Setup a company, work permit and visa

[FritsSikkink]

44 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

I refer to salaries of the Thais being paid in the tourist-sector in businesses that serve Western customers, such as guesthouses, sit-down restaurants, and pubs  - vs the jobs paying the minimum, such as "package tour" hotels and convenience-stores. 

Hopefully, the OP will open a business like this, rather than just an "on paper" business - assuming he can find a market niche that can survive the continual screw-tightening by immigration to root-out his potential customers.

 

I would not argue that the expat gross-take is proportionally massive - just that each one of us support multiple Thai jobs, many of which pay above the low-end.  Each baht we spend makes the country richer, since it comes from abroad.  We receive no taxpayer benefit, and are not the cause of overburdened infrastructure, crowding, etc.

 

If it were a "one or the other" question, that would be a valid argument, but we are not harming other economic-sectors.  Western expats don't eat or live at the same places as the "package" tourists.  Nor are we affecting the "elite" crowd, who live on another tier, above.  When I wonder why this is happening, I can only think of reasons which would be connected to corruption - only that this agenda is being paid-for.

 

This issue doesn't affect me directly any more - I live in the boonies now with my wife.  But I saw the damage while living in Jomtien, as one business after another was boarded-up - and we still have Western and Thai friends down there.  This pointless policy, being run primarily out of the Bangkok airports, is not helpful to any of them.

"one business after another was boarded-up"

These business are boarded up because the owners don't adept to the different sort of tourists coming to Thailand the last decade.

 

Why should the government let people stay here who can't sort out a proper visa? I think it is laughable that people who have 40K THB to spend a month think they make any impact on the economy. Thinking that they are well off because they have a couple times the minimum wage in a third world / developing country. Threatening they will move elsewhere if the government won't stop applying the law. 

They have to move elsewhere because they can't afford to live here anymore which is sad for them but won't make any impact on the economy. Tourism is growing year on year and the new tourists do spend a lot of money albeit not in the Western bars and restaurants. 

[manarak]

12 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

The people who are leaving are spending not much money anyhow otherwise they could afford a proper visa, so goodbye.

It's not that simple.

I have been trying to find staff for years, but it's really very difficult in my business (internet/programming).

I'm not a tourist, I need a work permit because I am working and paying taxes, but currently the requirement to have 4 Thai employees is an obstacle and I can't afford to pay 4 people for doing nothing.

I think it's good if some flexibility can be found in an arrangement in which nobody is at a disadvantage, from any perspective. Everybody benefits.

[FritsSikkink]

57 minutes ago, manarak said:

It's not that simple.

I have been trying to find staff for years, but it's really very difficult in my business (internet/programming).

I'm not a tourist, I need a work permit because I am working and paying taxes, but currently the requirement to have 4 Thai employees is an obstacle and I can't afford to pay 4 people for doing nothing.

I think it's good if some flexibility can be found in an arrangement in which nobody is at a disadvantage, from any perspective. Everybody benefits.

Sorry to say but if you can't find staff (put an add on https://th.jobsdb.com/th) , you can't make enough money to pay staff and you can't find work for staff then you don't have a proper business, you are a freelancer which isn't allowed here.

[manarak]

2 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

Sorry to say but if you can't find staff (put an add on https://th.jobsdb.com/th) , you can't make enough money to pay staff and you can't find work for staff then you don't have a proper business, you are a freelancer which isn't allowed here.

looks as if you have only commonplace banalities to say.

 

I make enough money to pay staff, but I can't find enough people worth spending the money on.

[KKBrian]

https://www.thailandstarterkit.com/business/thailand-company-registration/

 

http://msnagroup.com/faq/fees-to-set-up-a-company-in-thailand/

 

i hope this helps you

[FritsSikkink]

4 hours ago, manarak said:

looks as if you have only commonplace banalities to say.

 

I make enough money to pay staff, but I can't find enough people worth spending the money on.

Maybe you should pay a recruiter to help you with this problem. My IT company doesn't have that problem.

[JackThompson]

14 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

"one business after another was boarded-up"

These business are boarded up because the owners don't adept to the different sort of tourists coming to Thailand the last decade.

... because the "different sort of tourists" shop at convenience-stores and stay at large, commercial "package-tour" hotels.  There is no way that many of those small businesses could "adapt" to this.

 

14 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

Why should the government let people stay here who can't sort out a proper visa?

Without digressing into what "proper" means - Why should the government turn people with money to spend away?  What is gained?

 

14 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

I think it is laughable that people who have 40K THB to spend a month think they make any impact on the economy.

They create better-paying employment for Thai people and opportunities for thousands of Thai businesses.  That is the impact.  It is important to those affected - expat and Thai.

14 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

Thinking that they are well off because they have a couple times the minimum wage in a third world / developing country.

40K is over 5x the Thai min-wage for full-time.

 

14 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

Threatening they will move elsewhere if the government won't stop applying the law. 

They have to move elsewhere because they can't afford to live here anymore which is sad for them

They can and do live here just fine.  I lived on that in a relatively expensive area of the country - with a view of the ocean and islands from my condo (not a hovel), eating out at restaurants most days (not street-food) with my now-wife, going on trips around the country, etc. 

 

The only problem people with that income-level (or even less) encounter, is entry to the country at certain checkpoints.

 

14 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

but won't make any impact on the economy.

It impacts many Thai lives negatively.  Whether it creates a major impact in the macro-economic sense is another question.  This policy fuels a sense of hopelessness in all those whose opportunities were senselessly-destroyed, contributing to social/political instability. 

 

A small minority who is thrown under the bus by policies like this - whose chance to be successful in the market is needlessly thrown in the trash - leads people to give up hope in market-based economics and in the govt, generally.  That is the greater threat.  Enough Thais have socialist-leanings - thanks to Soros-funded NGOs, and limited economic opportunities as-is.  There is no need to manufacture more of this sentiment with foolish polices that convince them that their businesses/jobs/lives/families don't matter to the authorities.  We need more Thai-capitalist success-stories - not less.

 

14 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

Tourism is growing year on year and the new tourists do spend a lot of money albeit not in the Western bars and restaurants. 

Agreed.  But this is in no way harmed by Western expats staying and keeping Western-expat supported bars and restaurants open, also.

[FritsSikkink]

50 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

... because the "different sort of tourists" shop at convenience-stores and stay at large, commercial "package-tour" hotels.  There is no way that many of those small businesses could "adapt" to this.

 

Without digressing into what "proper" means - Why should the government turn people with money to spend away?  What is gained?

 

They create better-paying employment for Thai people and opportunities for thousands of Thai businesses.  That is the impact.  It is important to those affected - expat and Thai.

40K is over 5x the Thai min-wage for full-time.

 

They can and do live here just fine.  I lived on that in a relatively expensive area of the country - with a view of the ocean and islands from my condo (not a hovel), eating out at restaurants most days (not street-food) with my now-wife, going on trips around the country, etc. 

 

The only problem people with that income-level (or even less) encounter, is entry to the country at certain checkpoints.

 

It impacts many Thai lives negatively.  Whether it creates a major impact in the macro-economic sense is another question.  This policy fuels a sense of hopelessness in all those whose opportunities were senselessly-destroyed, contributing to social/political instability. 

 

A small minority who is thrown under the bus by policies like this - whose chance to be successful in the market is needlessly thrown in the trash - leads people to give up hope in market-based economics and in the govt, generally.  That is the greater threat.  Enough Thais have socialist-leanings - thanks to Soros-funded NGOs, and limited economic opportunities as-is.  There is no need to manufacture more of this sentiment with foolish polices that convince them that their businesses/jobs/lives/families don't matter to the authorities.  We need more Thai-capitalist success-stories - not less.

 

Agreed.  But this is in no way harmed by Western expats staying and keeping Western-expat supported bars and restaurants open, also.

You can't adept as a business, you fail. don't blame others. 

 

Every country has rules by which to comply if you want to live there, obey the rules, don't blame them for being there.

 

Like I said before, Thais have a new job in no time. You might think they pay very well but they are on the low end of the market.

 

40K THB for a foreigner is nothing, people on benefits in the Netherlands get that as a minimum. You may feel rich in a developing country but you aren't.

 

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

You can't adept as a business, you fail. don't blame others. 

If an artificial means is used to choke-out your business - such as physically preventing your current/former customers from continuing to patronize to your business - you have every right to blame that which is obstructing your otherwise successful business as the cause.  Similar if your job is given-away to a cheap-labor source by traitor-policies (immigration / outsourcing).  Blame is absolutely appropriate in those conditions.

 

That doesn't mean one don't move on and adapt to their damaged life-circumstances, and try to improve one's condition. But unlikely they will forget who didn't value/consider their lives, when setting national-policy.

 

It is this reality that tempers my otherwise free-market views.  If we want something approximating a free-market, we have to make sure that market "works" for enough people, that is is generally supported.  It is better to do this by good policy that enables successful small businesses, than creeping socialist safety-net measures. 

 

In this case, let the customers enter the country, with their own money, so they can patronize those businesses.  This creates success-stories and decreases the demand for handout-based systems.

 

Quote

Every country has rules by which to comply if you want to live there, obey the rules, don't blame them for being there.

Yes.  But unfortunately, the published-rules are not being followed at some major points-of-entry - a change in policy which causes the problem for businesses, above.  I believe this is due to corruption, given there is no other logical explanation that fits. 

 

Quote

Like I said before, Thais have a new job in no time. You might think they pay very well but they are on the low end of the market.

When on the "low end" of payscales, a 30%-50% decrease is massive.  That is the range of how much more the closed Western-oriented business I cited above paid, vs convenience-store pay. 

 

Quote

40K THB for a foreigner is nothing, people on benefits in the Netherlands get that as a minimum. You may feel rich in a developing country but you aren't. 

How poorly one would live in an high-overhead country on that amount/mo is not relevant to Thailand.  The point is, it is all foreign-money being injected into the Thai economy creating jobs (good for them), and provides a satisfactory life for many expats (good for us), and there is no downside for either party which would create a reason to end this "win win" arrangement. 

 

This is why I disagree with the position that "less-rich" expats should leave Thailand.  The OP would have more angles for a successful business if they stay, and his business would benefit his Thai hires.  Even if only 4 of Thais hired and it never expands, that's 4 lives/families better off for as long as he can maintain profitability.