Change the reason for extension of stay from work to dependent

[Mattd]

Well, after a good long run it looks like I will be needing to change the reason for my extension of stay from work to my youngest son (16).

I need to get a good understanding of how to achieve this as easily as possible, my current extension was issued at CW and the extension based on dependent will need to be done at Jomtien.

 

This is my understanding now, please let me know where I've got it wrong, or it can be improved.

 

1. My contract will finish on 21st September 2018, I'm pretty sure that my employer will be relaxed about that date in terms of cancelling the current extension of stay a few days either way.

2. Attend CW immigration and cancel the current extension of stay based on work, with a letter from the employer.

3. Head to Jomtien immigration and firstly submit a TM.28 and a TM.30 for the change of address (CW have never needed these), once these are in, then apply to change the reason for the extension to dependency.

 

So the questions related to the above.

 

1. Can I submit the TM.28 / TM.30 at Jomtien in advance of cancelling the current extension in CW?

2. Will I have to cancel the existing extension in CW and reapply in Jomtien on the same day? (I suspect so) Is there a way around this at all, it is doable, but depending on how long it takes in CW / traffic it could be a stretch.

 

Regarding the change over, these are the documents I will take with me to Jomtien.

 

1. Tabien Baan showing my son - original and copies.

2. Thai birth certificate for my son - original and copies.

3. Copy of original Thai marriage certificate and divorce certificate - This proves that myself and his mother were married at the time of his birth, therefore legalizing him.

4. Copy of the divorce agreement stating I have custody of him - This is not from a court, the divorce was amicable and at an Amphur office (Banglamung).

5. Bank book showing 400k THB - Do I need a letter from the bank as well and if so, does it have to be the same day? (difficult if combining CW & Jomtien as well!!)

6. Completed TM.7 and photos.

7. Copies of passports with previous extensions and original Non - B visa from 2004 and of course existing passport photo page, latest entry stamp and TM.6

 

Obviously my son will have to be with me in Jomtien, is there any advantage in my ex. wife going as well regarding custody?

 

What am I missing or misunderstanding?

 

[ubonjoe]

1/2. To get a enough time to apply for the extension in Jomtien you can cancel your extension a few days before the date on a termination letter from your employer and immigration will postdate the cancelation prior to that date.

3. Will you have proof of residence for Pattaya area when you do the TM28/30. You will need a rental agreement and copies of the owners house book and ID card.

 

1. You might be able do the TM28/30 in advance.

2. Yes unless you do as I wrote above.

 

5. The bank letter can be done a couple of days before the day you apply for the extension. You will also need copies of your updated bank book.

    Will you have the 400k baht in the bank on the date your apply. Jomtien may require that even though the rules do no state it is needed to apply for an extension based upon being the parent of a Thai.

6. Two completed TM7 forms will be needed along with 2 sets of copies of the required documents. One set will will be sent to division 3 in Bangkok for their approval of your application.

You will need a few more things that will include photos of you and child in and around the house and one showing with both of you together.

I highly suggest you contact Jomtien immigration to find out what will be required to do the extension application. Every office has their own requirements.

You ex wife will not need to be with you when your apply.

One option to get more time between the cancelation in Bangkok and the extension application in Jomtien would be to apply for a 60 day extension at Chaeng Wattana to visit your child when you do the cancellation. They would need to be with you when you apply, birth certificate and copy of their house book registry.

[Mattd]

Thanks Joe,

 

Yes, I will have proof of my residence for the TM.28 / TM.30, the house was the marital home and my ex. wife is the housemaster in the tabien baan, so no problem to get copies of this and her ID card, the divorce agreement states clearly that I have the right to live there, if needed then we can draft a rental agreement for immigration purposes - thoughts?

As I said the ex. and I are on good terms and she is horrified at the thought of me leaving Thailand, so will assist in anyway needed.

 

Noted on canceling in CW a few days before or extending for 60 days based on my son, I hadn't thought of those, thanks, either would work.

 

Noted on the bank letter and updated bank book, it shouldn't be an issue to time it to do this the day before going to Jomtien (branch is at Pinthong IE, so close to Sri Racha).

400k is in the bank and has been for a lot longer than 3 months, so this should not present a problem immigration wise.

 

I will go to Jomtien office and ask them about their particular requirements well in advance, thanks for the suggestion, the single biggest concern is the custody, as this is just contained within the divorce agreement that was prepared by lawyers and signed by us both, not sure if this will be accepted or not.

 

I want to do the extension on dependency rather than retirement, so if more work comes along I can take advantage without having to mess around with immigration.

 

Noted on needing 2 x TM.7 and 2 sets of copies, plus the photos of my son around the house and together with me.

 

Edited August 21, 2018 by Mattd

[ubonjoe]

9 minutes ago, Mattd said:

Yes, I will have proof of my residence for the TM.28 / TM.30, the house was the marital home and my ex. wife is the housemaster in the tabien baan, so no problem to get copies of this and her ID card, the divorce agreement states clearly that I have the right to live there, if needed then we can draft a rental agreement for immigration purposes - thoughts?

No need for a rental agreement. A written statement form her stating you are living in her house along with signed copies of her house book and ID card would be enough.

 

11 minutes ago, Mattd said:

I want to do the extension on dependency rather than retirement, so if more work comes along I can take advantage without having to mess around with immigration.

The extension is for being the parent of a Thai. A dependency visa or extension does not exist. You can get a work permit and work with that type of extension.

 

14 minutes ago, Mattd said:

I will go to Jomtien office and ask them about their particular requirements well in advance, thanks for the suggestion, the single biggest concern is the custody, as this is just contained within the divorce agreement that was prepared by lawyers and signed by us both, not sure if this will be accepted or not.

Custody granted as part of the divorce agreement is legal document that immigration should accept.

[Mattd]

1 minute ago, ubonjoe said:

No need for a rental agreement. A written statement form her stating you are living in her house along with signed copies of her house book and ID card would be enough.

 

The extension is for being the parent of a Thai. A dependency visa or extension does not exist. You can get a work permit and work with that type of extension.

 

Custody granted as part of the divorce agreement is legal document that immigration should accept.

All understood thanks.

[Mattd]

One more thing, I should include copies of my son's Thai ID card signed by him?

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, Mattd said:

One more thing, I should include copies of my son's Thai ID card signed by him?

Yes if he has one.

[Mattd]

10 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Yes if he has one.

Will do and yes, he is 16 so must have one, well that is if he hasn't lost it again!

[Mattd]

On 8/21/2018 at 9:48 AM, ubonjoe said:

To get a enough time to apply for the extension in Jomtien you can cancel your extension a few days before the date on a termination letter from your employer and immigration will postdate the cancelation prior to that date.

@ubonjoe do you have any idea how many days immigration would accept my employer to forward date the cancellation date by? For example, if we go to CW on lets say 28th August, then would they be OK with the 31st August, or better still 4th September?

The company are saying the earliest we can go to CW is the 28th, as they need a document from the revenue department first, I am assuming this must be a tax clearance certificate perhaps?

[ubonjoe]

18 minutes ago, Mattd said:

@ubonjoe do you have any idea how many days immigration would accept my employer to forward date the cancellation date by? For example, if we go to CW on lets say 28th August, then would they be OK with the 31st August, or better still 4th September?

The company are saying the earliest we can go to CW is the 28th, as they need a document from the revenue department first, I am assuming this must be a tax clearance certificate perhaps?

If the termination letter was dated for September 4th they accept it on the 28th.

I have never heard of anything being needed from the revenue department to cancel an extension. 

[Mattd]

12 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

If the termination letter was dated for September 4th they accept it on the 28th.

I have never heard of anything being needed from the revenue department to cancel an extension. 

Thanks, will see if can go for that.

I've never heard of it either, but they insist on getting something from there and it will have been on advice from the lawyer / agent they use for immigration stuff.

[Mattd]

Quick update / report, went to Jomtien Immigration this morning to submit both the TM28 and TM30, this area was surprisingly busy, but mainly with people that were unsure what to do or why, just shows that this reporting isn't widely understood!

Whilst waiting my turn, I saw 4 people get fined 1,600 THB for not reporting within the specified time, just prior to me, there was an American guy who was directed in to the address reporting area, as he was coming to extend his 30 VE entry by a further 30 days, his ticket out is 8 days later than his current permission to stay, he is staying at the Holiday Inn executive wing, immigration lady checks the online system and the hotel had NOT reported him as staying there (been there nearly 3 weeks!) to be fair she did not fine him, just told him to go back to the hotel and ask them to make the report online, got me wondering why immigration do not chase the hotel for a fine and compliance, it isn't exactly a flea pit after all, poor guy had to go back to his hotel, then return to immigration to repeat and hopefully get his 30 day extension!

 

With me, for the TM30 they accepted a letter, written by me in English and signed by my ex. wife, stating that I was living at the house, copies of the house registration, her ID card, my passport data page, extension page and latest TM6 / entry stamp, they had no problem with my explanation regarding working in Bangkok / moving to here for the time discrepancy between arrival in Thailand in April 2018 and now.

TM28 was not required to be submitted, I asked twice, in fact the girl said 'no need it is same same form TM30, but TM30 better'.................!!!!

 

Asked about the requirements for extending based on my son, which are pretty much the same as I thought originally and confirmed by ubonjoe.

 

Lets see what next week brings with the cancellation of the existing extension at CW and reapplying in Jomtien.

[Tanoshi]

54 minutes ago, Mattd said:

Asked about the requirements for extending based on my son, which are pretty much the same as I thought originally and confirmed by ubonjoe.

Long term your going to have to apply based on retirement within the next few years, but I'm guessing your already aware of that fact and planning ahead.

[ubonjoe]

7 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Long term your going to have to apply based on retirement within the next few years, but I'm guessing your already aware of that fact and planning ahead.

Why?

Or are you under the incorrect impression he cannot apply based upon being the parent of Thai if the child is 20 or older. There is no rule that states that.

[Tanoshi]

2 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Why?

Or are you under the incorrect impression he cannot apply based upon being the parent of Thai if the child is 20 or older. There is no rule that states that.

Yep, I'm looking at sections 2.18 and 2.19, both state the child must not be over 20 years of age.

[ubonjoe]

14 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Yep, I'm looking at sections 2.18 and 2.19, both state the child must not be over 20 years of age.

That is for a child to get an extension under clause 2.18 (pay attention to the or at the end of it)

 

 

There is no age limit in this one for being the parent of Thai .

[Mattd]

32 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Long term your going to have to apply based on retirement within the next few years, but I'm guessing your already aware of that fact and planning ahead.

 

22 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Why?

Or are you under the incorrect impression he cannot apply based upon being the parent of Thai if the child is 20 or older. There is no rule that states that.

 

17 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Yep, I'm looking at sections 2.18 and 2.19, both state the child must not be over 20 years of age.

Yes, I must admit I was under the impression that 20 was the cut off age, although not sure if it would be applicable if they / he were in full time education here?

The reason I will use my youngest son is because he is 16, the other is 19 and 20 in May next year.

Will see how it all pans out employment wise before thinking so far ahead, worst case I'll end up going back to the UK, which will be a shock to the system after virtually 30 years here!!

 

The point of my report was really to show that even the bigger hotels don't necessarily comply with the reporting of the address, which causes complications when immigration services are needed, at least in Jomtien.

Edited August 24, 2018 by Mattd

[Tanoshi]

23 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

 

There is no age limit in this one for being the parent of Thai (pay attention to the or at the end of it).

 

What clause is that taken from? (2.18)

Surely that is the section Matt will apply under as the Father of a Thai national.

 

I see no OR, other than for the financials.

Edited August 24, 2018 by Tanoshi

[ubonjoe]

17 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

What clause is that taken from? (2.18)

Surely that is the section Matt will apply under as the Father of a Thai national.

I see no OR, other than for the financials.

Both are from 2.18. Number (4) is for the children of the foreign husband or wife to get an extension.

I edited my post shortly after posting to move the or comment to (4) of 2.18.

[Tanoshi]

16 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Both are from 2.18. Number (4) is for the children of the foreign husband or wife to get an extension.

I edited my post shortly after posting to move the or comment to (4) of 2.18.

(4) In the case of children, adopted children, or spouse's children, said children, adopted
children, or spouse's children must not be married, must live with the alien as part of the

family, and must not be over 20 years of age except in case of the person hereof is of illness
or disability and cannot live without support of father or mother: or
(5) In the case of parents, the father or mother must maintain an average annual income
of no less than Baht 40,000 per month throughout the year or must have deposited funds of
no less than Baht 400,000 to cover expenses for one year.

 

Ok, thanks, now I've got it!

 

So to clarify my understanding and your interpretation;

If Matt had a dependant son from a previous marriage (non Thai) the son could apply for extensions provided he wasn't married or over 20 without any financial proof under 2.18 clause 4.

 

As the parent of a Thai child, Matt can apply for an extension based on being the dependant, regardless of age or marital status of the child, but must prove financial status under 2.18 clause 5.

 

Edited August 24, 2018 by Tanoshi

[Mattd]

@ubonjoe sorry, quick one, do I need to copy every single extension of stay since 2004 including the passport changes etc. or only the existing extension of stay which will be the one they cancel?

I will take a copy of the original non-b visa and the data page of the passport that that was in.

[ubonjoe]

16 minutes ago, Mattd said:

@ubonjoe sorry, quick one, do I need to copy every single extension of stay since 2004 including the passport changes etc. or only the existing extension of stay which will be the one they cancel?

I will take a copy of the original non-b visa and the data page of the passport that that was in.

You only need copies of your current passport pages. To cancel the extension you will only need a copy of your current extension and the page with the stamp put in your passport when you got the new one that has info about your visa and old passport on it.

I don't think Jomtien will want anything more than your current extension, most recent entry stamp and the page that has the stamp I mentioned.

[Mattd]

OK thanks, that is a relief, would have been a lot of copying to do!

I have changed passport twice since 2004, so to be safe I will make copies of the two passport changes and take the originals with me.

Company has confirmed to go to CW on 29th.

[Mattd]

Not the greatest experience yesterday at CW immigration, arrived there just after 8am, once open and inside it was discovered that the agent the company use had not got the original document from DBD (he only had a copy), luckily DBD have an office on the floor below, so he had to go and get the original, the IO would not issue a queue number until that was all in order, after about 20 minutes this was done and got queue no. 73!!

Finally got seen at 3pm, some 7 hours after arriving, the cancellation itself took all of 5 minutes............. effective from 4th September, so next step Jomtien immigration with my son.

 

As a side note, whilst sitting there waiting, was looking at the paperwork produced for all the different types of service in CW, I watched 25 sack truck loads (full) go to the side office on the right side of the M desks, this is just one day of one immigration office, there must be thousands of tons of paper stored somewhere!! Apparently they retain it for 10 years!

[Mattd]

@ubonjoe A couple more queries if I may.

1. Will immigration accept statements printed from online and then endorsed by the bank, or 3 months of statements printed by the bank themselves, or does it have to be the updated passbook? (I will get the bank letter as well)

The reason I ask is that I haven't done a book update in over 4 years on this account and there has been lots of activity, I'd guess 4 or 5 books worth at least, which takes a lot of time and effort on behalf of the bank, SCB won't just print lets say 3 months activity, they will only do from the last time the passbook was updated to now!

2. Copies of the house registration with my son in it, do these need signing by his mother as she is the housemaster? Not a problem to do if so, also does my son need to sign the page he is entered on?

 

Edited August 30, 2018 by Mattd

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, Mattd said:

@ubonjoe A couple more queries if I may.

1. Will immigration accept statements printed from online and then endorsed by the bank, or 3 months of statements printed by the bank themselves, or does it have to be the updated passbook? (I will get the bank letter as well)

The reason I ask is that I haven't done a book update in over 4 years on this account and there has been lots of activity, I'd guess 4 or 5 books worth at least, which takes a lot of time and effort on behalf of the bank, SCB won't just print lets say 3 months activity, they will only do from the last time the passbook was updated to now!

2. Copies of the house registration with my son in it, do these need signing by his mother as she is the housemaster? Not a problem to do if so, also does my son need to sign the page he is entered on?

 

1. Normally when a bank book has not been updated for a long time the update will only show the current balance. You should get a statement from the bank stamped by them to present to immigration showing the balance for the last 3 months to prove it has been there at least 3 months.

2. You or your son can sign the house book copies.

[Mattd]

5 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

1. Normally when a bank book has not been updated for a long time the update will only show the current balance. You should get a statement from the bank stamped by them to present to immigration showing the balance for the last 3 months to prove it has been there at least 3 months.

2. You or your son can sign the house book copies.

Thanks, I will get the bank to print 3 months worth of statements and write the letter. Will also ask them about the book update, if it is only a print to show the current balance, then will do that as well.

Noted on the house book copies, we will both sign them for good measure.

[Mattd]

Will be going to Jomtien this morning as today is the last day, the other extension cancellation is effective today.

 

Paperwork hopefully all prepared apart from photos, which I'll get close by to the immigration office.

 

Taking two full sets of the following.

 

TM.7 

Copies of the following pages of existing passport: Data page, last entry / TM.6, extension of stay, cancellation stamp from CW and transfer of stamps to new passport.

Copies of previous passports with data pages, transfer of stamps and original non b visa (may not be needed, but no harm to take)

House Registration - copy of the first page and the page my son is entered on.

Son's Thai Birth certificate & ID card.

Copy of marriage & divorce certificates, including name change certificates for the ex. wife, as her first name has changed four times between the two certs!!

Copy of the relevant sections of the divorce agreement to show custody.

3 months bank statements & bank letter showing 400k + in the account, all issued yesterday.

Photos of my son in the house and in front of the house, one of which with myself.

Hand drawn map of the house location.

TM.30 slip issued by Jomtien on 24th August 2018.

Printout of last online 90 day report approval issued by CW on 6th July 2018.

 

Originals: Passports, birth certificate, house registration, son's ID card, updated bank passbook, divorce certificate and divorce agreement.

 

Am I forgetting anything?

 

@ubonjoe I was just thinking, would it be wise to stop at an ATM and get a printout of the balance on the account as of this morning showing that it hasn't changed from yesterday's bank statements / bank letters?

Edited September 4, 2018 by Mattd

[ubonjoe]

20 minutes ago, Mattd said:

Photos of my son in the house and in front of the house, one of which with myself.

You will need to be with your son in all the photos. One must show both of you with the house number shown.

[Mattd]

2 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

You will need to be with your son in all the photos. One must show both of you with the house number shown.

Ah, now that could be a problem, as we are the only ones in the house right now, so nobody to take the photos, the one I do have of us both already is showing the house number, let me try to think how to get more with us both together in the house.

Edited September 4, 2018 by Mattd