Family Trouble

[pumpuiman]

My wifes brother has been married for about two years. He has a seven month old daughter with his wife.

The child is being raised by my wifes mother and sister in Isaan, while the father and mother of the child work in Bangkok.

The child's mother now says that she wants a divorce. She says she has another man interested in her, and now that she is "beautiful" again after having the baby, she doesn't want to lose the chance at another life with this man and wants to abandon her relationship with her husband and child. She claims that her current husband will not be able to provide the style of life she wants.

He has a decent but not high paid job.....middle class by Thai standards I guess you would say.

My wife and I had already planned on supporting the child's schooling and other needs as they would arise. We planned this prior to the current trouble....but had not yet told them of our intentions.

As I understand it The woman is asking for 40,000 baht to divorce....and claims she wants nothing to do with the child.

What legal rights are available to the father, and how should this be handled?

Can anyone recommend a law firm in Bangkok?

Please relate any experiences you may have had.....we just want to make sure this woman has no future ties to the child or her ex- husband.

Thanks, I'll be watching this thread closely, and would appreciate constructive suggestions at this difficult time.

Eric and Pan

[sutnyod]

Hi,

I take it the whole family is from Isaan? How did your brother-in-law marry? Just by having a Baci or did they register the marriage?

In the case of a Baci, divorce is settled most commonly by the families. What does not fit here is why is she asking for money for a divorce only she wants? If she wants out, she has to bring the money ("tjang pa" concept) or get it from her lover. What was your wife's family's reaction?

[pumpuiman]

Hi,

I take it the whole family is from Isaan? How did your brother-in-law marry? Just by having a Baci or did they register the marriage?

In the case of a Baci, divorce is settled most commonly by the families. What does not fit here is why is she asking for money for a divorce only she wants? If she wants out, she has to bring the money ("tjang pa" concept) or get it from her lover. What was your wife's family's reaction?

My wifes family is furious, embarrassed, and confused.

I too do not understand her request for money.

It is a registered marriage.

[Casanundra]

You know my views as I PM'd you about it.

Under Thai law, if she has committed adultery then the husband is able to seek compensation from the other man.

The wife asking for 40k clearly shows that she doesn't understand Thai divorce laws and this request should be countered by the husband for a demand for compensation from the other man who did the dirty deed. Assuming of course she has done a dirty deed with another man.

[pumpuiman]

You know my views as I PM'd you about it.

Under Thai law, if she has committed adultery then the husband is able to seek compensation from the other man.

The wife asking for 40k clearly shows that she doesn't understand Thai divorce laws and this request should be countered by the husband for a demand for compensation from the other man who did the dirty deed. Assuming of course she has done a dirty deed with another man.

From what I understand....she says that no "deed" has been done. She claims that this man has only expressed interest in her, and she feels she wants to pursue a relationship.

I think it's bull.....but who knows.

And thanks again for your PM. Very helpful.

Eric

[pumpuiman]

My wife is telling me that she would suggest the both of them going to the amphur, hammering out the details and trust this woman means what she says.....when she says she will relinquish custody of the child.

I don't trust the woman.

Am I being overly cautious?

Would the introduction of a lawyer to write up the agreement be too much of a shaking of the bee hive?

Unfortunately neither my wife or I can be in Thailand at the moment. My wifes sister plans to attend the proceedings (if they occur) to make sure things are written correctly.....but she is a post office manager, not a lawyer.

What about compensation to the family from her parents for loss of face?

Is it a possibility?

[bina]

i am going to give a few words of advise u can take or leave:

dont u get too involved personally. find info, pass info on, do not take anyone's side. very often there is more then meets the eye to the story (u heard your wife's brother's side, and not first hand from him either since u arent there, i am assuming, unless u spoke with him personally).

do NOT put up money for lawyer or anything else unless its thru your wife.

the parents might think slightly different then u in dealing with things, as in not thinking legally but emotionally.

they might not understand that a written legal agreement is something that is REAL and might involve dirt in a court. (when i told (thai issaan)husband of my divorce agreement about my kids with my ex, he shrugged and said "so what'. its just paper." (involving visiting rights etc).

they might prefer to keep things 'gentlement's agreement/verbal' and low key. just guessing but u might just supply the key info with the words 'if they want' and just let them run with it. even if things seem like they might screw up the brother, let your wife, her sister, et al deal. NOT YOU. and it doesnt matter if its thailand or israel. never get involved in in-law problems. ever. afterwards down the line u might be used as the 'if u hadnt pressured him, etc etc etc'.

this is my farang woman's point of view.

btw, when i suggested a lawyer for my hubby's beaten up sister, i just got 'the look'. so am letting the family deal.

cant save everyone from themselves. u can guide/advocate but not interfere.

hope things are sorted.

was just curious if your interest was also due to your previous intention to unofficially 'adopt' (i.e. support) the baby ???? so you are trying to protect your interests (the baby)???

not being cynical, just curious....

bina

edit: sorry not just a few words ) a lot of words but read thru and think first.

Edited March 24, 2007 by bina

[pumpuiman]

i am going to give a few words of advise u can take or leave:

dont u get too involved personally. find info, pass info on, do not take anyone's side. very often there is more then meets the eye to the story (u heard your wife's brother's side, and not first hand from him either since u arent there, i am assuming, unless u spoke with him personally).

do NOT put up money for lawyer or anything else unless its thru your wife.

the parents might think slightly different then u in dealing with things, as in not thinking legally but emotionally.

they might not understand that a written legal agreement is something that is REAL and might involve dirt in a court. (when i told (thai issaan)husband of my divorce agreement about my kids with my ex, he shrugged and said "so what'. its just paper." (involving visiting rights etc).

they might prefer to keep things 'gentlement's agreement/verbal' and low key. just guessing but u might just supply the key info with the words 'if they want' and just let them run with it. even if things seem like they might screw up the brother, let your wife, her sister, et al deal. NOT YOU. and it doesnt matter if its thailand or israel. never get involved in in-law problems. ever. afterwards down the line u might be used as the 'if u hadnt pressured him, etc etc etc'.

this is my farang woman's point of view.

btw, when i suggested a lawyer for my hubby's beaten up sister, i just got 'the look'. so am letting the family deal.

cant save everyone from themselves. u can guide/advocate but not interfere.

hope things are sorted.

was just curious if your interest was also due to your previous intention to unofficially 'adopt' (i.e. support) the baby ???? so you are trying to protect your interests (the baby)???

not being cynical, just curious....

bina

edit: sorry not just a few words ) a lot of words but read thru and think first.

Thanks for your concern.

I realize I can only make suggestions, but want my new family to know I will stand behind them.

I would hate to see an outcome that adversely affected my family because they felt they couldn't afford legal representation.

I just want them to know they have access to resources if needed. Something they would never think of asking for.

We are of course considering the fate of the child on a personal level.

I consider my brother in law my brother, he is a great guy and I love him.

I have seen divorce chew people up and spit them out. I only want what's best for the well being of my family.

I have no control over these people, and would respect any decision they made.

I just let them know that if needed, we can be a force to be reckoned with.

Thanks again,

Eric

[Rob_Ptty]

G'day. Against my better judgement I am going to weigh into this one.

First of all PLEASE re-read and digest everything that Bina has had to say. Every single word of it is valid. Having been through the divorce thing last year you really are only touching the tip of the ice-berg and, as cynical as it may seem there is always more to stories like this than meets the eye.

Secondly, and more importantly, you need to stop judging the situation by western standards. Most of us who have grown up in a western society would find it totally unfathomable that a Mother could walk away from her child without a second thought yet my ex-wife has managed to do it and, in her case, without a penny either.

You really do need to let your wife's family handle this one and stay well and truly in the background until the dust has settled.

[Casanundra]

What about compensation to the family from her parents for loss of face?

Is it a possibility?

Unlikely. One of the reasons (and there are many) cited for paying sinsot in the first place is to compensate the family should a divorce happen.

Having a lawyer involved makes things formal and gets it documented but also adds to the cost. At the end of the day, lawyers are there to make money from others misery.

I would listen to the other posters, Offer advice but don't get involved too much as it may come back with a loaded finger being pointed your way blaming you for something that may happen.

Also the notion that western viewpoints and experiences with regards to divorces do not apply to Thailand at all.

[pumpuiman]

Thanks to everyone. The whole family is rallying together in support.

Myself included.

I appreciate your "warnings" but have to tell you, when I married my wife...I gained a brother, two sisters, a Dad, and a wonderful Mom.

I care for all of them like my blood relatives.

I will of course let them make their own decisions, but won't just sit back and watch any of them suffer.

I offer my love and support...whatever the consequences.

That's what families do.

Casunundra, your PM was excellent and informed....thanks again.

I'll update as things transpire.

[November Rain]

"My" son's real (Thai) mother has not seen him or had any contact with him for over 5 years. But, I strongly believe if she found out his father (my BF) is dead & I am looking after him, she'd be around, demanding money for him (selling him, effectively)

Something legal has to be drawn up, IMO, between your in-laws to make sure the mother can't come back 2 years down the line & demand her child or money in lieu of her.

[torrenova]

Whilst only having heard one side of the story, her family would have been the recipients of sinsot not the other way around. She should be giving him money.