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Freelancer with Elite Visa and income tax in home country


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Hello, 

I am a freelancer and can work remote with a laptop and internet from my condo. 
I work exclusively for my clients in my home country.
I would like to work from Thailand remote for 6-9 months a year.
For this I want a Thailand Elite visa.
I know it's a gray zone when it comes to work permits. 

But do i have to pay income tax in Thailand when i already pay income tax in my home country?

Edited by martinafr
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As for taxes, the answer is no. But you will probably get many different answers here that will contradict each other, but actually if you work online in your condo, and don't broadcast what you are doing, then nobody is the wiser. Keep a low profile.

 

Actually I think I read recently about new laws/regulations coming into effect soon to cover people/digital nomads like yourself, so once you are here, that will be worth checking out.

Edited by couchpotato
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The general consensus is that, if you are in Thailand for more than 180 days during the year, you are liable for tax on your worldwide income, but only if the income is transferred to Thailand in the year that it is earned. In practice, since cash is fungible, it is next to impossible to prove whether money transferred to Thailand is income earned in the current year. The tax authorities rarely, if ever, try.

 

That aside, depending on your nationality, there may be double taxation treaties between your country and Thailand that prevent you being taxed twice on the same income.

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This topic has been covered to death. OP , you will have no issues. Immigration have no interest in so called digital nomads.

Before COVID Chiang Mai immigration actually released a statement to that effect.( Chiang Mai being a hub for digital nomads and shared office spaces)

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2 hours ago, BritTim said:

The authorities have decided to completely tolerate remote workers without the "correct" visa and work permit because (i) they appreciate that there is no "correct" visa; and (ii) it is felt that people living in Thailand and bringing in money from abroad is a positive development that they do not want to deter.

I think the same with regard to work permits and visas i'm not too worried. But what happens if thai income tax arises? Then you would have to apply for a tax number for income without wp maybe here starts then a problem?

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4 minutes ago, martinafr said:

I think the same with regard to work permits and visas i'm not too worried. But what happens if thai income tax arises? Then you would have to apply for a tax number for income without wp maybe here starts then a problem?

The tax id number is definitely not a concern. There are many kinds of income you can legally have in Thailand without any need for a work permit. The tax authorities are, anyway, completely separate from the Labour Department and disinterested in each other's affairs.

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13 hours ago, BritTim said:

The general consensus is that, if you are in Thailand for more than 180 days during the year, you are liable for tax on your worldwide income, but only if the income is transferred to Thailand in the year that it is earned

 

yes but if the authorties think that a "business carried on in Thailand" (accroding to section 41 of the Revenue Code)  generated income can be taxable from day 1 in Thailand. Question is what is "business carried on in Thailand"

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1 hour ago, martinafr said:

yes but if the authorties think that a "business carried on in Thailand" (accroding to section 41 of the Revenue Code)  generated income can be taxable from day 1 in Thailand. Question is what is "business carried on in Thailand"

While semantically it could mean almost anything, previous experience seems to suggest it only comes into play when it involves Thai clients. I am aware of no case where it has been applied just because of overseas income.

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14 hours ago, BritTim said:

it is next to impossible to prove whether money transferred to Thailand is income earned in the current year.

It's easier to prove it isn't, i.e., bank statement from home country as of 31 December, transfer up to that balance say 2 January, it cannot be current years income (remember Thai Tax Year is the calendar year), just remember not to go above the 31 December balance, but again there are claimable allowances and the tax rate on first 150K of taxable income is 0% currently.

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15 hours ago, martinafr said:

I know it's a gray zone when it comes to work permits. 

But do i have to pay income tax in Thailand when i already pay income tax in my home country?

When you stay more than 180 days within a calendar year (= tax year), you income taxable in Thailand.

 

When you stay less than 180 days in your home country, you might be partially taxable or limited taxable there.

 

Your country probably has a Double Taxation Agreement (DTA) with Thailand, so you are not double taxed of your income.

 

A legal trick is to live from savings when staying in Thailand. Money earned abroad is income taxable in Thailand when transferred into Thailand, but only if it's during the same calendar year as they are earned. Savings are not income taxable in Thailand. The trick is to keep foreign taxable income abroad until the following calendar year – or any later year – before they are transferred into Thailand, as they by then are magically transformed into savings...????

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16 hours ago, BritTim said:

The general consensus is that, if you are in Thailand for more than 180 days during the year, you are liable for tax on your worldwide income, but only if the income is transferred to Thailand in the year that it is earned. In practice, since cash is fungible, it is next to impossible to prove whether money transferred to Thailand is income earned in the current year. The tax authorities rarely, if ever, try.

 

That aside, depending on your nationality, there may be double taxation treaties between your country and Thailand that prevent you being taxed twice on the same income.

I know a Dutch pensioner that -due to this regulation- always sends money to Thailand for the whole year (~15.000 EUR) on 1 January. I guess better safe than sorry.

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So many replies, I just skipped them all so you may have already gotten this advice:   Google tax treaty your country/Thailand.   That will identify your tax requirements and you will know what is the law instead of what Thai Visa thinks.

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no problem, they only care if you are working for a thailand company or do business inside thailand with Thai people.

if you keep paying tax in france (I assume) its even better as you are still a tax resident of france and there is a double tax treaty that prevent double taxation between france and thailand.

 

worst case scenario use a credit card for all money transfered to thailand and then the money earned outside the country during the year it is earned is never directly transfered inside Thailand and therefore not taxable, problem solved at very reasonable cost.

 

anyways better to always keep a low profile and avoid talking about this in detail to most people around you. you are a business person managing her business in europe from thailand, no problem.

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On 6/6/2023 at 1:17 AM, martinafr said:

Hello, 

I am a freelancer and can work remote with a laptop and internet from my condo. 
I work exclusively for my clients in my home country.
I would like to work from Thailand remote for 6-9 months a year.
For this I want a Thailand Elite visa.
I know it's a gray zone when it comes to work permits. 

But do i have to pay income tax in Thailand when i already pay income tax in my home country?

Hi, did you want to know what is legal, or what you may be likely to get away with?  The two are not the same.

 

Unfortunately the laws, and the Thai elite visa, don't allow for this plan.  To be legal, you need a visa that permits working, and a work permit. It's not really a grey area, it's just a grey area whether anything would happen if you followed your plan. Thus the comments "don't tell anyone."

 

The oft quoted "it's only taxable if you bring the money into Thailand in the year you earn it" only applies to income that is passively generated overseas, such as dividends, interest, etc.  It doesn't apply to income you earn while you are working in Thailand.  Income earned from working in Thailand, even if paid overseas, is taxable under the tax code whether or not you bring it into Thailand. So yes, the income you've described is taxable. But there isn't really a means to pay tax since you don't have permission to work.

 

If you want to do this legally instead of a Thai elite card suggest an LTR Visa from the Board of Investment.  You'll find a number of threads on it in this forum.

 

 

 

 

 

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27 minutes ago, Misty said:

Hi, did you want to know what is legal, or what you may be likely to get away with?  The two are not the same.

 

Unfortunately the laws, and the Thai elite visa, don't allow for this plan.  To be legal, you need a visa that permits working, and a work permit. It's not really a grey area, it's just a grey area whether anything would happen if you followed your plan. Thus the comments "don't tell anyone."

 

The oft quoted "it's only taxable if you bring the money into Thailand in the year you earn it" only applies to income that is passively generated overseas, such as dividends, interest, etc.  It doesn't apply to income you earn while you are working in Thailand.  Income earned from working in Thailand, even if paid overseas, is taxable under the tax code whether or not you bring it into Thailand. So yes, the income you've described is taxable. But there isn't really a means to pay tax since you don't have permission to work.

 

If you want to do this legally instead of a Thai elite card suggest an LTR Visa from the Board of Investment.  You'll find a number of threads on it in this forum.

 

 

 

 

 

Disagree with most of this post.

OP will have zero issues. 

 

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7 hours ago, freeman01 said:

 

if you keep paying tax in france (I assume) its even better as you are still a tax resident of france and there is a double tax treaty that prevent double taxation between france and thailand.

 

Its germany but i think most DTA are similiar. The Thailand/German DTA regulates that tax is to be paid where the work is done. 
In the case that somone work from a condo in Thailand and in his homeland he has two tax offices who are responsible. 
This is time-consuming and you are forced to apply for a thai tax number. 

Maybe Thailand will waive the income tax if it is taxed in the home country...

Edited by martinafr
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On 6/6/2023 at 12:47 PM, BritTim said:

I think when making this statement, you should advise the OP on which visa he should get (assuming he does not qualify for the LTR WTP, Long Term Resident Work from Thailand Professional, visa).

The authorities have decided to completely tolerate remote workers without the "correct" visa and work permit because (i) they appreciate that there is no "correct" visa; and (ii) it is felt that people living in Thailand and bringing in money from abroad is a positive development that they do not want to deter.

And the third, most important reason - they have no ways to catch them working remotely.

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2 hours ago, Misty said:

 

It doesn't apply to income you earn while you are working in Thailand. 

do you have any official proof of that (or is that your opinion)
or is there an official definition for "business carried on in Thailand"?

Edited by martinafr
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On 6/5/2023 at 1:17 PM, martinafr said:

Hello, 

I am a freelancer and can work remote with a laptop and internet from my condo. 
I work exclusively for my clients in my home country.
I would like to work from Thailand remote for 6-9 months a year.
For this I want a Thailand Elite visa.
I know it's a gray zone when it comes to work permits. 

But do i have to pay income tax in Thailand when i already pay income tax in my home country?

My friend was  DN for twenty years and he has stayed all over the World, including Thailand, but has never paid any taxes in any country except in his home country. 

Edited by CartagenaWarlock
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OP don't overthink it, just come with whatever visa you want, open your laptop and do whatever you want, nobody is going to stay behind your back. For that matter it would be the same in most of the countries in the world. Don't let the clients pay you in Thai bank accounts and generally avoid workspaces, there is good 5G and fibre broadband Internet here.

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2 minutes ago, gearbox said:

OP don't overthink it, just come with whatever visa you want, open your laptop and do whatever you want, nobody is going to stay behind your back. For that matter it would be the same in most of the countries in the world. Don't let the clients pay you in Thai bank accounts and generally avoid workspaces, there is good 5G and fibre broadband Internet here.

+1

Good advice. 

Edited by DrJack54
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