To Get Involved Or Not To Get Involved?

[mearkat75]

Its crazy the amount of young(usually Swedish or english) girls who goto Phangan/Samui etc and fall for the beach boys.

it's true! it usually is swedish or english girls! and the occasional german! strange!

im half Swedish/English.im buggered then arent i? is that why im stuck in South Thailand with a Thai boy ?

[bina]

mearkat: could be worse: u could be stuck with a tel aviv stud, since that same combo in girls here seems to make these girls go after the 19 yr old guys in uniforms here...... i've warned my boy to steer clear... )) (at the moment its the american teens that are here for school overseas programs that he is wooing every thursday night)... as girlx i think put it, a lot of mixed cultural signals: type of dress, actions, talking, even size (some of these 16 yr olds look 30 at least)...

but then again, imagine us, working in a small town tourist area: its not the 'boy/girl next door, its new fun imported different...

bina

[isabelle17]

I know that this is just the way it is, but it makes me sad thinking about it and the extremes that people will take just to get out of that situation.

Lets not pull out the violins for them just yet . Free booze, free drugs, free boom boom, party every night - it's not exactly scavenging on rubbish dumps in Calcutta

Ahaha. Yeah thats true. But I actually was thinking more about the kids who's poor families put them in charge to earn money for the rest of the family so they dont have a chance to get an education, decent job, etc. I wasnt actually really talking about the beach boys...I probably should have been more clear about that! (sorry that last line was probably confusing and thats just what I started thinking about randomely...)

Yeah...they tend to have this idea that girls from the west, especially america, in my case, are all like what you see in the movies. Sexy, easy, and carefree. Of course...I have to admit that compared to the good thai girls, in thai standards...westerner women are kind of...easy. But we wouldnt be considered that way in our home countries.

I think the whole "rushing to get married thing" is generally just a Thai thing. I know that with my boyfriend I had to put on the brakes and say "No...I am not ready to get married yet." That is the ONE thing that irritates me so much about Thai culture is the emphasis they put on getting married and having children. I know this is a little off topic, but does anyone happen to really know WHY they put so much emphasis on that? If the family is poor, wouldnt they want to have less children so that they can have more money to raise the rest of the family? Im pretty sure this is a common thing in a lot of countries, not just Thailand, but...it's something I can never really understand. But I guess thats because I come from America, where being independent is really important and children and marriage arent usually a top priority, at least not until much later in life.

Someone should write a survival handbook for women who go to Thailand....

[mssabai]

Its crazy the amount of young(usually Swedish or english) girls who goto Phangan/Samui etc and fall for the beach boys.

it's true! it usually is swedish or english girls! and the occasional german! strange!

im half Swedish/English.im buggered then arent i? is that why im stuck in South Thailand with a Thai boy ?

Ha ha ha, yep. Where do you live?

But really I think the only reason that it is mainly english and swedish girls is that these are the two nationalities you tend to meet most in the areas of Thailand where beach boys tend to congregate. Both are very well travelled nations. Don't think it is any more mysterious than that.

[Boo]

Don't think it is any more mysterious than that.

Agreed, they have more financial & social freedom than southern europeans for example who tend to be quite strict & controlling on the upbriging & freedoms given to young girls & young women. You rarely see italian or spanish women travelling alone in asia to the same extent as you would UK/german/swedish girls, in fact in all my years I have never met one of these women travelling alone, only as a couple or in a large family group. Whereas UK, northern europeans are all over the place.

American women are also not so prevailant I think due to the massive travel hours that getting from US to Thailand takes. I think sbk mentioned it took 40+ hrs her last trip to get from door to door, our 14hrs from Europe is peanuts in comparision.

[mssabai]

but then again, imagine us, working in a small town tourist area: its not the 'boy/girl next door, its new fun imported different...

bina

Yep and how many people have had holiday romances and enjoyed them (ahhh, Christophe from Paris )? In the UK we have the club reps phenomenem. Tour guides who are assigned to groups on 18-30 the holidays with the mission of helping them have a good a time as possible (and yes that involves doing pretty much everything). There was a very entertaining show about them on UK TV. Anyway, same scenario basically - people who's job is living in a holiday/good time bubble permanently seems to turn them into less than savoury members of society

The only thing that sucks is that I moved here not because of a man, or because I wanted the holiday lifestyle, but because of an amazing job opportunity. Trying to work out how to have a normal life is la la land is tricky....

[GuestHouse]

I know this is a little off topic, but does anyone happen to really know WHY they put so much emphasis on that? If the family is poor, wouldnt they want to have less children so that they can have more money to raise the rest of the family? Im pretty sure this is a common thing in a lot of countries, not just Thailand, but...it's something I can never really understand. But I guess thats because I come from America, where being independent is really important and children and marriage arent usually a top priority, at least not until much later in life.

There are two specific issues that create a difference in attitudes to having children.

1. Ecconomics - There is no welfare system in Thailand, added to which Thais are much closer to their agricultaral roots than in the west. There is an ecconomic imperative to have children and have them early. Fistly so they can provide for their parents as they enter old age and secondly because that agricultral work which is setting the context of the expectation is work that very few can do effectively past their mid 40s/50s. The need is for kids to take over providing for the family.

2. Family v Individual. Thais are raised in a family centered society (as against an individualist society), they define themselves as members of their family in a far more deeply rooted sense than we in the west define ourselves in the (relatively modern) individual sense. A look at the way in which Thai language provides detailed and very specific titles to 'Family' members gives an idea of the importance of family and being in the family group. So just as you feel hemmed in by having your individuality challenged, a Thai will feel isolated without family - Hence urge for early marriage and children.

[mssabai]

For anyone who was following this amusing little drama I have an update.....

I by complete chance ended up meeting one of the swedish girls involved - a friend of the girl trying to get pregnant. She actually seemed like quite a mature girl so I thought perhaps I should try and talk with her about he fact that her friend (and all of them) may be rushing into things. I tried to do this as diplomatically and non-gossipy as possible, saying that I thought it was a good idea for them all to wait a while longer, keep there ears and eyes open as SOME Thai men were not always what they seemed. She of course then asked me if I knew anything specific about any of the ones they were with and I went against my best sister instincts by saying no...but that no boys who work on a beach can be considered saints.

So anyway, she seemed to take on board what I was saying and said that she would talk again to her friend about waiting a while longer. Then she says, "well who knows, I may be pregnant as well - we don't use anything". ANYTHING? I said what not ONE thing? "No" she says "I can't take the pill and he says he doesn't like condoms, but it's OK because I don't think I can get pregnant". "errrm, why is that" I say "because I am 21 and haven't been pregnant yet". At this point I realised the entire conversation was pointless and that every one who was saying they really are just stupid girls and deserve what was coming to them was right. I pity the poor mothers who are going to have to deal with the inevitable fall outs of these doomed relationships. I have learnt my lesson and will never get concerned again about a situation like this - I think they all deserve each other!

[isabelle17]

For anyone who was following this amusing little drama I have an update.....

I by complete chance ended up meeting one of the swedish girls involved - a friend of the girl trying to get pregnant. She actually seemed like quite a mature girl so I thought perhaps I should try and talk with her about he fact that her friend (and all of them) may be rushing into things. I tried to do this as diplomatically and non-gossipy as possible, saying that I thought it was a good idea for them all to wait a while longer, keep there ears and eyes open as SOME Thai men were not always what they seemed. She of course then asked me if I knew anything specific about any of the ones they were with and I went against my best sister instincts by saying no...but that no boys who work on a beach can be considered saints.

So anyway, she seemed to take on board what I was saying and said that she would talk again to her friend about waiting a while longer. Then she says, "well who knows, I may be pregnant as well - we don't use anything". ANYTHING? I said what not ONE thing? "No" she says "I can't take the pill and he says he doesn't like condoms, but it's OK because I don't think I can get pregnant". "errrm, why is that" I say "because I am 21 and haven't been pregnant yet". At this point I realised the entire conversation was pointless and that every one who was saying they really are just stupid girls and deserve what was coming to them was right. I pity the poor mothers who are going to have to deal with the inevitable fall outs of these doomed relationships. I have learnt my lesson and will never get concerned again about a situation like this - I think they all deserve each other!

Is that girls boyfriend trying to get her pregnant as well?? She's crazy...

Its one thing to have a relationship with someone, its another thing to have a baby with someone....

Sounds like no one will be able to help them. They will just have to learn it the hard way, eh? Good job on trying to give some advice. At least you know now that they aren't worth trying to "save" as they are going to get into some sort of trouble anyway.

[HomeisThai]

Do they realise there are diseases they can catch without protection too, esp HIV

Jeeeez

[rainx]

Soooo, it goes like this. I have a friend who works in a bungalow and bar in Koh Phangan. I go down and see her occasionally as my favourite dog lives there (sad I know). I like to catch up on the gossip when I am down there. The boys on that beach are pretty wild and it keeps me entertained hearing about their latest escapades. So I went down last week for a catch up. My friend got onto the subject of three swedish girls who had been there for a while - all of whom were dating boys (and yes they really are boys) who worked there. The longest relationship out of them all is 2 months...the oldest girl involved is about 22. You get the picture. So I have now been told that all 3 couples are planning on getting married so the boys can all get to Sweden. Of course I creased up when I heard this, until I heard that the youngest girl (19) has been trying for a baby, and that her boyfriend has been verbally abusing her about the fact that she has not got pregnant yet. Whhhhhaaaaaaaa?????? Now I know beach boys/ bar boys. I know what they get up to and what their ultimate aims are but for some reason this story is really upsetting me. I am not involved, I don't know these girls personally, but I feel like there is no one telling them that they are being ridiculous. I feel most for the youngest girl - she is obviously both completely immature and completely hoodwinked. There are no other people staying there who will get involved and her friends are the ones getting married so are in no position to help.

I feel helpless, I think if I got involved then it wouldn't be appreciated or listened to, but I feel like this girl might very well end up pregnant and married by the end of the month. Is there anything I can do to help or does she just have to learn the hard way? When should you or should you not get involved in situations you see like this?

Goodness. Is Thailand a Mecca of international idiots or what?

No offense to blonds, but for some reason as I read the story I kept picturing three blondes.

[rainx]

Anyway, I just want to say I totally agree with what you say. And very true. The only way to get out of the rut they get stuck in is to quit working on the beach. Gosh. This gets me to thinking how I think its so unfair that so much of the world population has to be poor. I know that this is just the way it is, but it makes me sad thinking about it and the extremes that people will take just to get out of that situation.

Agreed. Thinking about it makes me sad too.

[girlx]

Do they realise there are diseases they can catch without protection too, esp HIV

seriously... the latest on my beach is one of the newer bar boys (who is 18), cheated on his english girlfriend and she acquired HPV(!), gonohrrea, and chlamydia all at once from him. so off she went back to england in a huff. next night he picked up a new english "girl", who is 33! (this boy's mother is only 39). she is a stripper in england, quite rough actually, and after 4 days she declared her undying love for him, went back to england to sell up, and plans to come right back here to live with him (never mind the fact that he moved on as soon as she jumped on the taxi to leave). i know they did not use protection together either, but there are so many things wrong with that situation, the mind boggles. ... there is a certain type of girl who comes here and goes down a totally destructive path, i don't know if it is ignorance or low self esteem or ???. i have been one of them to some extent, but i consider myself intelligent enough to not get pregnant or married, and the first thing i did with my thai bfs was to get them tested for STDs. if these girls didn't exist we would all be bored without the drama on the beach, but i do feel sad for them!

[NALAK]

sounds to me they came here with the intention of looking for sex with locals. as sex tourist they deserve all they get. you can bet they are paying money to the guys one way or another.

[BigSnake]

MYOB

[girlx]

sounds to me they came here with the intention of looking for sex with locals. as sex tourist they deserve all they get. you can bet they are paying money to the guys one way or another.

actually you are wrong about that. these thai guys do not need the money at all. not nice to assume.

[hammockwoman]

it occurs to me that one thing you could do (before, anyway, since you've already had a conversation and realized these girls are entirely clueless in general) is to tell them "hey, there are some really interesting discussions about farang women falling for thai beach boys on the thiavisa site that you might want to check out to hear some stories from women with a whole lot of experience about how to handle the cultural differences" and let them come read on their own and draw their own conclusions.

i'm older, and not naive in the least, and in my year living on kho phangan, my romance was actually with an african guy (it was a great adventure while it lasted)... thai guys aren't usually attracted, or attractive, to me really. i do have a very very dear thai guy friend of many years who i plan to share a place with when i move back over there, thogh, who travels with me now when i visit every six months.

but on my last trip, i had an brief experience with a rasta bar guy that was remarkable... he pursued me with great intention, perhaps because he just likes my look and style, who knows... it was intense and delightful, and i'll be returning there and will see him again... but reading what some of you women have shared here made me take a cooler-head look at it, and made me remember what i already know about rasta bar guys who spend time with farang women that i had temporarily forgotten, for which i thank you. i'm really not interested in any thai-style relationship drama at all. not worth it.

[sbk]

it occurs to me that one thing you could do (before, anyway, since you've already had a conversation and realized these girls are entirely clueless in general) is to tell them "hey, there are some really interesting discussions about farang women falling for thai beach boys on the thiavisa site that you might want to check out to hear some stories from women with a whole lot of experience about how to handle the cultural differences" and let them come read on their own and draw their own conclusions.

Good advice, keeps her out of it, at least gives them the opportunity to be informed.

i'm older, and not naive in the least, and in my year living on kho phangan, my romance was actually with an african guy (it was a great adventure while it lasted)... thai guys aren't usually attracted, or attractive, to me really. i do have a very very dear thai guy friend of many years who i plan to share a place with when i move back over there, thogh, who travels with me now when i visit every six months.

but on my last trip, i had an brief experience with a rasta bar guy that was remarkable... he pursued me with great intention, perhaps because he just likes my look and style, who knows... it was intense and delightful, and i'll be returning there and will see him again... but reading what some of you women have shared here made me take a cooler-head look at it, and made me remember what i already know about rasta bar guys who spend time with farang women that i had temporarily forgotten, for which i thank you. i'm really not interested in any thai-style relationship drama at all. not worth it.

Easy to get bowled over when pursued aggressively, as the guys here can well attest. Just remember to use your head

[girlx]

it occurs to me that one thing you could do (before, anyway, since you've already had a conversation and realized these girls are entirely clueless in general) is to tell them "hey, there are some really interesting discussions about farang women falling for thai beach boys on the thiavisa site that you might want to check out to hear some stories from women with a whole lot of experience about how to handle the cultural differences" and let them come read on their own and draw their own conclusions.

this is what i would do too but even that can get you in trouble if the locals found out.

just the other day my good friend and i were talking to some newbie swedish girls. they asked a perfectly innocent question about how old the thai people around were- so we went down the list saying "so and so is 18, so and so 31, etc."... turns out a couple of the beach boys had lied to them about their age. these beach boys went screaming in to my friend's boyfriend telling him if she didn't keep her mouth shut she was going to have big problems. how petty and stupid is that?! now we are expected to back up their lies even if we don't know they are lying! pathetic people, some of them. in this case it doesn't even have to do with thai culture, just the stupidity and power trips that certain people will pull on you... you have to be careful.

[BigSnake]

Soooo, it goes like this. I have a friend who works in a bungalow and bar in Koh Phangan. I go down and see her occasionally as my favourite dog lives there (sad I know). I like to catch up on the gossip when I am down there. The boys on that beach are pretty wild and it keeps me entertained hearing about their latest escapades. So I went down last week for a catch up. My friend got onto the subject of three swedish girls who had been there for a while - all of whom were dating boys (and yes they really are boys) who worked there. The longest relationship out of them all is 2 months...the oldest girl involved is about 22. You get the picture. So I have now been told that all 3 couples are planning on getting married so the boys can all get to Sweden. Of course I creased up when I heard this, until I heard that the youngest girl (19) has been trying for a baby, and that her boyfriend has been verbally abusing her about the fact that she has not got pregnant yet. Whhhhhaaaaaaaa?????? Now I know beach boys/ bar boys. I know what they get up to and what their ultimate aims are but for some reason this story is really upsetting me. I am not involved, I don't know these girls personally, but I feel like there is no one telling them that they are being ridiculous. I feel most for the youngest girl - she is obviously both completely immature and completely hoodwinked. There are no other people staying there who will get involved and her friends are the ones getting married so are in no position to help.

I feel helpless, I think if I got involved then it wouldn't be appreciated or listened to, but I feel like this girl might very well end up pregnant and married by the end of the month. Is there anything I can do to help or does she just have to learn the hard way? When should you or should you not get involved in situations you see like this?

stay out of it

[hammockwoman]

yes, girlx, i definitely agree you have to be aware about how it looks to locals. that's why i think telling them about an interesting website is safer than trying to give any direct advice.

and sbk, i will keep my head, no worries, i don't get swept away easily, and i know my own boundaries. i'm not a backpacker passing through and he knows that, and we've had some honest conversations about me not being some chick looking for a fling. my desire to have a good relationship with the people in the area supercedes any interest in a hot guy, and i won't fool around with someone and risk my reputation. in the states, i could care less but the rules are different here. but in thailand? it's not worth it to me. he would have to prove himself in many ways before i'd go for it.

though he is lovely.... sigh ;^)

[wanderer9020]

wahts the problem with Thai beach boy.Just because she is Swiss, it doesnt make her a saint not to be screwed by just a Thai Boy.They might be inlove together, and comeon, not unless the girl is 7 year old, I guess she knows what her up to. Hmmm maybe, the Thai beach boy is really better than the Swiss or the farang that all of us is expecting?(i mean in bed)...

[mssabai]

Quick update...seems that I shouldn't have even worried so much....I think a higher authority stepped in. The girl in question ended up getting pregnant and then proceeded to have a miscarriage. She has now accepted that it isn't meant to be and from all accounts the baby quest is over. Poor girl is going to have some very bad memories from her gap year trip...as well as a heafty bill from the Bangkok Inter on Samui.

[piyush]

so sad to get aware of this.

Edited April 5, 2008 by piyush