23 minutes ago, Siripon said:

Many foreigners can be summed up as a few posters on Thai Visa with a lot of time on their hands. I know several foreigners in Thailand who have no interest in Thai politics. And those outside almost certainly don't care.

Having said that, I hope the Amnesty campaign regarding the charges pressed against the protestors is successful and they can gather many signatures but I doubt the junta are shaking in their boots at fear of foreigners' impressions.

Isn't Prayuth off to Europe next week?

 

I expect you're right, though it seems to me that if the majority of foreigners living in Thailand don't really give a rat's ass about Thais or what happens to them, then that on it's own ought to worry Thais. Still, I expect if they've been brought up on a diet of exceptionalism and many of them have to worry where their next meal is coming from, then that would be a reason not to really care what foreigners think of them.

 

Personally, I think they care deeply what outsiders think of them, it's just that they live in an alternate reality where the propaganda they're subjected to since birth and the observable behaviour of outsiders towards them conflict, and they live in a more or less permanent state of cognitive dissonance. I do thonk however, that the propaganda thing is fading and being replaced by an authoritarian dicate of 'you will do what you're told'. This would bring them into sync with most authoritarian regimes. For anyone to believe the same hagiography that applied previously seems like s stretch to me.

 

I'm not so much talking about my own opinion, personally I think most Thais are sub-human where intelligence is concerned, that won't surprise anyone here I don't think, but I sometimes find it hard to shake of the vestiges of concern that some of my fellow humankind are so disadvantaged and exploited in the 21st century. I suppose it makes a difference that I've made a permanent home here and many (perhaps most) are just passing through, which probably means that I care where most just don't, time on my hands or not being moot, I wasn't always retired since coming here, but I have always been repulsed at a waste of human potential.

 

I think the basic problem is that they're locked into a noxious and mediaeval culture that teaches them that the Thai is superior in all things and they haven't got the brains or the time to challenge that version of reality for themselves. It seems like a real shame to me... If that's right, then I'll bet the reception Prayuth gets as he struts the world stage for domestic consumption is a real treat, I've seen some of the body laguage towards hoi from world leaders, and it doesn't encourage me to think my opinion of Thais is an isolated one.

 

I would really like to hear what others think, though perhaps I won't hear, for all of the above reasons.

2 minutes ago, KiwiKiwi said:

 

I expect you're right, though it seems to me that if the majority of foreigners living in Thailand don't really give a rat's ass about Thais or what happens to them, then that on it's own ought to worry Thais. Still, I expect if they've been brought up on a diet of exceptionalism and many of them have to worry where their next meal is coming from, then that would be a reason not to really care what foreigners think of them.

 

Personally, I think they care deeply what outsiders think of them, it's just that they live in an alternate reality where the propaganda they're subjected to since birth and the observable behaviour of outsiders towards them conflict, and they live in a more or less permanent state of cognitive dissonance.

 

I'm not so much talking about my own opinion, personally I think most Thais are sub-human where intelligence is concerned, that won't surprise anyone here I don't think, but I sometimes find it hard to shake of the vestiges of concern that some of my fellow humankind are so disadvantaged and exploited in the 21st century. I suppose it makes a difference that I've made a permanent home here and many (perhaps most) are just passing through, which probably means that I care where most just don't, time on my hands or not being moot, I wasn't always retired since coming here, but I have always been repulsed at a waste of human potential.

 

I think the basic problem is that they're locked into a noxious and mediaeval culture that teaches them that the Thai is superior in all things and they haven't got the brains or the time to challenge that version of reality for themselves. It seems like a real shame to me...

 

I would really like to hear what others think, though perhaps I won't hear, for all of the above reasons.

I agree with much of what you say, KiwiKiwi. But as a fellow human being, I hate to see other human beings (especially those who have been deliberately kept uneducated, poor and ignorant from day one, to benefit the ruthlessly exploitative Masters) being robbed of even the most basic and fundamental human and civil rights that should be theirs. 

 

Yes, the system here is shockingly mediaeval / feudal - but I still loathe bullies and naturally side with those powerless people who are constantly being kicked in the teeth (and worse).

 

I am sure, knowing of your humane sympathies, that you are not a million miles away from my own position!

7 minutes ago, Eligius said:

I agree with much of what you say, KiwiKiwi. But as a fellow human being, I hate to see other human beings (especially those who have been deliberately kept uneducated, poor and ignorant from day one, to benefit the ruthlessly exploitative Masters) being robbed of even the most basic and fundamental human and civil rights that should be theirs. 

 

Yes, the system here is shockingly mediaeval / feudal - but I still loathe bullies and naturally side with those powerless people who are constantly being kicked in the teeth (and worse).

 

I am sure, knowing of your humane sympathies, that you are not a million miles away from my own position!

 

And you'd be right about that. Perhaps I'm just blowing smoke... but I am reminded of lemmings running headlong towards a cliff - for whatever reason.

 

Kiwikiwi, I think your idea that the same hagiography can't be believed anymore is a very interesting point and one I've considered quite a bit. I've seen it slip and slide all over the place and people desperately trying to reinvent it and shore it up from attacks that come from reason and evidence and historical fact and inference. And others eventually shedding it somehow. But religious convictions are difficult to shed. If Jesus Christ came to earth tomorrow, I'd probably still find reasons to remain an atheist!!!

 

The redshirt "Ta Sawang" (eyes opened) notion which, of course, has gone very quiet with the NCPO watching the peasants closely was quite clearly an expression of disbelief in the official and sanctified version of history. I think that, if there is an election, if the oppression is removed, if the relevant laws go into abeyance and disuse or even better become ridiculous and impossible to maintain, things might change. A long series of ifs...

 

But still the most optimistic statement on the situation that I've ever heard is from an old Northern  farmer who when pressed with the yellow position that the northerners were the backbone of the nation, but pretty stupid, buffaloes, uneducated. He replied: "Yeah, they're sort of right, we used to be stupid."

 

As for the middle classes - beyond redemption perhaps, but with luck and time their talismans will eventually become a trivial cult that other people don't have to worry about or consider.

Lets all just go to the pub and have a beer. Its June now and next June we will be still seeing his face on friday night Tv telling us what a wonderful job the junta are doing

8 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

I am truly at a loss to understand these people.

 

These 'pronouncements' do nothing but hurt their own cause.

 

If there isn't going to be an election anytime soon, better for them simply to say so; there will be a price to be paid but from their perspective it is probably better paid earlier rather than later. Alternatively, if there is going to be an election early next year, these vague, undefined suggestions of times simply roil opponents and undercut the limited credibility of a Junta already lacking credibility.

 

Are there not political people in the Junta who understand this? Why are they not being listened to?

 

This is political self-harm for no logical reason.

 

see: der Untergang

well all you guys did predict this   --   awesome foresight  --  well done.