torrent unconnectable on 3bb

[bearpolar]

Hey guys, im using the same computer i had back home. No firewall block or anything but my private torrent trackers are telling me im not connectable.

 

I tried port forwarding on the fiberhome modem, it still says the port is not open when testing on random sites. I tried with and without Upnp in modem and qbittorent, doesnt work. 

 

Any ideas? 

[JamJar]

Use a Seedbox...

[wgdanson]

Just downloaded Rocketman via extratorrents with 3BB 200/200 fibre, no VPN, no problems. Did you try to reset your network settings?

[sunnyboy2018]

I have no problem with 3BB . Try reinstalling your client software.

[bearpolar]

Why are you answering non-sense. I didnt say torrents don't work. I said im unconnectable. 

[poohy]

36 minutes ago, bearpolar said:

Why are you answering non-sense. I didnt say torrents don't work. I said im unconnectable. 

And is that a 3BB problem or you computer problem

3BB works for me with torrents so by deduction its your computer problem

 

just saying

 

 

[BritManToo]

3BB fibre doesn't allow port forwarding.

It shares IP address behind a firewall at their end.

[bearpolar]

1 hour ago, poohy said:

And is that a 3BB problem or you computer problem

3BB works for me with torrents so by deduction its your computer problem

 

just saying

 

 

Torrents work even if you're unconnectable. Why are you even answering if you dont understand simple computer stuff?

[bearpolar]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

3BB fibre doesn't allow port forwarding.

It shares IP address behind a firewall at their end.

thank you that makes sense. I played with the port forwarding option in the modem for hours with nothing getting through.

 

 

[bkkcanuck8]

On 8/22/2019 at 10:49 AM, bearpolar said:

thank you that makes sense. I played with the port forwarding option in the modem for hours with nothing getting through.

 

 

I think if you google myipaddress - it will show you your IP address on the public internet.  This address likely does not match your WAN address.    Effectively your WAN address is already a private IP address on the inside of a private network (which is NATd before it reaches your modem).  You might be able to get them to give you a public IP address if you request it for a reason (like security cameras for example) [if they do give it to you - you might have to look and do the same thing if it flips back at some time in the future]

 

If you search for 3bb DDNS you might take a look, it seems to say that you can port forward up to 10 address using their DDNS/port forwarding service.

[JetsetBkk]

On 8/22/2019 at 9:31 AM, BritManToo said:

3BB fibre doesn't allow port forwarding.

It shares IP address behind a firewall at their end.

Really?

 

(Some details blanked out by me )

 

[bearpolar]

go to canyouseeme and put those ports in

 

it wont work.

 

Why would you even hide your local ip

 

That's like scanning your passport and hiding the last letter of your country

Edited August 28, 2019 by bearpolar

[poohy]

On 8/22/2019 at 10:48 AM, bearpolar said:

Torrents work even if you're unconnectable. Why are you even answering if you dont understand simple computer stuff?

Dont ya learn something new every day!????

[bkkcanuck8]

9 hours ago, JetsetBkk said:

Really?

 

(Some details blanked out by me )

 

That looks like your private network (not familiar with 3BB setup), but it looks like you are just port forwarding from the private network that 3BB will give you by default to your internal network.  If you are on a private network you need something to forward traffic on their router as well.  I recommend googling 3BB DDNS because I think they allow you to do that as well while still leaving you on a private network. 

[bkkcanuck8]

On 8/22/2019 at 9:19 AM, poohy said:

And is that a 3BB problem or you computer problem

3BB works for me with torrents so by deduction its your computer problem

 

just saying

 

 

With torrents there is you being able to connect to them, and the outside world connectable to you.  (two directions).  The easiest is to connect to download, which is fine just having it that way if you are using services like piratebay etc which are not member sites... but if you are a member of a private group -- then you will need to have the connection working from the outside world because sooner or later the site admin will get a complaint and realize you are blocking incoming... usually you will get a warning, and if not resolved they will then terminate your membership.

 

[Tayaout]

7 minutes ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

With torrents there is you being able to connect to them, and the outside world connectable to you.  (two directions).  The easiest is to connect to download, which is fine just having it that way if you are using services like piratebay etc which are not member sites... but if you are a member of a private group -- then you will need to have the connection working from the outside world because sooner or later the site admin will get a complaint and realize you are blocking incoming... usually you will get a warning, and if not resolved they will then terminate your membership.

 

The way p2p software works is that if you can't be reached directly then they do NAT traversal via hole punching or TCP relay for most communication apps. Sure the software will tell you can't be reached directly via your public ipv4 address but it will still work fine. 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NAT_traversal

 

I use 3BB and I have no issue leeching or seeding torrents. 3BB seems to support ipv6 which make NAT traversal obsolete but I did not test if my ipv6 address is firewalled. 

Edited August 28, 2019 by Tayaout

[bkkcanuck8]

41 minutes ago, Tayaout said:

The way p2p software works is that if you can't be reached directly then they do NAT traversal via hole punching or TCP relay for most communication apps. Sure the software will tell you can't be reached directly via your public ipv4 address but it will still work fine. 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NAT_traversal

 

I use 3BB and I have no issue leeching or seeding torrents. 3BB seems to support ipv6 which make NAT traversal obsolete but I did not test if my ipv6 address is firewalled. 

A torrent client is actually a server as well.  If you initiate a connection, and there is a response then it can traverse backwards... but if the other side initiates the connection to your host -- there is no way to punch a hole through since it does not know where it is to go.  They send a packet to the WAN address, the router at the WAN address will have to deal with routing -- and it won't know where to send it.  There were some consumer modems that support some protocols for auto configuring your local router (not the main one that is doing the NAT in 3BBs case)... but only consumers with no knowledge of network configuration would leave it that way since it is a security faux-pas.

 

ipv6 does not do NAT, or at least it did not up until a few years ago... no need as there are enough addresses for each person to have a full subnet (which is what is typically assigned).  There is very few sites that support IPv6 (other than a few major ones unfortunately).  If you are seen as unconnectable and it comes to the attention of the site admins -- you will eventually be banned.

Quote

This leaves the internal network ill-suited for hosting servers, as the NAT device has no automatic method of determining the internal host for which incoming packets are destined. This is not a problem for general web access and email. However, applications such as peer-to-peer file sharing, VoIP services, and video game consoles require clients to be servers as well. Incoming requests cannot be easily correlated to the proper internal host. Furthermore, many of these types of services carry IP address and port number information in the application data, potentially requiring substitution with deep packet inspection.

 

[Tayaout]

18 minutes ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

A torrent client is actually a server as well.  If you initiate a connection, and there is a response then it can traverse backwards... but if the other side initiates the connection to your host -- there is no way to punch a hole through since it does not know where it is to go.  They send a packet to the WAN address, the router at the WAN address will have to deal with routing -- and it won't know where to send it.  There were some consumer modems that support some protocols for auto configuring your local router (not the main one that is doing the NAT in 3BBs case)... but only consumers with no knowledge of network configuration would leave it that way since it is a security faux-pas.

 

ipv6 does not do NAT, or at least it did not up until a few years ago... no need as there are enough addresses for each person to have a full subnet (which is what is typically assigned).  There is very few sites that support IPv6 (other than a few major ones unfortunately).  If you are seen as unconnectable and it comes to the attention of the site admins -- you will eventually be banned.

 

Hole punching works through NAT since I do program this kind of software. It's a bit complicated to explain but basically UDP is a stateless protocol. It means if 2 host send each other packet blindly eventually the firewall (NAT) will know where the packet goes. It can get more complicated but this is the basic. 

 

Some software like VOIP can use stun/turn server that are provided for free by many company. It's not exactly a direct connection and it's usually only used if direct hole punching did not work. 

 

I know ipv6 doesn't use NAT but most p2p software supports it. The issue is sometimes it is firewalled but I did not test if that's the case with 3bb.

 

The software mention if you can't be reached directly but it's easy to see if you are seeding or not. Not reachable doesn't mean your are not seeding. 

 

https://stackoverflow.com/q/8523330/1189679

 

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/8892142/udp-hole-punching-algorithm#targetText="Hole Punching" refers to triggering,and port%2C and vice versa.

Edited August 29, 2019 by Tayaout

[JetsetBkk]

14 hours ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

That looks like your private network (not familiar with 3BB setup), but it looks like you are just port forwarding from the private network that 3BB will give you by default to your internal network.  If you are on a private network you need something to forward traffic on their router as well.  I recommend googling 3BB DDNS because I think they allow you to do that as well while still leaving you on a private network. 

Yes I have a network at home. I don't understand what you mean by "private network that 3BB will give you".

 

I simply plug my WiFi router's LAN output into an Ethernet Switch and connect my computers to the Switch. Nothing specific to 3BB there.

 

All these LAN connected PCs have unique local IPs - I set them up in Internet Protocol Version 4 Properties.  

 

Then the Port Forwarding was done as shown in my earlier post - the local IP of the computer running Vuze and Vuze's port  were entered and it all worked.

 

My Vuze client shows both local (from me) and remote (from the outside world) connections and the private sites show my client as uploading. Here's one:

 

But I don't understand why Vuze's "NAT Test" fails, I'm sure it worked when I was on ADSL.

 

And "portcheckers.com" says my Vuze port is closed and also that local IP 192.168.xxx.xxx will not work. I don't know what that's all about.

 

Anyway, I've been uploading OK. These from the last month:

 

Any comments welcomed, but try not to be too snarky. 

[bkkcanuck8]

17 minutes ago, JetsetBkk said:

Yes I have a network at home. I don't understand what you mean by "private network that 3BB will give you".

 

I simply plug my WiFi router's LAN output into an Ethernet Switch and connect my computers to the Switch. Nothing specific to 3BB there.

 

All these LAN connected PCs have unique local IPs - I set them up in Internet Protocol Version 4 Properties.  

 

Then the Port Forwarding was done as shown in my earlier post - the local IP of the computer running Vuze and Vuze's port  were entered and it all worked.

 

My Vuze client shows both local (from me) and remote (from the outside world) connections and the private sites show my client as uploading. Here's one:

 

But I don't understand why Vuze's "NAT Test" fails, I'm sure it worked when I was on ADSL.

 

And "portcheckers.com" says my Vuze port is closed and also that local IP 192.168.xxx.xxx will not work. I don't know what that's all about.

 

Anyway, I've been uploading OK. These from the last month:

 

Any comments welcomed, but try not to be too snarky. 

 

If your computer (or your modem) is "on the internet" you will be assigned a "public IP" address.  That public IP address is only used by ONE device on the internet. 

 

A "private IP" address can be assigned to devices not on the internet, and that traffic can be routed to a switch that will do address translation for requests/responses going to or coming from the internet.  (NAT - Network Address Translation).  That switch has basically remember who sent what and be able to match the communications coming back from the internet and then translate it back to a private IP so it can go back to your computer. 

 

Before 2012, everyone that got a switch/modem from an ISP would plug in a computer to your modem.  Everything connected to the modem in your house would be on a "private network" and then after it left your house on the ISP cables it would get put on the "public network" (internet). 

 

After 2012, the standards released a set of IP addresses (100.64.0.0 - 100.127.255.255) that were reserved for carrier grade NAT.  If the ISP uses this then the point you actually get on the internet is not at your modem -- but some other switch in a box in your neighbourhood or at the central office of the ISP.

 

For outbound traffic, you would not notice any difference.   For internet traffic that is sent to you as a response to what you have done, it can do address translation and be routed back to you.  The vast majority of people would never notice any difference. 

 

Where it becomes an issue is when some 3rd party is trying to connect "blindly" (i.e. server/host). 

 

With torrents there is a tracker that keeps track of your IP address and the port that it can communicate to you on.  Another user of the same tracker would request a file and it would say - that person has it, and this is there IP address and port so you can now go directly to them.   If you are not already communicating with the person wanting to connect to you... they would get blocked.   If however you were both downloading the same file and you were downloading from them, they could also be downloading from them (I don't think it has to be the same file for this to happen).  But this only happens when you are already in communication with them.

 

The issue becomes obvious when you are seeding a file that has very few seeders.... and you are not in communication with the other party...  they would be trying to download and the only people that they are connecting to is not allowing them to download.  They would message the admin that they have an issue and they would see that you are blocking incoming traffic - that is usually when it would come to their attention.  (it is a violation of terms of most private trackers). 

 

How do you know you are on a private network instead of the internet... if you google something like my ip address and google displays a number that is not what is on the your modem... it is private.

 

Private IP ranges include:

10.0.0.0 - 10.255.255.255
172.16.0.0 - 172.31.255.255
192.168.0.0 - 192.168.255.255
100.64.0.0 to 100.127.255.255  (this one is the most common one that ISPs use since it is reserved for that purpose).

 

 

 

[JetsetBkk]

1 hour ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

 

If your computer (or your modem) is "on the internet" you will be assigned a "public IP" address.  That public IP address is only used by ONE device on the internet. 

 

A "private IP" address can be assigned to devices not on the internet, and that traffic can be routed to a switch that will do address translation for requests/responses going to or coming from the internet.  (NAT - Network Address Translation).  That switch has basically remember who sent what and be able to match the communications coming back from the internet and then translate it back to a private IP so it can go back to your computer. 

 

Before 2012, everyone that got a switch/modem from an ISP would plug in a computer to your modem.  Everything connected to the modem in your house would be on a "private network" and then after it left your house on the ISP cables it would get put on the "public network" (internet). 

 

After 2012, the standards released a set of IP addresses (100.64.0.0 - 100.127.255.255) that were reserved for carrier grade NAT.  If the ISP uses this then the point you actually get on the internet is not at your modem -- but some other switch in a box in your neighbourhood or at the central office of the ISP.

 

For outbound traffic, you would not notice any difference.   For internet traffic that is sent to you as a response to what you have done, it can do address translation and be routed back to you.  The vast majority of people would never notice any difference. 

 

Where it becomes an issue is when some 3rd party is trying to connect "blindly" (i.e. server/host). 

 

With torrents there is a tracker that keeps track of your IP address and the port that it can communicate to you on.  Another user of the same tracker would request a file and it would say - that person has it, and this is there IP address and port so you can now go directly to them.   If you are not already communicating with the person wanting to connect to you... they would get blocked.   If however you were both downloading the same file and you were downloading from them, they could also be downloading from them (I don't think it has to be the same file for this to happen).  But this only happens when you are already in communication with them.

 

The issue becomes obvious when you are seeding a file that has very few seeders.... and you are not in communication with the other party...  they would be trying to download and the only people that they are connecting to is not allowing them to download.  They would message the admin that they have an issue and they would see that you are blocking incoming traffic - that is usually when it would come to their attention.  (it is a violation of terms of most private trackers). 

 

How do you know you are on a private network instead of the internet... if you google something like my ip address and google displays a number that is not what is on the your modem... it is private.

 

Private IP ranges include:

10.0.0.0 - 10.255.255.255
172.16.0.0 - 172.31.255.255
192.168.0.0 - 192.168.255.255
100.64.0.0 to 100.127.255.255  (this one is the most common one that ISPs use since it is reserved for that purpose).

 

 

 

Thank you for your detailed post. Your mentioning of NAT made me remember something from a long time ago.

 

But first, I checked the IP addresses of 3 of my computers. Two are on the LAN (i.e. connected by cable to my Ethernet Switch) and one - this one - is on the 5G WiFi from the 3BB "AN5506-04-FA" modem/router.

 

All 3 report the same IP: 171.6.240.xxx

 

But your mentioning of NAT made me remember that I used to make screen captures of my modem configurations - all the different screens - so I could re-enter the data if anything got screwed.

 

In July 2009, my ZyXel modem on Maxnet had a "NAT Mode - SUA Only" page. I had to set up a "SUA/NAT Server Set" by entering the port number used by my bittorrent client - Vuze - and my PC's local IP address. 

 

In February 2013, my Huawei "SmartAX MT880" on 3BB ADSL, under "NAT Settings, Virtual Server" I had the Vuze port number as Start Port Number, End Port Number, Start Port (Local) and End Port (Local). The Local IP Address was the usual 192.168.1....

 

There was also a "Virtual Server Listing" table showing my Desktop and also my Laptop. The Vuze port number and Local IP Address were different for the Laptop settings. This was so I could run Vuze on both computers without them affecting each other.

 

In April 2015 I'd added two more entries in the "Virtual Server Listing" table in the "NAT - Virtual Server" page. These entries were for Tight VNC for my Desktop and for a Samsung Netbook. The same entries were needed - port numbers for TVNC and local IP addresses for the computers.

 

That was the last time I captured these "Setup Screenshots" so I haven't got any for the 3BB fiber modem/router that I'm using now.

 

But one thing is for sure - there is no entry in the NAT page. It merely says "You could configure Multi-NAT". But the "Multi NAT Rules List" is empty. The rule requires a "Local Start IP" and "Local End IP", and a "Public Start IP" and "Public End IP" which, of course, keep changing.

 

 

 

So I don't know if there's anything that can be done to make port forwarding work like it used to. As you say, once my Public IP and port is known to the tracker, it can be passed on to another user for uploading from me and that is why, I presume, Vuze says that it's a remote connection. 

 

Any thoughts?

 

[bearpolar]

And "portcheckers.com" says my Vuze port is closed and also that local IP 192.168.xxx.xxx will not work. I don't know what that's all about.

 

there you go

 

your ports are blocked, you are not connectable.

 

Most people do 200gb+ a month i dont see how you managing to upload 1gb over a months time is relevant information

 

 

[JamJar]

1 hour ago, bearpolar said:

And "portcheckers.com" says my Vuze port is closed and also that local IP 192.168.xxx.xxx will not work. I don't know what that's all about.

 

there you go

 

your ports are blocked, you are not connectable.

 

Most people do 200gb+ a month i dont see how you managing to upload 1gb over a months time is relevant information

 

 

 

Perhaps you missed;

 

Quote

Any comments welcomed, but try not to be too snarky. 

 

 

Take a leaf from bkkcanuck8 and his patient and helpful reply and the other posters who are making intelligent and informative posts.