My Exerience With Thai Courts Thus Far

[ray23]

This is my second time of having personal knowledge of the actual verdicts in Thai court cases. You do your homework and in at least the two cases I know of, one in Nong Khai, one in Udon. Where the farrang got exactly what he asked for.

The last case Rayria from Nong Khai was the attorney she also assisted in my case that I won.

What made this one unusual was that a few American Farrangs decided they were going to teach the wife how to get money. Even to the extent of getting a gift of funds from a local organization, to the now exwife. I have never been able to understand that.

From the information I got it was the typical game the lady asking for pity money, ( 100K) whatever that is. When the truth finally came out the lady was left with a multi million dollar house a SUV which was sold for in excess of 300 K plus 260K in cash. What did she fight for another three million more in alimony. That her attorney thought they would walk away with. Didn't happen All the assests I mentioned had already been given to her before the hearing. She ended up with exactly what she was given in the first place and an attorney bill.

Guess this guy never met Rayrai before, the wifes lawyer told her your a Thai you have to protect the Thai, He got the standard answer I'm a lawyer my job is to protect my client.

Cudo's to Rayria for another job well done.

I will say this don't throw in the towel quickly, in serious matters. don't be afraid because you hear all these rumors about Thai courts. If you have a good case, so far the personal aspects I have seen say you will get fair treatment in the Thai courts. If you have bad case it's a bad case anywhere you are.

One of thing I have alway admired about Rayria she pulls no punches she thinks you got a loser she tells you right up front and tries to limit the losses for you. Can't ask for much then that.

Well there is obviusly a lot more details to this, but I don't want to embarrass anyone or any organiztions that felt they were doing the right thing.

So please just accept that the rumors are not always true.

[soundman]

I have personally witnessed two cases involving farang versus thai disputes that have ended up in the courts.

In each of the cases the magistrates (khun) gave no bias at all to either side & judged the cases on evidence supplied, points of Thai law & listened to no hearsay or conjecture (usually given by the thai side) at all, only provable facts.

IMO the Thai legal system is one of the parts of Thailand that actually works. It's a pity that the judges / magistrates have so many stupid & archaic laws they have to contend with.

I am in the middle of writing a small essay, to be posted on TV, as to how stupid some of these laws are. It concerns a motor accident of one of my staff members late last year.

One must bear in mind that you cannot hold the judiciary in Thailand responsible for some of the silly laws that they have to uphold & pass judgement on. The judiacary, do however, have a lot of discretionary power with regards to sentencing (or passing judgement in civil matters) in criminal cases, & unfortunately, this can lead to back room deals that don't pass the wash test.

Cheers,

Soundman.

[ThaiPauly]

Thats comforting to hear guys.

I think that I am just about to become involved in one myself with a Thai Company, so your posts have given me a bit my confidence I KNOW I am in the right therefore I should win.....but I have been told that just becuause you win does not neccassarily mean that you will get the money you are claiming...time will tell I guess!

Cheers

TP

[ray23]

TP a gentle hint do good case preperation, remember you have to prove to someone who knows nothing about the circumstance that you are right

[samran]

I have personally witnessed two cases involving farang versus thai disputes that have ended up in the courts.

In each of the cases the magistrates (khun) gave no bias at all to either side & judged the cases on evidence supplied, points of Thai law & listened to no hearsay or conjecture (usually given by the thai side) at all, only provable facts.

IMO the Thai legal system is one of the parts of Thailand that actually works. It's a pity that the judges / magistrates have so many stupid & archaic laws they have to contend with.

I am in the middle of writing a small essay, to be posted on TV, as to how stupid some of these laws are. It concerns a motor accident of one of my staff members late last year.

One must bear in mind that you cannot hold the judiciary in Thailand responsible for some of the silly laws that they have to uphold & pass judgement on. The judiacary, do however, have a lot of discretionary power with regards to sentencing (or passing judgement in civil matters) in criminal cases, & unfortunately, this can lead to back room deals that don't pass the wash test.

Cheers,

Soundman.

I think in an entirely administrative sense, Thai courts are - usually - OK and give a fair hearing. In one case I personally know of, a guy was aquitted fraud that someone else (another farang) had committed, and then blamed it on the bloke. It took time though, but he defended his name successfully.

I think in high profile cases, judges can and are pressured to give certain verdicts.No doubt that judges can be bought, especially by the higher ups. But money and power always influence the wheels of justice no matter where you are. Sad but true.

[Loaded]

In civil cases it's a lot cheaper and easier to buy the other side's solicitor. This can be done because the solicitor is usually paid in advance by their client a sum that will cover the life of the case. There probably isn't a win bonus so no incentive to fight or even win.

They can 'forget' to sign supoenas or write the address slightly wrong so it needs to go back to the judge. Or they tell you not to supoena certain witnesses because it will damage your case if they give negative testimony. And of course they are constantly updating the other side on your strengths and weaknesses. This all happened to me and in addition i was also told I needed to attend court when in actual fact it was a compromise hearing - I had explicitly told my solicitor no more compromise hearings after the first 2 failed to resolve anything.

If you want the name of one of these rats, please pm me. It works in Chiang Mai and seems to do a lot of farang business.

[jingjoe]

But money and power always influence the wheels of justice no matter where you are. Sad but true.

Not always.

[Nienke]

In civil cases it's a lot cheaper and easier to buy the other side's solicitor. This can be done because the solicitor is usually paid in advance by their client a sum that will cover the life of the case. There probably isn't a win bonus so no incentive to fight or even win.

They can 'forget' to sign supoenas or write the address slightly wrong so it needs to go back to the judge. Or they tell you not to supoena certain witnesses because it will damage your case if they give negative testimony. And of course they are constantly updating the other side on your strengths and weaknesses. This all happened to me and in addition i was also told I needed to attend court when in actual fact it was a compromise hearing - I had explicitly told my solicitor no more compromise hearings after the first 2 failed to resolve anything.

If you want the name of one of these rats, please pm me. It works in Chiang Mai and seems to do a lot of farang business.

Don't tell me you got the same rat as I had a few years ago!

Nothing wrong with the magistrate, he was fair. Everything wrong with my solicitor (attorney?).

Nienke

[MTW]

Nobody is talking about what they paid and here is where I would like to add some info. I got divorced a couple of years ago, in Los Angeles, we didn't have any kids to fight about, did not dispute who owned our business, (we both said we owned 50% each) and this is a no fault state for divorce.

We NEVER went to court, and yet my bills were over 150,000 USD and my husband had to pay his equal bills and more which meant he got stuck with over $200,000 USD. How can a young couple, with no children, who don't have disputes about who owns the business, and don't have any other abnormal disputes, and who never went to to court, end up with more than $350,000 of legal bills?????

Many people I think in Thailand think they can retire very well from just the money we paid to our lawyers. I can't imagine, if we had children to fight about we would have needed $1 million dollars to even get it all going. How many people have that much money, and how is this for the good of the children????

Spending this much on lawyers is ridiculous and to all the men out there who think only they got screwed out of money by their farang wives, let me say, farang women got screwed out of a lot of money also. My husband planned for several years our divorce, had gotten loans I never signed for, never knew about, he had a second house and a second car to take all his lovers to, and he stole a lot of money from our jointly owned business, and never paid taxes on that which can implicate me.

So, if you feel bad you probably have the right to, but I thought I would write a little bit of my story so you don't feel too bad.

[wasabi]

Nobody is talking about what they paid and here is where I would like to add some info. I got divorced a couple of years ago, in Los Angeles, we didn't have any kids to fight about, did not dispute who owned our business, (we both said we owned 50% each) and this is a no fault state for divorce.

We NEVER went to court, and yet my bills were over 150,000 USD and my husband had to pay his equal bills and more which meant he got stuck with over $200,000 USD. How can a young couple, with no children, who don't have disputes about who owns the business, and don't have any other abnormal disputes, and who never went to to court, end up with more than $350,000 of legal bills?????

Many people I think in Thailand think they can retire very well from just the money we paid to our lawyers. I can't imagine, if we had children to fight about we would have needed $1 million dollars to even get it all going. How many people have that much money, and how is this for the good of the children????

Spending this much on lawyers is ridiculous and to all the men out there who think only they got screwed out of money by their farang wives, let me say, farang women got screwed out of a lot of money also. My husband planned for several years our divorce, had gotten loans I never signed for, never knew about, he had a second house and a second car to take all his lovers to, and he stole a lot of money from our jointly owned business, and never paid taxes on that which can implicate me.

So, if you feel bad you probably have the right to, but I thought I would write a little bit of my story so you don't feel too bad.

Are you talking about a divorce between a Thai and farang, married by Thai law? I went through this personally and also under the no fault stipulation. I found it very painless, fair and inexpensive. My ex wife and I agreed on an out of court settlement which is a private matter. However the Thai court fees paid at the LA consulate in the USA were no more than $100 I have no idea where your exorbitant bills are arising from. Were those lawyer fees? For a no fault divorce lawyers are not required. In fact nothing is required but for both parties to sign the no fault document and pay the minimal Thai consulate fees.

[MTW]

This was a farang/farang divorce, in California, and all of the fees except for some peanut money, went to the lawyers, who didn't do a ###### thing in my opinion other than create bills out of thin air.