Confused with Investment Visa - How old can the condo be?

[Sophon]

On 11/4/2018 at 4:51 PM, elviajero said:

Thailand Elite provide help, if necessary, in opening a bank account and applying for a driving license.

 

It would probably be easier to obtain both for a TE member than it would for a non-immigrant visa holder.

I never suggested that it would be difficult for a Thailand Elite member to open an account or renew a drivers license, just that the account/license could be of a different (less attractive) category.

 

Sophon

[hrrecruiter]

13 minutes ago, faranglaowai said:

One final thing to remember is that it's the value registered at the Land Office that counts to the 10m, not what you pay.

 

Very often, if you pay a developer directly, say 10m then the actual registration at the Land Office may be only 8m (they can reduce their costs of transfer this way), leaving you with another 2m to hold in a bank to make up the 10m for the Investment Extension.

 

Since you will be paying a 'flipper', they will be making some money (likely) and thus the declared value at the Land Office may be much lower than 10m, leaving you with a bigger problem.

 

Personal experience speaking here.  Been there and done that.

Appreciate your input. Tks

[hrrecruiter]

36 minutes ago, stud858 said:

Invest or elite visa, still up to the IO to allow or deny your entry. Either way not the best bet in my opinion. Too risky.  

But hey,  I'm a pessimist.  

Its my current status and a great option, Im just weighting the pros and cons to see if the property can beat that. If I need to bring 10m and sit on cash for most of the time earning >2%, plus the risks, etc, the 500k for 5y Elite looks a much better option indeed.Tks

Edited November 5, 2018 by hrrecruiter

[elviajero]

3 hours ago, Sophon said:

I never suggested that it would be difficult for a Thailand Elite member to open an account or renew a drivers license, just that the account/license could be of a different (less attractive) category.

 

Sophon

You were saying that having a non-immigrant visa is an advantage over a Tourist Visa. I was pointing out that isn’t the case for TE members — even if the PE Visa is classed as a Tourist Visa — which I don’t beleive it is.

[Sophon]

6 minutes ago, elviajero said:

You were saying that having a non-immigrant visa is an advantage over a Tourist Visa. I was pointing out that isn’t the case for TE members — even if the PE Visa is classed as a Tourist Visa — which I don’t beleive it is.

Try reading what I said again.

 

With a Non Immigrant visa you can get a five year license when you renew, with a tourist visa you will only get a two year license. Advantage for the Non Immigrant visa.

 

When opening a bank account, you might get a non resident account if on a tourist visa. That results in no interest on your account in Krung Thai Bank, an an inability to get internet banking in Bangkok Bank. Both things happened to me personally. With a Non Immigrant visa none of those things apply. Again, advantage for the Non Immigrant visa.

 

And yes, the Thailand Elite is classified as a tourist visa.

 

Understand now?

 

Sophon

 

[elviajero]

47 minutes ago, Sophon said:

And yes, the Thailand Elite is classified as a tourist visa.

It is not Tourist Visa, it’s a Privilege Entry Visa. 

 

The maximum stay per entry for tourism is limited to 90 days by law. This visa is not issued for tourism; it’s issued under investment conditions, which is why they can issue a 1 year permit to stay.

 

Understand now?

[Sophon]

9 hours ago, elviajero said:

It is not Tourist Visa, it’s a Privilege Entry Visa. 

 

The maximum stay per entry for tourism is limited to 90 days by law. This visa is not issued for tourism; it’s issued under investment conditions, which is why they can issue a 1 year permit to stay.

 

Understand now?

From Thailand Elite's own FAQ:

 

Notice the "Elite Visa is categorized under Tourist Visa".

 

Sophon

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, Sophon said:

Notice the "Elite Visa is categorized under Tourist Visa".

But not for a all situations. That refers to getting a work permit and working.

People can open a standard bank account with a Thai Elite membership and a PE visa. Thai elite already have arrangements with a couple of banks to assist a member when opening an account.

For the drivers license it depends upon which Department of Land Transport office you go to. I am aware of some office issuing 5 year driver's licenses to those of on tourist visas. There already been reports of people getting a 5 year one with a PE visa.

[lapamita]

until 2003  i had the old investment visa  based on 3mio baht

taxsin cancelled it, during his " 0% policy for foreign deposits"

my visa was grandfatherd

but when extend new rules applied  for grandfatherd visa

before my money was on commercial bank..now they want the 3 mb  deposit at the GHSB  at 0% intrest

i was given up on the visa even it was grandfatherd, bcs on this after change rules, i would lost 150.000 k in intrest at this time  ( was aprox 5% in 2003).

 

not done a visa coast me 150k . and more bad today. if you buy a new condo for more than 10 mb at this time , you canbe sure 40% is gone within the first 3 yr, what stupid nonsens , in a completly overpriced propertymarket incl an overvalued currency

 

i have even a laugh at the word "grandfatherd' - maybe yes but under ever changing rules

 

if thailand would not have the Girls , yes i know  everybody come here for the beauty of thai and culture, People would think 3 time more with the head instead of with the xxxx

Edited November 6, 2018 by lapamita

[Wilson Smith]

On 11/3/2018 at 3:01 PM, edwardandtubs said:

 

Well, you're 1M baht down and the only benefit is you avoid the need for annual renewals. But those renewals are a very minor inconvenience so it's a no-brainier really unless 1M baht really means nothing to you.

since you have to purchase a new project, you are paying "full retail", which in your words is really throwing money away.

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, lapamita said:

until 2003  i had the old investment visa  based on 3mio baht

taxsin cancelled it, during his " 0% policy for foreign deposits"

my visa was grandfatherd

but when extend new rules applied  for grandfatherd visa

before my money was on commercial bank..now they want the 3 mb  deposit at the GHSB  at 0% intrest

i was given up on the visa even it was grandfatherd, bcs on this after change rules, i would lost 150.000 k in intrest at this time  ( was aprox 5% in 2003).

Actually it was canceled in 2006 and anybody that was on one could still continue to apply for one.

From clause 2.5 of the the current police order.

There is no requirement for it be in a government bank.

[lapamita]

YES WAS LIKE THAT !!!!  maybe a year or too later under taxsin !!

 

and he was introduced the 0% policy on bank ACs for froeigners for aprox 12month (until cancelled again) , maybe they change again and can use ( nearly)all banks..but at this time was GHSB point and finnished...or people at immi lies ,but i dont think so !! iwas on this vsa more than 5yrs, so i must know

 

3mb condo was never accepeted (ex. new purchases!!)

Investmentfunds was also not accepted ( aberdeen and fidelity  thai funds)

 

so the rest completly up to you !

 

Edited November 6, 2018 by lapamita

[elviajero]

18 hours ago, Sophon said:

From Thailand Elite's own FAQ:

 

Notice the "Elite Visa is categorized under Tourist Visa".

 

Sophon

I am aware of what's written on the Thai Elite website, but it's misleading. IMO it is simply advising that the PE visa -- like a Tourist Visa -- does not allow you to work.

 

It couldn't be categorised as a Tourist Visa otherwise they couldn't -- by law -- grant a 1 year stay.

 

[ArickChaiyaphum]

On 11/3/2018 at 7:35 PM, ubonjoe said:

What kind of project do you mean? Did you read the info on immigrations website I posted a link to earlier.

There is another category of investment done through the Board Of Investment (BOI)

Projects are what Thais call (condo buildings)   I spoke to a guy at the BOI that had worked directly for the general at immigration wattana that deals with 10m investment extensions. It seemed straight forward buyer agreement in a new project plus funds deposited in a Thai bank not less then 10 million.

you would have to go straight into wattana and ask directly and show him what you have as documents. 

The second year you may have to show income paid on that investment??? My investment was paid as a penalty fee to me every month until the condos are transferred. Meaning no income tax . I decided to just stay with a non B until I am 50. 

Before you get your extension on 10m investment your suppose to have a 90 day Non IM Visa 

How do you get that at an embassy they have Non idea what your talking about. 

You would have to have your 90’day tourist visa changed also at Wattana. 

Edited November 6, 2018 by ArickChaiyaphum

[ArickChaiyaphum]

19 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Actually it was canceled in 2006 and anybody that was on one could still continue to apply for one.

From clause 2.5 of the the current police order.

There is no requirement for it be in a government bank.

Good luck getting the NON IM

[huberthammer]

On 11/4/2018 at 7:15 AM, Sophon said:

Also, some banks (or more precisely, some branches of banks) will open non-resident accounts for you if you open the account while on a tourist visa. My first accounts with Krung Thai Bank and Bangkok Bank were opened while on a tourist visa, so I didn't get interest in Krung Thai Bank and couldn't get internet banking with Bangkok Bank until I had a Non Immigrant visa.

 

Thai Elite works with Bangkok Bank and they will open an account for you without any issues. But as your rightly say, all the other banks will treat you like any tourist and will give you the "Mai dai"

[ubonjoe]

2 hours ago, ArickChaiyaphum said:

Good luck getting the NON IM

Of course it could not be obtained for the 3 million baht investment now.

But not any problem at all to get one for the 10 million baht investme. It can even be applied for at immigration if on a tourist visa or visa exempt.

entry. See: https://www.immigration.go.th/content/service_85

[hrrecruiter]

Hi All,

 

I went to a law firm this morning, surprisingly the lawyer who I had scheduled the meeting with didn't know too much about this. He will check with his colleague that has experience w it (I doubt it). I have also booked another lawyer next week. If a lawyer at one of BKK top firm doesnt know about it, chances are it will be hard work w a big chances of failure

 

I'm just trying to understand the steps here before I either commit or rule out, but based on the experience so far, the Elite Visa is getting more and more attractive. Pay it, and forget it. Go and rest and use the 10million baht to invest elsewhere to pay for that visa cost.

 

 

[ArickChaiyaphum]

On 11/7/2018 at 7:31 AM, ubonjoe said:

Of course it could not be obtained for the 3 million baht investment now.

But not any problem at all to get one for the 10 million baht investme. It can even be applied for at immigration if on a tourist visa or visa exempt.

entry. See: https://www.immigration.go.th/content/service_85

Well I should go all the way to Bangkok and find him and ask???

it can not be done anywhere else or can it 

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, ArickChaiyaphum said:

Well I should go all the way to Bangkok and find him and ask???

it can not be done anywhere else or can it 

The 90 day non immigrant visa (category B) entry based upon qualifying for an extension of stay for investment can be applied for at any immigration office.

[jessebkk1]

On 11/6/2018 at 4:28 PM, huberthammer said:

Thai Elite works with Bangkok Bank and they will open an account for you without any issues. But as your rightly say, all the other banks will treat you like any tourist and will give you the "Mai dai"

 

   Yes while the Thai Elite Visa is an easy fix for someone desperate to stay here, however it has a whole lot of disadvantages. It really is just a long ass tourist visa, you re not allowed to work or do business with it and if caught you'd lose the visa aka your 500k/1m/2m. Honestly, it's really easy for a disgruntled local or another foreigner with a working visa to shake down a person with an Elite visa. Moreover any future government can come in and cancel the elite visa, and you stand to get no refunds as described in the Thai elite website.

 

  Also you would have taken yourself off the non-immigrant category which allows for potential PR and possibly citizenship.

 

  Also any little run in with the law could cause you to lose the visa aka your 1m/2m baht.

 

  Here are some examples of situations that any foreigner with bad luck can find theirselves in and potentially lose their Elite Visa/money paid.

 

  - Drive a car/motorbike with an expired insurance, hit someone and the person gets hurt/hospitalized.

  - Be accused of paying for sex.

  - Get involved in Bar fight/brawl or pretty much any fight that ends up involving the police.

  - Be accused of rape.

  - Trying to do business/work on the Elite Visa, this covers a very vast area of potential mistakes that most foreigners could mistakenly be entrapped into. T

- The list is honestly endless.

 

   To be quite honest, there's a ton of stuff that you could mistakenly do and if the immigration gets involved you'd lose your investment in an Elite Visa. A lot of advantages and praises has been talked about the Elite Visa recently and a lot of foreigners are flocking/hoping to flock to it to continue to stay here. It's great to let people know exactly what they are paying for, it already hurts when you are asked to leave for any mistakes made on a regular visa, it has to sting when you know you've paid as much as 2M for the visa.

 

 

 

 

 

[huberthammer]

4 hours ago, jessebkk1 said:

 

   Yes while the Thai Elite Visa is an easy fix for someone desperate to stay here, however it has a whole lot of disadvantages. It really is just a long ass tourist visa, you re not allowed to work or do business with it and if caught you'd lose the visa aka your 500k/1m/2m. Honestly, it's really easy for a disgruntled local or another foreigner with a working visa to shake down a person with an Elite visa. Moreover any future government can come in and cancel the elite visa, and you stand to get no refunds as described in the Thai elite website.

 

  Also you would have taken yourself off the non-immigrant category which allows for potential PR and possibly citizenship.

 

  Also any little run in with the law could cause you to lose the visa aka your 1m/2m baht.

 

  Here are some examples of situations that any foreigner with bad luck can find theirselves in and potentially lose their Elite Visa/money paid.

 

  - Drive a car/motorbike with an expired insurance, hit someone and the person gets hurt/hospitalized.

  - Be accused of paying for sex.

  - Get involved in Bar fight/brawl or pretty much any fight that ends up involving the police.

  - Be accused of rape.

  - Trying to do business/work on the Elite Visa, this covers a very vast area of potential mistakes that most foreigners could mistakenly be entrapped into. T

- The list is honestly endless.

 

   To be quite honest, there's a ton of stuff that you could mistakenly do and if the immigration gets involved you'd lose your investment in an Elite Visa. A lot of advantages and praises has been talked about the Elite Visa recently and a lot of foreigners are flocking/hoping to flock to it to continue to stay here. It's great to let people know exactly what they are paying for, it already hurts when you are asked to leave for any mistakes made on a regular visa, it has to sting when you know you've paid as much as 2M for the visa.

 

 

 

 

 

Noted thanks - you forgot to add that one could die in a traffic accident and lose the Elite Membership fee as well. 

 

There are risks in life and in decisions you make. I would think that there are many considering the Elite Visa who obey by the law and the risks you outline above are more acceptable than living here longterm on dodging immigration laws or exploiting loopholes in the grey zone.

[jessebkk1]

1 hour ago, huberthammer said:

Noted thanks - you forgot to add that one could die in a traffic accident and lose the Elite Membership fee as well. 

 

There are risks in life and in decisions you make. I would think that there are many considering the Elite Visa who obey by the law and the risks you outline above are more acceptable than living here longterm on dodging immigration laws or exploiting loopholes in the grey zone.

Mate most the circumstances I stated are situations that could happen to legit person just by an act of sheer luck. My biggest point is you're not allowed work to or do business or make profit while on the Elite Visa, you will lose the Elite Visa and the money you paid for it. Unlike other Visa categories where you can be fined or just asked to leave the country and comeback again with another.

 

  I'm saying this because I personally know a bunch of my friends who are not old enough to get the retirement visa, are planning on getting the elite even though they plan on working/doing business here. The next visa crackdown might just be on those who have forked millions for the elite visa but are working here with it.

 

Goodluck!

[JayBird]

Buying a new project can be tricky. The good ones sell out on the first day. Also some people purchase multiple units at the same time, so get a better price.

Also, you end up having some capital tied until you can move in. Usually 2 to 3 years. This could possibly translate to rent lost.

It's difficult to find a good condo available from developer ready to move in.

Alternatively, buy pre owned, and you could easily save 1m as you can really shop around and find a hot deal. This would easily offset the cost of a 20 year Thailand elite.

After all, that's only a 10% discount on a 10m property. With market prices in several areas showing drops, you could easily barter a quick sale with discount.

Sent from my ASUS_Z017DB using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, jessebkk1 said:

Mate most the circumstances I stated are situations that could happen to legit person just by an act of sheer luck. My biggest point is you're not allowed work to or do business or make profit while on the Elite Visa, you will lose the Elite Visa and the money you paid for it. Unlike other Visa categories where you can be fined or just asked to leave the country and comeback again with another.

 

  I'm saying this because I personally know a bunch of my friends who are not old enough to get the retirement visa, are planning on getting the elite even though they plan on working/doing business here. The next visa crackdown might just be on those who have forked millions for the elite visa but are working here with it.

 

Goodluck!

That is wrong. There is nothing stopping a PE Visa holder from owning and profiting from a business. They just can’t work for the business beyond attending business meetings.

 

If they want to work, they don’t lose their TE membership, but have to give up the PE visa while they are working.

 

Anyone planning to own and work for a business doesn’t need a PE visa. 

[jessebkk1]

18 hours ago, elviajero said:

 

 

If they want to work, they don’t lose their TE membership, but have to give up the PE visa while they are working.

 

 

Mate, there's really no reason to mislead anyone here.

 

  The Thai Immigration will cancel your Elite Visa if you are caught working based based on what the I/O defines as working, and you will not be allowed to stay in the country using an Elite Visa afterwards. The Elite Visa is subject to approval from the Thai Immigration, it's clearly stated on their website. Don't get caught working with the Elite Visa!

[elviajero]

3 hours ago, jessebkk1 said:

21 hours ago, elviajero said:

If they want to work, they don’t lose their TE membership, but have to give up the PE visa while they are working.

Mate, there's really no reason to mislead anyone here.

 

  The Thai Immigration will cancel your Elite Visa if you are caught working based based on what the I/O defines as working, and you will not be allowed to stay in the country using an Elite Visa afterwards. The Elite Visa is subject to approval from the Thai Immigration, it's clearly stated on their website. Don't get caught working with the Elite Visa!

I am not misleading, you are misreading,  and clearly don’t understand the Thailand Elite Membership Scheme and foreign employment law.

 

Your money buys membership of the scheme, and that membership doesn’t need to be cancelled if you start working. As part of the membership you receive a Privilege Entry Visa, which if you want to start working would have to be cancelled— or at the very least not used to enter the country — in favour of a Non B/O visa.

 

Owning a business does not require a Non ‘B/O’ visa. Working for a business does.

 

Attending business meetings is one activity that is exempt from requiring a work permit.

 

The TE scheme was originally targeted specifically at foreign businessmen to encourage new investment in the country.

[Sexbomb]

Am I among the few that thinks that the qualifications and requirements to obtain an Investment Visa are very straightforward? 

 

I don't see them as complicated at all.

 

On the contrary, among the clearest qualifications to obtain a visa in Thailand that are not among the usual tourist visas.

[hrrecruiter]

On 11/7/2018 at 1:40 PM, hrrecruiter said:

Hi All,

 

I went to a law firm this morning, surprisingly the lawyer who I had scheduled the meeting with didn't know too much about this. He will check with his colleague that has experience w it (I doubt it). I have also booked another lawyer next week. If a lawyer at one of BKK top firm doesnt know about it, chances are it will be hard work w a big chances of failure

 

I'm just trying to understand the steps here before I either commit or rule out, but based on the experience so far, the Elite Visa is getting more and more attractive. Pay it, and forget it. Go and rest and use the 10million baht to invest elsewhere to pay for that visa cost.

 

 

 

I'm back from a 2nd lawyer - indeed to get the visa the property has to be in your name, from developer, and property has to be ready. A combination that isnt the easiest to find, the ones you find may equal they are overpriced.

 

If you want to buy a pre-sale or from a flipper, you need to pay the property in full first, then apply for the investment visa. The value on the deed is what it counts, you dont get the deed until the property is ready

 

All in all, it is an option but my experience does validade the fact why more people isnt using this, its very hard for the circumstances to match 100% and one may be better w the Elite Visa

 

Thank you all for the input