. If I read either of these rags, it's only the online versions that I read.

 

I know and agree about 'American' though.

 

Each to his own though, lots of things I say or think aren't for everyone - not even for me sometimes... :-)

Edited May 17, 2018 by KiwiKiwi

[cliffspab]

On 16/05/2018 at 10:32 AM, Jane Dough said:

On the contrary...anyone could see that the Khaosod story was much more detailed and representative of the two sides to this matter. While the "truth" may be as mentioned in the Guardian but Khaosod have presented an alternative hypothesis that could also hold water. 

 

 

The Guardian piece was based purely on Mr Pandev's Facebook post, which I recommend people read to see his actual level of ability with written English...

 

Khaosod actually interviewed some employees.

 

I've never heard of any censorship being forced upon the BKP editorial staff beyond the regular moans that it, and all papers, receive from the Junta.

 

If you'd just been sacked for mismanagement, it'd be a smart move to paint it as though you were some kind of crusading martyr...

 

 

 

[jayboy]

 
The Guardian piece was based purely on Mr Pandev's Facebook post, which I recommend people read to see his actual level of ability with written English...
 
Khaosod actually interviewed some employees.
 
I've never heard of any censorship being forced upon the BKP editorial staff beyond the regular moans that it, and all papers, receive from the Junta.
 
If you'd just been sacked for mismanagement, it'd be a smart move to paint it as though you were some kind of crusading martyr...
 
 
 

And if you sacked an editor for promoting democracy rather than the Junta party line it would be a smart ( if tiresomely predictable) move to suggest it was mostly about his management deficiencies.

For the umpteenth time it doesn’t work along the lines that the Junta directly censors the media.In the case of the Bangkok Post It doesn’t need to given the sympathies of shareholders and directors.


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[cliffspab]

On 18/05/2018 at 10:02 AM, jayboy said:

 

And if you sacked an editor for promoting democracy rather than the Junta party line it would be a smart ( if tiresomely predictable) move to suggest it was mostly about his management deficiencies.

For the umpteenth time it doesn’t work along the lines that the Junta directly censors the media.In the case of the Bangkok Post It doesn’t need to given the sympathies of shareholders and directors.


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I know very well how it works.

 

I also know there was something of a delighted atmosphere among staff after he left.

 

Read for yourself, see if the editorial tone changes at all.

[jayboy]

16 minutes ago, cliffspab said:

 

I know very well how it works.

 

I also know there was something of a delighted atmosphere among staff after he left.

 

Read for yourself, see if the editorial tone changes at all.

I think it can be assumed with certainty that the editorial tone will change.

 

Easy to monitor too.Let's see if over the next couple of months there will be several hard hitting attacks on the government.

 

Whether there was a 'delighted atmosphere' as you claim or not is neither here nor there - there often is in an organization after a reforming "new broom" has been ousted.In any case it depends which journalist or regular correspondent is talking talking.If that was the opinion of the amiable but apolitical Crutchley it would hardly matter.If someone of stature/courage like Alan Dawson openly echoed your view I would have to think again.As for the majority of the Thai "journalists" on the BP, I don't think there is much need to reflect on their integrity, energy, literacy or independence since the record speaks for itself.Pandey's sidelining is the worst example of independent journalism being snuffed out at the BP but not the first eg Voranai Vanijaka.

[cliffspab]

On 5/19/2018 at 3:39 PM, jayboy said:

I think it can be assumed with certainty that the editorial tone will change.

 

Easy to monitor too.Let's see if over the next couple of months there will be several hard hitting attacks on the government.

 

Whether there was a 'delighted atmosphere' as you claim or not is neither here nor there - there often is in an organization after a reforming "new broom" has been ousted.In any case it depends which journalist or regular correspondent is talking talking.If that was the opinion of the amiable but apolitical Crutchley it would hardly matter.If someone of stature/courage like Alan Dawson openly echoed your view I would have to think again.As for the majority of the Thai "journalists" on the BP, I don't think there is much need to reflect on their integrity, energy, literacy or independence since the record speaks for itself.Pandey's sidelining is the worst example of independent journalism being snuffed out at the BP but not the first eg Voranai Vanijaka.

9

I hope you've noted the continued anti-junta line in the paper, especially Surasek's column comparing Prayut to Hun Sen the other day

[The Old Bull]

The Bangkok Post can get no blander. They have been serving up government 

"thin soup" for years.

[elwood]

On 5/19/2018 at 3:39 PM, jayboy said:

I think it can be assumed with certainty that the editorial tone will change.

 

Easy to monitor too.Let's see if over the next couple of months there will be several hard hitting attacks on the government.

 

Whether there was a 'delighted atmosphere' as you claim or not is neither here nor there - there often is in an organization after a reforming "new broom" has been ousted.In any case it depends which journalist or regular correspondent is talking talking.If that was the opinion of the amiable but apolitical Crutchley it would hardly matter.If someone of stature/courage like Alan Dawson openly echoed your view I would have to think again.As for the majority of the Thai "journalists" on the BP, I don't think there is much need to reflect on their integrity, energy, literacy or independence since the record speaks for itself.Pandey's sidelining is the worst example of independent journalism being snuffed out at the BP but not the first eg Voranai Vanijaka.

Voranai left of his own free will, to edit Thai GQ. Now he is back, and still laying into the government.

Incidentally, another poster remarked a few days back that Voranai was another junta-fanboy, so who is correct?

[elwood]

10 hours ago, cliffspab said:

I hope you've noted the continued anti-junta line in the paper, especially Surasek's column comparing Prayut to Hun Sen the other day

And another well written anti-junta editorial this morning.

[jayboy]

30 minutes ago, elwood said:

Voranai left of his own free will, to edit Thai GQ. Now he is back, and still laying into the government.

Incidentally, another poster remarked a few days back that Voranai was another junta-fanboy, so who is correct?

You are wrong.He was eased out because some of his articles were seen as too critical.I know about this pressure for certain because a group of us spoke to Voranai at an Oxbridge dinner a few years ago - he was a guest speaker.

 

Voranai is - like most intelligent people - a bit ambiguous about all sides and I would concede he has been a bit wobbly sometimes.Like many upper middle class Thais there's a bit of tribalism about him (and who of us can honestly claim not to have been influenced by class, education, upbringing?).It tends to be the dullards who think in binary terms.

 

Incidentally I think the expression "junta-fanboy" along with "Thaksin-fanboy" should be avoided.It's so crude and unhelpful.I shall add it to the list of expressions (farmers' suicides is the classic) that automatically loses the user the argument.

[elwood]

4 minutes ago, jayboy said:

You are wrong.He was eased out because some of his articles were seen as too critical.I know about this pressure for certain because a group of us spoke to Voranai at an Oxbridge dinner a few years ago - he was a guest speaker.

 

Voranai is - like most intelligent people - a bit ambiguous about all sides and I would concede he has been a bit wobbly sometimes.Like many upper middle class Thais there's a bit of tribalism about him (and who of us can honestly claim not to have been influenced by class, education, upbringing?).It tends to be the dullards who think in binary terms.

 

Incidentally I think the expression "junta-fanboy" along with "Thaksin-fanboy" should be avoided.It's so crude and unhelpful.I shall add it to the list of expressions (farmers' suicides is the classic) that automatically loses the user the argument.

Thanks for the enlightenment Jayboy, and I am pleased that Voranai is back in the BP fold.

Junta-fanboy; sorry about that; I should have said boot licker, which one poster used when referring to Voranai a  few days ago; something I never noticed in his excellent articles.