'let's Get A Dumptruck...

[mbkudu]

i really dont know what works in thailand but it is so ez to see what wont.

This thought process is what separates the Thais from the Thai-Chinese. Thai entrepreneurs will often engage in some madcap business (many Farangs as well for that matter) without thinking things out beforehand; setting up businesses without thinking about location or markets. The Chinese usually see the potential or non-potential of a business right away, and simply won't do it if they know it won't make them any money. My Thai wife started a business a few years ago in the above fashion, no planning, no forethought, but a desire to succeed. She was lucky because the business has worked. Many are not as fortunate.

[fletchsmile]

...looks like 3-4 trucks would be needed before any kind of money could be made...

any comments?

The moment you start looking at having to invest more and more just to make a profit in Thailand for this type of business, is the moment to really think again. If you can't come close to a profit with 1 or 2 trucks, then don't get anywhere near 3 or 4. Basic concept for this business is money per truck. It's not something that requires a large support infrastructure with large overheads initially. i.e revenue per truc vs all in cost per truck.

The foreigners I see that make money here (aside from salaried dudes), either start small with a business you can multiply and build as you go along, which is close to profitable from the start. or taking an international company/business model proven elsewhere with large amounts of capital. The latter is more often done by the companies already doing successfully in other countries.

Similar to the som tam lady in a chequered shirt on the street. If she can't make a go with one stall, forget an empire...

dunno...looks like monthly maintenance would be a large outgoing...especially for a used truck...also road tax...in western countries HGVs pay a lot as they eat up the roads...

no matter, the wife got really pissed off when I showed her the figures...looks like I was right; she's probably made some deals already and folks are expecting her to come through...to keep the peace I said OK: I'll front the initial 180k baht but if she don't show a profit in 4 months time she can hang it up...

exactly. these are part of the "all-in costs for the truck". 4 trucks = 4 x the maintenance, 4 x the road tax, 4 x the insurance, fuel, drivers wages etc. so if one truck is struggling to generate revenue in excess of costs. 4 trucks aren't going to help, and likely just compound your problem almost 4 times. There may be some small economies of scale, but not many

Edited September 9, 2007 by fletchthai68

[ThaiWanderer68]

.... Then after that, is this really about business for you and your wife to make money, or something to help a family member, or pander to a family member's whim? Each is valid in its own way, just be clear why you are doing it.

If you can afford to lose 100k then you're financially ok to start. Tho' that doesn't mean you should, and be careful not to set precedents for every family whim that comes along in the form of a business venture. I would add that 100k looks low for start up. What's the total outlay in say 6 months with no income (worst case)?

After that how much above that are you prepared to put in to keep it going? And will you be disciplined enough to cut your losses if you put that extra in and it doesn't work out? What expectations are you going to set to your wife and brother-in-life? What are the consequences when they don't meet them, and will you stick to them? eg I'm only going to do this once, and if it doesn't work that's it. No more ideas of internet cafes, pig farms, restaurants etc.

In terms of business model. Yes - crunch some numbers, and don't forget insurance. ....

dunno...looks like monthly maintenance would be a large outgoing...especially for a used truck...also road tax...in western countries HGVs pay a lot as they eat up the roads...

no matter, the wife got really pissed off when I showed her the figures...looks like I was right; she's probably made some deals already and folks are expecting her to come through...to keep the peace I said OK: I'll front the initial 180k baht but if she don't show a profit in 4 months time she can hang it up...

looks like you're in for a rough ride ... if you'll excuse the pun.

- Your reasons for doing it have shifted since your initial post. Now you're doing it to appease Mrs tutsi

- You've crunched the numbers and found it not viable

- You're putting in more than your initial start up cost already.

And you're still going ahead

As an outsider's observation, I understand the family pressure, but I doubt you'll be disciplined enough to cut your losses later, having read the above. It will be you wife and brother-in-law running it for as long as they feel they want to. You'll give in to them each time despite losing money, as it's small compared to the cost of peace. The real winners will be everyone but you.

Sorry you seem like a nice guy, but I've got to say this is not a real business venture. It's another classic of foreigner putting money into what he calls a "business". Then the real business for the Thais is taking your money out of the business. You're putting in 180k capital. They're taking out 180k revenue (less a few costs). From a Thai perspective why bother trying to make money? 180k is probably 30 months income for your brother in law. (Assuming he earns say 6k a month). Even if your brother-in-law gets only a few months wages or say 25% or 45k, he will have been successful. Even if he loses the other 75% to other people. Your wife will be successful because of the face generated in "big business", as well as trying to help her family. You'll be the only unsuccessful loser. All you're getting is a little temporary P&Q. I would also emphasise temporary as you are not exactly "nipping the problem in the bud". How long will it continue and how long before you start to resent it.

Financially it doesn't seem to make sense. On the personal front: consider taking the hit now with the Mrs. Otherwise you're risking a lot bigger issues down the road, on this as well as other ventures..

Edited September 9, 2007 by ThaiWanderer68

[tutsiwarrior]

.... Then after that, is this really about business for you and your wife to make money, or something to help a family member, or pander to a family member's whim? Each is valid in its own way, just be clear why you are doing it.

If you can afford to lose 100k then you're financially ok to start. Tho' that doesn't mean you should, and be careful not to set precedents for every family whim that comes along in the form of a business venture. I would add that 100k looks low for start up. What's the total outlay in say 6 months with no income (worst case)?

After that how much above that are you prepared to put in to keep it going? And will you be disciplined enough to cut your losses if you put that extra in and it doesn't work out? What expectations are you going to set to your wife and brother-in-life? What are the consequences when they don't meet them, and will you stick to them? eg I'm only going to do this once, and if it doesn't work that's it. No more ideas of internet cafes, pig farms, restaurants etc.

In terms of business model. Yes - crunch some numbers, and don't forget insurance. ....

dunno...looks like monthly maintenance would be a large outgoing...especially for a used truck...also road tax...in western countries HGVs pay a lot as they eat up the roads...

no matter, the wife got really pissed off when I showed her the figures...looks like I was right; she's probably made some deals already and folks are expecting her to come through...to keep the peace I said OK: I'll front the initial 180k baht but if she don't show a profit in 4 months time she can hang it up...

looks like you're in for a rough ride ... if you'll excuse the pun.

- Your reasons for doing it have shifted since your initial post. Now you're doing it to appease Mrs tutsi

- You've crunched the numbers and found it not viable

- You're putting in more than your initial start up cost already.

And you're still going ahead

As an outsider's observation, I understand the family pressure, but I doubt you'll be disciplined enough to cut your losses later, having read the above. It will be you wife and brother-in-law running it for as long as they feel they want to. You'll give in to them each time despite losing money, as it's small compared to the cost of peace. The real winners will be everyone but you.

Sorry you seem like a nice guy, but I've got to say this is not a real business venture. It's another classic of foreigner putting money into what he calls a "business". Then the real business for the Thais is taking your money out of the business. You're putting in 180k capital. They're taking out 180k revenue (less a few costs). From a Thai perspective why bother trying to make money? 180k is probably 30 months income for your brother in law. (Assuming he earns say 6k a month). Even if your brother-in-law gets only a few months wages or say 25% or 45k, he will have been successful. Even if he loses the other 75% to other people. Your wife will be successful because of the face generated in "big business", as well as trying to help her family. You'll be the only unsuccessful loser. All you're getting is a little temporary P&Q. I would also emphasise temporary as you are not exactly "nipping the problem in the bud". How long will it continue and how long before you start to resent it.

Financially it doesn't seem to make sense. On the personal front: consider taking the hit now with the Mrs. Otherwise you're risking a lot bigger issues down the road, on this as well as other ventures..

yeah...I know...looks like a no brainer...but she has obviously made some deals and ye gotta work the loss of face into the scheme...

I googled the mill in Prachinburi and they're on the third stage of the plant, ie. the supply infrastructure is already in place and they will be late comers with all the disadvantages that is implied...I showed that to the wife and she was genuinely confused; she thought about running a food business sideline as well...I didn't haveta say nothin'; I've recently come offa a project in rural Vietnam that was genuinely new...lotsa new money floating around for the hustlers that could get it...well, the wife and the brother are babes in the woods just waitin' to get fleeced...

I'm on a good number presently in Saudi so I can afford to lose the 180k...the loss thereof may kick some sense into her heid so that maybe the next time she'll think about things more carefully...I happen to be in love with her and her lovely family; they've never asked for any kind of dough in the 7 years of my marriage and I know all of them to be honest, hard working people...the local gangsters know the dynamic: get some commitments in place then sit back and enjoy ...'land of smiles'? shit...smiling at your disadvantage and their good luck...

btw, thanks to all for your advice...

Edited September 9, 2007 by tutsiwarrior

[fletchsmile]

yeah...I know...looks like a no brainer...but she has obviously made some deals and ye gotta work the loss of face into the scheme...

Don't forget, you have face too... or respect. If it's first time round, you might be seen as trying to help the family, so it could be positive. If it happens/reoccurs a few times though, it won't be so positive - you could be seen as more money than sense, and someone who makes stupid mistakes. That's when the requests mount, and face is still lost by saying no later.

[blizzard]

sorry. this guys deserves to lose his money. I BET A LOT OF FARANGS BUY BUZNITS FOR THEIR WIFE JUST TO KEEP EM AT BAY.

MR FLETCH, he is already seen as a tree of money. he just dont see it. what wife would want to keep on going when its obvious she should cum up with another moneylosing idea.

maybe this guy should get a less ambitious wife, one who is interested in losing smaller amounts of dosh.

Edited September 9, 2007 by blizzard

[tutsiwarrior]

yeah...I know...looks like a no brainer...but she has obviously made some deals and ye gotta work the loss of face into the scheme...

Don't forget, you have face too... or respect. If it's first time round, you might be seen as trying to help the family, so it could be positive. If it happens/reoccurs a few times though, it won't be so positive - you could be seen as more money than sense, and someone who makes stupid mistakes. That's when the requests mount, and face is still lost by saying no later.

yeah...you got it; this has to be a learning experience... I control the purse strings and if there ain't no profit outta 4 months then no more dough from my end...

sorry. this guys deserves to lose his money. I BET A LOT OF FARANGS BUY BUZNITS FOR THEIR WIFE JUST TO KEEP EM AT BAY.

MR FLETCH, he is already seen as a tree of money. he just dont see it. what wife would want to keep on going when its obvious she should cum up with another moneylosing idea.

maybe this guy should get a less ambitious wife, one who is interested in losing smaller amounts of dosh.

you know what you can do ...

[blizzard]

you control the purse strings but she controls your soul. you know you shouldnt buy a duumptruck yet you going to buy a duumptruck. you another comedian or what?

you obviously have no cents for busnit as you expect from the start she wont make money and yet you only give her 4 months to turn a profit.

Edited September 9, 2007 by blizzard

[sbk]

If you don't like tutsi's business sense there is no need to get insulting, neither is name calling necessary.

Lets keep this polite and flame free guys.

[tutsiwarrior]

If you don't like tutsi's business sense there is no need to get insulting, neither is name calling necessary.

Lets keep this polite and flame free guys.

darling...I want to SCREAM but I won't as I don't want to be separated from TV an' yer precious self and suffer fate worse than death...

however, there is a misunderstanding...mr blizzard, you got to understand that separating with money is not necessarily about not doing good business...whatever 180K baht represents is something to piss at at my present salary and my wife has the same purpose as meself...when I retire if I don't have USD1000 per month to show then my ass is outta here per the current legislation; everyone wants to stay cool...I want my nieces to continue to give me backrubs...if it takes a few thou to get the wife to wise up and to save face <deleted>?

there is a limit to the damage but a world to gain if a valuable lesson is learned...

[sbk]

Topic closed as it seems the thread strayed too far off topic to even bother.

Off topic posts have been deleted, as well as those discussing moderation issues.

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