Thai Pr

[jingjingna]

For those who are interested, applications for Thai PR will be accepted as of 1st November 2007, according to The Royal Thai Consulate U.K website.

I just thought I'd let you guys know.

[absolutelyBangkok]

Truth at San Plu may be a different reality though.

Would be the first time that the application period is extended in such a way.

Would clearly be a positive sign though! Meaning: We want more of you foreigners permanently in the country.

I doubt it though, will probably still be the one week in December.

[sbk]

Upon checking out the Immigration website -- www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/en/base.php--indeed, on the very front page is a PDF document entitled

Notification of Immigration Bureau Admission of application for residential permit in the year B.E. 2550 (2007)

and inside that document it states:

1.

Submit Applications, check required documents

Pay fee and stamped fingerprint

From 1 November 2007

Until 28 December 2007

[absolutelyBangkok]

Then that's a first, a clear relaxation of the rules and therefore good news!

[SHDWFX]

Out of curiosity I called Siam Legal and asked about their assitance for getting permanent residency. I was unaware that the fees were enormous. The Thai Immigration fee is about 200,000 Baht and the Siam Legal fee is 400,000 Baht! Our conversation was pretty short!

[john b good]

Out of curiosity I called Siam Legal and asked about their assitance for getting permanent residency. I was unaware that the fees were enormous. The Thai Immigration fee is about 200,000 Baht and the Siam Legal fee is 400,000 Baht! Our conversation was pretty short!

I don't know how onerous a process it is to go through but it can't come close to be worth Baht 400K.

Maybe a good idea to shop around.

[samran]

the 200K immigration fee is only payable if you are successful. The application fee is a couple of thousand baht.

[lopburi3]

7,600 baht for application.

[monty]

And the 200K gets halved when you are married to a Thai national!

[Tingnongnoi]

what about if you are married to a Thai national and have a work permit, but dont pay tax here due to income overseas, can you still apply or does the non payment of tax mean you don't qualify?

[KamnanT]

Out of curiosity I called Siam Legal and asked about their assitance for getting permanent residency. I was unaware that the fees were enormous. The Thai Immigration fee is about 200,000 Baht and the Siam Legal fee is 400,000 Baht! Our conversation was pretty short!

I don't know how onerous a process it is to go through but it can't come close to be worth Baht 400K.

Maybe a good idea to shop around.

It is entirely possible to complete the PR application process without the assistance of a legal or paralegal advisor. The paperwork can be onerous, but it's primarily collecting information about your own background and life in Thailand, getting translations, certifications and authentications and presenting it all to Immigration. I always found the officers in the Permanent Residence section to be very helpful in walking applicants through the requirements and process.

All of this is time-consuming, so it's a personal decision whether or not your time is worth what a paralegal would charge to do 80% of the running around for you. A word of warning on one piece of paperwork: the criminal background check from your home country. This must be from your home national police authority (eg. FBI in the US, RCMP in Canada, AFP in Australia) and MUST be a fingerprint-based search. The AFP, for example, will do a criminal record search based on fingerprints or solely on name and date of birth, but in the latter case the certificate you get back states that no fingerprint search was conducted and the Thai Immigration Bureau will reject such a certificate. The AFP can return a certificate in a few days, but some authorities (notably the FBI) have a big backlog of fingerprint search requests and it can take months to get a certificate from them. If you haven't submitted a request already, you may not get one by the December 28th application deadline.

BTW, THB 400,000 for the legal side is more than a touch on the high side. I had a very well regarded local Thai law firm (same one my employer uses for immigration work) do the whole thing for myself, my wife and two children for less than 100K including all disbursements and VAT. Saved me a lot of running around and in my case, I considered it worthwhile.

[lopburi3]

It will be the sum of all factors so is best to ask - Immigration reportedly tries to give correct advise on these applications and your odds.

[absolutelyBangkok]

If your papers are correct, you don't need the help of any lawyer or consultant.

It will be a time consuming affair, but I made it without any outside help and anybody can make it without outside help if your application papers meet the conditions.

Just start collecting the papers early enough.

The most important figure remains the annual tax.

It's a very transparent process, not need to pay money under the table.

[endure]

All of this is time-consuming, so it's a personal decision whether or not your time is worth what a paralegal would charge to do 80% of the running around for you. A word of warning on one piece of paperwork: the criminal background check from your home country. This must be from your home national police authority (eg. FBI in the US, RCMP in Canada, AFP in Australia) and MUST be a fingerprint-based search.

What if you don't have a national police authority as we in the UK don't?

[jingjingna]

If you are from the U.K, you can apply for a Police Clearance Certificate online. Allow 40 days for it to arrive. However, a seperate set of 'fingerprints' may need to be taken at Thai Police Headquarters.

I agree, the Legal fees that some of the lawyers are asking for are very high! My personal opinion is get an upto date checklist and make sure you have all the necessary paperwork prepared, then cross your fingers and wait ...

[akaika]

If your papers are correct, you don't need the help of any lawyer or consultant.

It will be a time consuming affair, but I made it without any outside help and anybody can make it without outside help if your application papers meet the conditions.

Just start collecting the papers early enough.

The most important figure remains the annual tax.

It's a very transparent process, not need to pay money under the table.

Could you clarify what you mean by the annual tax?

[lopburi3]

Proof that you have been paying tax on income in Thailand over a period of time. This is reported to be desired at the 80k per month income level or higher for best chance of success.

[JetsetBkk]

Strange how the current rules prevent retirees from getting PR. Considering how so much in Thailand is money oriented (no pun intended), I would have thought Immigration would put a figure on "100,000 baht/month tax paid over 5 years" and give that as an alternative requirement.

If the monthly tax on 100,000 was 30,000 (I have no idea how close that is) then why don't they put a figure of 12*30,000*5 ( = 1,800,000 baht) on PR?

It seems as though they simply don't want retirees to get PR, which I would have thought is exactly the type of people they should want.

[absolutelyBangkok]

If your papers are correct, you don't need the help of any lawyer or consultant.

It will be a time consuming affair, but I made it without any outside help and anybody can make it without outside help if your application papers meet the conditions.

Just start collecting the papers early enough.

The most important figure remains the annual tax.

It's a very transparent process, not need to pay money under the table.

Could you clarify what you mean by the annual tax?

How much tax you pay per year. Should be above 80,000 baht.

Probably more if you're applying under the 191,400 baht biz option.

The family option for 95,700 baht though as well is quite smooth sailing if you're above 80 k/y.

[younghusband]

Strange how the current rules prevent retirees from getting PR. Considering how so much in Thailand is money oriented (no pun intended), I would have thought Immigration would put a figure on "100,000 baht/month tax paid over 5 years" and give that as an alternative requirement.

If the monthly tax on 100,000 was 30,000 (I have no idea how close that is) then why don't they put a figure of 12*30,000*5 ( = 1,800,000 baht) on PR?

It seems as though they simply don't want retirees to get PR, which I would have thought is exactly the type of people they should want.

Your conclusion is correct although it seems to surprise you.Whether it is uncomfortable for some to hear or not, making life easier for relatively low net worth retirees is not seen as a priority, nor contrary to your assumption is this category seen to represent, far from it, exactly the type of people they should want.There is no intention nor has there ever been any wish or intention to give retirees PR status.If you know retirees who have PR status they will have almost certainly qualified by means of other criteria - business, family etc and in all cases will have been bona fide tax payers in Thailand.

[JetsetBkk]

Your conclusion is correct although it seems to surprise you.Whether it is uncomfortable for some to hear or not, making life easier for relatively low net worth retirees is not seen as a priority, nor contrary to your assumption is this category seen to represent, far from it, exactly the type of people they should want.There is no intention nor has there ever been any wish or intention to give retirees PR status.If you know retirees who have PR status they will have almost certainly qualified by means of other criteria - business, family etc and in all cases will have been bona fide tax payers in Thailand.

I'd like to know why you consider retirees to be "relatively low net worth".

If your definition is based on "tax paid", then clearly a fee could be charged to non-tax paying retirees to compensate the treasury.

If your definition is based on money spent, then I'm sure a lot of retirees out-spend a lot of tax-payers.

If your definition is based on something else, I'd be interested to hear it.

[RAZZELL]

If you are from the U.K, you can apply for a Police Clearance Certificate online. Allow 40 days for it to arrive. However, a seperate set of 'fingerprints' may need to be taken at Thai Police Headquarters.

In the UK, what exactly does a "police clearance certificate" mean? What does it show? What sort of "crimes" would disqualify a PR application?

After 10 years are they not "recorded?"

RAZZ

Edited October 29, 2007 by RAZZELL

[younghusband]

Your conclusion is correct although it seems to surprise you.Whether it is uncomfortable for some to hear or not, making life easier for relatively low net worth retirees is not seen as a priority, nor contrary to your assumption is this category seen to represent, far from it, exactly the type of people they should want.There is no intention nor has there ever been any wish or intention to give retirees PR status.If you know retirees who have PR status they will have almost certainly qualified by means of other criteria - business, family etc and in all cases will have been bona fide tax payers in Thailand.

I'd like to know why you consider retirees to be "relatively low net worth".

If your definition is based on "tax paid", then clearly a fee could be charged to non-tax paying retirees to compensate the treasury.

If your definition is based on money spent, then I'm sure a lot of retirees out-spend a lot of tax-payers.

If your definition is based on something else, I'd be interested to hear it.

1.High net worth individuals do not generally retire in places like Thailand although they might spend the European winter months here.Clearly there are exceptions but the vast majority of retirees on one year visas are not particularly well educated "ordinary Joes", many ex-blue collar or similar on average incomes .Nothing wrong with that of course but that's the reality.

2.If you asked me to define high net worth, I would say income of $500,000+ and assets of $ 5 million +.Latter figure might be too low these days.

3.I don't know how to make the point other than repeat what I've said already.The Thai Government of whatever persuasion has no interest in giving this floating population permanent residence rights partly because of the Thai instinct to keep foreigners on a leash, and partly because no need is seen to give PR given the relatively simple one year extension facility.

Solution

1.Try Malaysia where things are simpler

2.Earn PR legitimately by geting a job which eventually will qualify you to apply for PR

3.Learn to live with the existing system which frankly isn't that onerous.

[sbk]

Camerata has an excellent thread on PR here:

Camerata's guide to PR

[homegal]

I am going to try my luck in this very tedious process of getting PR here. However, I am stuck with a small obstacle. I am from Singapore and I am trying to get my certificate of no criminal conviction, which takes 2 weeks to process. How the Singapore police needs this one thing that is killing me!

"Documentary proof from the immigration authority requiring the certificate. (A print out of the application requirements is not acceptable.)"

I have been to the PR section at Suanplu and they say they do not issue such a document. I can't seem to reach the Singapore office in charge, so how in the world am I going to get this document. Anyone has any advise?

HELP!

[absolutelyBangkok]

Call your embassy. They will know which authority in Singapore is issuing that certificate.

The officers at Suan Plu have nothing to do with this.

Each country issues different certificates of no criminal record.

And don't forget to have it translated into Thai.

And you still have time until December 28 to submit your papers.

No worries if you don't have everything at hand. If they see your papers have a chance they allow you to add a missing document later.