PAD Lay Siege On Government House, NBT TV Station

[Colonel_Mustard]

If PAD wants to drive off all farangs as policy and blame us for the political situation,

how come when I go into a restaurant and the TV shows a PAS ralley

and staff AND boss are ALL glued to it, when I speak with the owner he is :

a ) More than happy to explain what's happening and enjoys my interest,

b ) Is not even slightly xenophobic and gives no hints of disliking my presence

c ) Is only showing interested in clean government and a fair shake for all.

d ) and the up country staff are happy to have a farang show interest too.

This all runs counter to the propaganda I see posted above.

Fear is a powerful tool. But fear can be counter acted by what you

actually see and feel on the ground with real people.

I assumed he was talking about the PAD leadership rather than some of their followers.

[h90]

Are the 'anti-PAD' ignoring the fact that the PPP should be disbanded by law?

Not ignoring it at all. However, they should be disbanded by LAW (not by mobs with no mandate) and then new elections should take place.

The PPP might wish to amend the constitution (as you state) for their own aims but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons.

The PAD get into action to stop the government to make their changes.

"but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons." that is a bit weird....the PAD is no party, don't want to get into power, does not stay in parliament...so which "same reasons"?

[h90]

If PAD wants to drive off all farangs as policy and blame us for the political situation,

how come when I go into a restaurant and the TV shows a PAS ralley

and staff AND boss are ALL glued to it, when I speak with the owner he is :

a ) More than happy to explain what's happening and enjoys my interest,

b ) Is not even slightly xenophobic and gives no hints of disliking my presence

c ) Is only showing interested in clean government and a fair shake for all.

d ) and the up country staff are happy to have a farang show interest too.

This all runs counter to the propaganda I see posted above.

Fear is a powerful tool. But fear can be counter acted by what you

actually see and feel on the ground with real people.

I assumed he was talking about the PAD leadership rather than some of their followers.

The leadership is as well not xenophobic in any way.

[Colonel_Mustard]

Are the 'anti-PAD' ignoring the fact that the PPP should be disbanded by law?

Not ignoring it at all. However, they should be disbanded by LAW (not by mobs with no mandate) and then new elections should take place.

The PPP might wish to amend the constitution (as you state) for their own aims but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons.

The PAD get into action to stop the government to make their changes.

"but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons." that is a bit weird....the PAD is no party, don't want to get into power, does not stay in parliament...so which "same reasons"?

To suit their vision of the future. As I said earlier their ideas cannot be brought about without changes to the constitution.

[Colonel_Mustard]

If PAD wants to drive off all farangs as policy and blame us for the political situation,

how come when I go into a restaurant and the TV shows a PAS ralley

and staff AND boss are ALL glued to it, when I speak with the owner he is :

a ) More than happy to explain what's happening and enjoys my interest,

b ) Is not even slightly xenophobic and gives no hints of disliking my presence

c ) Is only showing interested in clean government and a fair shake for all.

d ) and the up country staff are happy to have a farang show interest too.

This all runs counter to the propaganda I see posted above.

Fear is a powerful tool. But fear can be counter acted by what you

actually see and feel on the ground with real people.

I assumed he was talking about the PAD leadership rather than some of their followers.

The leadership is as well not xenophobic in any way.

I'm not totally convinced about that (and feel the same way about the PPP leadership too).

[h90]

Are the 'anti-PAD' ignoring the fact that the PPP should be disbanded by law?

Not ignoring it at all. However, they should be disbanded by LAW (not by mobs with no mandate) and then new elections should take place.

The PPP might wish to amend the constitution (as you state) for their own aims but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons.

The PAD get into action to stop the government to make their changes.

"but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons." that is a bit weird....the PAD is no party, don't want to get into power, does not stay in parliament...so which "same reasons"?

To suit their vision of the future. As I said earlier their ideas cannot be brought about without changes to the constitution.

yes their evil visions of elections without vote buying. Fresh politic without the dinosaurs buying their way out of the court all the time, a country without corruption and free media.....

As educated people also want that, you can see that hugh support

[onethailand]

The statement from students representing Chulalongkorn and Thammasat is most telling:

Students call on govt and PAD to quit

By The Nation

The National Institute of Development Administration (NIDA) yesterday issued an official statement advising the government to step down, while Chulalongkorn and Thammasat universities called on the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) to stop rallying.

According to the statement, students from NIDA's School of Social and Environmental Development are worried that there will be a repeat of the bloody October 14, 1973, and May, 1992 uprisings, and want the government to withdraw all police officers and do the responsible thing by resigning.

The statement also said the PAD should stop rallying after the government resigns, and has called on the media to report the news in a moral and balanced manner.

However, students from the two universities issued a statement condemning the PAD, saying that their protest was destroying democracy and that peaceful means were not being used.

All sides said they had issued the statements independently.

Thammasat students have been at the heart of most protests in the past. The fact that they are distancing themselves from this one is, in itself, a very strong signal.

[h90]

copy/paste from the Nation:

PM to be granted an audience with HM the King at 5pm Saturday

He will fly to Hua Hin and is scheduled to be granted an audience at 5pm to report the political tensions in the country.

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej is expected to be granted an audience with HM the King this afternoon.

Anti-government protesters have seized the Government House since Tuesday and police's uses of forces on the protesters on Friday added the tensions to the political atmosphere.

An informed source said that Samak failed to have an audience with HM the King earlier, so he is rescheduled this afternoon.

[ozterix]

list of charges against Taksin and Samak?

I am producing a blog in French relating this story and the background information, for my friends and family who can not read English, and I would like to list the 8 + 16 charges against thaksin and the others against samak as it looks like now they won't find any way out.

I searched the forum but could not find a list, only occasionally mentions of the list

could someone point me in the right direction?

thanks

oz

You might wish to include a list of charges that relate to PAD leaders too

I definitely will but that is a lot easier, it is repeated in this forum quite a lot. Taksin's case though is more difficult to group in one list as the charges as disseminated everywhere and they come up on occasions. I found the mention of 8 + 16 in many posts but not their list.

[Spee]

That's always seemed one of the major problems to me. The Military and the Police need to be subordinate to whatever form of parliament exists as the expression of democracy. Ranking military or police ought to be required to resign their commissions before they can become MPs.

This is so 100% right on the money.

On an aside note, why do the foreign media insist on reporting these events as a riot. There are protests to be sure. There are scuffles to be sure. But these things can hardly be called a riot. French hoodlums burning cars is a riot. Americans burning cities when King got killed is a riot.

The events in Bangkok and Phuket are mild and reserved in comparision. Let's hope the issues can be resolved without rioting. Let's hope that the constitution and democracy are maintained. And let's hope that one day there is a separation of power as Endure has suggested.

[animatic]

For one section of the community to prosper disproportionately and unfairly requires a large poor underclass to support their excesses. A poor underclass that must be kept in check by being kept poor and uneducated. Basically a feudal system founded on economic and political power over the poor underclass masses. Economic slavery by another name....

I have no doubt the elites would love to disenfrancise the rural poor voters and I believe it would be the end of the emerging democracy in Thailand if this were allowed to happen. It would merely strengthen their grip of political power over the peasant class.

That describes six years under TRT government very nicely, except they didn't disenfranchise the poor, they found the way to keep them under complete control. Or rather enough of them to keep TRT in power, to hel_l with all the rest, as per infamous Thaksin's remark right after the elections: "we will not provide funds to provinces that voted against TRT".

PAD wants to end this one way or another.

>>>>

Realistically, without suspending the constitution, the only way out is to dissolve the parlement and call for new elections. Replacing Samak with someone like Surapong won't change a thing.

Yesterday's meeting of coalition partners didn't produce any results, and there are no surprises there - they are not ready to go into elections yet, not enough funds to buy themselves back into power.

They, of course, haven't thought about what the country needs right now, but that's not unusual, is it?

>>>>

Thailand has fought against vote buying for ages and it hasn't got them anywhere.

What is needed is a complete structural reform that would remove the very need to buy votes.

Back in the 90s people voted for their local pooyais, no matter what party they belonged to. MPs, in turn, provided the voters with funds, infrastructure, roads etc to assure they won't lose the next elections. So we have Chart Thai lock on Suphanburi or Chidchobs on Buriram.

But WHY do these MPs need to be in Bangkok, legislating? Half the current parlament don't want to be here at all, they need to take care of their voters, not sit here and do nothing. They tried to get their hands on central government projects but they are prohibited by the current constution, they are in legislative, not executive branch.

For them running in local administrative elections is the best place to be, perhaps even running for governor, though it's completely against the tradition. Acc. to 97 constitution they should have enough funds in provincial budgets, a lot more than they can possible get now, up to 25% of all government budget.

Then came Thaksin and people would vote for him no matter whose name is on the ballot. That was a comlete swing from just a decade earlier (Thaksin, of course, has all the winning MPs in his pocket anyway, just to make sure).

Again, why would people vote for a local MP if they really want to vote for the national leader with a national agenda?

From that point of view, the national parlament and central government should be elected on "party list" results only. The criteria for party list candidates could be a lot stricter than now, especially for candidates for ministerial positions. Experience and clean history is a must.

That way people would know who they vote for to govern the country, right now Cabinet selection is completly closed process, devoid of any public input or scrutiny, and without any minimal requirements for position with enourmous responsibilities.

A setup like this will practically eliminate vote buying - MPs will be elected to do exactly what they want to and judged by the results, not

Plus, and excellent and very clear post.

[h90]

Is that strange:

Yesterday: Samak should have an audience with HM the King Friday and fly to Hua Hin.

Today: Samak is granted an audience today.

Now: quote from the Nation:

"Samak returns from Hua Hin

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej returned from Prachuap Khiri Khan Saturday morning.

He arrived at the Don Muang Military at 10 am.

The Nation"

that does not seem very logic, or does he fly in the evening again?

[Colonel_Mustard]

Are the 'anti-PAD' ignoring the fact that the PPP should be disbanded by law?

Not ignoring it at all. However, they should be disbanded by LAW (not by mobs with no mandate) and then new elections should take place.

The PPP might wish to amend the constitution (as you state) for their own aims but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons.

The PAD get into action to stop the government to make their changes.

"but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons." that is a bit weird....the PAD is no party, don't want to get into power, does not stay in parliament...so which "same reasons"?

To suit their vision of the future. As I said earlier their ideas cannot be brought about without changes to the constitution.

yes their evil visions of elections without vote buying. Fresh politic without the dinosaurs buying their way out of the court all the time, a country without corruption and free media.....

As educated people also want that, you can see that hugh support

I was thinking of more their idea that only 30% should be elected and their belief that the army should be allowed to intervene in politics.

[animatic]

That's always seemed one of the major problems to me. The Military and the Police need to be subordinate to whatever form of parliament exists as the expression of democracy. Ranking military or police ought to be required to resign their commissions before they can become MPs.

This is so 100% right on the money.

On an aside note, why do the foreign media insist on reporting these events as a riot. There are protests to be sure. There are scuffles to be sure. But these things can hardly be called a riot. French hoodlums burning cars is a riot. Americans burning cities when King got killed is a riot.

The events in Bangkok and Phuket are mild and reserved in comparision. Let's hope the issues can be resolved without rioting. Let's hope that the constitution and democracy are maintained. And let's hope that one day there is a separation of power as Endure has suggested.

Ditto.

I live through some REAL French riots, and a general strike or ten,

and forced busing riots in the USA this is not a riot.

Constitutional change through referendums is a legal tradtion.

PPP's trying to back door repeal reforms about vote buying and voter fraud

to save their butts from conviction, and retro active repeal of corruption acts

pertaining to their boss, is NOT a legal tradition by any stretch.

[animatic]

Are the 'anti-PAD' ignoring the fact that the PPP should be disbanded by law?

Not ignoring it at all. However, they should be disbanded by LAW (not by mobs with no mandate) and then new elections should take place.

The PPP might wish to amend the constitution (as you state) for their own aims but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons.

The PAD get into action to stop the government to make their changes.

"but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons." that is a bit weird....the PAD is no party, don't want to get into power, does not stay in parliament...so which "same reasons"?

To suit their vision of the future. As I said earlier their ideas cannot be brought about without changes to the constitution.

yes their evil visions of elections without vote buying. Fresh politic without the dinosaurs buying their way out of the court all the time, a country without corruption and free media.....

As educated people also want that, you can see that hugh support

I was thinking of more their idea that only 30% should be elected and their belief that the army should be allowed to intervene in politics.

Nice thoughts, but the army already regularly intervenes in politics here.

Do you know of ANYWHERE they do that more?

[Tony Clifton]

Yae ASTV the opium of the Minorities!(Arethey Chewing Beetle Nut or something while Glued to that crap?)

KURTGRUEN: My THAI WIFE translates EVERTHING those Thugs are saying! WAKE UP and SMELL THE COFFEE MAN!!!! Sondhi and Loonie Gang ONLY Want YOUR MONEY! They Despise You and ALL of Farang who aint "CHIN"! They DON"T want Democracy.THAT is "YOUR FARANG POISON".

I have heard Him and Other PAD Leaders speak and These quotes are QUOTES!

"Motherf...ing farang Dogs". "F..king Kwai Farang Come to Thailand and Think they can Force us to elect leaders to suit their pillaging of Thai Economy"( Kwai= Buffalo =stupid)"Stupid Isan Dogs Who Voted for This and the Previous Govt""If SamaK(yes the Elect Prime minister of this nation) comes To the South WE will Kill him" Quotes From PAD ASTV and Sondhi.

KURTGRUEN: If You support Xenophobic KNOWN criminals who Hate You and ALL You stand for and Talk OPENLY about it,

They WILL take Your Business,Land,Home and Right to Be Here when they are ruling! You/ We are screwed on that day!You as many others love to be an open book and talk TOO much about that which should be private.What stops THESE thugs Near to us From Popping up and Evicting You and Your Wife? (No Tabien Ban! No Tanot No Work Visa for The Coffe shop!That's Mine and I'm Taking it! Try going to the Police They'll just laugh!)PAD IS SICK BRAIN POISON!!!I wish You see that and Save Your Plight!

What's with the annoying and excessive use of capital letters, got a twitch on your pinkie?

You did incite speed reading before, now I just skip the whole thing.

Most of it makes no sense anyway.

Edited August 30, 2008 by Tony Clifton

[Samuian]

list of charges against Taksin and Samak?

I am producing a blog in French relating this story and the background information, for my friends and family who can not read English, and I would like to list the 8 + 16 charges against thaksin and the others against samak as it looks like now they won't find any way out.

I searched the forum but could not find a list, only occasionally mentions of the list

could someone point me in the right direction?

thanks

oz

You might wish to include a list of charges that relate to PAD leaders too

yes and maybe YOU might consider what this means:

from post#2301:

\

"Time is critical, the government is trying to amend the constitution to make vote-buying acceptable.

Among the amendment proposed was removal of Article 237 which would dissolve a political party if one of the executives was involved in vote buying. Yongyuth Tiyapairat, People's Power Party executive who was also the Parliament president after the election, was being tried for vote buying.[7] Yongyuth was later found guilty by the Supreme Court on July 8, 2008."

it's "only" one of the "amendments" the recent "government" is planning, for me it reads like they are going to issue themselves a "Carte Blanche" for future election frauds!

How about this and how much does it tell the audience about their "honesty" in trying to run this country?

How about that?

How about that the press, public opinion are airing worries that they as a puppet cabinet are going to revoke issues, regarding the wrongdoings of the Ex-Premier Mr.T.?

have we forgotten what happened in Sept.2006?

"we" have, haven't we?

That the pot is full to it's rim and it's contents are running over... as simple as that!

This nation can bear a lot, can forgive wholeheartedly and forget but the annoyances don't stop, it goes on and on and on... that is why the "PAD" the people are on the roads now!

it's all quite simple, isn't it?

And those who don't want to understand, don't want to understand, but that is an entirely different matter!

[Spee]

http://socialistworker.org/2008/08/28/behi...ailand-protests

It seems to me to be a reasoned and resonable account. Would others agree?

Yeah you're exactly right. All except for the "reasoned and reasonable" part.

It's a bunch of inaccurate drivel. I knew there was a reason I used to laugh at these idiots during their demonstrations at the U.of London.

[h90]

Are the 'anti-PAD' ignoring the fact that the PPP should be disbanded by law?

Not ignoring it at all. However, they should be disbanded by LAW (not by mobs with no mandate) and then new elections should take place.

The PPP might wish to amend the constitution (as you state) for their own aims but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons.

The PAD get into action to stop the government to make their changes.

"but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons." that is a bit weird....the PAD is no party, don't want to get into power, does not stay in parliament...so which "same reasons"?

To suit their vision of the future. As I said earlier their ideas cannot be brought about without changes to the constitution.

yes their evil visions of elections without vote buying. Fresh politic without the dinosaurs buying their way out of the court all the time, a country without corruption and free media.....

As educated people also want that, you can see that hugh support

I was thinking of more their idea that only 30% should be elected and their belief that the army should be allowed to intervene in politics.

That was just an idea in a discussion, that's not a policy. Only Sondhi spoke about it....not one of the others.

[Bangyai]

What we have here and now in Thailand is a situation where by less than 0.1% of the voters are mounting a campaign of civil unrest and violence in an effort to force their will on the other 99.9% of voters.

Your post is well-written and fairly well thought out. Why would you end it with a meaningless statistic that you can't possibly defend? The fact of the matter is that nobody really knows how many people the PAD represent.

Read the last paragraph again and you might understand. The question is not about what percentage of voters would like to see Samak and his government go or stay, but rather about what percentage of people believe strongly enough to go out on the streets in a campaign of civil disobedience and violence to force their will on others.

Approximately 38 million potential voters in Thailand. About 35 thousand PAD protesters on the streets and maybe a few thousand more unionists to back them up with industrial strikes. (Actually, the unionists have taken leave days rather than strike, -- so the public pays them to strike) You do the figures and see what they come out to.

When PAD start their antics we often hear comments here that they have massive support throughout the nation. But ask yourself, why then if they have so much support as alleged, don't they form a political party and contest the leadership through legitimate political means. The answer of course is that they have very little numerical support across the nation and would not have much of a voice in the legitimate democratic process. Its a bit like when any special interest group masses in one place, be they anti-war protesters or gay rights, when they all come out in force it looks very impressive. But only rarely are they representative of the majority. And in PADS case they are representative of only a small but very vocal minority.

When 0.1% of voters protesting on the streets over rules the wishes of the majority of voters at the ballot box, democracy is in real trouble.

Well said

[Thai at Heart]

Hmmmm...

You have a Protest leader, who owns a police station, which constantly airs free service announcements against Child Labour, against family violence, against sex slavery. A station that educates people about AIDS and other things

You have protest leaders who have been keeping large masses of people demonstrating peacefully. Protest leaders who know how to organize defensive moves to hold their ground at the government building

Lots of intelligent people supporting them....doctors, teachers, University Students, Pilots, etc....

while they are leading a peaceful, civil disobedience protest...

...and you call them bad

Then you got Samak and his corrupt government, who only got elected, because they bought the votes, who have less than 50% of voter support in Thailand (even after spending billions of Baht trying to buy it), who use force to deal with peaceful demonstrators, beating on old men and women, etc....

A government that tortures innocent hilltribe people to admit to crimes they didn't commit. An illegal government under Thai constitution, because of it's leaders being involved in vote buying..

and you they they are good????

Give me a break.

I openly support the PAD, so does my Thai wife and we are proud of it.

For 24 hour coverage of the demonstrations here is the ASTV link...

http://www.thaiDUMLOOK.tv/

I seriously doubt that you are what you claim to be.

Why do you find it necessary to post nonsense (now Samak is "torturing hill-tribe people.....") at regular intervals just to constantly post the link to ASTV?

Yae ASTV the opium of the Minorities!(Arethey Chewing Beetle Nut or something while Glued to that crap?)

KURTGRUEN: My THAI WIFE translates EVERTHING those Thugs are saying! WAKE UP and SMELL THE COFFEE MAN!!!! Sondhi and Loonie Gang ONLY Want YOUR MONEY! They Despise You and ALL of Farang who aint "CHIN"! They DON"T want Democracy.THAT is "YOUR FARANG POISON".

I have heard Him and Other PAD Leaders speak and These quotes are QUOTES!

"Motherf...ing farang Dogs". "F..king Kwai Farang Come to Thailand and Think they can Force us to elect leaders to suit their pillaging of Thai Economy"( Kwai= Buffalo =stupid)"Stupid Isan Dogs Who Voted for This and the Previous Govt""If SamaK(yes the Elect Prime minister of this nation) comes To the South WE will Kill him" Quotes From PAD ASTV and Sondhi.

KURTGRUEN: If You support Xenophobic KNOWN criminals who Hate You and ALL You stand for and Talk OPENLY about it,

They WILL take Your Business,Land,Home and Right to Be Here when they are ruling! You/ We are screwed on that day!You as many others love to be an open book and talk TOO much about that which should be private.What stops THESE thugs Near to us From Popping up and Evicting You and Your Wife? (No Tabien Ban! No Tanot No Work Visa for The Coffe shop!That's Mine and I'm Taking it! Try going to the Police They'll just laugh!)PAD IS SICK BRAIN POISON!!!I wish You see that and Save Your Plight!

I wouldn't expect foreigners to be very welcome in Sondhi's world.

[Thai at Heart]

Are the 'anti-PAD' ignoring the fact that the PPP should be disbanded by law?

Not ignoring it at all. However, they should be disbanded by LAW (not by mobs with no mandate) and then new elections should take place.

The PPP might wish to amend the constitution (as you state) for their own aims but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons.

The PAD get into action to stop the government to make their changes.

"but the PAD also want to make changes to the constitution for the same reasons." that is a bit weird....the PAD is no party, don't want to get into power, does not stay in parliament...so which "same reasons"?

To suit their vision of the future. As I said earlier their ideas cannot be brought about without changes to the constitution.

yes their evil visions of elections without vote buying. Fresh politic without the dinosaurs buying their way out of the court all the time, a country without corruption and free media.....

As educated people also want that, you can see that hugh support

I was thinking of more their idea that only 30% should be elected and their belief that the army should be allowed to intervene in politics.

Huge?

If it is 60,000 sitting in Bangkok, Man U V Man City gets a higher attendance

[animatic]

If PAD wants to drive off all farangs as policy and blame us for the political situation,

how come when I go into a restaurant and the TV shows a PAS ralley

and staff AND boss are ALL glued to it, when I speak with the owner he is :

a ) More than happy to explain what's happening and enjoys my interest,

b ) Is not even slightly xenophobic and gives no hints of disliking my presence

c ) Is only showing interested in clean government and a fair shake for all.

d ) and the up country staff are happy to have a farang show interest too.

This all runs counter to the propaganda I see posted above.

Fear is a powerful tool. But fear can be counter acted by what you

actually see and feel on the ground with real people.

I assumed he was talking about the PAD leadership rather than some of their followers.

I am talking about several instance of discussing the situation in different restaraunts

around the area with different people all willing to talk to a farang about what's happening

with PAD and their country. I never got any sense of the scare words spouted by some here.

I really wonder WHY some are trying to say this stuff. As if farangs can control the situation.

Or is it some effort to sway world opinion on the forum level? Doesn't seem too effective.

No doubt in any large group you have extremes, some followers want faster and farther,

and others want more measured approaches. My anecdotal evidence is from multiple sources.

I so far don't think I have actually MET a PAD member, then again it is not a card carrying kind of thing either.

I just note quite a few Thais are intensely interested in this

and none here seem to fear PAD as some boggie man for the old elites.

One must remember alliances here are often of the moment and of a given opportunity.

There will no doubt be several trying to jump on the PAD band wagon as they see them

gaining an upper hand. And also there will be those CLAIMING to be influencial behind the scenes

when they are just being opportunistic as they always have been.

One must take ALL pronouncements and press reports with a grain of salt the size of Chumpon.

Edited August 30, 2008 by animatic

[Bangyai]

Hmmmm...

You have a Protest leader, who owns a police station, which constantly airs free service announcements against Child Labour, against family violence, against sex slavery. A station that educates people about AIDS and other things

You have protest leaders who have been keeping large masses of people demonstrating peacefully. Protest leaders who know how to organize defensive moves to hold their ground at the government building

Lots of intelligent people supporting them....doctors, teachers, University Students, Pilots, etc....

while they are leading a peaceful, civil disobedience protest...

...and you call them bad

Then you got Samak and his corrupt government, who only got elected, because they bought the votes, who have less than 50% of voter support in Thailand (even after spending billions of Baht trying to buy it), who use force to deal with peaceful demonstrators, beating on old men and women, etc....

A government that tortures innocent hilltribe people to admit to crimes they didn't commit. An illegal government under Thai constitution, because of it's leaders being involved in vote buying..

and you they they are good????

Give me a break.

I openly support the PAD, so does my Thai wife and we are proud of it.

For 24 hour coverage of the demonstrations here is the ASTV link...

http://www.thaiDUMLOOK.tv/

I seriously doubt that you are what you claim to be.

Why do you find it necessary to post nonsense (now Samak is "torturing hill-tribe people.....") at regular intervals just to constantly post the link to ASTV?

Yae ASTV the opium of the Minorities!(Arethey Chewing Beetle Nut or something while Glued to that crap?)

KURTGRUEN: My THAI WIFE translates EVERTHING those Thugs are saying! WAKE UP and SMELL THE COFFEE MAN!!!! Sondhi and Loonie Gang ONLY Want YOUR MONEY! They Despise You and ALL of Farang who aint "CHIN"! They DON"T want Democracy.THAT is "YOUR FARANG POISON".

I have heard Him and Other PAD Leaders speak and These quotes are QUOTES!

"Motherf...ing farang Dogs". "F..king Kwai Farang Come to Thailand and Think they can Force us to elect leaders to suit their pillaging of Thai Economy"( Kwai= Buffalo =stupid)"Stupid Isan Dogs Who Voted for This and the Previous Govt""If SamaK(yes the Elect Prime minister of this nation) comes To the South WE will Kill him" Quotes From PAD ASTV and Sondhi.

KURTGRUEN: If You support Xenophobic KNOWN criminals who Hate You and ALL You stand for and Talk OPENLY about it,

They WILL take Your Business,Land,Home and Right to Be Here when they are ruling! You/ We are screwed on that day!You as many others love to be an open book and talk TOO much about that which should be private.What stops THESE thugs Near to us From Popping up and Evicting You and Your Wife? (No Tabien Ban! No Tanot No Work Visa for The Coffe shop!That's Mine and I'm Taking it! Try going to the Police They'll just laugh!)PAD IS SICK BRAIN POISON!!!I wish You see that and Save Your Plight!

Wow. I wasn't aware of that- can anyone confirm this. I don't doubt it but this is an element that the media has not touched on- certainly not the English speaking media.

Go helterskelter ..... tell it like it is. My thai is good enough to follow most of what is said and my gf fills in the bits I miss. I can confirm that these ARE REAL COMMENTS actually beind said by the PAD leadership ( Chamlong excepted , he usually refrains from such gutter language )

Edited August 30, 2008 by Bangyai

[Boater]

Please add all bashing or support of the PAD into this thread please

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Pad-Comments-t209464.html

thus we can keep the news forum clean

thanks

boater

[Tony Clifton]

Hmmmm...

You have a Protest leader, who owns a police station, which constantly airs free service announcements against Child Labour, against family violence, against sex slavery. A station that educates people about AIDS and other things

You have protest leaders who have been keeping large masses of people demonstrating peacefully. Protest leaders who know how to organize defensive moves to hold their ground at the government building

Lots of intelligent people supporting them....doctors, teachers, University Students, Pilots, etc....

while they are leading a peaceful, civil disobedience protest...

...and you call them bad

Then you got Samak and his corrupt government, who only got elected, because they bought the votes, who have less than 50% of voter support in Thailand (even after spending billions of Baht trying to buy it), who use force to deal with peaceful demonstrators, beating on old men and women, etc....

A government that tortures innocent hilltribe people to admit to crimes they didn't commit. An illegal government under Thai constitution, because of it's leaders being involved in vote buying..

and you they they are good????

Give me a break.

I openly support the PAD, so does my Thai wife and we are proud of it.

For 24 hour coverage of the demonstrations here is the ASTV link...

http://www.thaiDUMLOOK.tv/

I seriously doubt that you are what you claim to be.

Why do you find it necessary to post nonsense (now Samak is "torturing hill-tribe people.....") at regular intervals just to constantly post the link to ASTV?

Yae ASTV the opium of the Minorities!(Arethey Chewing Beetle Nut or something while Glued to that crap?)

KURTGRUEN: My THAI WIFE translates EVERTHING those Thugs are saying! WAKE UP and SMELL THE COFFEE MAN!!!! Sondhi and Loonie Gang ONLY Want YOUR MONEY! They Despise You and ALL of Farang who aint "CHIN"! They DON"T want Democracy.THAT is "YOUR FARANG POISON".

I have heard Him and Other PAD Leaders speak and These quotes are QUOTES!

"Motherf...ing farang Dogs". "F..king Kwai Farang Come to Thailand and Think they can Force us to elect leaders to suit their pillaging of Thai Economy"( Kwai= Buffalo =stupid)"Stupid Isan Dogs Who Voted for This and the Previous Govt""If SamaK(yes the Elect Prime minister of this nation) comes To the South WE will Kill him" Quotes From PAD ASTV and Sondhi.

KURTGRUEN: If You support Xenophobic KNOWN criminals who Hate You and ALL You stand for and Talk OPENLY about it,

They WILL take Your Business,Land,Home and Right to Be Here when they are ruling! You/ We are screwed on that day!You as many others love to be an open book and talk TOO much about that which should be private.What stops THESE thugs Near to us From Popping up and Evicting You and Your Wife? (No Tabien Ban! No Tanot No Work Visa for The Coffe shop!That's Mine and I'm Taking it! Try going to the Police They'll just laugh!)PAD IS SICK BRAIN POISON!!!I wish You see that and Save Your Plight!

Wow. I wasn't aware of that- can anyone confirm this. I don't doubt it but this is an element that the media has not touched on- certainly not the English speaking media.

Go helterskelter ..... tell it like it is. My thai is good enough to follow most of what is said and my gf fills in the bits I miss. I can confirm that these ARE REAL COMMENTS actually beind said by the PAD leadership ( Chamlong excepted , he usually refrains from such gutter language )

So, how do you translate m*th3erf*^%er in Thai?

I'm also curious about how "F..king Kwai Farang Come to Thailand and Think they can Force us to elect leaders to suit their pillaging of Thai Economy"( Kwai= Buffalo =stupid)" is possible when murdered tourists families have to fight like hel_l to get a fair trial or even a decent investigation and their respective Embassies just about have their hands tied.

Edited August 30, 2008 by Tony Clifton

[ando]

The Civil Court has reneged on its initial judgement ordering the protesters out of government house. The reason given is that it might cause further conflict.

That's pretty much a political judgement rather than a legal one. What ever happened to blind justice and the rule of law? It seems the Civil Court is more interested in playing politics than doing in its job. What hope is there for this country when the courts are afraid to enforce the law.

Can anyone imagine such a thing happening in any developed western democratic country? --- A mob of protesters has taken over Government house , but the court has reneged on a previous eviction order because the court is afraid the protesters might resist eviction and some may get hurt in the process.

How is this country ever expected to progress when even the courts cant follow the most basic principles of law.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/300808_News/30Aug2008_news01.php

[animatic]

So you are saying preventing the loss of life of protesters or police

by NOT creating a full conflagration,

is NOT a good thing?

This has gotten way beyond a simple go in clean them out situation.

Prudence in all things seems in order.

Or our you advocating to be like the Inquesitioner at Bezier.

When told there were inocents in Bezier town too he said:

"Burn them all, God will know his own."

Edited August 30, 2008 by animatic

[blaze]

The Civil Court has reneged on its initial judgement ordering the protesters out of government house. The reason given is that it might cause further conflict.

That's pretty much a political judgement rather than a legal one. What ever happened to blind justice and the rule of law? It seems the Civil Court is more interested in playing politics than doing in its job. What hope is there for this country when the courts are afraid to enforce the law.

Can anyone imagine such a thing happening in any developed western democratic country? --- A mob of protesters has taken over Government house , but the court has reneged on a previous eviction order because the court is afraid the protesters might resist eviction and some may get hurt in the process.

How is this country ever expected to progress when even the courts cant follow the most basic principles of law.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/300808_News/30Aug2008_news01.php

The line of reasoning used by this court should be of concern to every Thai citizen. It would explain why it took so long for Thaksin to face justice, why those who overthrow elected government by force never face justice and why the PAD leadership will probably escape justice this time round.

[Bangyai]

It is also worth pointing out that Sondhi himself is only a puppet on a string. When Taksin made his remarks about having some very high people ' in his pocket ' it was felt by the ' old school ' that he had gone to far and was getting too big for his boots. They saw that if he were not removed he would become a more serious threat to the established order. But how do you remove a democratically elected PM with massive popular support and keep your hands clean at the same time ??? Clearly some dupe needed to be found to do the necessary dirty work. Who better than Sondhi, a media tycoon with an axe to grind and just aching for revenge. The deal is made and the stage is set. In the subsequent campaign Sondhi is accused of lese majeste and gets a slap on the wrist but is allowed to continue his work.

Then the coup. The coup leaders make a pigs ear of their illegal time in office and pull out a few weeds without getting at the roots. The weeds bloom again. Sondhi is let loose again. For the second time he is arrested for lese majeste remarks but is again immediatley released. Others are not so lucky . Darunee , who is twice refused bail by the courts because she might flee. The same courts that let Taksin go knowing he would flee ?????

So now with 2 counts of lese majeste against him he is allowed to continue what he has started....the extermination of TRT and its offspring PPP. Once this has been achieved he will become a paria amongst the very people who are embracing him now.

As for Samak, he probably knows he is doomed and is under intense pressure to quit. All part of Panlops plan. But what if Samak doesn't want to jump ??? Two can play at the martyr game. If he does nothing but hang on and refuse to quit, how long will the military sit on their hands before they get tired of waiting. If this happens, it will look bad in the eyes of the rest of the world and Samak could find himself an unlikely hero .