Scary

[yabbit]

i was just seeing this video on youtube

Principal Posts List of Homosexual Students http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzG-HcxKpSA

even if i don't go to school any more or don't live where this happened it really feels scary what happened.

[bluemanna]

i was just seeing this video on youtube

Principal Posts List of Homosexual Students http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzG-HcxKpSA

even if i don't go to school any more or don't live where this happened it really feels scary what happened.

Then the principal should be held personally responsible for anything that happens to the students. Some people really need to grab a brain, how the hel_l does dome <deleted> like that get to be a principal of a school.

[yabbit]

Then the principal should be held personally responsible for anything that happens to the students.

i really feel sorry for the students that had their name published, my guess is that their life turned into an unsupportable hel_l. don't know why, but i felt scared when learning about this.

[farang prince]

This is one of the most irresponsible actions I have ever seen a person in authority take...and a school principal at that!!!! It is inexcusable and the principal should be fired immediately. If I was the parent of one of the students I would be seeking legal remedies.

[OxfordWill]

maybe some of the bigger guys on that list should get together and pay the principle a "personal visit"

[kek]

Have any of you considered that the principle was trying to help the gay students find partners?

[farang prince]

Have any of you considered that the principle was trying to help the gay students find partners?

Have you considered buying some land in the Nevada desert that I have for sale?

[Scott]

There is a good chance they could sue the principle for a number of things, one being defamation of character and since there still is discrimination against gays, especially in the area where this happened, they could show a potentially significant loss of earnings. The principal and the school board could get to pay out a lot of money--and they deserve it, because apparently they aren't really able to perform the duty of 'educating' anyone.

[geriatrickid]

Whoa. How about everyone backs up a bit and look at what happened. This wasn't targeted exclusively at gays.

When I saw the article, I said, jeez the woman is an ass. She's pushing her morals on people. Must be one of those white evangelicals or something, what with the story coming from the deep south of the USA. So I did a little digging. What brought this about?

Brace yourself because it's a minefield for those that harbour political correctness. Know why? The school is a centrepoint for Afro American advancement, a gifted learning centre. The principal is a well regarded female Afro American with bonafide liberal credentials. She received multiple complaints from the adult servicing college with which her school was associated. This wasn't so much about persecuting gay people as it was about the enforcement of a code of conduct at a school that was predominately afro american and dedicated to academic achievement.

There are two sides to every argument and I think the position of the school board is worth reading;

"Memphis City Schools is committed to providing its students with the best possible learning environment. Hollis F. Price Middle College is an accelerated high school, which is located on the historically black LeMoyne-Owen College campus. Eligible students may enroll in college classes in pursuit of completing the first two years of college while attending this high school. Because we have high school students on a college campus, we have to carefully monitor the activities of our students. We are at all times proactive in assuring that our students are provided a safe, nurturing and disciplined learning climate. Unfortunately, in fall 2007, we received numerous complaints from LeMoyne-Owen College faculty and staff that some of our student couples were involved in explicit sexual behavior in public view on the college campus.

In light of this information from LeMoyne-Owen faculty and staff, the principal of Hollis F. Price made several general announcements to the student body that this behavior would not be tolerated. Regrettably, the improper behavior continued. Therefore, the principal felt it appropriate to notify the parents of those children she knew to be involved romantically. This was done in an effort to gain the support of the parents in reinforcing the message that such behavior is in violation of Memphis City Schools' Student Code of Conduct. The principal did not list any information other than students' names on her personal call list, and she certainly did not specify the sexual orientation of any student. Additionally, the list was never posted publicly anywhere at the school.

It is the position of Memphis City Schools that the principal did act in an appropriate manner in order to correct a serious issue at the school and that Memphis City Schools has not subjected either of these students to

discriminatory treatment.

In the coming days, we will submit a formal response to the ACLU. We look forward to working with them to amicably resolve this matter."

The school board position provides a pretty clear explanation as to what happened. I would have been the first to criticize the principal for the act itself because of its sheer stupidity and apparent invasion of privacy, but as for specifically targeting gays, I don't think so. Not a good option, but something in light of the recorded complaints about the sexual behaviour by her students she deemed necessary. And btw the complaints were from the college were logged and made available to the ACLU.

There are several allegations made that the principal called one of the boy's mothers and that one of the boys suffered discrimination from a teacher. These are allegations and unproven. In light of the information provided by the college and the actual events, the allegations might be an embellishment or statements taken out of context. Just because the person making an allegation is gay doesn't mean it's accurate.

To pull out the experience of the 2 boys from the event turns it exclusively into an abrogation of civil rights based upon sexual choice. My point is that if anything, this was an infringement of everyone's civil rights. The odd part was that it was a decision taken by a person in a predominately visible minority school that has benefited from those very same civil rights.

The ACLU took up the issue and it is not a group that shirks from proceeding with a civil litigation in such matters. However, I notice that aside from a stiff letter in May , the ACLU did not take any further action. Is the ACLU just as guilty as the principal because it chose not to pursue the matter, or was it because there was additional information about the case that demonstrates it wasn't just about gays or as egregious as it seemed?

The fact of the matter is that the subsequent investigation shows that the two boys named were OPENLY dating (i.e. it was in the public domain already), the principal never posted a list as was alleged, and the school made repeated announcements to students that discrimination against people based upon race, ethnic origin, religion, disability, gender or sexual identity was unacceptable.

I am not justifying the event, nor downplaying the significance. However, it does need to be put into perspective and the notion that this was specifically targeted at two gays addressed. Argue the event as an infringement of civil rights. Argue it as an inappropriate action, but don't argue it as an exclusive gay event, because it was not.

[ozymandious]

i was just seeing this video on youtube

Principal Posts List of Homosexual Students http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzG-HcxKpSA

even if i don't go to school any more or don't live where this happened it really feels scary what happened.

The students should post lists of <deleted> with the principal at the top.

[OxfordWill]

Some quite clear contradictions in the schools own public comments.

[farang prince]

Geriatrickid, you can dress principal's stupidity up in any gown you want...it is still a hamfisted approach to the problem. I could care less whether she is an award-winning teacher or whether she is black, white or purple. But then I'm not politically correct...she screwed the pooch. I just know when someone has acted in a manner where she has created more problems than she has solved, then her judgment is questionable. She should be reassigned. There are consequences for stupidity, especially when it involves someone in authority over young people.

[Ijustwannateach]

^I agree. For whatever reason the information has become more public as a result of the principal's actions, it was wrong to allow it to become so. If the school had a code against public displays of affection, the individual students should have been disciplined in the manner already outlined for such cases- involving other parties only if it is a standard procedure (and perhaps not even then considering the sensitive nature of 'outing' gays), and probably consulting the school's counsellor at some point.

While the principal may not have been acting in a manner specifically targetting gay students, the fact that some students were 'outed' as a result of her actions (to anyone) indicates that her policy itself was poorly thought out and would have been violating confidentiality/privacy- and this has special consequences, usually harmful ones, for gay persons in a homophobic environment. At best, a crime of carelessness or neglect, but a violation of student safety nonetheless and a sign that the policy- as well, perhaps, as the person who set it- should be removed.

"S"

[fred2007]

Have any of you considered that the principle was trying to help the gay students find partners?

Have you considered buying some land in the Nevada desert that I have for sale?

Address please

[Scott]

Basically, of all the antics that kids can do that could outrage a lot of people, the one that needs to be disciplined and brought to everyones attention is anything that looks "gay." Basically, it sounds like a witch-hunt.

[farang prince]

Have any of you considered that the principle was trying to help the gay students find partners?

Have you considered buying some land in the Nevada desert that I have for sale?

Address please

The address is: Inthemiddleofnowhere, Nevada 30744. Hehehehe. Unfortunately, I just sold the land to a sheik who was homesick. But I do have a nice bridge in Brooklyn that is for sale.

[geriatrickid]

I am not saying I agreed with her behaviour. If I had been one of those students I'd have been upset. However, people's positions are based upon a youtube commentary offered by some person that was neither a party to the event, did not make an effort to gather additional facts and that based his opinion on one newspaper article.

There is no evidence that the principal publicly posted anyone's name. The ACLU abandoned its complaint. Yes, she called parents when students kept misbehaving. The fact is that the students were minors and the principal was acting as locus parenti. Had she not informed the parents she would have been negligent. Did you know that students that enter this school are subject to a specific code of conduct that is made known to them at enrolment? She was merely enforcing the rules that were known to the students. It's one of those charter school setup thingies.

Iwanna, I do not believe she outed anyone. The gay students that were dating were already "Out". According to classmates and as was reported in the local newspapers, when Andrew broke up with another boy, he was quite public in the matter of dating Nicholas. It wasn't a secret in the school and no one harassed him over it.

Now, if you say it was wrong on the basis that Andrew and Nicholas may not have been part of the regulars fornicating and swapping spit in the stairwells and in public areas and that their conduct should have been documented before calling the parents, then I would agree 100% with you. It was a like amputing an arm because a finger had an infection.

[elkangorito]

Firstly, I do believe that this story bears no relevance to Thailand.

Secondly, my wish is that the person who posted the Youtube video, would sooner or later learn to not start every sentence with "and" or "like"...or was it just one long sentence?

[Ijustwannateach]

^El K, just as women can discuss women's issues in the Ladies forum, and teachers can discuss education in the Teaching forum, gay people are free to discuss gay issues here even if they don't directly apply to Thailand. Do feel free to discuss gay issues if the grammar isn't too enthralling!

^^GK, I'm with you as long as the principal herself did not say to the parents something like "your son is snogging another boy under the stairwell!!" If she attempted to maintain confidentiality and consider the mental and emotional health of the students in question while also acting in loco parentis, she could have simply said, "your son is violating section 8.19.20a of the Student Conduct Handbook which restricts displays of public affection to hand-holding, hugs, and kisses on the cheek. If your son continues, he may be disciplined or suspended. You may wish to discuss his behaviour with him." That gives the parent the opening to warn the child that the behaviour is a problem, while also allowing the child to avoid awkward 'outing.'

And yes, if the principal were a properly experienced and sensitive professional, she would consider such issues when making her decisions.

I agree that it appears that public information is incomplete here; however, if the youtube commentator is mistaken, the principal can always take him to task either at school or through legal channels; otherwise if the student is substantially correct, the principal may herself be legally at risk.

"S"

"S"