Biodiesel - 4.5 Questions

[bentrein]

After the King's latest birthday, lots of news came out on Biodiesel. His Majesty had mentioned it in one of his speeches, I believe.

The news was that several police stations in Bangkok had started producing it...

My first question is: How good/bad is it? Many say, it's no better than normal diesel regarding Global Warming. Why is this? Because the way I see it, is that if it's produced from plants, theres a lot less total CO2 emission...

My second question is: What cars can, and what cars can't use it?

My third question is: Are these coppers still selling it? If so, which stations are?

My fourth question is: Is it financially interesting to use it?

The oridinal numbers are only so I can edit the subject...

[Crossy]

5% bio-diesel (B5) is available at PTT stations, it's about 70 Satang a litre cheaper than regular diesel, on a 70 litre fill the savings will buy me a cold Chang

No problems in unmodified engines, I've been putting it in the Ranger since our local outlet started selling. No problems, same performance and consumption. It's the one alternative fuel that really does save money

We have a chap who buys the used cooking oil from the restaurant (used to get it free until the local farmers sussed it would run the iron-buffalos), he filters it and bungs it straight in his ancient Nissan pickup (I think he mixes it with some diesel). Seems quite happy on the stuff although I'm not about to try it in my common-rail turbo. We change the cooking oil every day, so it's not picked up excessive water and bits of fish.

Edited June 23, 2008 by Crossy

[dave_boo]

After the King's latest birthday, lots of news came out on Biodiesel. His Majesty had mentioned it in one of his speeches, I believe.

The news was that several police stations in Bangkok had started producing it...

My first question is: How good/bad is it? Many say, it's no better than normal diesel regarding Global Warming. Why is this? Because the way I see it, is that if it's produced from plants, theres a lot less total CO2 emission...

You are correct. From a release of CO2 viewpoint, it is better than using petrol products. As you alluded to, the carbon being released is simply the carbon that was trapped a year or so ago. No net addition to this wonderful place we call Earth.

My second question is: What cars can, and what cars can't use it?

My third question is: Are these coppers still selling it? If so, which stations are?

My fourth question is: Is it financially interesting to use it?

The oridinal numbers are only so I can edit the subject...

[nakhonsi sean]

After the King's latest birthday, lots of news came out on Biodiesel. His Majesty had mentioned it in one of his speeches, I believe.

The news was that several police stations in Bangkok had started producing it...

My first question is: How good/bad is it? Many say, it's no better than normal diesel regarding Global Warming. Why is this? Because the way I see it, is that if it's produced from plants, theres a lot less total CO2 emission...

My second question is: What cars can, and what cars can't use it?

My third question is: Are these coppers still selling it? If so, which stations are?

My fourth question is: Is it financially interesting to use it?

The oridinal numbers are only so I can edit the subject...

1. Correct in theory. However, new studies are showing that it may actually be worse in the CO2 department. On small scale ok but if we were to produce large quantities for the planet the removal of forest cover needed for land to grow bio-fuel crops would release vast amounts of CO2. Wether this is a problem is debatable.

2. Almost any diesel car can use it. There are a couple of issues. Poorer quality hoses and seals in the fuel system may degrade and fail as bio-diesel is a very good solvent. Not a big problem, just replace when they start leaking. Some car manufacturers have not approved the use of bio-diesel with their cars, however this looks like they are just protecting themselves against warrenty claims. In cooler climates bio-diesel gels at much warmer temps. than petro-diesel so it is necessary to mix petrol/diesel/kerosene with it. When first using bio-diesel you need to keep checking the fuel filters as the new fuel has a tendency to clean out any filth in the system.

3. No idea

4. If you make it yourself there are huge savings and it is not that difficult, basic chemistry. If bought, well check the price difference.

[Badbanker]

Yes savings can be made recycling used oil of almost any kind and so basic chemistry and some good filters will turn any oil vegetable or mineral in usable fuel.

Crossy is very right to be wary of using anything but real diesel fuel in a common rail engine. A normal diesel engine has 200-300 psi in the fuel pump but a commonrail has 14,000 psi and will not work with thick oil. It will destroy itself and you will be looking for a 50-100k baht replacement commonrail and electronic pump! Be Very Careful!

Have a look at: http://www.veggies.org.uk/biodies.htm

BB

[dave_boo]

After the King's latest birthday, lots of news came out on Biodiesel. His Majesty had mentioned it in one of his speeches, I believe.

The news was that several police stations in Bangkok had started producing it...

My first question is: How good/bad is it? Many say, it's no better than normal diesel regarding Global Warming. Why is this? Because the way I see it, is that if it's produced from plants, theres a lot less total CO2 emission...

My second question is: What cars can, and what cars can't use it?

My third question is: Are these coppers still selling it? If so, which stations are?

My fourth question is: Is it financially interesting to use it?

The oridinal numbers are only so I can edit the subject...

1. Correct in theory. However, new studies are showing that it may actually be worse in the CO2 department. On small scale ok but if we were to produce large quantities for the planet the removal of forest cover needed for land to grow bio-fuel crops would release vast amounts of CO2. Wether this is a problem is debatable.

Those are rather pessimistic studies, in my opinion. Granted, requiring more bio-fuels will necessitate the use of more land.....using the crops that are currently expected to be converted. However, there are much better alternatives. Sawgrass for instance. Also, looking toward Brazil for an example, going with straight bio-fuel is a wrong answer unless you're willing to accept the ecological catastrophe that shall ensue (read deforestation on a huge scale) due to lack of proper planning by the government.

I have not seen the numbers, but I do believe that since forests are much better recyclers of CO2 than most crops we should work to expand the current growths through forward thinking rather than soiling our pants simply due to high fossil fuel prices and do something rash. Sorry I keep interjecting this information, but climate change is a major concern and I feel like there's a lot of rumours and innuendos on both sides of the debate so I attempt to pass on the information and observations I have made.

2. Almost any diesel car can use it. There are a couple of issues. Poorer quality hoses and seals in the fuel system may degrade and fail as bio-diesel is a very good solvent. Not a big problem, just replace when they start leaking. Some car manufacturers have not approved the use of bio-diesel with their cars, however this looks like they are just protecting themselves against warrenty claims. In cooler climates bio-diesel gels at much warmer temps. than petro-diesel so it is necessary to mix petrol/diesel/kerosene with it. When first using bio-diesel you need to keep checking the fuel filters as the new fuel has a tendency to clean out any filth in the system.

3. No idea

4. If you make it yourself there are huge savings and it is not that difficult, basic chemistry. If bought, well check the price difference.