Schengen Visa

[sierra01]

I want to take my misses to Greece in September/October, and take advantage of last minute deals. It seems that the Greek Embassy wants provisional flight and accomodation bookings before they will grant the visa. Travel agents won't a hold a deal more than a couple of days so how on earth does she get her visa, anyone got any comments?

[the scouser]

In theory, she should get the visa free of charge and without having to provide provisional bookings, solely because your European treaty rights to exercise freedom of movement (in this case to Greece) are automatically extended to your spouse, irregardless of her nationality.

The problem that you face is that if the bubbles-and-squeaks dig their heels in, and insist that your wife has to both pay for a visa and provide an itinerary, you don't really have sufficient time left within which to threaten them with infraction proceedings. Perhaps choose a more visa-friendly Schengen country?

Scouse.

[Mahout Angrit]

It seems that the Greek Embassy wants provisional flight and accomodation bookings before they will grant the visa. Travel agents won't a hold a deal more than a couple of days so how on earth does she get her visa, anyone got any comments?

I have had no dealings with the greek embassy but are you reading this information off the web site or is that what they have told you specific to your circumstances? Remember the info on the web sites etc is general for visa nationals who are independantly in UK and is probably not exactly the same as what is required if she has UK residence and is married to a Uk citizen.

Suggest you contact them if you can get past those blasted automatic machines.

[sierra01]

I've emailed the Greek Embassy asking for confirmation that flight/accomodation bookings aren't required for us, and politely stating that under EU law my freedom of movement is automatically extended to her.... perhaps I'm wrong but I thought that as she's my spouse etc etc. I'll let you know what they say.

Any idea of which countries are more visa friendly?

So a booze cruise to Dieppe is out then!

[sierra01]

Here is the reply I got from the Greek Embassy a few minutes ago....

Thai Passport holders require a visa to go to Greece. You must have all

documents that our website require otherwise you will be unable to apply.

That was it, no Dear Sir, nothing.

[sjaak327]

So if you are set on going to Greece, you can easily get that schengen visa, I mean what's the problem with provisional tickets, the Dutch embassy in Bangkok also requires a provisional booking. I just today did just that, a booking for october, I will pay them (travel agency in BKK) when I'm back in Bangkok after the visa has been approved, it will be around 5 weeks before the departure date. This is the third time I did this. No problem.

Even if the agency will hold it for a couple of days, that's how long it will take anyway. A schengen visa for NL takes a total of three days, I'm not sure about the procedure at the greec embassy, but if they handle it in a similar way, it's not a big deal.

[the scouser]

Here is the reply I got from the Greek Embassy a few minutes ago....

Thai Passport holders require a visa to go to Greece. You must have all

documents that our website require otherwise you will be unable to apply.

That was it, no Dear Sir, nothing.

It really depends how far you want to take this, but you can reply by quoting the relevant legislation which can be found here, especially articles 3(1) and 5(2) which state respectively:-

This Directive shall apply to all Union citizens who move to or reside in a Member State other than that of which they are a national, and to their family members as defined in point 2 of Article 2 who accompany or join them.

and

Family members who are not nationals of a Member State shall only be required to have an entry visa in accordance with Regulation (EC) No 539/2001 or, where appropriate, with national law. For the purposes of this Directive, possession of the valid residence card referred to in Article 10 shall exempt such family members from the visa requirement.

Member States shall grant such persons every facility to obtain the necessary visas. Such visas shall be issued free of charge as soon as possible and on the basis of an accelerated procedure.

Ask that they confirm that in the circumstances your wife's visa will be issued free of charge and with the minimum of formalities. If they say no, ask upon which legislation they are basing their stance and say you will consider lodging a formal complaint with the European Commission as their actions constitute an infraction.

If you want to quote the directive to them in Greek, have a butcher's at this link.

Alternatively, you might just choose to apply for a Schengen visa for another EU country and then travel to Greece from there.

Scouse.

[sierra01]

So if you are set on going to Greece, you can easily get that schengen visa, I mean what's the problem with provisional tickets, the Dutch embassy in Bangkok also requires a provisional booking. I just today did just that, a booking for october, I will pay them (travel agency in BKK) when I'm back in Bangkok after the visa has been approved, it will be around 5 weeks before the departure date. This is the third time I did this. No problem.

Even if the agency will hold it for a couple of days, that's how long it will take anyway. A schengen visa for NL takes a total of three days, I'm not sure about the procedure at the greec embassy, but if they handle it in a similar way, it's not a big deal.

According to the Greek Embassy website the visa takes 3-14 working days to issue, an interview is required (one trip to the smoke and a day off work for both of us), then another day off work to collect our passports. Documents required are.....her PP, my PP, 2 PP photos of her, 2 of me, letter from her employer, pay slip, provisional bookings of flights and accomodation, evidence of sufficient funds, proof of travel insurance, marriage certificate, translation of same, and a photo copy of EVERYTHING!

I dont think a travel agent will hold flights/accomodation for up to 14 days, I'll have to go and ask them if the paperwork actually states that they will only hold it for 2 days or whatever.

[the scouser]

If they abide by the European legislation, you need:-

1 A completed application form plus photos;

2. Your wife's passport;

3. Your passport;

4. Your marriage certificate plus a legalised translation;

5. A European health card (used to be called an E111 and issued by a post office) which can be obtained online.

Scouse.

[sierra01]

Here is the reply I got from the Greek Embassy a few minutes ago....

Thai Passport holders require a visa to go to Greece. You must have all

documents that our website require otherwise you will be unable to apply.

That was it, no Dear Sir, nothing.

It really depends how far you want to take this, but you can reply by quoting the relevant legislation which can be found here, especially articles 3(1) and 5(2) which state respectively:-

This Directive shall apply to all Union citizens who move to or reside in a Member State other than that of which they are a national, and to their family members as defined in point 2 of Article 2 who accompany or join them.

and

Family members who are not nationals of a Member State shall only be required to have an entry visa in accordance with Regulation (EC) No 539/2001 or, where appropriate, with national law. For the purposes of this Directive, possession of the valid residence card referred to in Article 10 shall exempt such family members from the visa requirement.

Member States shall grant such persons every facility to obtain the necessary visas. Such visas shall be issued free of charge as soon as possible and on the basis of an accelerated procedure.

Ask that they confirm that in the circumstances your wife's visa will be issued free of charge and with the minimum of formalities. If they say no, ask upon which legislation they are basing their stance and say you will consider lodging a formal complaint with the European Commission as their actions constitute an infraction.

If you want to quote the directive to them in Greek, have a butcher's at this link.

Alternatively, you might just choose to apply for a Schengen visa for another EU country and then travel to Greece from there.

Scouse.

Thanks for all the info Scouse, it's really appreciated.

I'm rapidly going off Greece but I'll look into getting there from another country. In the meantime I think I will use the info to have a go at them, if they still insist then I'll contact my local MEP for help, they can easily ignore me but an MEP is another kettle of fish (I hope!)

[Mahout Angrit]

If they abide by the European legislation, you need:-

1 A completed application form plus photos;

2. Your wife's passport;

3. Your passport;

4. Your marriage certificate plus a legalised translation;

5. A European health card (used to be called an E111 and issued by a post office) which can be obtained online.

From the French embassy web site

Can I use the European Health Insurance Card, issued by the N.H.S., in lieu of the medical travel insurance?

The EHIC is not a substitute for travel insurance since it may not cover all health costs and never covers repatriation costs.

Be advised that if you take out an insurance valid for 4 says, your visa will be of 4 days.

Your insurance must clearly state your full names as well as the duration of the cover.

The insurance can be purchased directly at the Visa Section via a direct line to a recognised insurance company.

If your bank account includes a travel insurance, please provide full details of the cover.

[the scouser]

As usual the French are marching to a different European tune.

Scouse.

[the scouser]

If they abide by the European legislation, you need:-

1 A completed application form plus photos;

2. Your wife's passport;

3. Your passport;

4. Your marriage certificate plus a legalised translation;

5. A European health card (used to be called an E111 and issued by a post office) which can be obtained online.

From the French embassy web site

Can I use the European Health Insurance Card, issued by the N.H.S., in lieu of the medical travel insurance?

The EHIC is not a substitute for travel insurance since it may not cover all health costs and never covers repatriation costs.

Be advised that if you take out an insurance valid for 4 says, your visa will be of 4 days.

Your insurance must clearly state your full names as well as the duration of the cover.

The insurance can be purchased directly at the Visa Section via a direct line to a recognised insurance company.

If your bank account includes a travel insurance, please provide full details of the cover.

I take back what I said in my previous post. I've now had a look at the French Consulate website and the bit you quoted from does not relate to spouses of EU nationals. In relation to such people, they now do not require any evidence of medical insurance - not even the European Health Card.

http://www.consulfrance-londres.org/articl...?id_article=352

Scouse.

[the scouser]

Neither do the Dutch.

Nor the Germans.

Scouse.

[Mahout Angrit]

Neither do the Dutch.

Nor the Germans.

Scouse.

Well researched! you can stop looking now ! the reference I gave asks if you can use the European Health Insurance card in lieu of travel insurance and the answer, no doubt, is correct. If you do not need medical insurance as the spouse of a UK citizen the question doesn't come into play and point 5 from the EU legislation, also quoted above, can be removed.

Edited July 27, 2007 by Mahout Angrit

[the scouser]

Come, come, M.A., you were just trying to indulge in a bit of cheap points scoring, and I responded. Sarcasm doesn't become your otherwise sunny disposition.

Scouse.

[Mahout Angrit]

Come, come, M.A., you were just trying to indulge in a bit of cheap points scoring, and I responded. Sarcasm doesn't become your otherwise sunny disposition.

Apologies if it came across as sarcasm, that certainly wasn't the intention, I was trying to heap praise but i guess your modesty wouldn't allow it.

[sierra01]

I've just been reading this thread http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...=132638&hl= to get round my problem with the Greek Embassy can I do the same, apply to the French Embassy (seems quite easy and straight forward), go to Greece and if asked say last minute change of plan and going to France at a later date?

[Mahout Angrit]

I've just been reading this thread http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...=132638&hl= to get round my problem with the Greek Embassy can I do the same, apply to the French Embassy (seems quite easy and straight forward), go to Greece and if asked say last minute change of plan and going to France at a later date?

Why not, especially if they dont ask for proof of accomodation or travel. (the OP of that post applied in Bangkok though but a Schengen visa once obtained is valid for all states) If you check the French embassy web site you will see that if you live in certain locations you can even apply through the post but you may need a relative with an address a long way from Bognor Do you still want to spend your money in Greece though?

Edited July 27, 2007 by Mahout Angrit

[sierra01]

I've just been reading this thread http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...=132638&hl= to get round my problem with the Greek Embassy can I do the same, apply to the French Embassy (seems quite easy and straight forward), go to Greece and if asked say last minute change of plan and going to France at a later date?

Why not, especially if they dont ask for proof of accomodation or travel. (the OP of that post applied in Bangkok though but a Schengen visa once obtained is valid for all states) If you check the French embassy web site you will see that if you live in certain locations you can even apply through the post but you may need a relative with an address a long way from Bognor Do you still want to spend your money in Greece though?

I like Greece, I just don't like their Embassy! It certainly seems the way to go though, bypass the bu**ers. The French Embassy does the visa on the day too.

[sierra01]

Just a quickie.

I got nowhere with the Greeks so I have my local MEP onto it, and I'm going to try the French Embassy.

The Thai Embassy weren't much help regarding the certified translation, so I rang the Cardiff consulate, as usual they couldn't have been more helpful. I sent off the requested documents and a £10 cheque last Friday, everything came back today all stamped....and a written wish that we have a good holiday!

[sierra01]

I have finally got a reply from my local MEP....

Thank you for your message asking about the Schengen Agreement and expressing surprise that the Greek authorities are requesting full travel-details for your wife on the grounds that she is not a British national and is not yet a fully-accredited resident of the UK, but present in the country by virtue of a marriage of less than three years duration (if I have that right?) and a visa issued a little over a year ago.

The difficulty you have lies, I think, in the fact that, although the Greek government is a signatory to the Schengen Agreement, the British Government is not. The UK is, thus, not in the Schengen-area, and normal restrictions therefore apply to nationals, of non-EU countries, who are living in Britain and wish to travel to Greece.

The website at http://www.aegee.tue.nl/site-archive/europ...hengen_sum.html may make this clearer. I hope this situation does not spoil your holiday.

It looks like we'll have to do it via the French Embassy, then have a last minute change of plan.

[the scouser]

He (or his office manager) has totally missed the point. It's got nowt to do with the Schengen area, but has everything to do with European legislation which states that family members can accompany EU nationals with the minimum of formalities and free of charge.

Scouse.