Cough, cough

[Moonlover]

5 hours ago, Denim said:

They announced over our village Tanoy that if farmers took burnt sugar cane to the mills they would from now on get a lower price.

 

Result............carry on burning.

 

Time to bring back the gibbet.

I've been told by those involved in sugarcane that burning makes it easier to harvest and therefor reduces labour costs.

 

So yes, you're right. They'll carry on burning and happily take the hit. The only way that they can stop the burning is to refuse to buy the cane at all.

 

And that's where the logic ends and the corruption begins. ????

[vivid]

3 hours ago, Dante99 said:

Is it equal to about 10 cigarettes per day (as posted on the other smoke thread) or is it the terrible crisis described by some above?

 

Yes, I do not think 10 cigarettes a day is a terrible crisis if for a small number of days.

 

The issue is that it affects everybody, including unborn, newborns, infants to those in hospitals, and of coz the usual list in the sensitive/susceptible groups.    N Thailand has a population of 6.3 mil? 

 

Health infants to school-going kids and those sick/elderly have died in Indonesian haze in 2015 particularly when it got real bad for just a few days in October 2015.  The videos are all on youtube, unfortunately i cannot post them here as they were deemed to be OT by the mods in the other thread.  

In China it's even worse coz there are even more people living ultra densely.  The health costs in sheer numbers is unimaginable if the issue is not controlled.

 

So yes, the above info is not kidding nor is it fear-mongering, it's real, and it has happened before.   

 

One location in Mae Hong Song just got to nearly 1400 ug/m3 for PM10.  961 ug/m3 PM2.5 just now, as shared by sis Cmsally in the Smoke Dust Smog 2018 thread. 

 

 

Edited March 30, 2019 by vivid

[Odysseus123]

51 minutes ago, THAIJAMES said:

I was almost going to go there this this smoke season but was afraid that Tasmania has been ruined by the fires recently?

You are joking.

[sanemax]

2 hours ago, Dante99 said:

Is it equal to about 10 cigarettes per day (as posted on the other smoke thread) or is it the terrible crisis described by some above?

 

Yes, I do not think 10 cigarettes a day is a terrible crisis if for a small number of days.

Its a different kind of smole though , the pollution smokes particles are bigger then cigarette smoke and more dangerous/damaging .

  Even worse for kids with small lungs , imagine a newborn baby smoking 10 cigarettes a day?

[cmsally]

Cp Maize contract farming in Shan State

 

An interesting study which is probably larger scale than the Thai side. Shows how it is related to Chinese demand and has many interesting details. Worth a read to understand the issues at hand. Farming and human survival have reached a tipping point, I would say.

[vivid]

31 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Its a different kind of smole though , the pollution smokes particles are bigger then cigarette smoke and more dangerous/damaging .

  Even worse for kids with small lungs , imagine a newborn baby smoking 10 cigarettes a day?

Cigarette smoke's particulate matter spatial distribution mainly ranges from 0.1 to 0.5 microns peaking at 0.25 microns thereabouts. 

Source : http://www.aaqr.org/files/article/797/31_AAQR-12-02-OA-0041_324-332.pdf

 

These forest fire/peat fire smoke in South East Asia also has particle sizes in this range aka PM2.5. Additionally it also has PM10, and also bigger particulate matter in the form of "fly ash".  As you get closer to the fires, PM10 concentration and "fly ash" rises.  

 

It's very difficult to correlate how bad is forest fire smoke compared to cigarette smoke.  Even within the forest fire/peat fire smoke category, there are various levels of toxicity and damage to the body.

Some read up....

https://www.krem.com/article/news/local/verify/is-breathing-smoky-air-like-smoking-cigarettes/293-586823790

https://www.epa.gov/sciencematters/science-behind-wildfire-smokes-toxicity

 

 

And yes, you are right......newborns, not forgetting the unborn fetus, those in hospitals, susceptible groups (whole list is quite long) etc.   I am not sure if N Thailand hospital wards provide airconditioning with at least a F7 grade filter in the AHU, which would decently bring the levels down to "acceptable" levels even for the terribly sick.

Edited March 30, 2019 by vivid

[rebo]

3 hours ago, Konini said:

Educate them so they know that the polluted air they breath every burning season It's going to give them or their children respiratory problems in the future that can be fatal.

Most of the people know it. They simply don't care.
They also know that helmets can protect life ...

 

[THAIJAMES]

1 hour ago, Odysseus123 said:

You are joking.

No I was not joking just wondering if the fires in Tasmania are as bad as they are made out to be.

 

Spoke with someone from Tasmania he said because of the fires hiking in the national Forest would not be rewarding.

 

https://theconversation.com/fires-in-tasmanias-ancient-forests-are-a-warning-for-all-of-us-53806

 

Edited March 30, 2019 by THAIJAMES

[Odysseus123]

11 minutes ago, THAIJAMES said:

No I was not joking just wondering if the fires in Tasmania are as bad as they are made out to be.

 

Spoke with someone from Tasmania he said because of the fires hiking in the national Forest would not be rewarding.

 

https://theconversation.com/fires-in-tasmanias-ancient-forests-are-a-warning-for-all-of-us-53806

 

What national forest?

 

There is not just one "national" forest in Tasmania or any other parts of Australia.

 

Do you think that the entire state has burned down?

 

This what it will look like..

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 30, 2019 by Odysseus123

[EL159]

4 hours ago, jesimps said:

I know I usually give Chiang Mai stick on here, but that's because on my one trip there I found it to be an incredibly boring place with no baht buses to get around, very dangerous roads and an expensive and not very good bar area. However, the air was clear during my stay. I can't imagine, why ANYONE would want to live there with the choking smog as well. In fact, I don't know why anyone would want to stay anywhere in the world where there was choking smog. All that and the worst immigration office in the country to boot.

Well stay in bloody Pattaya then....that dump is SO much better than CM......NOT!

[cmsally]

Just been reading some statistics on Facebook, where levels of PM2.5 in Lashio (Myanmar) were measured at 2,124

Will try to find the source so I can post them here.

[cmsally]

50 minutes ago, cmsally said:

Just been reading some statistics on Facebook, where levels of PM2.5 in Lashio (Myanmar) were measured at 2,124

Will try to find the source so I can post them here.

Lashio pm2.5

 

This I found for Myanmar, Lashio. The highest of 1683.

I saw some Thai reports of 2124 but can't find links for the data.

But still 1683 is incredibly high.

[vivid]

Lashio, AQI 1683   (look at the bottom black bars)

 

Edited March 30, 2019 by vivid

[Odysseus123]

2 hours ago, EL159 said:

Well stay in bloody Pattaya then....that dump is SO much better than CM......NOT!

Must be something in the air...

[vivid]

I really feel sad for those poor people.   3 days of black colour bars.  ????

Yesterday it was 13 whole hours of > AQI 1000 

 

In Indonesia, a few dozens have died in 2015 in their own ultra heavy haze season under similar conditions, newborns to young school children and all.

 

Edited March 30, 2019 by vivid

[vivid]

In Laos, Paksan.  Today was the worst with an AQI of 1474 at 0800hrs.  (see bottom black bars)

 

 

[Sydebolle]

Moving away - for good. Let the government carry on accepting the wishes of the oligarch elite of faster growing cycles of corn and sugar cane to make 'em richer. 

The farmers, too uneducated to understand the damage the leave behind, now and for their children, will be haunted one day for having millions of square metres of land on which nothing will grow anymore. 

[THAIJAMES]

14 hours ago, Odysseus123 said:

What national forest?

 

There is not just one "national" forest in Tasmania or any other parts of Australia.

 

Do you think that the entire state has burned down?

 

This what it will look like..

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are right in hindsight I should have probably gone there.  I can easily spend one month in the south island of New Zealand.  Do you think there is enough  hiking and other mountain activities to keep me busy for about a month away from the smoke?

 

Sorry for hijacking the thread I will start a new topic about where to leave to escape the smoke season.

Edited March 30, 2019 by THAIJAMES

[earlinclaifornia]

Doi Inthanon was almost just as bad.

[vivid]

15 hours ago, cmsally said:

Lashio pm2.5

 

This I found for Myanmar, Lashio. The highest of 1683.

I saw some Thai reports of 2124 but can't find links for the data.

But still 1683 is incredibly high.

 

I think i found it, sorta.  For Lashio.   Was on 26th March, 24-hr AQI 950, the 24-hr PM10 was 1054 ug/m3, that means you can say that every single hour in that 24hr period it was PM10 1054 ug/m3 if you average/smooth it out.   Yesterday was 24-hr AQI 693, then 3 days ago was 24-hr AQI 723.

 

So it's possible to have done 1hr 2124ug/m3 be it PM2.5 or PM10 or maybe it's 1hr AQI.  Just that unfortunately they only store 3 days of detailed hourly historical data.

 

Lashio, Myanmar, 24-hr AQI 950.

 

 

This is for Paksan, in Laos.  24-hr AQI 804.  On 14th March 2019.

 

 

Chittagong 

1hr AQI 1910 on 29th March

 

Edited March 31, 2019 by vivid

[vivid]

So yeah, 3 countries are burning the stuff.   The very high PM10 concentrations suggests nearby burnings. 

[PhotoJohn]

If all those people doing the burning were really smart, they'd find a way to introduce nicotine into the smoke,  Then everyone would get addicted to it and they wouldn't want it to stop.

[TigerandDog]

On ‎3‎/‎30‎/‎2019 at 8:03 AM, FolkGuitar said:

It IS bad today. I can't see Maya at all from my windows, and even Hillside 4 is hard to make out. To the East, Kad Suen Kaew is almost invisible. I, too, have never seen it this bad. Today will be the third day this year to wear a mask! Worst I've ever seen.

Chiang Mai has clean air compared to Fang, Mae Soon, Mae Ai & Chia Prakhan Districts. Visibility was down to 150 metres yesterday. The best it's been over the last couple of weeks is 300 metres, so please stop whingeing and whining when there are districts with air pollution far more serious than in Chiang Mai city.

[Konini]

5 hours ago, TigerandDog said:

Chiang Mai has clean air compared to Fang, Mae Soon, Mae Ai & Chia Prakhan Districts. Visibility was down to 150 metres yesterday. The best it's been over the last couple of weeks is 300 metres, so please stop whingeing and whining when there are districts with air pollution far more serious than in Chiang Mai city.

Fair suck of the sausage, mate. 

 

We're all entitled to a whine every once in a while.  Yesterday it was the worst it's ever been in Chiang Mai.  We all know it's worse outstation, but that's not where most of us live.  The majority of us posting on here are in Muang CM, and the just about 600 reading for Muang is a first for us, which means it's a talking point.  We're not downplaying how bad it is in other districts, just discussing how it's so bad here.  In Bangkok a few weeks ago the headlines were all about the sky falling in and schools and government offices closing.  The highest it got was 160-odd.  Can't be bothered to look for the source, but it was in The Nation today somewhere.  160-something and they were in full on panic mode, yet we get 600 and the governor doesn't want to declare an emergency because of the effect it will have on tourism.  I'm rambling again, but it's a fair point to make.

 

Anyway, nobody is denying how bad it is in other areas, but this isn't a pishing competition;  I started this thread because yesterday was the worst I've seen in my ten years here, before I'd even looked at any AQI sites.  I made a followup post later in the day because I thought it was getting worse as the day went on, not better as it usually does, so i looked at the AQI sites and sure enough, it was getting worse.

 

I could go further here and recommend a BBC documentary I watched a couple of weeks ago about how bad the air is in Ulaanbaatar where it was above 900, or another doco I've downloaded, yet to watch, about Katmandu which is apparently awful in the winter months when the brick kilns are burning and it's probably just as bad as Ulaanbaatar. I could also say at this point that you have nothing to whinge about because the 600ish that the districts you mentioned is nothing compared to Mongolia or Nepal, but we're not discussing Mongolia or Nepal here.  We are not discussing the outlying districts of Chiang Mai either; we're talking about - and yes, having a whinge and an whine about - how bad it is here in Muang. Because it's the worst it's ever been and it's a talking point.

 

It's a bit unfair of you to have a pop at FolkGuitar because of that. I used to be a very active poster on this forum until a couple of years ago.  This kind of post is the reason I stopped coming on here, and this is the second or third time I've actually posted anything in about two years and your contribution to my post means it will probably be a couple of years again before I bother looking in at the forum again.  Good on you, I suppose.  Some people didn't like my meandering rambles and they'll be thankful to you.

[orang37]

5 hours ago, Konini said:

... it will probably be a couple of years again before I bother looking in at the forum again.  Good on you, I suppose.  Some people didn't like my meandering rambles and they'll be thankful to you.

 

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun Konini,

 

Please, don't drink the troll kool-aid. Remember the people who respect you, and find your thoughts interesting ????

 

~o:37;

[metisdead]

A troll post has been reported and removed. 

[FolkGuitar]

On 3/30/2019 at 8:03 AM, FolkGuitar said:

It IS bad today. I can't see Maya at all from my windows, and even Hillside 4 is hard to make out. To the East, Kad Suen Kaew is almost invisible. I, too, have never seen it this bad. Today will be the third day this year to wear a mask! Worst I've ever seen.

 

13 hours ago, TigerandDog said:

Chiang Mai has clean air compared to Fang, Mae Soon, Mae Ai & Chia Prakhan Districts. Visibility was down to 150 metres yesterday. The best it's been over the last couple of weeks is 300 metres, so please stop whingeing and whining when there are districts with air pollution far more serious than in Chiang Mai city.

 

If you don't like my posts, don't read them. THAT is your only option.

[Thailand]

17 hours ago, TigerandDog said:

Chiang Mai has clean air compared to Fang, Mae Soon, Mae Ai & Chia Prakhan Districts. Visibility was down to 150 metres yesterday. The best it's been over the last couple of weeks is 300 metres, so please stop whingeing and whining when there are districts with air pollution far more serious than in Chiang Mai city.

A mine's bigger than yours post, don't you just love em!

[oneoffpost]

oi! my post got deleted, i wasnt trolling i was complimenting konini. Like i said i deleted my account ages ago and made a new one specially to do it.

Cant remember my exact words but something like I had forgot how good it is the way she tells people off when they need telling. Like so condesending like that only the English can do with an aussie twist on the tail. Always knows just the right words to use and i think i said i miss seeing it.

[DLock]

I left CM last night. Got fed up yesterday at not being able to do all the things I like, and jumped the next plane to Australia and landed in Brisbane this morning.

 

AQI is 36.

 

I'll go surfing and fishing until the rains come. Then I'll come back.

 

Best of luck to all that remain in that toxic soup.