Junta figures deny using power to gain poll edge

[Eric Loh]

4 minutes ago, sungod said:

Like when Pheu Thai were in Government and  used Tharit and the DSI as a political tool you mean?

 

I don't think any government has the monopoly on this, they all do it.

Tharit was appointed by Ahbisit. 

[sungod]

1 minute ago, Eric Loh said:

Tharit was appointed by Ahbisit. 

Dont dispute that, and then manipulated by PT.

[robblok]

23 minutes ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

Lies.

Sure mate... hard to comprehend for people like you, should look up my comments about Prawit and his watches.. and corruption concerning Prayut his family. 

 

But I had not expected much different from you. 

[robblok]

Just now, sungod said:

Dont dispute that, and then manipulated by PT.

You won't get any straight replies from Eric ever condemning things of the PTP, he is incapable of it. Just like he avoids the hard questions when asked. He  accepts rumors from one side without proof, but rumors going against his side he needs proof. T

[sungod]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

You won't get any straight replies from Eric ever condemning things of the PTP, he is incapable of it. Just like he avoids the hard questions when asked. He  accepts rumors from one side without proof, but rumors going against his side he needs proof. T

Thanks, I gathered that from his rather weak response.

[Eric Loh]

35 minutes ago, robblok said:

You seem to believe the story of MP's being bribed without seeing real proof (you havent seen any nothing has been presented), but you don't seem to accept Thaksin paying his MP's because I can't show you proof.

The media ran the story about the Sam Mitr politicians being woo like cattle trading in various grades and monetary rewards. Haven't you seen that? Why don;t you show me similar reports that Thaksin did the same. 

[Eric Loh]

5 minutes ago, sungod said:

Dont dispute that, and then manipulated by PT.

Weak response.

[sungod]

1 minute ago, Eric Loh said:

The media ran the story about the Sam Mitr politicians being woo like cattle trading in various grades and monetary rewards. Haven't you seen that? Why don;t you show me similar reports that Thaksin did the same. 

Under starters orders................and he's off !!!!!!

 

 

[sungod]

1 minute ago, Eric Loh said:

Weak response.

Is that the best you got, copying me?

 

Thanks for your endorsement!

[robblok]

9 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

The media ran the story about the Sam Mitr politicians being woo like cattle trading in various grades and monetary rewards. Haven't you seen that? Why don;t you show me similar reports that Thaksin did the same. 

The media ran the story.. without any proof of financial transactions. Just like there is NO proof for Thaksin paying and yes there were articles about him paying. Just hard to find as its so long ago. 

 

Your too one sided, would have used an other word but I keep it civil as you always do stay civil. I will look into finding the articles but again I doubt that if I find then you will agree. You will find an other reason why its not true then.

 

 

 

[Eric Loh]

46 minutes ago, sungod said:

Under starters orders................and he's off !!!!!!

 

 

It is a start for the clueless. It’s that all you got.

[Eric Loh]

46 minutes ago, sungod said:

Is that the best you got, copying me?

 

Thanks for your endorsement!

You don’t see sacarsm even he kick you from the behind. Stay classy. 

[Eric Loh]

28 minutes ago, robblok said:

The media ran the story.. without any proof of financial transactions. Just like there is NO proof for Thaksin paying and yes there were articles about him paying. Just hard to find as its so long ago. 

 

Your too one sided, would have used an other word but I keep it civil as you always do stay civil. I will look into finding the articles but again I doubt that if I find then you will agree. You will find an other reason why its not true then.

 

 

 

I am being civil. If the news is false, the junta will sue them for defamation, close down the media or worse. Silence so far. 

[sungod]

3 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

You don’t see sacarsm even he kick you from the behind. Stay classy. 

Sarcasm is the only thing I excel in, as opposed to you who is just plain boring. Now run along and come up with a few of your own lines.

[Eric Loh]

6 minutes ago, sungod said:

Sarcasm is the only thing I excel in, as opposed to you who is just plain boring. Now run along and come up with a few of your own lines.

 

Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Mark Twain 

[sungod]

14 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

 

Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Mark Twain 

'Wise mean create proverbs, and fools repeat them'

(Samuel Palmer)

 

And on that note I'm off for some lunch ?

[JemJem]

This whole possible poll manipulation, possible election fraud, limiting of the opposition's capabilities  etc. , surely, cannot be as bad as all the nasty pre and post election stuff that has happened very recently in Turkey due to Erdogan and his AKP party. Can it ?  

 

I doubt it. But that (the Turkey stuff) is quite a high bar of nastiness of course.

Edited July 4, 2018 by JemJem

[tomta]

2 hours ago, BestB said:

Do not know who is cheating or who is not, but one thing for certain Junta is in no hurry to leave and if by some miracle they win an election , that would be the end of Thailand as we know it

They will "win" and it won't be  a miracle. It will be the result of the contemptible manipulation and bribery they have been perpetrating. And the suppression of free speech and inquiry.

[candide]

2 hours ago, sungod said:

Like when Pheu Thai were in Government and  used Tharit and the DSI as a political tool you mean?

 

I don't think any government has the monopoly on this, they all do it.

It seems to me that you suggest that they are all crooks, whatever their political stance, a statement with which few will disagree. 

However, the point made by Eric was addressing different issue. To express it more directly there is a big difference between having crooks in power, whose power is limited by an (albeit imperfect) democratic system, than having crooks who benefit from absolute power and absolute impunity.

Edited July 4, 2018 by candide

[Eric Loh]

23 minutes ago, candide said:

It seems to me that you suggest that they are all crooks, whatever their political stance, a statement with which few will disagree. 

However, the point made by Eric was addressing different issue. To express it more directly there is a big difference between having crooks in power, whose power is limited by an (albeit imperfect) democratic system, than having crooks who benefit from absolute power and absolute impunity.

The point I was making was that Tharit has remarkable political agility, being able to transform overnight from rabid, royalist supporters of Abhisit’s regime to political pussycats cuddling up to new Deputy Prime Minister Chalerm Yubamrung.  He went after the Red Shirts with a fervor during Ahbisit’s tenure and did the same under Yingluck’s government. Then he also was reluctant to investigate the Finland plot much to the annoyance of PTP. 

 

To quote him as being a tool for Yingluck is just a shallow attempt to make a point. Moreover as you stated, their power is limited like the charges against Ahbisit and Suthep for the shooting of civilians were discharged by NACC. Wide difference of the absolute power and the influence of this power on corruption agencies and even the judiciary system. 

[robblok]

24 minutes ago, candide said:

It seems to me that you suggest that they are all crooks, whatever their political stance, a statement with which few will disagree. 

However, the point made by Eric was addressing different issue. To express it more directly there is a big difference between having crooks in power, whose power is limited by an (albeit imperfect) democratic system, than having crooks who benefit from absolute power and absolute impunity.

But basically the junta crooks and the PTP crooks and democrats crooks all do the same stuff. I can dig up an article about Thaksins abuse of power. Fact is they all when in power will abuse it to their own end. They all also moan like crazy when they are on the receiving end of the abuse but smile and deny when they are the one doing it. 

 

Almost everyone (Eric excluded) will accept the fact that Thaksin pays his MP's and has offered incentives for them to join him. Nobody could really prove it, same as now they accuse the junta of it without proof. (proving such matters is always hard). I believe that Thaksin did what i just wrote and I believe that the junta is doing as they are accused of right now. I just find it ironic and fun. T

 

I doubt its even a good Idea for the PTP IF they get enough votes and that is a big IF (alone never.. only if they team up) to get in government. Because they will be handicapped take all the blame for things go wrong. This is not a good time to be in government with it being so restrictive.

 

That said not sure if the PTP can afford to be out of power for 4 more years.. 4 more years without government protection (they will influence everyone they have power on to stop court cases investigations against them once in power just like all other governments do) Also, the money must be running dry an other 4 years without pillaging the coffers of the government might be too much for them to stand (not saying others are not corrupt I am saying the PTP is corrupt and wants to be in power for money like the others)

 

Only party i believe in is future forward.. but they have to prove themselves.. but i like to keep a little bit hope for changing this rotten system.

 

 

[robblok]

1 minute ago, Eric Loh said:

The point I was making was that Tharit has remarkable political agility, being able to transform overnight from rabid, royalist supporters of Abhisit’s regime to political pussycats cuddling up to new Deputy Prime Minister Chalerm Yubamrung.  He went after the Red Shirts with a fervor during Ahbisit’s tenure and did the same under Yingluck’s government. Then he also was reluctant to investigate the Finland plot much to the annoyance of PTP. 

 

To quote him as being a tool for Yingluck is just a shallow attempt to make a point. Moreover as you stated, their power is limited like the charges against Ahbisit and Suthep for the shooting of civilians were discharged by NACC. Wide difference of the absolute power and the influence of this power on corruption agencies and even the judiciary system. 

To act like Tarit was not a tool for Yingluck is just a shallow attempt at denying facts. Everyone knows he was Yingluck her attack dog and used to go after political enemies. Just like the junta does with their tools. The PTP is not above the junta its tactics it uses them too. They are as dirty as the junta only difference is they were voted in. To you that means the world.. to me not so much as I judge actions.. not how they came in power and similar actions I judge with similar disapproval. I rather have a clean non corrupt military goverment (no not this junta as they are corrupt) then a corrupt PTP goverment that is voted in. 

 

That does not mean I want an other coup, its just an example of how i see things.. I think actions are the decisive factor.. not if someone is voted in. Most perfect would be of course a non corrupt voted in goverment. But i place a non corrupt military goverment over a corrupt civilian one. 

[pornprong]

6 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

Pheu Thai just can't stand the thought of anyone else cheating! They think that's only their right 555!

So you have no concerns about cheating, as long as its not PTP.

How wonderful (and clever).

The irony of your misguided conception is that PTP are actually the only ones that don't need to cheat to win an election (or five).

 

[DM07]

Who else finds "Junta Figures" a very fitting description for the muppets in charge?!

[pornprong]

4 hours ago, robblok said:

For people who are not scared and not worried about MP's defecting the PTP is making an awful lot of noise. Its ironic to see the mercenary MP members switching sides when they get a better offer. I can only say Thaksin is getting a piece of his own medicine using MP's to stay with him for money.. now it backfires. 

Your obsessive hatred of Thaksin blinds you to the obvious fact that the ones getting a dose of medicine are the Thai people.

You cheer on an undemocratic regime hellbent on keeping the poor and miserable poor and miserable so that they and theirs can continue to wallow in undeserved opulence and the only justification you can offer is "but, but,but Thhaaakkksssiiinnn".

 

4 hours ago, robblok said:

I have no bone in this fight.. I dislike both sides equally.. would be nice if they destroy each-other and a third party wins. 

You're a junta boy, plain and simple.

 

4 hours ago, robblok said:

I am real curious about the election results (whenever that will be). Personally I think the PTP will lose votes (not seats they will lose those for sure under the new system). But I am more interested to see how many votes they lose as what I heard there are a lot of defectors in south Isarn. The big question is will the votes follow them. That is the interesting part.

You think PTP will lose votes based on what???

The truth is.....you want PTP to lose votes based on what I can only imagine is a mixture of ignorance, gullibility and just a splash of fascism/right wing authoritarianism.

[pornprong]

4 hours ago, robblok said:

I think its fitting punishment .. how do you think he acquired these MP's in the first place. If they are as mercenary that they switch then they were paid for in the first place. Like what I and many members have always said Thaksin pays his members extra to keep them under control. The problem with that is if someone pays better they switch because money is the motivator.

 

So yes I think its funny and fitting punishment to see Thaksin his own breaking of the rules now back fires. 

How many MP's are we talking about here?

Can you even quantify how big the defection issue is......1 MP, 10 PM's.......50MP's?

How many sitting MP's from Yingluck's last government are swapping?

Do you have a clue?

 

The question also begging to be asked is "if money is the motivator" for those that switch, what do you attribute the motivation for majority who choose to stay with PTP"? How do you explain the multitude of PTP members turning down large windfall bribes to stay put?

Do enlighten us.

 

[pornprong]

4 hours ago, robblok said:

Sure, Eric i seen many articles about this already.. they are worried otherwise they would not bring it up that these guys are being paid and defecting. I think its real fitting that so many defect shows that only Thaksin his money kept them there. Like i and so many others have always stated and you have denied. 

If there is more money on offer on the other side.....why are so many remaining with Thaksin??

You are far to close minded and one eyed in your views of the world.

It seems every single thing in your life is viewed solely through the prism of Thaksin.

[pornprong]

3 hours ago, robblok said:

You can say what you want, if you look at my posts you will find many bad things about the junta. Unlike many here I am not blind. Thaksin is evil and so is the junta.

The order in which you list the evil ones reveals all.

Thaksin is evil and so is the Junta

 

You've only started tacking on and so is the Junta since the revealed list of Junta misdeeds has become so long and grotesque that even the strong doses of kool aid and ignorance that previously did the job are no longer effective.

[robblok]

2 minutes ago, pornprong said:

If there is more money on offer on the other side.....why are so many remaining with Thaksin??

You are far to close minded and one eyed in your views of the world.

It seems every single thing in your life is viewed solely through the prism of Thaksin.

Just like you defend the guy till the end.. you the same as me but at the opposite end of the spectrum.

As for your question why so many remain, maybe they think he will win again and then they will get nice positions that get them money. Do you honestly believe they are not all in it for the money ? (and I mean all junta, ptp, democrats ect) only one i exclude is future forward. 

 

I am not a junta boy I am a future forward boy who sees the truth about Thaksin. He is a corrupt criminal all those court cases against him prove it. I hate corruption no matter who does it.

[Eric Loh]

30 minutes ago, robblok said:

To act like Tarit was not a tool for Yingluck is just a shallow attempt at denying facts. Everyone knows he was Yingluck her attack dog and used to go after political enemies. Just like the junta does with their tools. The PTP is not above the junta its tactics it uses them too. They are as dirty as the junta only difference is they were voted in. To you that means the world.. to me not so much as I judge actions.. not how they came in power and similar actions I judge with similar disapproval. I rather have a clean non corrupt military goverment (no not this junta as they are corrupt) then a corrupt PTP goverment that is voted in. 

 

That does not mean I want an other coup, its just an example of how i see things.. I think actions are the decisive factor.. not if someone is voted in. Most perfect would be of course a non corrupt voted in goverment. But i place a non corrupt military goverment over a corrupt civilian one. 

You simply don’t make sense. How on earth you can have a clean non corrupt military when they already corrupt themselves by seizing power from an elected government.

 

You don’t want a coup but you approved a military government. That’s incoherent thinking.