They Took Our Land

[Monroe]

During my stay in Thailand this summer, an uncle of mine was called to present himself and the deeds to his land at some government office, so off he went to Chiang Rai or Chiang Mai (one of the two, can't recall which).

The next news I got upon his arrival home was that they took the papers for half his land and gave the other half back, no compensation or anything (not as if they'd actually match their appraisal, but you know...). Their reasoning was that the land may be necessary in the expansion of the Doi Tung/Mae Fah Luang projects. We're still allowed to use the land, but they can come in whenever they want and tear everything down.

The land that was taken was 4 or so sq. kilometers up near the mountainside (the good stuff), it's wasn't being used at the time, but it's been in our family for 3-4 generations (cut down personally by my grandfather and his relatives) and my generation had plans to build houses on it as those before us did the land below. Now we have to settle for less mountain air/breeze =/

Is this really legal? It feels like we've been robbed.

Our family is well-to-do and all, but not filthy rich to the point that we can just ignore something like this (mostly attorneys, architects, doctors, teachers, etc... very closely knit).

We've considered attorneys as we're unfamiliar with the Thai legal system, but what's the chance we'd actually get this back and how many people has this already happened to?

[ProfessorNiceGuy]

Dunno, but sounds illegal to me. Suggest u talk to a good lawyer.

[draggons]

Your family has had the land for 3-4 generations, mostly attorneys, architects, doctors, teachers etc, and none are familiar with the Thai legal system?

[Monroe]

Your family has had the land for 3-4 generations, mostly attorneys, architects, doctors, teachers etc, and none are familiar with the Thai legal system?

For the most part they practice in the US.

Should also mention there are two sides in my family, but we've all sort of adopted the land originally owned by my mother's family. It's hard to explain.

Edited September 3, 2007 by Monroe

[ColPyat]

Is this really legal? It feels like we've been robbed.

Given what you said the land is going to be used for - you will just have to swallow the bitter pill. There is little the law can do about it. Be glad that it was only half of your land and your family can survive without it.

A bit more than 20 years ago a similar thing happened to my wife's family, and it was all they had left, throwing them from poverty into abject poverty, no compensation offered, no discussion possible - just ordered off the land.

[buffcoat]

Compulsory purchase is alive and well in the UK as well but the operative term is purchase.

From what you have said the authorities have not at this point seized the land but are warning you they might and could therefore demolish any structure on it (they have done this to avoid a compensation claim in the future because you now know the possibility exists?????).

I suspect this is legal as all Govts as far as I am aware hold the ultimate title to all land but most certainly go to a good land lawyer and find out.If you cannot stop the compulsory 'purchase' then your only recourse is to achieve the best price for the forced sale.

Sorry to read of your difficulty

[Monroe]

Dunno, but sounds illegal to me. Suggest u talk to a good lawyer.

Thinking of it, at the moment only a few members of the family even know this is going on and it's a bit difficult for my immediate family to handle it from the US.

Is this really legal? It feels like we've been robbed.

Given what you said the land is going to be used for - you will just have to swallow the bitter pill. There is little the law can do about it. Be glad that it was only half of your land and your family can survive without it.

A bit more than 20 years ago a similar thing happened to my wife's family, and it was all they had left, throwing them from poverty into abject poverty, no compensation offered, no discussion possible - just ordered off the land.

Quite sad how a charitable program might go about forcing people into poverty. We were lucky enough to have more, but I doubt they even looked it over to see whether we might have been farmers or business tycoons.

[steveromagnino]

The land that was taken was 4 or so sq. kilometers up near the mountainside (the good stuff), it's wasn't being used at the time, but it's been in our family for 3-4 generations (cut down personally by my grandfather and his relatives) and my generation had plans to build houses on it as those before us did the land below. Now we have to settle for less mountain air/breeze =/

Is this really legal? It feels like we've been robbed.

What exact title type was it ?

This is critical...if it was a farming title type or restricted in some way, then you may not be losing much.

If it is a full title, then that is a different matter.

Nor Sor sahm etc etc - it will be something like that...tell us this bit first and we might have more info.

[Monroe]

The land that was taken was 4 or so sq. kilometers up near the mountainside (the good stuff), it's wasn't being used at the time, but it's been in our family for 3-4 generations (cut down personally by my grandfather and his relatives) and my generation had plans to build houses on it as those before us did the land below. Now we have to settle for less mountain air/breeze =/

Is this really legal? It feels like we've been robbed.

What exact title type was it ?

This is critical...if it was a farming title type or restricted in some way, then you may not be losing much.

If it is a full title, then that is a different matter.

Nor Sor sahm etc etc - it will be something like that...tell us this bit first and we might have more info.

I'm afraid I couldn't say for sure =/

If this helps any, my mother used to tell me stories of how the Thai government offered free land out in the countryside to anyone willing to clear it up for themselves and later presented them with deeds. Sounds easy, but there were giant trees and such that had to be cleared with axes and shovels.

One of the marvels there is my grandmother's house--the first house here. Built by my late grandfather of wood that's no longer available. Its been standing many moons and not a single termite.

I'd have to guess it's a full title as all the land we've owned has been used for housing.

Should also mention we've bought a lot of land from neighbors (at a premium) for our family's future use. They had houses and whatnot on them before they were demolished.

Back in a bit on the chance that somebody responds, cleaning out my closet then heading to a department store to buy school clothes, backpacks and such for myself and my sister.

Edited September 3, 2007 by Monroe

[lannarebirth]

It is very rare to find large blocks of land in the mountains with first class titles. When it exists, it usually belongs to a general or a family member of a minister or something. Also, MOST land that was formerly forest , even with titles, can be reclaimed by the government if it is not being used in the way specified in the title granting. ie: much reclaimed "degraded" forest land MUST be used for agriculture, to remain in compliance of the terms of the title grant. Has your land been in use of late? Did you really mean 4 sq. kms? If so, and you haven't used it someone will definitely be wanting it. If it happened recently, it's probably army officers.

You should file some sort of protest and ensure you are in compliance with the requirements that granted title. Right now there is a big problem in the north with land departments and forestry departments. Everythig is frozen pending elections. the former forestry chief from Chiang Rai is a Thaksin guy and a "warlord" sort. Everybody is scared to act as they don't know if he'll be back in charge or not. Get on the record that you believe you've been done wrong and perhaps the next administration can unwind it.