Buddhist Monk And Skin Colour

[howtoescape]

Whilst watching a Buddhist monk on TV last night, i was surprised to hear the views/preachings he offered about skin colour.

He said that people with lighter skin were good in their previous life, hence why they were blessed with fair skin, he then went onto say that people in this life who are prejudice or rude toward darker skin people will thus come back with darker skin in their next life. Hence it would appear that he views dark skin as some kind of punishment.

He did mention climate as a factor in this, but was very vague about these factors, what he was saying would most certainly give someone with dark skin a inferiority complex, is this really the line that gets preached or was this guy a one off?

Maybe he is sponsored to spout this drivel by one of them whitening skin companies.

[TheDon]

Ive never heard of that before from a monk. But isnt there some crazy religion that also thinks that?

[lazeeboy]

Ive never heard of that before from a monk. But isnt there some crazy religion that also thinks that?

must make africans really bad people then

[YangYaiEric]

Whilst watching a Buddhist monk on TV last night, i was surprised to hear the views/preachings he offered about skin colour.

He said that people with lighter skin were good in their previous life, hence why they were blessed with fair skin, he then went onto say that people in this life who are prejudice or rude toward darker skin people will thus come back with darker skin in their next life. Hence it would appear that he views dark skin as some kind of punishment.

He did mention climate as a factor in this, but was very vague about these factors, what he was saying would most certainly give someone with dark skin a inferiority complex, is this really the line that gets preached or was this guy a one off?

Maybe he is sponsored to spout this drivel by one of them whitening skin companies.

What a load of Cods-Whallop! BTW what colour was the good monks skin?

[kiakaha]

He said that people with lighter skin were good in their previous life, hence why they were blessed with fair skin, he then went onto say that people in this life who are prejudice or rude toward darker skin people will thus come back with darker skin in their next life. Hence it would appear that he views dark skin as some kind of punishment.

Does that makes Zebras god ?

[bina]

:D

[mittheimp]

Presumably Buddha himself was quite dark skinned coming from India!

[mrtoad]

He said that people with lighter skin were good in their previous life, hence why they were blessed with fair skin, he then went onto say that people in this life who are prejudice or rude toward darker skin people will thus come back with darker skin in their next life. Hence it would appear that he views dark skin as some kind of punishment.

Does that makes Zebras god ?

I would assume that Albino's would be the closet to god.

[mbkudu]

If what the OP said is really what this monk said, then I would say the monk is a small minded, untraveled, uneducated person who needs to really think things out a bit more. This type of backward thinking makes me understand why many people worldwide are abandoning religion altogether.

Edited November 21, 2007 by mbkudu

[Big A]

What a prat!!

[mbkudu]

If one wished to hear the same claptrap, one could read the old preachings of white ministers from the US South on their interpretation of the plight of the poor negros. This is how old and outdated this type of thinking is.

[howtoescape]

must make africans really bad people then

He was saying there is good in all races just that in the last life they must have been bad.

It was on at about 9-10 o clock on some Thai channel so it must have had a decent audience.

I believe Glenn Hoddle lost his job as England Manager by saying something similar about disabled people, which is meant to be a fairly accepted thought in whatever religion he supports.

[TheDon]

You should of asked him was Michael Jackson good or bad in his previous life

[sriracha john]

Whilst watching a Buddhist monk on TV last night, i was surprised to hear the views/preachings he offered about skin colour.

He said that people with lighter skin were good in their previous life, hence why they were blessed with fair skin, he then went onto say that people in this life who are prejudice or rude toward darker skin people will thus come back with darker skin in their next life. Hence it would appear that he views dark skin as some kind of punishment.

He did mention climate as a factor in this, but was very vague about these factors, what he was saying would most certainly give someone with dark skin a inferiority complex, is this really the line that gets preached or was this guy a one off?

Maybe he is sponsored to spout this drivel by one of them whitening skin companies.

must make africans really bad people then

He was saying there is good in all races just that in the last life they must have been bad.

It was on at about 9-10 o clock on some Thai channel so it must have had a decent audience.

I believe Glenn Hoddle lost his job as England Manager by saying something similar about disabled people, which is meant to be a fairly accepted thought in whatever religion he supports.

Who was it?

What was the channel?

Was he speaking in English or were there English sub-titles?

[goldfish]

is this really the line that gets preached or was this guy a one off?

Have listened to exactly the same, 'bout a year ago, on the buddhist channel. Can't recall if it was spoken english or sub-titled but Iwas rather unimpressed. Sincerely hope it was just one monks view and not a currently accepted view

[Stephen Cleary]

I was busy flicking through the channels Tuesday night but hasten to say that i didn't find any program with a monk preaching such a thing.

In fact, no monk ever did say such a thing on prime time TV on Tuesday 9-10.

In fact, it is just the kinda thing a Farang would make up, and he obviously did.

What was the point in making up this nonsense thread? Were you just trying to stir even more animosity?

[goldfish]

I was busy flicking through the channels Tuesday night but hasten to say that i didn't find any program with a monk preaching such a thing.

In fact, no monk ever did say such a thing on prime time TV on Tuesday 9-10.

In fact, it is just the kinda thing a Farang would make up, and he obviously did.

What was the point in making up this nonsense thread? Were you just trying to stir even more animosity?

Have listened to exactly the same, 'bout a year ago, on the buddhist channel. Can't recall if it was spoken english or sub-titled but Iwas rather unimpressed. Sincerely hope it was just one monks view and not a currently accepted view

[tom yum goong]

In fact, it is just the kinda thing a Farang would make up, and he obviously did.

What was the point in making up this nonsense thread? Were you just trying to stir even more animosity?

I'm sad to say that this nonsense isn't made up. You can find similar rubbish in books on buddhism in any Thai book store. I know because my girlfriend reads this stuff . According to the Thai version of "buddhism" , you are born fair skinned, beautiful, rich, clever etc. because you have accumulated good karma in your previous life. Conversely, if you are ugly, disabled, poor or unfortunate in any other way such as having dark skin, then you deserve it because of the karma carried over from your past life.

This is Thai buddhism 101. If you think this is nonsense then you clearly know very little about this country and its culture.

[Stephen Cleary]

In fact, it is just the kinda thing a Farang would make up, and he obviously did.

What was the point in making up this nonsense thread? Were you just trying to stir even more animosity?

I'm sad to say that this nonsense isn't made up. You can find similar rubbish in books on buddhism in any Thai book store. I know because my girlfriend reads this stuff . According to the Thai version of "buddhism" , you are born fair skinned, beautiful, rich, clever etc. because you have accumulated good karma in your previous life. Conversely, if you are ugly, disabled, poor or unfortunate in any other way such as having dark skin, then you deserve it because of the karma carried over from your past life.

This is Thai buddhism 101. If you think this is nonsense then you clearly know very little about this country and its culture.

Well, i used to be a Buddhist monk! So, i would agree that i know very little about Thai Buddhism.

As a professional translator of Thai>Eng, i don't need a girlfriend to explain the contents of some Thai Buddhism book

As for knowing little about Thailand and her culture etc..... well, previous to coming here 14 years ago, i graduated in Thai Studies.

Edited November 22, 2007 by Stephen Cleary

[meadish_sweetball]

I honestly don't know how widespread these beliefs are, hopefully not very - but some googling in Thai on กรรม "karma" and ผิวดำ "black skin" confirms that they do exist. I read Thai ok but quite slowly, so I don't have time to do any further research.

Just as mentioned in the OP, there is an article on the following two websites that says skin colour is an effect of many factors, one being environment, and the other being karma from your past life/lives. The first website seems to be associated with the Dhammakaya.

The second website is a discussion forum where the same type of reasoning about people who are soon to anger being born with a dark skin colour, and that those who mock or look down on people with dark skin will be reborn in a body with such skin as a type of punishment.

http://www.dmc.tv/pages/casestudy/2549-03-18.html

http://larndham.net/index.php?showtopic=26926

They may just be fringe sect beliefs such as those put forward by various Christian sects in the West - I can't say for sure.

[tom yum goong]

i speak Thai, read Thai, am half Thai and was born in Thailand. i don't need my girlfriend to translate books on buddhism for me either.

i think you should do a little more research on the country you obviously have a keen interest in. i'm not saying that the belief specifically about skin colour is part of buddhist doctrine, but it is taught by many buddhist monks and can be found in many books on buddhism in Thailand. i don't claim this belief is necessarily mainstream but i've certainly encountered it more than a few times.

i repeat again, definitely not made up.

[tom yum goong]

ok just found the name of a series of books which definately mentions the stuff about skin color. the series is called เตรียมสเบียงไว้เลี้ยงตัว by ดังตฤน . This is available in most Thai book stores such as Se-ed and B2S. there are 11 books in the series so i'm not going to sift through and find a quote

[meadish_sweetball]

I should add that only a few days ago I had a long conversation with a Buddhist monk, and he said that regardless of folk beliefs, the important message put forward by the Buddha was that each person has the ability to start changing what he or she does not like about their situation, at any given moment.

In other words, whatever influence karma from past lives and experiences there may be, it is not as relevant as one's efforts to work on self-improvement.

[Stephen Cleary]

ok just found the name of a series of books which definately mentions the stuff about skin color. the series is called เตรียมสเบียงไว้เลี้ยงตัว by ดังตฤน . This is available in most Thai book stores such as Se-ed and B2S. there are 11 books in the series so i'm not going to sift through and find a quote

By quite amazing co-incidence, that book was mentioned in the very first comment in one of the two links which Meadish Sweetball gave. The guy in that comment also wrote that he wasn't sure which book of the series it was stated!

Going on from what Meadish wrote, that is the kinda though, what the Dhammakaya sect would teach. They also teach their disciples that during World War 2, it was only through the meditation powers of their monks that America nuked Hiroshima instead of Bangkok. And not forgetting, their nuns were witnessed levitating in the sky while the bombs dropped around Wat Dhammakaya. As for their founder 'Luang Phor Pak Nam', he is the Thai equivalent to the miracle man fraud of India 'Sai Baba'.

Again though, further to what Meadish wrote, this kind of belief is more of a fringe sect belief than mainstream Thai Buddhism. Same kinda crap you'll find in Christian sects.

Edited November 22, 2007 by Stephen Cleary

[007]

Whilst watching a Buddhist monk on TV last night, i was surprised to hear the views/preachings he offered about skin colour.

He said that people with lighter skin were good in their previous life, hence why they were blessed with fair skin, he then went onto say that people in this life who are prejudice or rude toward darker skin people will thus come back with darker skin in their next life...

So Africans were really bad people in their previous life? I'm always stunned how Thais interpret the teachings of Buddha.

Only a few years ago I used to 'wai' Buddhist monks, being a Buddhist myself. But since I'm being called names for having a (very) slight sun tan (having lived in Thailand for five years), I don't do that anymore. Also, where in Buddha's teachings can you find that monks should have fat bank accounts, walk around with a walkman, go shopping at the mall, or take a taxi in order to travel even short distances? Well, I guess, Thai monks know as much about Buddhism as I do about the dark age...

[sriracha john]

I was busy flicking through the channels Tuesday night but hasten to say that i didn't find any program with a monk preaching such a thing.

In fact, no monk ever did say such a thing on prime time TV on Tuesday 9-10.

In fact, it is just the kinda thing a Farang would make up, and he obviously did.

What was the point in making up this nonsense thread? Were you just trying to stir even more animosity?

Have listened to exactly the same, 'bout a year ago, on the buddhist channel. Can't recall if it was spoken english or sub-titled but Iwas rather unimpressed. Sincerely hope it was just one monks view and not a currently accepted view

There is no such thing as "the buddhist channel."

Do you mean the DMC Channel?

[meadish_sweetball]

So Africans were really bad people in their previous life? I'm always stunned how Thais interpret the teachings of Buddha.

I don't think it's been established that this skin colour thing is a Thai consensus view, only that it exists.

Also, where in Buddha's teachings can you find that monks should have fat bank accounts, walk around with a walkman, go shopping at the mall, or take a taxi in order to travel even short distances? Well, I guess, Thai monks know as much about Buddhism as I do about the dark age...

A bit off topic, don't you think?

That's been debated quite a few times (check the Buddhism forum). Today's society is not quite the same as it was during Gautama Buddha's time. Many of the younger people in saffron robes are not monks by conviction but by necessity, so it is not all that easy for abbots and senior monks to stop them from breaking the rules.

Imagine yourself going through puberty in saffron robes and living by the quite strict rules required by monastic discipline. How well would you have managed?

Have you ever heard a Thai say they support monks doing these things? I haven't. Most seem to be quite upset by it.

Monks will be offered cash and other types of gifts by lay people, who believe it brings them merit. As I understand it, monks are not allowed to refuse gifts either, so I think it's fair to say it puts them in a difficult position even though some obviously abuse their standing.

[tom yum goong]

Going on from what Meadish wrote, that is the kinda though, what the Dhammakaya sect would teach. They also teach their disciples that during World War 2, it was only through the meditation powers of their monks that America nuked Hiroshima instead of Bangkok. And not forgetting, their nuns were witnessed levitating in the sky while the bombs dropped around Wat Dhammakaya. As for their founder 'Luang Phor Pak Nam', he is the Thai equivalent to the miracle man fraud of India 'Sai Baba'.

Again though, further to what Meadish wrote, this kind of belief is more of a fringe sect belief than mainstream Thai Buddhism. Same kinda crap you'll find in Christian sects.

While i wont disagree that Dhammakaya teaches a load of weird nonsense, i'm pretty sure that the belief of skin colour from karma is not restricted to that sect, if it can be attributed to them at all.

Buddhism (in Thailand) teaches that you are rewarded in this life for the merit you made in your past life, or punished for your misdeeds. If that is a given, then the fact that you are born poor, disabled or ugly can be attributed to your bad karma. Is it so hard to believe that many Thais, with their constant obsession with skin color, would believe that undesirable dark skin is also due to karma?

I'm even more sad to say that there are definitely a lot weirder beliefs than this that are quite mainstream in Thailand.

Edited November 22, 2007 by tom yum goong

[007]

Many of the younger people in saffron robes are not monks by conviction but by necessity, so it is not all that easy for abbots and senior monks to stop them from breaking the rules.

Imagine yourself going through puberty in saffron robes and living by the quite strict rules required by monastic discipline. How well would you have managed?

I saw quite a few monks who weren't teenagers anymore, but (probably) had been monks for many years - shopping at Big C and 7-Eleven, travelling by taxi, etc. etc.

Edited November 22, 2007 by 7

[naka]

Presumably Buddha himself was quite dark skinned coming from India!

I would guess he was unaware of that fact

Naka.