Corrupt To The Core: Beware!

[misterme]

With all due respect, you got taken for $500. I'd count yourself one of the lucky ones.

The work you're doing sounds like it's worth it. Count it as part of the price to pay for trying to help.

Corruption here stinks. And the mindset is too deep for you or me to make a big effect. But that shouldn't stop us from trying.

[Manchester]

Some sympathetic posts there JR.

I am sorry but i,m not sure what to believe here. You have over 600 posts on a Thailand based forum...........yet you are still taken to the cleaners? No written contract?

You have an email right? You still have some leverage under the Thai labour laws.

My father always told me that the brainier they are..........the easier they are to scam.

So much for Doctorates in the real world huh?

If the story is true...............i genuinely sympathise.

Nagging away at the back of my small brain is the thought....................." Is this guy for real? "

Edited October 25, 2007 by Manchester

[JR Texas]

JR, you should have called their bluff. Smile nicely and say 'the Dean advised me that my rent was xxxx, if you are looking for more then you need to speak with the Dean' . . . and walk away!!

I've found that if you play their game, then they soon back down, especially if you smile and are polite whilst you are doing this ., .

Simon

I did call their bluff.........began nice and cordial and tried to work things out........showed the Dean the email.......then she flew off to Japan on yet another important meeting at a 5-star hotel........secretary told me that I must pay.......I went to the Vice-President and he was outraged and told me not to pay......we agreed that the rent would be reduced after that............apparently the department was told to pay.........they may or may not have paid........I thought it was all over until after I left. At that point I received a warning that I must pay now "or else." I could not believe it. So I coughed up the money. They still owe me money.......but I have had it with Thailand and its corruption.

[skettios]

JR, you should have called their bluff. Smile nicely and say 'the Dean advised me that my rent was xxxx, if you are looking for more then you need to speak with the Dean' . . . and walk away!!

I've found that if you play their game, then they soon back down, especially if you smile and are polite whilst you are doing this ., .

Simon

I did call their bluff.........began nice and cordial and tried to work things out........showed the Dean the email.......then she flew off to Japan on yet another important meeting at a 5-star hotel........secretary told me that I must pay.......I went to the Vice-President and he was outraged and told me not to pay......we agreed that the rent would be reduced after that............apparently the department was told to pay.........they may or may not have paid........I thought it was all over until after I left. At that point I received a warning that I must pay now "or else." I could not believe it. So I coughed up the money. They still owe me money.......but I have had it with Thailand and its corruption.

Ugh, but why cough up the money? That's the last thing I would do. By paying, aren't you effectively admitting that they are right?

[JR Texas]

JR, you should have called their bluff. Smile nicely and say 'the Dean advised me that my rent was xxxx, if you are looking for more then you need to speak with the Dean' . . . and walk away!!

I've found that if you play their game, then they soon back down, especially if you smile and are polite whilst you are doing this ., .

Simon

I did call their bluff.........began nice and cordial and tried to work things out........showed the Dean the email.......then she flew off to Japan on yet another important meeting at a 5-star hotel........secretary told me that I must pay.......I went to the Vice-President and he was outraged and told me not to pay......we agreed that the rent would be reduced after that............apparently the department was told to pay.........they may or may not have paid........I thought it was all over until after I left. At that point I received a warning that I must pay now "or else." I could not believe it. So I coughed up the money. They still owe me money.......but I have had it with Thailand and its corruption.

Ugh, but why cough up the money? That's the last thing I would do. By paying, aren't you effectively admitting that they are right?

I did it because I know that farangs virtually never win, even when the Thai is on the wrong side of the law.

[skettios]

JR, you should have called their bluff. Smile nicely and say 'the Dean advised me that my rent was xxxx, if you are looking for more then you need to speak with the Dean' . . . and walk away!!

I've found that if you play their game, then they soon back down, especially if you smile and are polite whilst you are doing this ., .

Simon

I did call their bluff.........began nice and cordial and tried to work things out........showed the Dean the email.......then she flew off to Japan on yet another important meeting at a 5-star hotel........secretary told me that I must pay.......I went to the Vice-President and he was outraged and told me not to pay......we agreed that the rent would be reduced after that............apparently the department was told to pay.........they may or may not have paid........I thought it was all over until after I left. At that point I received a warning that I must pay now "or else." I could not believe it. So I coughed up the money. They still owe me money.......but I have had it with Thailand and its corruption.

Ugh, but why cough up the money? That's the last thing I would do. By paying, aren't you effectively admitting that they are right?

I did it because I know that farangs virtually never win, even when the Thai is on the wrong side of the law.

I wasn't there, so I don't know the circumstances that were involved with you actually paying them. Wish you didn't have to go through this. Thanks for the warning.

[CTM]

JR, you should have called their bluff. Smile nicely and say 'the Dean advised me that my rent was xxxx, if you are looking for more then you need to speak with the Dean' . . . and walk away!!

I've found that if you play their game, then they soon back down, especially if you smile and are polite whilst you are doing this ., .

Simon

I did call their bluff.........began nice and cordial and tried to work things out........showed the Dean the email.......then she flew off to Japan on yet another important meeting at a 5-star hotel........secretary told me that I must pay.......I went to the Vice-President and he was outraged and told me not to pay......we agreed that the rent would be reduced after that............apparently the department was told to pay.........they may or may not have paid........I thought it was all over until after I left. At that point I received a warning that I must pay now "or else." I could not believe it. So I coughed up the money. They still owe me money.......but I have had it with Thailand and its corruption.

Ugh, but why cough up the money? That's the last thing I would do. By paying, aren't you effectively admitting that they are right?

I did it because I know that farangs virtually never win, even when the Thai is on the wrong side of the law.

And this attitude is why farangs “never win”. They don’t stand up for themselves. Once you paid them the money you lost your leverage and were marked as a wimp who could be trampled. Wow, you’re going to go on a web board and complain but scared to even mention the school by name. They are running scared now. LOL

What makes you think the farangland foundations really care about corruption or are not aware of it already? They are in the business of preserving their own even more overpaid positions. Most don’t care about how the money is squandered. It is about making the wealthy donors feel good about themselves and giving the donors something to feel superior about when prattling on at cocktail parties. $500 is what they spend on lunch.

As far as the Dean flying all around the world staying at posh hotels and attending do nothing seminars and meetings, how exactly is this different then Western academia or large charitable organizations?

PS It is TV not TF. TF is Thailandfriends.

[Scott]

You have my deepest sympathies on this matter and I hope you follow through to some logical conclusion that causes them a loss of face, at least. Unless places are "outed" they will continue to do this sort of stuff.

See it too many times.

It hurts all of us in the end.

[Rumpole]

It is an ethical problem that needs a solution.

The solution is for visiting scholars to avoid Thailand like the plague. The Thais care nothing for education and should be allowed to rot in the educational dungheap of their own making. Publicize what happened to you as extensively as possible to ensure that others avoid Thai institutions. Just another example of why Thai universities have difficulty in attracting and retaining foreign faculty - not that they particularly care.

Edited October 30, 2007 by Rumpole

[JR Texas]

It is an ethical problem that needs a solution.

The solution is for visiting scholars to avoid Thailand like the plague. The Thais care nothing for education and should be allowed to rot in the educational dungheap of their own making. Publicize what happened to you as extensively as possible to ensure that others avoid Thai institutions. Just another example of why Thai universities have difficulty in attracting and retaining foreign faculty - not that they particularly care.

I appreciate all of the replies. It is clear that the system of education in Thailand is abysmal and corrupt to the core. I do not want to let people know precisely where I was at for one simple reason: I want to remain anonymous. Having said that, I can assure you that the Rockefeller Foundation and others will know the name of the university and specific departments. (As an aside, I am currently visiting a medical college in China.....the students are smart, energetic and interesting......the administrators have been very kind to me......even immigration gave me a smile as I crossed the border.......Amazing China! They are far ahead of Thailand in many areas.)

[enuff said]

.

Are you really that naive? No need to answer.

Just wander over to Daves ESL Cafe forum (or the three or four other forums that cover China) to read about the teacher abuse, ripoffs, corruption in China.

'nuff said

~

[Rumpole]

Are you really that naive? No need to answer.

Just wander over to Daves ESL Cafe forum (or the three or four other forums that cover China) to read about the teacher abuse, ripoffs, corruption in China.

'nuff said

~

The complaints are mostly from those employed in the private sector, and are often from naive young newbies who have never been out of their home country before. Chinese government universities are generally much better places to work than their Thai counterparts, and do not attract many complaints. I spent four years at a Chinese university - having initially intended to stay for only one semester - and was treated far better and accorded much more respect (had to earn it though) than at the two Thai universities for which I was foolish enough to work.

I'd rather dine on powdered glass than work for the Thais again.

Edited October 30, 2007 by Rumpole