Entering Monkhood And Celebration

[geriatrickid]

Question: What is the local custom in respect to the celebration (i.e. party) before entering the monkhood?

I did a TV search and couldn't get the specific answer. This is not a religion question so I can't put it in there and this relates specifically to Isaan. We have a friend that is waiting on his wat in Isaan to go be a monk. Apparently there is some sort of reception and ceremony prior to entering. The cost I was told was 30-50,000 Bh

My non Isaan friends have different opinions, particularly since it involves an Isaan person. I reckon if it's a legit cost then I should contribute. In the 2 years we've been friends he's never asked for money and I have never given him any either. He didn't ask for money for this event either. However, since he's been really good to me over the years and is sort of close, I reckon it's the least I can do. The questions then are;

1. Is there really a reception?

2. Is this an accurate cost? (My friends said, they'll probably just go get a soi dog and eat that, so don't worry. There were other crueler comments too. These comments should explain why my Thai friends are of no help in this matter, and he is the only guy I know from Isaan.)

3. Is this in part a forced gift to the wat, along the lines of those old european church indulgences?

He makes a relatively good salary from his job as a construction manager in Bangers and isn't impverished, but isn't rich either.

To be blunt, 10, 15 or 20K is nothing for me. My western friends and I are generous with each other so if my Isaan friend was one of my dawgs, it'd be a no brainer. This being Thailand, I have learnt to ask first, even though I'm so going to get nailed on this one. I just want to do the right thing for someone that's been there for me.

[sezzo]

3 of my wifes family members all entered for their one weeks work of monkhood a few years back. Apparently its something they are obliged to do once in their life to gain merit. There was a big party that went on for a couple of days at the mother in laws place. We had family coming from all parts of Thailand so obviously it is important part of their lives.

Not sure about the cost altogether but Im sure I contributed about 5 - 10 k baht for the food, grog, etc. When they eventually did the trip to the temple there were pickups full of presents for the monks. ie. pillows, food, etc. These presents were from other distant family members as contribution to the entering the monkhood. All people attending the party will usually give a donation towards the cost of the party which is customary.

Hopefully this has been some help but its been a while since this particular occasion.

[JohnC]

Friend entered in his home temple in Pratchunburi last month , cost for the 2 day event was in the region of 80 - 100, 000 baht. There was a party the day before with procession round the town, an evening big party with dancers, food whiskey etc , all those attending contributed to this. Then on the day there was a ceremony and food etc plus presentations to the monks. Have not seen the final bill but the figure given was an estimate from those organising and paying.

Edited April 10, 2008 by JohnC

[Boo]

My friends said, they'll probably just go get a soi dog and eat that, so don't worry. There were other crueler comments too. These comments should explain why my Thai friends are of no help in this matter,

Dunno about cost but you might want to see about getting less ignorant friends

[Boo]

ok serious answer, if he hasn't asked for any money then why are you thinking about contributing such a large amount?

If you have been invited to the festivities then put 1-3k baht in an envelope & give it to him when you are there. That is normal in my experience, same for weddinngs too. IMO You may just insult him by trying to stump up such a large amount without his asking or presuming that he needs your help in paying for this. If he has a good job & can clearly afford to pay for it himself (& as he hasn't asked you to cover the cost then one has to assume he can) then why do you assume you need to pay anything more than a token amount the same as evreyone else who will attend?. Most families who do this make back the amount they paid for the party & sometimes even come out with a profit as everyone donates something towards the cost when they come to the party so imo, no don't offend this friend by presuming he wants your money or else ask him if he needs help in covering the cost & let him tell you himself

[MISTERBONK]

It is Thai custom and it's usually expensive! And for just 7/10 days! Contributions to a funeral/wedding are a different matter as they are usually/intended to be for ever.

If the man and his family believe this is making merit (ie procuring a better life next time) - hokus pokus! then let them pay themselves. Why should everyone else be expected to chip in? Might be a bit different if he were going to be a Monk forever, as he would be if in the West.

Most young men cannot wait for release day after 7/10 days and will then be off to town asap drinking and womanising as before.

[ronthompson]

I have been to several of these parties and they are all really big, They seem to be larger in scope to the first post or new house parties. A few have been really big catered, stage shows, parades and many gifts to the Wat. What ever the family can afford seems to be the price tag. The bigger the party the more u put in the envelope. Most Thai in Issan do not have the money to put a large sum in the envelope.

If he is a good friend just tell him u would like to help him and what would he prefer from u financial support, a pig or 2 or even beer or whiskey; You will have a chance to help cut his hair.

The propose of the party is for him to have as easier journey into the next life. Now I am NOT an expert but I have been to many going to be a monk parties and this is from my observation and discussion with my wife.

IMHO: I would wonder about some of your friends, It is your money so spend it to make u happy, thats why u worked.

[rgs2001uk]

i will answer your questions one at a time.

1. yes there really is a reception.

2. the cheapest i have heard of is 15,000 baht, this will become clearer with the next answer.

3. depending on which wat your friend goes to will depend on the cost.

a lot of these (nen) apprentice monks are given a list of things they will be required to buy (depending on the temple these things will be bought from the temple) such as 3 robes, sandals etc etc. there will also

be a donation to the temple.

most of the time these ceromonies are more about face than any spiritual benefit,its all about who can

throw the biggest party, ironically its those who can least afford it. usually these people areputting

themselves into debt than can take years to pay off.

then there is the temple itself, a lot of these temples have bad reputations amongst ordinary thais, some

are seen as no more than a front for money making ( but thats another topic in its own right).

i also see mention of alcohol (this is another topic, some temples turn a blind eye to it, others forbid it).

if i were you i would put a thousand baht in an envelope, the last one of these parties i was at was a

dignified experience, some others are more like a stag night, the type of event it is will be an indication

of the place in thai society of the person involved.

[prakhonchai nick]

most of the time these ceremonies are more about face than any spiritual benefit,its all about who can

throw the biggest party, ironically its those who can least afford it. usually these people are putting

themselves into debt than can take years to pay off.

.

Sadly most of the parties/ceremonies are only about gaining face, Everyone tries to outdo everyone else, regardless of whether they put themselves into debt.

Quite apart from every ceremony/party getting bigger, with bands. music. likkhae shows, each persons contribution is closely monitored, and if they gave for example 500bt to your family ceremony, regardless of whether it was a funeral, marriage, lucky home or entering the monkhood for a week you will be expected to increase the contribution by at least 10%. How one can expect the donation for a week-long monk interrment to exceed that of a death I cannot understand. But if you don't give more tongues will wag!

[geriatrickid]

Thank you for the responses. No way, I could ever have learned about all these intricacies unless people who have been there & done that had told me. I have a good handle on what I'll do when the time comes and will be able to avoid making an ass of myself.

[yourshoutmate]

if your friend is family or living in your village it will all be about face the amount you give should be up to you. i wish you were in my village i would go mong to 30 thou mai pen rai.

[bankei]

I ordained a few years ago and the whole thing ended up costing me a fortune. I think it was around 40,000 to 50,000B. There are various things you need to buy for yourself such as bowl, robes, hairbrush etc plus the monks participating expect donations - 2000B is the going rate for the preceptor. Generally people also make gifts to the monks at the ceremony (9 of them I think) - these are those little trays with toothpaste, towels etc and the ordinand's family usually organises the noon meal for a large number of monks too. Many Thai people also hire a band, maybe tent and chairs etc depending how many people are coming for the 'party'.

You will also need some money for the disrobing ceremony - eg. 5 monks with a donation of 200B each, flowers etc.

Bankei