Thailand On US Copyright Piracy List

[LaoPo]

AP

12 Nations Put on Copyright Piracy List

China, Russia and 10 other nations were targeted by the Bush administration for failing to sufficiently protect American producers of music, movies and other copyrighted material from widespread piracy.

The Bush administration on Monday placed the 12 countries on a "priority watch list" which will subject them to extra scrutiny and could eventually lead to economic sanctions if the administration decides to bring trade cases before the World Trade Organization.

In addition to Russia and China, the 10 countries placed on the priority watch list were Argentina, Chile, Egypt, India, Israel, Lebanon, Thailand, Turkey, Ukraine and Venezuela.

The countries placed on a lower-level watch list were Belarus, Belize, Bolivia, Brazil, Canada, Colombia, Costa Rica, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Guatemala, Hungary, Indonesia, Italy, Jamaica, South Korea, Kuwait, Lithuania, Malaysia, Mexico, Pakistan, Peru, Philippines, Poland, Romania, Saudi Arabia, Taiwan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and Vietnam.

From Forbes:

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/04/30/ap3670384.html

LaoPo

[dumspero]

Good for fair, open and honest international trade. Good for rule of law and transparency. 2 steps forward and 1.9 steps backward, but at least this is in the right direction.

And I'm no Nostradamus, but I predict others will disagree.

[TopDogger]

Hmmz, thats supprising.. I thought the deputy PM single handedly mounted a crackdown on Pantit recently

[Donnyboy]

Like we really care.

Piracy will never cease as long as there is a willing market for copied goods.

There are bigger problems out there that the Bush Admin. need to address, which makes this a storm in a tea cup.

[larvidchr]

Piracy is wrong, but the big corporations have to lower their prices to realistic lewels in the poorer countries of the world, how many Thais could afford to buy their products if they where priced normal.

I saw on TV Banglamung cable, a western teenage girlband on walkingstreet, finding a vendor selling copys of their latest cd, they got very upset and the two 17 year old girls was rambeling on about how hard they had worked and how they now was loosing money because of this trade with copys in walking street.

If they had followed the vendor to his home after he had finished his 12 hour day, (7 days a week), they would proberly have found that their shoes back in the UK/US wouldent even fit inside this mans home.

How many cd would these two girls have sold in Thailand at full price, probably very few, and would they have been able to hold concerts packed with thousands of young Thai fans, if their music hadent been spread out through Thailand by cheap copys?

The computer industri, intertainment industri have to rethink their approch to these markets and lower their prices significantly if they want to eradicate/reduce the piracy buisness. how many cd/dvd is a Thai earning 4000ish bath a month going to buy at 600Bath a pop let alone talking about computerprograms running in the several thousand Bath range.

Kind regards

[hammered]

AP

12 Nations Put on Copyright Piracy List

China, Russia and 10 other nations were targeted by the Bush administration for failing to sufficiently protect American producers of music, movies and other copyrighted material from widespread piracy.

The Bush administration on Monday placed the 12 countries on a "priority watch list" which will subject them to extra scrutiny and could eventually lead to economic sanctions if the administration decides to bring trade cases before the World Trade Organization.

In addition to Russia and China, the 10 countries placed on the priority watch list were Argentina, Chile, Egypt, India, Israel, Lebanon, Thailand, Turkey, Ukraine and Venezuela.

The countries placed on a lower-level watch list were Belarus, Belize, Bolivia, Brazil, Canada, Colombia, Costa Rica, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Guatemala, Hungary, Indonesia, Italy, Jamaica, South Korea, Kuwait, Lithuania, Malaysia, Mexico, Pakistan, Peru, Philippines, Poland, Romania, Saudi Arabia, Taiwan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and Vietnam.

From Forbes:

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/04/30/ap3670384.html

LaoPo

Oh well if Israel is in the top ten I dont think we need to worry too much as they dont seem to suffer from any US retribution. In fact quite the opposite. It may help Thailand to set up its equivalent of AIPAC however.

Hmmm. Ditto Egypt, India, Argentina, Chile, Ukraine, Turkey, and Lebanon. Then not much can be done about China who have the fate of the US economy in their hands or Russia who control Europes out of control desire for oil and more to the point gas. That leaves only Venezuela who no doubt couldnt care.

Or to put it simply. This list is utterly meaningless unless you are already a country despised by the Bushistas. To date there is no evidence that Thailand falls into this category.

[andy1308]

Piracy is wrong, but the big corporations have to lower their prices to realistic lewels in the poorer countries of the world, how many Thais could afford to buy their products if they where priced normal.

I saw on TV Banglamung cable, a western teenage girlband on walkingstreet, finding a vendor selling copys of their latest cd, they got very upset and the two 17 year old girls was rambeling on about how hard they had worked and how they now was loosing money because of this trade with copys in walking street.

If they had followed the vendor to his home after he had finished his 12 hour day, (7 days a week), they would proberly have found that their shoes back in the UK/US wouldent even fit inside this mans home.

How many cd would these two girls have sold in Thailand at full price, probably very few, and would they have been able to hold concerts packed with thousands of young Thai fans, if their music hadent been spread out through Thailand by cheap copys?

The computer industri, intertainment industri have to rethink their approch to these markets and lower their prices significantly if they want to eradicate/reduce the piracy buisness. how many cd/dvd is a Thai earning 4000ish bath a month going to buy at 600Bath a pop let alone talking about computerprograms running in the several thousand Bath range.

Kind regards

I actually thought the same until I read recently that Thailand is classed by The World Bank and the IMF as having the world's 20th and 21st largest economy respectively. Thailand is not a poor country in global terms.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...y_GDP_%28PPP%29

Edited May 1, 2007 by andy1308

[larvidchr]

I actually thought the same until I read recently that Thailand is classed by The World Bank and the IMF as having the world's 20th and 21st largest economy respectively. Thailand is not a poor country in global terms.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...y_GDP_%28PPP%29

Yes you are ofcause right looking at it like that, but in real buying power terms, it depends on wether the companys wants 2 or 3 % of the population as costumers or the rest 63 millions Thais without a lot of money

[KireB]

Just bought a bunch of pirated dvd's! 6 for 500 baht and superb quality!

One of the things I love about Thailand!

[torito]

Just bought a bunch of pirated dvd's! 6 for 500 baht and superb quality!

One of the things I love about Thailand!

[John K]

Things are back to normal on Sukhumvit, just another cycle.

[richard10365]

AP

12 Nations Put on Copyright Piracy List

China, Russia and 10 other nations were targeted by the Bush administration............................

Doesn't that little phrase kinda take the sting out of the rest of the story?

[Crash999]

I actually thought the same until I read recently that Thailand is classed by The World Bank and the IMF as having the world's 20th and 21st largest economy respectively. Thailand is not a poor country in global terms.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...y_GDP_%28PPP%29

That's GDP adjusted by PPP, making the Thai economy look stronger because stuff is cheaper here. In terms of non-adjusted GDP, Thailand slips down the rankings:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...P_%28nominal%29

Interesting to see that Canada is on the 2nd tier list. Those devious IPR pirates to the North!

Edited May 1, 2007 by Crash999

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

Here's a thought, America can always close her borders to foreign trade. America has within her own borders everything she needs to survive and prosper including energy resources. The big MNCs won't like it but it. Big oil won't like it. But it will create jobs, improve wages and generally help improve the lives of ordinary Americans.

[Jai Dee]

US put Thailand on priority watch list

Thailand has joined China, India and nine other countries that top the US list of worst offenders of international copyright rules, the US government said.

The other countries are Russia, Egypt, Argentina, Chile, Israel, Lebanon, Turkey, Ukraine and Venezuela.

The annual "Special 301 report," issued by the US Trade Representative's office Monday, placed the countries on a special "priority watch list" that will be monitored to "encourage and maintain" effective intellectual property rights protections.

Another 31 countries were put on lower levels of monitoring.

Only Thailand is new to the priority watch list this year, reflecting a concern that the past year has been characterised by an overall deterioration in the protection and enforcement of copyright laws.

It pointed out that Thai officials have worked "amid challenging circumstances" to enforce the law. But the efforts "appear not to have had a measurable effect on piracy and counterfeiting rates".

US trade officials singled out Thailand's lack of control over optical disc media (DVDs).

Piracy of trademarked products like footwear, books, business software, cable and signals were also cited.

According to the report, Thailand had insufficient penalties for violations, and there were indications of a further "weakening of respect" for patents such as pharmaceutical products.

The report said in China, an estimated 85 to 93 per cent of all copyrighted material sold is thought to be pirated. Russian piracy sales have robbed US copyright holders of an estimated US$2.1 billion last year.

Chile and Venezuela remain on the top priority list because of failure to make progress in enforcement and cooperation, and increasing levels of piracy, the report said.

Egypt has improved its systems, especially in modernising its infrastructure and training key personnel such as judges and civil inspectors. But Israel "appears to have left unchanged its intellectual property regime."

Source: The Nation - 02 May 2007

[Wellyoudidask]

Piracy is wrong, but the big corporations have to lower their prices to realistic lewels in the poorer countries of the world, how many Thais could afford to buy their products if they where priced normal.

I saw on TV Banglamung cable, a western teenage girlband on walkingstreet, finding a vendor selling copys of their latest cd, they got very upset and the two 17 year old girls was rambeling on about how hard they had worked and how they now was loosing money because of this trade with copys in walking street.

If they had followed the vendor to his home after he had finished his 12 hour day, (7 days a week), they would proberly have found that their shoes back in the UK/US wouldent even fit inside this mans home.

How many cd would these two girls have sold in Thailand at full price, probably very few, and would they have been able to hold concerts packed with thousands of young Thai fans, if their music hadent been spread out through Thailand by cheap copys?

The computer industri, intertainment industri have to rethink their approch to these markets and lower their prices significantly if they want to eradicate/reduce the piracy buisness. how many cd/dvd is a Thai earning 4000ish bath a month going to buy at 600Bath a pop let alone talking about computerprograms running in the several thousand Bath range.

Kind regards

I actually thought the same until I read recently that Thailand is classed by The World Bank and the IMF as having the world's 20th and 21st largest economy respectively. Thailand is not a poor country in global terms.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...y_GDP_%28PPP%29

Absolutly right,. the Thais have money, but they dont brag about it !,. as for the lifestyle of the vendor, who is to say he dosent enjoy that lifestyle ? in my opinion if you brag about what you have some rotten sod will try and get it off you ( probably the tax man )! Edited May 2, 2007 by Wellyoudidask

[Bottlerocket]

Good. Let them put their own effort and expense into marketing their own brand names. Develop some quality products that will soon be recognised throughout the world and reap the benefits. Think for youselves. Be creative. Have an imagination. Get out from under the thumb of social and cultural brainwashing. This country is by no means poor. $9 million in pay raises for the junta members and $1.1 billion increase in military spending doesn't leave a lot of room for the "But we're poor plea."

[richard10365]

Here's a thought, America can always close her borders to foreign trade. America has within her own borders everything she needs to survive and prosper including energy resources. The big MNCs won't like it but it. Big oil won't like it. But it will create jobs, improve wages and generally help improve the lives of ordinary Americans.

Here's another thought. They would never do it because it would be impossible for them to do. Another reason is it would creat such a vacume that other countries would rush to fill. The trade vacume would fill so fast that you would think the USA was never involved with world trade.

Countries like China, India and Venuzuela would step right in and take over without missing a beat.

Oh wait! NEWSFLASH!!! They already took much of the USA business without the USA closing their borders.

The rest of the world dosen't need the USA to survive.

Wake up America! Stop looking all teary eyed at your red, white and blue flag take a look what's going on around you.

If the USA doesn't learn how to do trade in the 21st century, they will get left behind.

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

Krirk-krai defends aim of new laws Disappointed by US downgrade

PHUSADEE ARUNMAS

Commerce Minister Krirk-krai Jirapaet has asked Washington to be more understanding about Thailand's move to amend the Foreign Business Act and retail law. Since the Thai government revised the laws to make them more transparent and plug existing loopholes, US officials should not view such moves as a cause for trade punishment, he said.

His comments came after the US ambassador to Thailand said at a press conference yesterday that the amendments to the FBA and retail laws might have led the US Trade Representative (USTR) to downgrade Thailand to the Priority Watch List in this year's Special 301 report announced on Monday in Washington.

''We've improved the laws for the benefit of our people. We hope the Americans understand the process,'' Mr Krirk-krai said.

http://bangkokpost.com/Business/02May2007_biz35.php

Obviously Mr. Krirk-Krai doesn't understand that America may decide to improve her laws to benefit her people. Apparently he has no problem with Americans losing their jobs because of cheap imports from countries like Thailand. It doesn't even cross his mind. Apparently he doesn't think much of the idea of some of those same Americans trying to open businesses in Thailand. Apparently he finds it Amusing to see ordinary Americans lose home, savings and their children's future. I guess it makes him feel proud. Mr. Krik-Krai apparently has no problem with middle class Thais freely opening small businesses in America and sending the money home while at the same making it difficult if not impossible for middle class Americans and citizens of Thailand's other trading partners being locked out of the Thai market. Apparently hehas no problem seeing these foreigners having their assets defacto taken by requiring them to turn control of their investment over to Thai nationals who may or may not run the business responsibly or share any profits. Apparently Mr. Krik-Krai doesn't believe trade and investment is a two way street. It will be interesting to see what Thailand's trading partners including the United States will do when Mr. Krik-Krai's xenophobic FBA becomes law. This IP flap may just be a sample of more things to come. If other countries start to retaliate watch Thailand sink below Burma.

[Bottlerocket]

With America's record, if that happens they'll just trade in pain until everybody gets back in line.

[Bottlerocket]

Wow, even ambassadors are using "xenophobic" to describe the current state of affairs in Thailand.

[wintermute]

''We've improved the laws for the benefit of our people. We hope the Americans understand the process,'' Mr Krirk-krai said.

What a complete moron. This is what happens when a little rice farmer pokes a stick at the sleeping giant. I hope a full round of WTO sanctions are coming too. If Thailand wants to talk big then it should be prepared to take it when it comes too.

Apparently Mr. Krik-Krai doesn't believe trade and investment is a two way street. It will be interesting to see what Thailand's trading partners including the United States will do when Mr. Krik-Krai's xenophobic FBA becomes law. This IP flap may just be a sample of more things to come. If other countries start to retaliate watch Thailand sink below Burma.

These guys are as short sighted as Hugo Chavez. They think that seizing foreign assets will have no longterm reprecussion when they themselves have little understanding of how economics or business works. I wouldn't be surprised if nationalist politics is what brings Thailand down in the long run.

[cclub75]

It will be interesting to see what Thailand's trading partners including the United States will do when Mr. Krik-Krai's xenophobic FBA becomes law. This IP flap may just be a sample of more things to come. If other countries start to retaliate watch Thailand sink below Burma.

I agree. The Commerce Minister's comments show that they are living in a dream world.

Of course the "downgrade" of Thailand on the IP watch list is a first step : a first retaliation.

But still a... symbolic one.

The thai gvt has been so dwarf to the legitimate worries of foreign business community about FBA 2,Retail Act, IP rights on drugs etc... they have shown so much arrogance... that now the time is coming for retaliation.

The next step could be to scrap their "most favored nation" status.

And at that game, Thailand has a lot to loose.

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

Here's a thought, America can always close her borders to foreign trade. America has within her own borders everything she needs to survive and prosper including energy resources. The big MNCs won't like it but it. Big oil won't like it. But it will create jobs, improve wages and generally help improve the lives of ordinary Americans.

Here's another thought. They would never do it because it would be impossible for them to do. Another reason is it would creat such a vacume that other countries would rush to fill. The trade vacume would fill so fast that you would think the USA was never involved with world trade.

Countries like China, India and Venuzuela would step right in and take over without missing a beat.

Oh wait! NEWSFLASH!!! They already took much of the USA business without the USA closing their borders.

The rest of the world dosen't need the USA to survive.

Wake up America! Stop looking all teary eyed at your red, white and blue flag take a look what's going on around you.

If the USA doesn't learn how to do trade in the 21st century, they will get left behind.

Obviously you know little of economics. All of the countries mentioned are dependent on US trade for their economic growth. And in case you haven't been there, even Cuba is filled with dollar only malls. India's economy is driven by US trade. China's economy is driven by US trade. And lets not forget the remittences sent home by Cuban in the US. And Venuzela is living it up on oil. Who buys much of the world's oil? Remove the US from that equation and the good times are over.

And where are these countries now that foreign investment is drying up in Thailand? I haven't seen any willing to turn over control of their assets to the control of Thai nationals. China as a big friend? China would love to devour Thailand. India a big friend? Look at the exclusions India is demanding from Thailand in their FTA. India wants goods that has a compartive advantage in manfacturing excluded and has thus far been able to get what she wants. You are the one who needs to wake up and look at reality.

You may enjoy spouting leftest nonsense but pull the US economy out of the equation and the economies of these countries go down the tubes faster than you can blink you eyes. The US hasn't been using much of this clout but given the level of unfair trade by these countries with no end in sight, it may be time for her to exercise it. A growing number in the US Congress are of this opinion as are a growing number of American citizens.

Edited May 2, 2007 by ChiangMaiAmerican

[mmushr00m]

woohoo Go! Canada!!

Heh it actually cost the same for me to by DVDs in XXXXXXX in Canada as it does for me to buy at Panthip, cheaper actually as I dont have to bargain. Cops goes and bust them every few months but back in action again after a couple of days.

[wintermute]

woohoo Go! Canada!!

Heh it actually cost the same for me to by DVDs in XXXXXXX in Canada as it does for me to buy at Panthip, cheaper actually as I dont have to bargain. Cops goes and bust them every few months but back in action again after a couple of days.

It's not so much the piracy that caused the dominoes to finally fall but the pharmaceuticals lobby which is probably one of the single most powerful and well connected lobbies in Congress. The patent theft along with the FBA stuff was the final straw really.

[Plus]

Downgrade of trade standing not tied to drugs: Boyce

Washington has downgraded Thailand's trade status by putting it on the "priority watch list" over extensive copyright violations, but denied it was a result of Bangkok's decision to suspend patent rights on selected drugs.

So it's not about compulsory licensing. FBA and retail law are also not mentioned anywhere in the report BUT: "the ambassador noted that "the fact Thailand is being placed on the PWL reflects US and international concerns towards Thailand's recent economic policies such as the Foreign Business Act amendment, capital control measures and the pending retail business act". He refused to elaborate."

http://nationmultimedia.com/2007/05/02/nat...al_30033180.php

Isn't interesting that the US doesn't want to address those issues directly but decided to tighten screws on boring IP piracy?

I think most pirated DVDs here are "authored" somewhere in China or Malaysia and simply printed or burned here. The movies themselves are ripped or camcoded in the West.

[Old Man River]

Piracy is wrong, but the big corporations have to lower their prices to realistic lewels in the poorer countries of the world, how many Thais could afford to buy their products if they where priced normal.

Ordinarilly, I would agree with your comment and I understand Thailand's reasoning to invoke compulsory licenses (although the question of due process still remains). However, people outside of Thailand remember the government's view following the tsunami that Thailand did not need foreign aid as it could take care of its own. This has been followed by a few years of strong economic growth. It is hard for those outside of Thailand to all of a sudden think that Thailand now needs help to take care if its own. This is the problem nationalism breeds vis a vis the real needs of the populace.

While the US maintains that there were other issues at work that led to this downgrade, the pharma issue swayed those that sat on the fence and confirmed the decision of those that were already leaning this way.

As it relates to the FBA and pending retail act, the old adage of "for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction" comes into play. The Thai government knows that there will be reactions to its policies and needs to be ready to find ways around them.

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

For those who doubt the political will in the US is changing, here is an excerpt from a USA Today/Gallup poll on from Polling Report. That one was a year ago. More recent polls on the same site show a continuing trend. Note the changes since 1999. There is probably not a person in America, except perhaps in Bush's inner circle, that hasn't seen someone they know, themselves, relatives, friends or neighbors lose a good job, their homes, savings and security to job losses from increased international trade. Americans have been told to create opportunity for themselves when this happens. When countries close their markets to American small business as Thailand is attempting to do with the new and improved FBA, it doesn't make these Americans favorably disposed toward continuing privileges for those countries and their citizens. Trade is a two way street. The "sleeping giant" is awakening.

USA Today/Gallup Poll. April 7-9, 2006.

"Do you believe increased trade between the United States and other countries mostly helps or mostly hurts American workers?"

Helps Hurts Unsure

4/7-9/06 30 % 65 % 6 %

11/18-21/99 35 % 59 % 6 %

"Do you believe increased trade between the United States and other countries mostly helps or mostly hurts American companies?"

Helps Hurts Unsure

4/7-9/06 44 % 50 % 6 %

11/18-21/99 56 % 39 % 5 %

http://www.pollingreport.com/trade.htm

[larvidchr]

Piracy is wrong, but the big corporations have to lower their prices to realistic lewels in the poorer countries of the world, how many Thais could afford to buy their products if they where priced normal.

Ordinarilly, I would agree with your comment and I understand Thailand's reasoning to invoke compulsory licenses (although the question of due process still remains). However, people outside of Thailand remember the government's view following the tsunami that Thailand did not need foreign aid as it could take care of its own. This has been followed by a few years of strong economic growth. It is hard for those outside of Thailand to all of a sudden think that Thailand now needs help to take care if its own. This is the problem nationalism breeds vis a vis the real needs of the populace.

While the US maintains that there were other issues at work that led to this downgrade, the pharma issue swayed those that sat on the fence and confirmed the decision of those that were already leaning this way.

As it relates to the FBA and pending retail act, the old adage of "for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction" comes into play. The Thai government knows that there will be reactions to its policies and needs to be ready to find ways around them.

The farma. companys are among the most ruthless robbers in the world, their products is wildly overpriced, look what the prices of medecin is in Europe and the US it is one of the big strains on western economies wether you have private health care or state healthcare, In my country the government is forever trying to stop the companys ordering Doctors to check for the cheepest medicin and prescribing that to the patients thus trying to force the companys in to pricing competition.

Examinations of their pricing policys have revealed that prices on medicin is set after middel income levels in each country, rather than costs of development of the product.

It is no use stating the wealth of Thailands rich as an escuse for setting high prices in this country, it must be the real buying power of normal people that should be the base for price setting.

Kind regards.