German man found dead at home in Pattaya

[Leaver]

54 minutes ago, billd766 said:

My wife has always had my pin numbers and has a second ATM card on our joint account at KBank and can access my sole account with the ATM card. She can also access my sole account with the ATM card at BKK Bank.

 

We have known each other since 1993 and we married in 2000.

 

We trust each other which makes life a lot easier.

 

Most of my friends who are married have similar banking arrangements.

 

I agree that some Thai wives do what you suggest but the ones that I know don't

I think you completely missed my point.

 

It has nothing to do with trust, and everything to do with a foreigner receiving a Government pension whilst living in Thailand. Actually, and funds from abroad, for that matter.

 

In many cases the Thai wife has access to the account.  I don't have a problem with that.  The thing is, the Government pension stops when you die.

 

Some Embassies of some countries are now demanding proof of life every 2 or 3 years, which I believe means presenting yourself to your Embassy.

 

For those estranged from their family in their home country, it's very easy for a Thai partner to have a local cremation, and keep accessing the deceased's Government pension, after he has died.  

[kingofthemountain]

15 minutes ago, Leaver said:

it's very easy for a Thai partner to have a local cremation, and keep accessing the deceased's Government pension, after he has died.

No

the only way for a Thai wife to hide the death is to hide the body in the fridge 

or bury it in the garden.

It should works only if there is nobody else in the neighborhood.

 

So you are right its probably happens sometimes but is should be pretty rare.

(And don't forget the Thais are very afraid of ghosts.so because of that a lot

could be reluctant to act in this way)

 

As soon as the local authorities are notified (And the local temple for the cremation is one of them) the police comes makes a death certificate, even in the smallest villages and alert the embassy or consulate from the origin country of the deceased.

Edited January 20, 2020 by kingofthemountain

[billd766]

12 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I think you completely missed my point.

 

It has nothing to do with trust, and everything to do with a foreigner receiving a Government pension whilst living in Thailand. Actually, and funds from abroad, for that matter.

 

In many cases the Thai wife has access to the account.  I don't have a problem with that.  The thing is, the Government pension stops when you die.

 

Some Embassies of some countries are now demanding proof of life every 2 or 3 years, which I believe means presenting yourself to your Embassy.

 

For those estranged from their family in their home country, it's very easy for a Thai partner to have a local cremation, and keep accessing the deceased's Government pension, after he has died.  

My wife knows that when I die my State pension stops and that she will get a reduced amount from my other 2 pensions.

 

The proof of life form that I got from the UK had to be signed and stamped by a government official. I went to the police station the first time and the local hospital for the second one

[sniggie]

22 hours ago, Barry343 said:

There seems a lot of older farang's die in Pattaya, not a safe place for the over 50's

If you've got to die Pattaya is as good a a place as any. Better than in a freezing winter in northern Europe. I hope he was having fun until the end.

[Leaver]

12 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

No

the only way for a Thai wife to hide the death is to hide the body in the fridge 

or bury it in the garden. It should works only if they are nobody else in the neighborhood.

So you are right its porbably happens but is should be pretty rare. )Don;t forget the Thais

are very afraid of ghosts)

As soon as the local authorities are notified (And the local temple for the cremation is one

of them) the police makes a death certificate, even in the smallest villages, and alert the

embassy or consulate.

Yes, I was thinking of small villages in Issan.  It's obviously been happening for certain Governments to demand proof of life. 

 

Edited January 20, 2020 by Leaver

[Leaver]

3 minutes ago, billd766 said:

My wife knows that when I die my State pension stops and that she will get a reduced amount from my other 2 pensions.

 

The proof of life form that I got from the UK had to be signed and stamped by a government official. I went to the police station the first time and the local hospital for the second one

How often do you have to submit that form? 

 

Edited January 20, 2020 by Leaver

[billd766]

3 hours ago, Leaver said:

How often do you have to submit that form? 

 

Whenever they send it. In the last 10 years I have had 2 from the State pension people and 1 from my company pension. They send it by snail mail and the first one had about a week left before they stopped my pension and I had just received it. I rang the Pension centre and explained that I had just got it and they noted it and told me not to worry. 

The other 2 came by the same route but there was 4 months to complete it in.

AFAIK the recipients are chosen at random so you may get a couple in 3 or 4 years or you may never get one.

[BritManToo]

3 hours ago, Leaver said:

How often do you have to submit that form? 

 

Never, if you haven't told them you're living outside your home country.

[SoSoCNX]

RIP

Sad to hear, that expat dies alone 

[cyril sneer]

19 hours ago, Leaver said:

It's quite possible you can die, and if your Thai wife has the pin number to your ATM card, no one will know you are dead, and yes, it does happen. 

more often than not i'd expect

[Leaver]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

Never, if you haven't told them you're living outside your home country.

Surely it's linked to their immigration data base.

[Leaver]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

Whenever they send it. In the last 10 years I have had 2 from the State pension people and 1 from my company pension. They send it by snail mail and the first one had about a week left before they stopped my pension and I had just received it. I rang the Pension centre and explained that I had just got it and they noted it and told me not to worry. 

The other 2 came by the same route but there was 4 months to complete it in.

AFAIK the recipients are chosen at random so you may get a couple in 3 or 4 years or you may never get one.

I was under the belief it's not a random check.  If you are over a certain age, and receive a Government benefit, every X amount of years you have to show proof of life. 

 

Possibly different rules for different countries. 

[BritManToo]

15 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Surely it's linked to their immigration data base.

UK doesn't record people exiting the country or how long you were out for.

It would need a database linked to ports and airports in every European country.

[BritManToo]

16 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I was under the belief it's not a random check.  If you are over a certain age, and receive a Government benefit, every X amount of years you have to show proof of life. 

 

Possibly different rules for different countries. 

I don't know any pensioner in the UK that ever had to fill out a 'proof of life'.

Allegedly the DWP doesn't even have a current address for 40% of UK pensioners.

Edited January 20, 2020 by BritManToo

[Leaver]

Just now, BritManToo said:

UK doesn't record people exiting the country or how long you were out for.

It would need a database linked to ports and airports in every European country.

Doesn't the EU know that an EU passport holder is outside of the EU? 

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Doesn't the EU know that an EU passport holder is outside of the EU? 

Can't see how, the borders between all the countries are totally open.

It would need a common database of all EU citizens in all EU ports and airports to track who was leaving the EU.

And that wouldn't give any clue about where an EU citizen was in the EU at any time.

 

It's not as if the EU is a little country like Australia, with only one border, where every citizen is easily tracked.

I always claim I was in Spain or France if anyone asks, if they wanted to see my passport, I just lost it.

If the government asked, I've only ever left the country for a week or two on holiday.

Edited January 20, 2020 by BritManToo

[Leaver]

7 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I don't know any pensioner in the UK that ever had to fill out a 'proof of life'.

I am talking about foreigners receiving Government benefits who are living abroad.  Not all countries require proof of life, but some do. 

 

Here's a random link from Google about UK State Pensions.  They use the term "Life Certificate" which I always took to mean proof of life. 

 

https://www.gov.uk/state-pension-if-you-retire-abroad/report-a-change-in-your-circumstances

 

Edited January 20, 2020 by Leaver

[BritManToo]

4 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I am talking about foreigners receiving Government benefits who are living abroad.  Not all countries require proof of life, but some do. 

Here's a random link from Google about UK State Pensions.  They use the term "Life Certificate" which I always took to mean proof of life. 

https://www.gov.uk/state-pension-if-you-retire-abroad/report-a-change-in-your-circumstances

So you just don't tell them you retired abroad.

I certainly haven't retired abroad, I'm just here on holiday for a few weeks.

My bank is in the UK, they don't have any foreign address for me.

I've never transferred money from a bank in the UK to outside the UK.

Edited January 20, 2020 by BritManToo

[kingofthemountain]

27 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Surely it's linked to their immigration data base.

The information comes more often from the bank or the pension office

than the immigration,

You need to have your pension transfered here on a regular basis in a way

or another

Edited January 20, 2020 by kingofthemountain

[kingofthemountain]

4 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

So you just don't tell them you retired abroad.

I certainly haven't retired abroad, I'm just here on holiday for a few weeks.

My bank is in the UK, they don't have any foreign address for me.

I've never transferred money from a bank in the UK to outside the UK.

Just out of curiosity

how can you manage to transfer your money here in Thailand on a regular basis?

You do some travels go and comeback every year with cash on you?

[Leaver]

4 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Can't see how, the borders between all the countries are totally open.

It would need a common database of all EU citizens in all EU ports and airports to track who was leaving the EU.

And that wouldn't give any clue about where an EU citizen was in the EU at any time.

 

It's not as if the EU is a little country like Australia, with only one border, where every citizen is easily tracked.

I always claim I was in Spain or France if anyone asks, if they wanted to see my passport, I just lost it.

I know what you are getting at, but I can't see how an EU citizen, leaving the EU from any country inside the EU, does not have any departure data held anywhere that they have left the EU. 

 

I had a quick Google but all I get is Brexit links.  Do you think the EU will know that every UK citizen has left the EU, all on the same day?  ????

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, kingofthemountain said:

Just out of curiosity

how can you manage to transfer your money here in Thailand on a regular basis?

You do some travels go and comeback every year with cash on you?

I use a money moving company in the UK.

[Leaver]

8 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I've never transferred money from a bank in the UK to outside the UK.

Huh? 

 

What's the alternative for a retiree?

[BritManToo]

4 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I know what you are getting at, but I can't see how an EU citizen, leaving the EU from any country inside the EU, does not have any departure data held anywhere that they have left the EU. 

 

I can't see how the UK could access that data, even if it existed.

 

Back on topic,

dead German, sad but at 77 he's had a good run, and the weather was nicer than Germany.

Edited January 20, 2020 by BritManToo

[Leaver]

10 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

The information comes more often from the bank or the pension office

than the immigration,

So how does a bank or a pension office know your are abroad?

[Leaver]

3 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I use a money moving company in the UK.

Yeh, I've heard of that company, Bin Laden's International Money Transfer.   ????

 

Seriously, without doing something illegal, do you really think there is no paper trail of the money leading back to you in Thailand? 

[Leaver]

4 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I can't see how the UK could access that data, even if it existed.

Well, committing fraud maybe one reason the UK would be able to access that data.  ????

[kingofthemountain]

7 minutes ago, Leaver said:

So how does a bank or a pension office know your are abroad?

Because it happens the pension office or a bank in your origin country

transfer the money to your bank account in Thailand, Im a way or another 

you needs to have your money transfered

[BritManToo]

9 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Well, committing fraud maybe one reason the UK would be able to access that data.  ????

Have you lived in fear of your own government all your life?

Have you ever known your government to have the slightest competence in tracking terrorists and/or criminals (let alone an old guy on holiday)?

Edited January 20, 2020 by BritManToo

[Enki]

5 hours ago, Leaver said:

Yes, I was thinking of small villages in Issan.  It's obviously been happening for certain Governments to demand proof of life.

Small villages in Isaan are just like small villages in Germany, France, or any other place ...