Thai men

[Nat]

Hi

I'm planning on moving to thailand and curious about your views on thai men. I was recently in thailand and got together with a thai guy. We now speak nearly every day. At times he's really sweet however not sure whether he's genuine and whether I can trust him. I say this cause he's a barman and has been with many western women. Apart from that I've heard that thai men can not be faithful.

I'm really confused and would appreciate any views or stories about thai men.

Thanx Nat

[Boo]

Hi Nat, I won't lie to you as to the nature of a lot of thai guys, but you must take care in the sense that, if you would'nt put up with it at home from a guy, don't put up with it here. Thai guys are masters at making you feel guilty,from having more money to them & not spending it on what they want, to not loving them enough & having a cold heart, especislly if you don't do what they want. I don't know if' it's the way they've been raised or whether this country is far behind most of the world in the womens rights issues but they just think that women are pushovers (especially farang women & their money), created for the sole purpose of pleasing them & it can be easy to fall into their little mind games & become a complete mug. If this guy is a barman & has had a lot of farang women already just be warned that he is used to girls being here for a few weeks, having a bit of fun & then taking off, so just make sure he isn't playing games with you & if he starts, give him a kick up the arse & find yourself another guy, because in the case of thai men for farang girls, there IS plenty more fish in the sea. Good luck & I hope this guy is the real Mcoy.

[elfe]

I absolutely agree with Boo, so be careful. but on the other hand, there is chance that your guy might be genuine and also be already disappointed of all the farang girls who just come here for a few days and use him for fun and just drop him when they go back home - depends on how long he's been 'in the business' already, so it's on both of your sides to raise trust. to be with someone working in a bar can be a drag as he might be tempted easily and also nightlife might become your schedule if you are staying with him - if you like it or not...

to find out the truth about his feelings and his personality you will have to watch him very close when you come back here. be aware of any mind games you can imagine (or not) and make your point immediately as clear as possible. keep your money invisible!

be patient, but also: as soon as he does you any harm - drop him! that might safe you a lot of tears later.

and as Boo said: there's more fish in the sea...

chokdee

elfe ::

[Boo]

Ni Nat, A couple more things to think about maybe.

1) How old is thins guy? You tend to find if they are over 30 they are a little calmer & more ready for a serious(!) relationship as apposed to younger guys who feel it's their duty to play around as much as possible.

2) Find out through any means if he has a thai girlfreind/wife hidden away in the provinces, as this tends to happen quite a lot.

I know one girl was with her guy for over a year, had a house & business together & one day his thai wife turned up with their 18 month old baby, farang wife was expected to sleep in the spare room for the duration of the stay. Unbeleivably, she agreed, she & the guy are still together but the thai wife now has 3 kids by him & still comes to stay & farang wife sleeps in the spare room!!! She must have had a really horrible childhood or something!?

They also sometimes have thai girls who they don't see but will be expected to marry by a certain age, this is usually arranged by the families with the man & woman in full consent because it means that if neither are married by say 33 years old they will marry each other rather that not being married too old or not having someone to have children with. (This is all true I swear)

3) If possible arrange with this guy to meet his family as soon as possible when you arrive. If he is reluctant then ask that you can speak to them on the phone, if he still refuses then it probably means that something like the other points above is true.

These points are just ideas you might want to bear in mind but remeber, use your gut insticts & if he makes you happy, be happy but if something bothers you, explain it to him & see how he reacts. Most people with something to hide go straight on the defensive whereas someone genuine will react in a clam & resonable manner.

Chokedee ka

[Nat]

Thanx for the advice, I will keep all those points in mind.

The weird thing is, before I read your reponse, I had a dream that he had a thai wife (think it must be my paranoia). I mentioned my dream to him on the phone and he just laughed it off.

Will just have to go with my gut instincts.

Thanx again

Nat x

[frenchie]

Hi Nat ! You story sounds so familiar to mine and i wish yours can work out but the reality is often the opposite. A few years ago i met my thai boyfriend who was just considerate as well off in this island, he owned a speed boat an his family had money and everything. We met in a bar and the relationship was wonderful, he was so nice and caring when i was there about 6 months of the year. Until i found out he was married had 2 kids and a girlfriend. Anyway we were  so "in love" he decided to leave wife and girlfriend and decided to start a new life  because he wanted to change and become a good man ... he introduced me to his family and so on but he was in debts and had to sell the boat. When he had money he was very generous to me so i has no suspicions that he could be with me for money. After 2 years he convinced me to go back to Europe to earn enough money to make a business in order to stay for ever in Thailand and be happy together. He worked as well and we were phoning every day. every time i said something about him being unfaithful he just laugh ... their way when they feel embarassed and dont know what to reply. The relationship lasted 3 years like this until one day he told me he had met a new girl that she was very good because her family had a lot  of money  and said horrible things to me so i would leave him alone. That guy manipulated me and lied. I knew thai men  were like this because some his friends were also using foreign women and my friends who are married there had warned me  they are not happy but stay there because they have kids and business and like the place but my advice would be don't get to involved you will end up being hurt. i Also thought our story was special and he was not like the others and he made sure that i wouldn't doubt of this. Now I feel sorry for the gierl he is with he is taking her money and made it clear  that it was only because he wanted power that he was with a foreigner. they are not genuine and specially if he works in a bar. I would say that 25 % might be sincere. Their culture is so important and is based on money I ended up speaking thai and if you listen to them they only talk about women and money.  it took me years to understand and now eventhough i Had a life there and very good friends i still feel hurt and bitter about going back there and seeing him. He left to settle down and open a restaurant in a different island because he is probably scared that His new girlfriend might find out about all the women he had hurt. I was not the first one and probably not the last one...Good luck and take care of yourself

[francois]

hi' all

well, I'm a guy ... living here married with a lovely daughter,

but since I read all what you were talking about thai guys,

I have to say, that I have quite a few thai friends, and "exept"

one of them. they are all unfaithfull, what I mean, is they are not only "glancing" at beautiful ladies passing by, they are running behind.

most of them don't like foreigners as they say they take away all their nice looking girls, basicaly jealous!, it's a fact,

thai men are jealous, but at the same time they can drive their wife to a night-bar to put them at work ...

jealous, but loving money and easy life more than anything else in life ...

alright, there are some exeptions like in any rule, but they are rare, really rare.

and all these guys that could make you believe that they are going to bring you a "thai" moon to you are just like any thai-bargirl, on the same basis "job", and it's a pity to say this because most of us did not come here for any kind of purpose like this, I'm married but met my wife through a circle of friends, I have met a lot of guys and girls that had been heartly robbed and it's a shame, yes they can play with you, for one reason, we are not fully aware of all thai hidden rules and traditions, it's a fact also, but I have to say, that we can hardly know them all, as some come from so long ago.

but anyway, this country is like any other, some good some bad, it's only more difficult to understand with a european way of thinking, anyway, be careful, as "having" a "farang"

girlfriend belongs to a kind of "proudness".

I wish you all the best you deserve, but again be careful, you have only one heart take good care of it.

I wish you all the best

sincerely

francois

[Nat]

Hi all

I think there is a "proudness" to having a "farang" girlfriend. I've heard thai guys say, on numerous occasions, that they prefer farang women over thai women. Curious whether it is a pride thing or something else?

Nat x

[elfe]

dear Nat,

don't let yourself get demoralised by all the ( very well-meant) advice you read on this board. not everbody is the same, but surely here is another culture and peoples values and morals differ from ours, but on the other hand you can learn a lot from this and also about your own limits and fears - might widen your horizon if your mind is ready and open for that. But surely don't put up with everything! you have to consider as your boyfriend is a barman (nothing against that, at least he is working), what about the barmen in your own country?? might be not easy to be with one of them either...

Boo made very good points about not letting yourself being fooled and cheated, you should check these points for to start out first. but, as can be seen in frenchie's story that is not always 100% sure, as his family will stand behind him, nt to destroy his chance to get a better life or some money/business through his 'wealthy' farang girlfriend. but where can you be 100% sure??

of course it depends what social layer/job/background he comes from and that is the same in every culture, surely not every thai man drives his witfe at night to a bar to make money from other men, that is only in certain circles, so stay away from these! a thai man from a very renowned family would probably never spend a second thought about being with a foreign woman...

so just listen to your guts and don't get too much involved, take it easy first and keep your eyes open. what I find is that you could rather have a firm and trustworthy relatioinship is when you constantly live here and not move back and forth. this will give your bf more confidence and you have more insight in his 'real' life.

good luck  :cool:

chokdee

elfe

[D80]

Hello there,

Well, I agree with elfe that although you need to be careful, you also have to bear in mind that everone's different.  

But I do have to say that it is also in the culture that encourage Thai men to be unfaithful to their partners.  I am a Thai so my mum & dad are also Thais.  My dad told me he disagrees with the idea that a man should try to bed as many women as he can (as most Thai men would do) to be consider a real man.  As far as I know, he has been staying faithful throughout the marriage and takes great pride in it.  But that is a very rare example.

Almost all of my Thai male friends have visited prostitues; many of them on regular basis, even when they already have girlfriends and wives.  

When they were dating, ie. not married, the excuse was that according to Thai culture you should not sleep with your gf before you get married so the men go to the prostitutes instead.  

But when they get married most of them will not stop their little 'relaxation' (as most of them call it).  Most if not all of their wives/girlfriends know about this but turn a blind eye as long as the men come back to them and have been using protection (although God knows if they really do).  

These days, lots of Thai women don't put up with it anymore and are prepared to walk out of the relationship if the other half hasn't been faithful.  But remember, gender equality hasn't really blossom here and there are many reasons why Thai women would tolerate the sort of behaviour from their men.  Sometimes, it's even been seen as the women's 'inadequacy' that the men play away and that it is all the women's fault.

If you read/write Thai, you could try going to some of the Thai webboards like Pantip (www.pantip.com) or sanook (www.sanook.com) and see what the Thai attitude on men playing away from home is like.  Although it is changing, I would say a lage majority will still see it as acceptable, even as 'men's nature' to do so.

Not all Thai men are untrustworthy, obviously.  There are lots of nice Thai men out there.  However, you have to be aware of these cultural attitudes as well.

As for Thai men being proud of having a farang gf, there are many reasons, really.  It might be because he is just proud of you as a person (hopefully).  It could also be because farang woman is seen as more modern and carefree in Thais' eyes and for a Thai man to be able to pursue such relationship would mean, in some Thais' point of view, that he is some sort of a hunk (really).  In some cases, the woman is nothing more than a 'trophy' for him to hold up to all his mates.  But remember everyone's different & so as their relationships.

What I've been saying come from what I have seen as a Thai woman.  I have no prejudice against Thai men personally.  I think there are untrustworthy men and wonderful men everywhere, be they farang or Thai.  Just thought I might share some of the things I have learnt and seen regarding the issue.

[Buccaneer]

Well let there be no mistake,Thai man are among the biggest womanisers you can find. Many , many girls find themsleves in the gutter after being "picked" whils hubby, if he did not run yet and left her with 3 kids, is bussy gobbling mekong and chasing yet an other Mi-a-noi. Not to mentiion the Tea houses and the monk (the fornicating ones ) scams. Girls bte wise and dont play Russuian roulete with a gun that has all the chambers loaded.

Cheers

Tjep

P.s. The phenomenon of the THAI MUSHROOM HEAD is often under discussion in Pantip Chat English

[elfe]

and how do most farang men behave in Thailand??

guess if it's easy game, man likes to play it... ???

life in Thailand might be easy going in some aspects but definitely not in the relationship-field. If you don't like the too loose ones...

being 'heartbroken' seems to be a frequent state. how comes? is the blood overboiling in the tropical heat?

any comments

[seville]

Coming from Florida I can tell you that living in a vacation spot is going to bring out the bad in the bad boy. Everyday you have a new person flying into town to party. It works the same for the women. I had a ton of girlfriends that would be on prowl looking for guys to hook up with on vacation. They didn't tend to sleep with them, but they got taken out to dinner, party, whatever for a week and the guy would take off home and it was on to the next boy.

[issan2]

Your boyfriend might be genuine but Thailand is such an unusual country. My Thai wife's younger brother is married with children but has a mistress as well. They all live in the same house. The only thing that he is scared of is his father finding out.

[singa-traz]

and how do most farang men behave in Thailand??

guess if it's easy game, man likes to play it... ???

life in Thailand might be easy going in some aspects but definitely not in the relationship-field. If you don't like the too loose ones...

being 'heartbroken' seems to be a frequent state. how comes? is the blood overboiling in the tropical heat?

any comments

The worse, I have witnessed, was a guy who came to work for 18-24 months in Bangkok, after 4 month, his girlfriend managed to quit her very good job in her home country to come and work here (loosy job compare to what she had) ... and the guy broke their relationship ... at Don Muang airport, just when she arrived ! ... too late ...

The most honest one, who actually decided to end/pause their relation BEFORE taking the plane ... managed to get back together at the end of his assignment here !

So 'heartbroken' ... yes, used to see a lot ... but when you are young without kids ... you can survive those moments.

[cold]

replying to thai men, oh just forget it, if your not involved, don't.  I think it's just not worth all the hassles, the misunderstandings, the suspicions, on both parties, because thai men can be very jealous.  Been there, done it, and I would not do it again, even though I have very special feelings for one particular man, but if I had to do it again.  NEVER.

cold, but not from my heart

[Nat]

You're right about thai men being very jealous. My thai boyfriend didn't speak to me almost an entire week cause HIS friend was talking to me. It was just an innocent chat but my boyfriend got very jealous. He didn't speak to his friend for a day or two, but was very harsh with me. I must admit I was very confused when this happened, especially cause I don't even blink twice when he talks to girls (which is very often).

[Boo]

The jelousy thing come under the messing with you head part of my previous posting. My advice is to ignore it & if he continues, tell him to get over it. This kind of control game is no good in any relationship, & as I said before, if you wouldn't put up with it with a guy from home why would you accept it in a thai guy. OK, the "good" Thai girlfriend do not have male freinds but we are farang & if a thai guy wants to be with us then they have to accept this part of our culture. If they don't like it then they can get a thai g/f. But I think you will find they are sick of thai girls constant jelousy & childishness which is why they are with farang in the first place!

If he continues you need to decide if you are ready to be controlled for the rest of your life & if not then it's best to finish with him & keep true to yourself. Don't let him make you become someone you are not.

[D80]

Well, normally, Thai women still have male friends even when they are in a relationship with someone (bf/gf relationship or married).  Any men (be it Thai or whatever nationalities) who tell you differently are usually extremely old fashion, control freaks or just pigs (or all of that!).  

All my female Thai friends have male friends and their boyfriends don't see that as anything to be upset about.  My mum, a Thai woman from an older generation, has loads and loads of guy friends.  I don't see dad getting jealous over silly things like that.  I've seen a few guy friends getting jealous over such silly things in the past; but it was just out of immaturity then they grew out of it.

If you put up with a guy like that now, you'll be sick of his 'constant jelousy & childishness' later on for sure (again, I don't think such characteristics are particular of any nationality really.  It depends a lot on the individuals).

[Nat]

Hi all

D80 think you're right about jealousy coming down to the person not nationality. I've seen western men get jealous over the silliest little things eg commenting an actor is good looking!

My thai boyfriend can be very childish at times and think that's where his jealousy stems from. However, some of these childlike qualities can be quite sweet at times - it would be nice if he could find a happy medium.

[Boo]

Sorry all thai ladies out there, you have my sincerest apoligies.

My comments were based on conversations with Thai male friends who after being in relationships with farang would not likely have another relationship with Thai women as they like farangs more liberal ideas & relaxed attitudes to relationships, also the fact that our parents on not on the scene to ask difficult questions or our need for dowry etc when marriage/children become a factor. Also after witnessing the realtionships between thai women & farang men, jelousy & game playing on her part are a major factor in the guy getting off his stool & going to another bar to meet a less demanding woman.

Maybe this behaviour is indicitive to the islands & of girls from the provinces working here but I can verify that this is very much the case.

D80 you sound like a well educated, travelled person from a liberal & loving family but you have to admit that many of the old fashion views still exist in Thailand & especcially in the northern provinces. My own b/fs mother (Issan) for example will not even tolerate us holding hands in her house or kissing each other, however chaste, in public & even sometimes here in samui, when we have a party with a mix of people, I will generally be the only women sitting with a group of thai men having a chat, while the thai women sit apart only coming over to bring more food, or clear the plates away!!!!

[enchanted]

Hi...very interesting topic, although it's about Thai men and not Thai women..

One question : Have it struck you people that the reason why Thai men would like to have a relationship with farang women could be the same as why farang men finds Thai women attractive?

Beneath all the beliefs/assumptions about culture, nationality and social behaviour, why is it not reasonable to think that Thai people (regardless men or women) may have just the same reasons as foreigners in finding a relationship with people from a different country exciting, interesting and different?

Afterall, we are all human beings...why can't Thais be thrilled by having a foreign partner? Or is it just only farangs who have the privilege of experiencing such excitment? Eurocentrism at play? I suspect so...

[D80]

Sorry Boo, I didn't mean to sound so serious.  I was just teasing you in that comment.  It's pretty difficult to express how we mean by our post without using emoticon!  hehehe  I'm still trying to master the art of that.  

I agree with you totally on your observation.  Thai culture makes it extremely easy for women to be childish in many ways.  For example, most of Thai women are taught to be follower (hence the 'back leg of the elephant' expression).  Traditionally, the women are taught to obey, at least on the face of it anyway.  If they have their own opinion and want to change their husband's mind, then they have to manipulate somehow.  I think that's one of the reason why emotional blackmail is so common among many Thais.  

It's a shame really that in many parts of Thailand, women are still seen as second class citizen in some ways.  Gender equality hasn't really sunk its roots here.  I am a born and bred Bangkokian so the way I was raised may be different; it certainly wasn't traditional.  I have a friend who was raised traditionally & her parents are extremely strict with the girl.  It was like you said and worse.  She's not even allowed to have a boyfriend.  It's the family that will choose who she will be with.  I don't know... I can't live with that.

Having said that, things are changing gradually.  These days, it's no longer frown upon for married Thai women to have male friends.  There are still boundaries on what you can and cannot do but that's pretty much the same as most countries in the world (as far as I've seen anyway). Although some people from the older generation still strongly believe in/practice the old way be it discriminating against women, I think the new generation isn't going to be as strict as that anymore.    :cool:

[Boo]

D80, don't apologise for your comments they were completly founded, sometimes I also have a problem with what i'm trying to express & what I actually type

I do beleive that bangkokians are more liberal in general, something to do with the big city I guess, but unfortunatly, as you say, many thai women are still oppressed in thier homes that they don't even know this behaviour is wrong.

So many times here in Samui, I see Thai guys out with Farang & even other thai women while their wives/g/fs are at home looking after babies or just generally being "good thai women!" (whatever that means) & we are expected to just keep our mouths shut & then look their real partners in the eye next time we see them. It makes me so crazy, that now, if a guy comes to talk with me who is out with another girl (of course not sister/aunt/friend), I will blatently ask how their wife is & see the look of horror on thier faces. Unpopular, yes I think I am but I can sleep better at night & can look people in the eye! & don't even get me started on farang guys, that could go on forever!

[Nat]

Unpopular, yes I think I am but I can sleep better at night & can look people in the eye! & don't even get me started on farang guys, that could go on forever!

Boo if unpopularity is the price to pay for a good night's rest well it may be worth it   At least you're staying true to yourself.

When it comes to farang men think we all have our fair share of tales to tell - a bit like "the never ending story"  

Natx

[elfe]

hi enchanted, I think thai people find it the same exciting to get to know people from other countries and try relationships with them. unfortunately there are many black sheep who want to profit also in money terms by that, gives it a somewhat sour feeling when getting to know somebody new, as you might be suspicious all the time. as it comes naturally, coming mostly from another financial background as you b/f / g/f might come from, you want to keep up your standard a bit and that involves mostly paying for two.

Boo, respect you show your inacceptance when you meet a friend who might be cheating his wife or g/f. I know about a thai lady who did the same and even more, means she talked around and to the wives and g/fs. now her husband doesn't have many friends anymore and noone wants to visit them in their house. that shows real friends. i did it once here, told a farang friend that thai parter was cheating and got into unpleasant trouble, but I would do it again, as I expect the same.

why do thai men fancy farang women? (apart from the great looks ). They accept a lot from us what they would not tolerate with their thai g/fs.

"Thai women as they like farangs more liberal ideas & relaxed attitudes to relationships, also the fact that our parents on not on the scene to ask difficult questions or our need for dowry etc when marriage/children become a factor. "

does that mean we are easy prey and easy to handle?

cold, I must admit, your advice is not the worst, haven't seen a lot of thai man - farang woman relationships which had been long lasting or still very happy in the long run. unfortunately

let's try for better :laugh:

chokdee

elfe

[Farang Ting Tong]

why do thai men fancy farang women?

From what I've seen of the Thai/Farang couples while living on Samui, I'd say that those Thai men fancy farang women because Thai women want nothing to do with them. These long-haired, hippie-types are some of the biggest <deleted> you could meet.

The farang women there (usually Brits or Aussies) are some of the most gross white women I've had the misfortune to see in Thailand.

Avoid at all costs.

Uuugh!

[Nat]

From what I've seen of the Thai/Farang couples while living on Samui, I'd say that those Thai men fancy farang women because Thai women want nothing to do with them. These long-haired, hippie-types are some of the biggest <deleted> you could meet.

The farang women there (usually Brits or Aussies) are some of the most gross white women I've had the misfortune to see in Thailand.

All I can say to this is, different strokes for different folks  

[Boo]

QUOTE (From what I've seen of the Thai/Farang couples while living on Samui, I'd say that those Thai men fancy farang women because Thai women want nothing to do with them. These long-haired, hippie-types are some of the biggest <deleted> you could meet.)

Maybe if you know these thai guys so well, to lable them all "<deleted>" then it's a case of "takes one to know one"?

QUOTE (The farang women there (usually Brits or Aussies) are some of the most gross white women I've had the misfortune to see in Thailand.)

Interesting point, it is also one of the reasons that us farang girls don't like to date with farang guys in Thailand, not to mention the diseases you may be carrying after sleeping with  bar girls! Just another point of view.

[Farang Ting Tong]

Maybe if you know these thai guys so well, to lable them all "<deleted>" then it's a case of "takes one to know one"?

Interesting point, it is also one of the reasons that us farang girls don't like to date with farang guys in Thailand, not to mention the diseases you may be carrying after sleeping with  bar girls! Just another point of view.

I don't know them at all. I just observe their behaviour.

Sorry but Thai guys don't sleep with 'bar girls'? No, they just frequent Thai brothels where the underage Burmese are shackled to the bed and condoms are not used.

Boo dear, you really need to take your head out of the sand. I've met a few farang women who've fallen for Thai guys' lies, been screwed over (literally and figuratively speaking) and lost a fair bit of money. It doesn't just happen to us farang GUYS, you know.

Also, not ALL farang men in Thailand sleep with bar girls though personally I think the majority do as compared to most farang women, even the "lowliest bus station skank" (copyright 'The Ladies Man' movie) outdoes white women in terms of grace, beauty and femininity. Things you all left behind in your search for equality.

BTW, you say 'us farang girls' as if you're speaking for all of them in Thailand. The actual reason 'farang girls don't like to date with farang guys in Thailand' is that any farang guy in his right mind is not going to go anywhere near your cellulite ridden, politically-correct, chain smoking asses. It's probably one of the reasons why he left his home country in the first place. ???