Ban Of Liquids On Flights

[think_too_mut]

Sorry, I did not make myself clear.

The use of mobiles is prohibited because they may interfere with avionics systems. I am not saying they do interfere.

If passengers leave their phones on, they are foolish and irresponsible.

The prohibition is for the safety of everyone.

It's been discussed in airline technical magazines and general feeling is "They have lied to us all these years about mobile phones on the planes".

Recently, I read in airline industry press that "No Smoking" signs on the planes may soon be replaced with "No talking over mobile" signs that would illuminate during take off and landing.

Not even then they pose any electronic threat, the safety concern is for a different reason - to prevent people using earphones with wires or whatever gadgets may connect to a mobile phone that may obstruct exits or be a physical obstacle in an emergency.

If there was any danger, 400 people boarding a plane would look at other passengers with suspicion "you did not leave your mobile on, huh?"

[Shrubbery]

I will repeat myself.

The use of mobile phone MAY interfere with avionic/navigation systems.

The cabin crew make an announcement on the aircraft telling people to switch their phones off. If people refuse to do so, they can be off loaded. If it happend in flight the crew are entitled to confiscate the phone. And if neccessary restrain the passenger.

The restriction on the use of mobile phones on board aircraft has existed for many years.

[onzestan]

It never ceases to amaze me, what length's people will go through to prove that a law or rule infringes on what they perceive to be their by god given right. There are even those that can prove to you that AIDS does not exist.

Once more, my life, and the lives of others are more important to me than anything I could by in duty free.

It is an inconvenience I agree, but one I can live with, if it means traveling (even a little bit) safer.

I cannot believe that authorities would go to such lengths to deny you your bottle of perfume, whiskey, cognac or whatever, and if you think it's all a conspiracy by the respective governments, just think of the conspiracies these terrorists are capable of.

As I said before, learn to live with it, there are more important things to worry about.

Onzestan

[A_Traveller]

Electronics can act unpredictably. Several years ago, an Apple notebook product caused an airliner to take evasive action (read as "nose dive"). The offending product was tested by the FCC, FAA, Apple, and a 3rd-party laboratory...and nothing was found. As the previous poster noted, it's best to obey the rules for everyone's benefit.

Would you have a citation for this please?

Cellular phones are a possible source of interference, though given the analysis in the US {sorry no citation [wired magazine I think]} that some 20% of phones are still left switched on when on-board, the risk has probably been over blown. Cynics also claim that it is more about selling the expensive sat phone in the arm rest than safety.

The use of cellular phones on 9/11 is one of those interesting events, I'm still trying to work out how they got a signal.

Regards

/edit typo //

Edited May 23, 2007 by A_Traveller

[TRIPxCORE]

I'm not an avionics engineer but I believe the use of mobile phones is not permitted because of the possible interference with avionic systems on the aircraft.

On board systems that allow passengers to send/receive emails & sms will have been approved by the relevant aviation authorities.

I cannot comment on the use of cell phones but as for all other electronic items such as MP3 players, CD's or laptops, which they dont let you use until 10 minutes after take-off, that is also a sham. These electronic items do not affect the plane in any way. I always use my MP3 player during take-off and before that always used my CD player. That is one rule I will never follow.

[Shrubbery]

quote]

I cannot comment on the use of cell phones but as for all other electronic items such as MP3 players, CD's or laptops, which they dont let you use until 10 minutes after take-off, that is also a sham. These electronic items do not affect the plane in any way. I always use my MP3 player during take-off and before that always used my CD player. That is one rule I will never follow.

Scenario. The aircraft is heading for the runway. You are wired up to your mp3/cd player happily listening to your music. An announcement is made by one of the crew to evacuate the aircraft.

You are very unlikely to hear that announcement. A few seconds in an aircraft evacuation can mean the difference between life and death for you and others.

There are reasons why airlines and aviation authorities impose bans, regulations and restrictions. They are there for the passengers and crews safety.

[midas]

I'm not an avionics engineer but I believe the use of mobile phones is not permitted because of the possible interference with avionic systems on the aircraft.

On board systems that allow passengers to send/receive emails & sms will have been approved by the relevant aviation authorities.

I cannot comment on the use of cell phones but as for all other electronic items such as MP3 players, CD's or laptops, which they dont let you use until 10 minutes after take-off, that is also a sham. These electronic items do not affect the plane in any way. I always use my MP3 player during take-off and before that always used my CD player. That is one rule I will never follow.

matey!! Since when did passengers make up the rules ? Its probably because

no one has noticed you doing it yet - you have to follow ANY and EVERY rule

cabin crew issue you with OR you risk being blacklisted by the airline

[TRIPxCORE]

quote]

I cannot comment on the use of cell phones but as for all other electronic items such as MP3 players, CD's or laptops, which they dont let you use until 10 minutes after take-off, that is also a sham. These electronic items do not affect the plane in any way. I always use my MP3 player during take-off and before that always used my CD player. That is one rule I will never follow.

Scenario. The aircraft is heading for the runway. You are wired up to your mp3/cd player happily listening to your music. An announcement is made by one of the crew to evacuate the aircraft.

You are very unlikely to hear that announcement. A few seconds in an aircraft evacuation can mean the difference between life and death for you and others.

There are reasons why airlines and aviation authorities impose bans, regulations and restrictions. They are there for the passengers and crews safety.

If an announcement was made to evacuate the aircraft, I would clearly see everyone get up and start to scatter. I don't need to hear anything.

I'm not an avionics engineer but I believe the use of mobile phones is not permitted because of the possible interference with avionic systems on the aircraft.

On board systems that allow passengers to send/receive emails & sms will have been approved by the relevant aviation authorities.

I cannot comment on the use of cell phones but as for all other electronic items such as MP3 players, CD's or laptops, which they dont let you use until 10 minutes after take-off, that is also a sham. These electronic items do not affect the plane in any way. I always use my MP3 player during take-off and before that always used my CD player. That is one rule I will never follow.

matey!! Since when did passengers make up the rules ? Its probably because

no one has noticed you doing it yet - you have to follow ANY and EVERY rule

cabin crew issue you with OR you risk being blacklisted by the airline

Where did I say I am making up my own rules? What I said was I am not going to follow that particular rule. Also, I work for the airline. I am not getting blacklisted for anything.

Edited May 24, 2007 by TRIPxCORE

[Shrubbery]

If you work for an airline, you of all people should be abiding by the rules and regulations.

[aussiestyle1983]

Does this only apply to carry on luggage?

We are going back to Oz soon and my wife has spent a lot of money stocking up on her fav makeup. Some of these things include creams and sorts of liquids, so we are just wondering if we will be able to take it with us or not? We plan to put it all in the check-in luggage, we will be carrying NO liquids in our carry on. But, we will have a lot of make up and other liquids such as camera lense cleaning liquids as well. If they are gonna throw it away we would rather leave it here, this will especially stop me from being arrested for making a scene at the airport if they try to bin the stuff. So can we still bring things such as mentioned above in the checked in luggege?

[think_too_mut]

Does this only apply to carry on luggage?

We are going back to Oz soon and my wife has spent a lot of money stocking up on her fav makeup. Some of these things include creams and sorts of liquids, so we are just wondering if we will be able to take it with us or not? We plan to put it all in the check-in luggage, we will be carrying NO liquids in our carry on. But, we will have a lot of make up and other liquids such as camera lense cleaning liquids as well. If they are gonna throw it away we would rather leave it here, this will especially stop me from being arrested for making a scene at the airport if they try to bin the stuff. So can we still bring things such as mentioned above in the checked in luggege?

The whole stupidity is about making explosives onboard.

So, the liquids in the checked baggage wont rise any attention.

[rychrde]

Just another scam to make lots of money for the 'duty free' shops in airports.

I hadn't flown for 9 months and found out about this policy the hard way. Had a long argument with Hong Kong airport police that the honey I bought for my father was unlikely to explode.

I also hope they enjoy the thai whisky - I thought on the way back would just p1ss in a bottle for them to take home.

Anyway, I was angry, but on reflection I blame the Thai duty free people.

Be very careful if buying liquids in Thai airports. They seem clueless about this policy and you must demand they seal the plastic bag and give you a valid receipt. Having the receipt stamped on the back of the boarding pass which is later taken away from you just won't count!

ok...rant over

[TRIPxCORE]

If you work for an airline, you of all people should be abiding by the rules and regulations.

[midas]

If you work for an airline, you of all people should be abiding by the rules and regulations.

I wish I knoew which airline you work for so that I can avoid it like the plague

in future ? What an incredibly irresponsible attitudue you have !

[Crossy]

I suggest anyone who thinks this ban is 'silly' read this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippine_Airlines_Flight_434 remember this incident was in 1994, IED technology has advanced significantly since then.

Keeping your toothpaste and shaving kit in checked baggage is hardly an inconvenience.

EDIT More detail here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bojinka

Edited May 25, 2007 by Crossy

[terryp]

The one that gets me in NO MASCARA ???? In carry on bags.

What’s that all about…I suppose it’s to stop the terrorists changing their identity prior to the act

Complete and utter Bollaks

[ozymandious]

Update on Liquids on planes and DutyFree.

My Mom came for a visit just the other day and she bought a bottle of Vodka at Singapore Duty Free.

The bottle was then placed in a plastic security bag with the receipt and heat sealed across the top. This she brought into Thailand no problem.

There were a few warnings on the bag but the implicit implication is that if you tamper with or break the bag you can't bring it on board.

Does BKK have such tamper bags and quick sealers in place at their Duty Free?

It's a pretty good solution for the duty free problem RE liquid be it alcohol or cosmetic.

But this still won't get you your tooth paste back.

Here's a crazy idea how about a little customer service from the airlines. As you board you're given a nice cool bottle of water and an ammenities bag. How about it?

[Crossy]

Here's a crazy idea how about a little customer service from the airlines. As you board you're given a nice cool bottle of water and an ammenities bag. How about it?

Travel long haul on the right airlines (or in the right class on the wrong airlines) and you'll find it in the seat pocket (OK you have to ask for the water).

[TRIPxCORE]

If you work for an airline, you of all people should be abiding by the rules and regulations.

I wish I knoew which airline you work for so that I can avoid it like the plague

in future ? What an incredibly irresponsible attitudue you have !

Irresponsible? Why? Because I won't follow the useless rule about electronics during take-off? That hardly qualifies as irresponsible.

[onzestan]

If you work for an airline, you of all people should be abiding by the rules and regulations.

I wish I knoew which airline you work for so that I can avoid it like the plague

in future ? What an incredibly irresponsible attitudue you have !

Irresponsible? Why? Because I won't follow the useless rule about electronics during take-off? That hardly qualifies as irresponsible.

It is in my book. Once you start NOT following rules because YOU think they are stupid you might be in for a nasty surprise sooner or later. Except that, you should at least show some courtesy towards other passengers that do follow the rules, especially since you are supposed to set the example as an airline employee.

What airline do you work for ?

onzestan

[pgs]

This thing with banning liquids on airplanes is completely ridiculous. On my most recent flight out of the U.S., I had a very small bottle of hairspray, half a bottle of lotion and a new tube of toothpaste that they took and threw away right in front of me.

As far as I'm concerned any man trying to board an aeroplane in possession of a can of hairspray should be denied boarding on the basis of being an unsavoury character !

You really have a problem with this hairspray thing, dont you? Sorry for wanting to groom myself.

This thing with banning liquids on airplanes is completely ridiculous. On my most recent flight out of the U.S., I had a very small bottle of hairspray, half a bottle of lotion and a new tube of toothpaste that they took and threw away right in front of me. I'm sorry but toothpaste isn't going to harm the airplane or anyone in it. As a matter of fact, the whole security thing at all airports is a sham. I work for a major U.S. airline at a major U.S. international airport. If a terrorist really wanted to do some harm, there are so many easy ways to do so that have nothing at all to do with security checkpoints. It's just a joke and it pisses me off.

In case my career path someday leads me to want to become a terrorist, can you please shed some light on the "many easy ways" to do harm? I'm sure the policing agencies around the globe would also like to hear your comments.

You do know that there are explosives that can be formed into a paste? You undoubtably also know that such paste can be inserted into a tube of toothpaste and then capped off with a layer of genuine toothpaste.

An easy way to bring down an airplane is with fire. Next time you are playing with your girly hairspray, use it near a flammable source (i.e. a cigarette lighter or a lit match).

No, I didn't know that about paste because I am not an explosives expert. Nevertheless, the fact remains, it's a stupid rule. A terrorist would study diligently what the current regulations are in airports before attempting anything. They would know that there is a liquid ban going on and would never try to smuggle liquids onto an airplane as a passenger because they know it would get tossed. Unless they were really stupid, they wouldn't even try this. These people trying to do harm are not stupid. Therefore, I will always believe this rule is ridiculous.

Another aspect of this is that government agencies are trying to be racially sensitive so they check people at random. This also needs to be done away with. There is a very specific group of people that are trying to do harm. I'm sorry but racial profiling is just necessary. I should be able to keep my toothpaste.

As for you wanting me to enlighten you as to what the many things are that can be done to do harm, I am not going to write that on a public forum for all to see. That wouldn't be very smart.

"Diplomatic immunity" would be SO handy...

Shame telling them to 'sod off' isn't considered diplomatic.

[TRIPxCORE]

It is in my book. Once you start NOT following rules because YOU think they are stupid you might be in for a nasty surprise sooner or later. Except that, you should at least show some courtesy towards other passengers that do follow the rules, especially since you are supposed to set the example as an airline employee.

What airline do you work for ?

onzestan

It isn't that I think they are stupid, it's that I know electronics do nothing to modern aircraft during take-off. Remember, I work there, it's my job to know this.

Please explain how my using electronics is being discourteous to others? Just because others feel they can't use them and I am flaunting it?

Surely you don't expect me to tell you who I work for? Just so I can hear a bunch of nonsense from you guys about, "Oh, I am never going to fly that airline anymore!!!!!!"

[inf]

I'll be flying Thai Monday night from Taiwan to Paris with one hour to change flights at BKK.

Into my checked-in luggage will go: toothpaste, shampoo, liquid soap, deodorant, and scissors of course. Whoever sits next to me will have to bear with any smells likely to emanate from my humble person. But hey, there's still soap for use in the toilets, and since it's always cool inside the plane, I won't be sweating very much.

As to electronic objects on flights, the last thing I want is someone shouting into a mobile phone in a Chinese dialect - or any other language - in the middle of the night on a 16-hour flight while I'm trying to get some sleep. So yes, I'm in favor of keeping the ban on cell phones.

I already hear enough of them in movie theaters or on Taiwan's public transport.

[A_Traveller]

It is in my book. Once you start NOT following rules because YOU think they are stupid you might be in for a nasty surprise sooner or later. Except that, you should at least show some courtesy towards other passengers that do follow the rules, especially since you are supposed to set the example as an airline employee.

What airline do you work for ?

onzestan

It isn't that I think they are stupid, it's that I know electronics do nothing to modern aircraft during take-off. Remember, I work there, it's my job to know this.

Please explain how my using electronics is being discourteous to others? Just because others feel they can't use them and I am flaunting it?

Surely you don't expect me to tell you who I work for? Just so I can hear a bunch of nonsense from you guys about, "Oh, I am never going to fly that airline anymore!!!!!!"

I do think it is incumbent on any employee to 'set an example'. There is the issue of the crew possibly having to waste time asking a fellow team member to abide by the rules, and creating unnecessary work for them. So as a matter of internal professional courtesy I would have throught observing a minor inconveniencing rule would not be to much to ask.

Regards

[Shrubbery]

It is in my book. Once you start NOT following rules because YOU think they are stupid you might be in for a nasty surprise sooner or later. Except that, you should at least show some courtesy towards other passengers that do follow the rules, especially since you are supposed to set the example as an airline employee.

What airline do you work for ?

onzestan

It isn't that I think they are stupid, it's that I know electronics do nothing to modern aircraft during take-off. Remember, I work there, it's my job to know this.

Please explain how my using electronics is being discourteous to others? Just because others feel they can't use them and I am flaunting it?

Surely you don't expect me to tell you who I work for? Just so I can hear a bunch of nonsense from you guys about, "Oh, I am never going to fly that airline anymore!!!!!!"

Maybe you could tell us all what your job is.

Flight Deck, Cabin Crew, Operations, Catering, Management or dare I risk saying engineering.

If you work in engineering, what licences do you hold.

[TRIPxCORE]

It is in my book. Once you start NOT following rules because YOU think they are stupid you might be in for a nasty surprise sooner or later. Except that, you should at least show some courtesy towards other passengers that do follow the rules, especially since you are supposed to set the example as an airline employee.

What airline do you work for ?

onzestan

It isn't that I think they are stupid, it's that I know electronics do nothing to modern aircraft during take-off. Remember, I work there, it's my job to know this.

Please explain how my using electronics is being discourteous to others? Just because others feel they can't use them and I am flaunting it?

Surely you don't expect me to tell you who I work for? Just so I can hear a bunch of nonsense from you guys about, "Oh, I am never going to fly that airline anymore!!!!!!"

I do think it is incumbent on any employee to 'set an example'. There is the issue of the crew possibly having to waste time asking a fellow team member to abide by the rules, and creating unnecessary work for them. So as a matter of internal professional courtesy I would have throught observing a minor inconveniencing rule would not be to much to ask.

Regards

First of all, when I am on a flight, none of the passengers know who I am anyway. Second, I carry a very small MP3 player with tiny ear phones and I keep the MP3 down on my side under my lap so no one can see it. I don't flaunt it out in the open and I never get told about it.

Maybe you could tell us all what your job is.

Flight Deck, Cabin Crew, Operations, Catering, Management or dare I risk saying engineering.

If you work in engineering, what licences do you hold.

I am not discussing any details about my job in here.

[A_Traveller]

Just because others feel they can't use them and I am flaunting it?

First of all, when I am on a flight, none of the passengers know who I am anyway. Second, I carry a very small MP3 player with tiny ear phones and I keep the MP3 down on my side under my lap so no one can see it. I don't flaunt it out in the open [see above quote] and I never get told about it.

But your answer does imply the crew do know you are an employee, so my point stands. By the by if you worked for me, and people do, your attitude would not be acceptable, but you don't so it's moot.

Regards

[Beardog]

Just because others feel they can't use them and I am flaunting it?

First of all, when I am on a flight, none of the passengers know who I am anyway. Second, I carry a very small MP3 player with tiny ear phones and I keep the MP3 down on my side under my lap so no one can see it. I don't flaunt it out in the open [see above quote] and I never get told about it.

But your answer does imply the crew do know you are an employee, so my point stands. By the by if you worked for me, and people do, your attitude would not be acceptable, but you don't so it's moot.

Regards

Isn't it odd the only countries that snag the toothepaste razors colonge or perfume water & whatever else they can justify are usually poor. When I went to Costa Rica they even stole my toilet paper. I can just imagine the horrible things a passenger can do to indanger other passengers with a roll of TP.

I haven't gotten my toothpaste snagged in the U.S. yet but if they would rather have a bunch of Quai Mai Dee men breath heathens on board I guess its their call.

DOES ANYONE KNOW IF YOU CAN TRANSPORT 500 CC'S OF MEDICAL WATER(USED FOR LIVER HEALTH)

IN CHECKED IN BAGGAGE? I GO TO THE U.S. NEXT MONTH & DON'T WANT ANY PROBLEMS.

THANKS

Beardog

[dingue2rep]

Just because others feel they can't use them and I am flaunting it?

First of all, when I am on a flight, none of the passengers know who I am anyway. Second, I carry a very small MP3 player with tiny ear phones and I keep the MP3 down on my side under my lap so no one can see it. I don't flaunt it out in the open [see above quote] and I never get told about it.

But your answer does imply the crew do know you are an employee, so my point stands. By the by if you worked for me, and people do, your attitude would not be acceptable, but you don't so it's moot.

Regards

Isn't it odd the only countries that snag the toothepaste razors colonge or perfume water & whatever else they can justify are usually poor. When I went to Costa Rica they even stole my toilet paper. I can just imagine the horrible things a passenger can do to indanger other passengers with a roll of TP.

I haven't gotten my toothpaste snagged in the U.S. yet but if they would rather have a bunch of Quai Mai Dee men breath heathens on board I guess its their call.

DOES ANYONE KNOW IF YOU CAN TRANSPORT 500 CC'S OF MEDICAL WATER(USED FOR LIVER HEALTH)

IN CHECKED IN BAGGAGE? I GO TO THE U.S. NEXT MONTH & DON'T WANT ANY PROBLEMS.

THANKS

Beardog

All this fuss about nothing! Israel has been doing this kind of thing since, well forever. I remember in the 70's how they would squeeze out the toothpaste in front of you and cut your bar of soap in two. They even ripped the heels off shoes sometimes.

[TRIPxCORE]

Just because others feel they can't use them and I am flaunting it?

First of all, when I am on a flight, none of the passengers know who I am anyway. Second, I carry a very small MP3 player with tiny ear phones and I keep the MP3 down on my side under my lap so no one can see it. I don't flaunt it out in the open [see above quote] and I never get told about it.

But your answer does imply the crew do know you are an employee, so my point stands. By the by if you worked for me, and people do, your attitude would not be acceptable, but you don't so it's moot.

Regards

No one knows I am using it unless another passenger looks at me for a while and sees me pull out my MP3 player and put it under my lap.