New House Build Plan

[longball53098]

New House Build Plan

Will this plan succeed?

I am posting this to get some feedback from anyone who has/is/will be building a house here in LOS. I plan to post this on at least 3 forums and let the fur fly. I expect to get thrashed soundly by many of you. Oh well! I have old broad shoulders. For anyone wanting to contribute and give me words of encouragement of have better ideas/suggestions bring them on. If all you want to do is bash me well that’s your prerogative.

I am in the final planning stages for my new house. Hope to build early next year. I do not have a builder contracted yet so I have time to adjust my intentions and modify the plans.

The house will be a normal single story bungalow built on a foundation with a service/crawl space under the floor. The floor will be 90cm off the ground. The house area will be about 155 square meters or for those that use feet about 1670 square feet. Your typical 2 bed, 2 baths, combined living/dining area with an office area off the living room area and the western style kitchen.

I have this idea I can make this house for about 1.75 million baht which includes a nice covered 2 car park and an exterior pump house. I have seen similar houses being built for close to this figure.

So, with this basic information here is my idea for the construction.

All the exterior and interior walls will be made with the AAC blocks 7.5cm but in addition I will make them double walls.

Why you ask?

For a few reasons; insulation is one, noise reduction is two, no columns sticking out in the rooms but clean lines in and out with flush walls three,

And number four, I have this idea I can convince a builder and his team to install the electric piping and water piping in the wall spaces between the double blocks. In other words no cutting of walls to install any pipes. To add more to this I will try to have the water and drain lines routed down under the floor (remember my crawl space) and then under the foundation walls to the septics and drain pipes. The electric pipes will route from the wall spaces up to the ceiling and cross to the wall containing the service panel. Again the main feed from the PEA meter will come under the foundation and up the wall to the panel. With this idea there will not be any pipes buried under the tiled floors and walls that later may need service.

I have asked this question to at least 2 Thai builders and they didn’t say “no can do” or even “up to you”. One actually said oh I see you do not want to cut the walls? Ok good.

So here is the end to this first post to get your brains in gear and tell me that I am going to wake up soon from this dream or good luck, great idea and here’s what you need to do to get it done that way.

Thanks in advance or any helpful answers and good ideas. And I hope there are more of these than nay Sayers.

:D

[dotcom]

All you have to do is layout all your conduit prior to construction so they see what you want to do.

It is no more & no less trouble than chopping holes after.

Mostly it is suggested to use 2.5 mm2 wire for sockets - but you might want to run 4mm2 to allow for future upgrades. Remember to wire air cons - even if you don't buy them for years to come. Ditto kitchen stove - storage water heater - pump house etc.

You can never have too many wall outlets.

ACC blocks - are those the insulated ones?

Edited September 24, 2008 by dotcom

[Geroc]

New House Build Plan

Will this plan succeed?

I am posting this to get some feedback from anyone who has/is/will be building a house here in LOS. I plan to post this on at least 3 forums and let the fur fly. I expect to get thrashed soundly by many of you. Oh well! I have old broad shoulders. For anyone wanting to contribute and give me words of encouragement of have better ideas/suggestions bring them on. If all you want to do is bash me well that's your prerogative.

I am in the final planning stages for my new house. Hope to build early next year. I do not have a builder contracted yet so I have time to adjust my intentions and modify the plans.

The house will be a normal single story bungalow built on a foundation with a service/crawl space under the floor. The floor will be 90cm off the ground. The house area will be about 155 square meters or for those that use feet about 1670 square feet. Your typical 2 bed, 2 baths, combined living/dining area with an office area off the living room area and the western style kitchen.

I have this idea I can make this house for about 1.75 million baht which includes a nice covered 2 car park and an exterior pump house. I have seen similar houses being built for close to this figure.

So, with this basic information here is my idea for the construction.

All the exterior and interior walls will be made with the AAC blocks 7.5cm but in addition I will make them double walls.

Why you ask?

For a few reasons; insulation is one, noise reduction is two, no columns sticking out in the rooms but clean lines in and out with flush walls three,

And number four, I have this idea I can convince a builder and his team to install the electric piping and water piping in the wall spaces between the double blocks. In other words no cutting of walls to install any pipes. To add more to this I will try to have the water and drain lines routed down under the floor (remember my crawl space) and then under the foundation walls to the septics and drain pipes. The electric pipes will route from the wall spaces up to the ceiling and cross to the wall containing the service panel. Again the main feed from the PEA meter will come under the foundation and up the wall to the panel. With this idea there will not be any pipes buried under the tiled floors and walls that later may need service.

I have asked this question to at least 2 Thai builders and they didn't say "no can do" or even "up to you". One actually said oh I see you do not want to cut the walls? Ok good.

So here is the end to this first post to get your brains in gear and tell me that I am going to wake up soon from this dream or good luck, great idea and here's what you need to do to get it done that way.

Thanks in advance or any helpful answers and good ideas. And I hope there are more of these than nay Sayers.

Hi,

Your project about pipes has no interest, but there is no problem for doing so, and builders will do as you like !

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

What do you intend to make the floor of? Termites can be a real terror if you use wood. Crawl space is nice and does make routing and rerouting water, sewerage and power much easier.

[roygsd]

New House Build Plan

Will this plan succeed?

I am posting this to get some feedback from anyone who has/is/will be building a house here in LOS. I plan to post this on at least 3 forums and let the fur fly. I expect to get thrashed soundly by many of you. Oh well! I have old broad shoulders. For anyone wanting to contribute and give me words of encouragement of have better ideas/suggestions bring them on. If all you want to do is bash me well that’s your prerogative.

I am in the final planning stages for my new house. Hope to build early next year. I do not have a builder contracted yet so I have time to adjust my intentions and modify the plans.

The house will be a normal single story bungalow built on a foundation with a service/crawl space under the floor. The floor will be 90cm off the ground. The house area will be about 155 square meters or for those that use feet about 1670 square feet. Your typical 2 bed, 2 baths, combined living/dining area with an office area off the living room area and the western style kitchen.

I have this idea I can make this house for about 1.75 million baht which includes a nice covered 2 car park and an exterior pump house. I have seen similar houses being built for close to this figure.

So, with this basic information here is my idea for the construction.

All the exterior and interior walls will be made with the AAC blocks 7.5cm but in addition I will make them double walls.

Why you ask?

For a few reasons; insulation is one, noise reduction is two, no columns sticking out in the rooms but clean lines in and out with flush walls three,

And number four, I have this idea I can convince a builder and his team to install the electric piping and water piping in the wall spaces between the double blocks. In other words no cutting of walls to install any pipes. To add more to this I will try to have the water and drain lines routed down under the floor (remember my crawl space) and then under the foundation walls to the septics and drain pipes. The electric pipes will route from the wall spaces up to the ceiling and cross to the wall containing the service panel. Again the main feed from the PEA meter will come under the foundation and up the wall to the panel. With this idea there will not be any pipes buried under the tiled floors and walls that later may need service.

I have asked this question to at least 2 Thai builders and they didn’t say “no can do” or even “up to you”. One actually said oh I see you do not want to cut the walls? Ok good.

So here is the end to this first post to get your brains in gear and tell me that I am going to wake up soon from this dream or good luck, great idea and here’s what you need to do to get it done that way.

Thanks in advance or any helpful answers and good ideas. And I hope there are more of these than nay Sayers.

:D

Hi,

Nice proposals, not rocket science and dependent upon exactly how far you wish to indulge yourself in respect of the quality of the bathroom/kitchen and other fixtures and fittings not an unreasonable budget.

The " no can do" is a fair answer and usually translates into " never done it before and afraid I dont have the skill or confidence in my ability to ensure it is done correctly".

The "up to you" response is more worrying as it could mean, "yes we know what we are doing" or " you will be paying for the materials and we will be getting paid daily or stage payments so we having nothing to loose if it goes pear shaped"!

THe only things I would certainly not do is to run the pipes/service UNDER the foundations, I would pass them THROUGH the blockwork ABOVE the foundatons ensuring that it has a concrete lintel installed above the opening provided for the service pipework to pass through and install a larger opening than the pipe going through it requires to allow the service pipes to be dragged through and repaced with relative ease if they ever need to be replaced, ensuring ofcourse the gap between the pipework and the newly formed opening is filled with foam to prevent rats or other nasties entering.

I would also ensure the cables between the blockwork is carried in plastic conduit for the same reasons as above.

Under no cirumstances would I put the water pipes in between the blockwork, I would route them under the floor and bring them up at the most convienient point into the rooms where that are required.

The use of blockwork is fine but it is vital that the founations are on solid ground and not any made up ground, you might like to visit the websites of celcon and thermolite who make the blocks in the uk as they are likely to give you best advice concerning the positioning of any movement joints and the possibly required mesh used in the mortar beds at certain locations.

All buildings move to some degree and failing to prepare for that in the design stage usually translates into prepare for failure in the future.

It really is not rocket science but the use of large and long blockwork walls do need to be carried out according to the manufacturers guidance if trouble is to be avoided or at least minimised.

What is very important to consider is the type and weight of the roof construction you want if you are to avoid " Roof Spread",

again cheap to deal with at the planing stage.

On very long walls you might have to introduce a bit of additional support every so many mtrs.

I hope you will be installing as much insulaton in the void between the block walls? It serves to keep the heat out as well as heat in.

Most important to me would be to ensure there is a passive air change (at least 2 per hour) to each room thus reducing the potential for those horrible black damp stains that are in most hotels/properties in LOS I have visited, trickle vents to or above the windows are really cheap to install at the planning stage.

You might like to be cheeky and send a copy of your plan to the technical departments of celcon or thermalite and ask for their advice regarding your proposals, just dont tell them you are not in the uk!

While you are at you should ask them for their advice regarding the floor, you may have seen the " T" shaped concrete beams that are placed upside down onto the brickwork/blockwork at even spaces and thegaps between the beams are filled with blocks and then screeded over and tiled if you wish, If you want to push the boat out ( your budget would stand it I think) you should consider placing additonal insulation below the floor to keep the temprature levels reasonable, may be a bit overkill but hey you are only likely to be doing this the once!

Like to see the plans if you get time to post them.

All the best

roy gsd

Edited September 24, 2008 by roygsd

[Pushit]

All you have to do is layout all your conduit prior to construction so they see what you want to do.

It is no more & no less trouble than chopping holes after.

Mostly it is suggested to use 2.5 mm2 wire for sockets - but you might want to run 4mm2 to allow for future upgrades. Remember to wire air cons - even if you don't buy them for years to come. Ditto kitchen stove - storage water heater - pump house etc.

You can never have too many wall outlets.

ACC blocks - are those the insulated ones?

I believe Thai electrical installation regulations now require 3 wire live/neutral/earth good sense chai mai?

[Lite Beer]

My opinion for what it is worth. Most of us know about Thai plumbing.

The more of it that is accessible the better.

If you have a leak and all the pipes are in the wall you are going to have ahell of a job trying to find it.

Edited September 24, 2008 by Lite Beer

[longball53098]

My opinion for what it is worth. Most of us know about Thai plumbing.

The more of it that is accessible the better.

If you have a leak and all the pipes are in the wall you are going to have ahell of a job trying to find it.

Thanks Lite for the advice and comment.

The service thing is exactly what I am aiming at.

If I can get this done the way I want and the pipes are installed correctly all the water/drain lines will be or should be serviceable. More so than the way I see most places where the pipes are buried under the cement and tile. 10 years from now when a pipe or joint fails I don't want to hire someone to destroy a wall or floor because of a leak, But some people don't mind and figure its time to remodel anyway and labor is cheap.

[longball53098]

Thanks roy gsd for all the thoughts and advice

Edited September 25, 2008 by longball53098

[longball53098]

What do you intend to make the floor of? Termites can be a real terror if you use wood. Crawl space is nice and does make routing and rerouting water, sewerage and power much easier.

No wood floors. Most likely be the concrete panels with a top layer of concrete as is the norm.

Also plans call for an insect/termite system surrounding the entire crawl space area

[Beardog]

Hi Longball,

It sounds like your house might be similar to our 2nd house we are starting to build.

Our was modified from 154sq. mtr. to 145 sq.meters. We were quoted around 1.5- 1.6 using all the pumps wells & septic off the old structure 8 months old. I will be doing the plumbing as I do not care for the low quality of standards here.

We are using red brick instead as where we live 45 minutes from you, We have a great breeze that keeps it cool year round (with the exception of 6 weeks in the year of hot season.) When it comes to putting in the plumbing in the double wall a lot of contractors are going to tell you can do & cut the walls to shreds as they have in the last double wall projects I have seen.

If you are going to be present best get an idea of if the plumber really can do (understand-you do not want your walls cut) A lot of the problem in Thailand is they are used to doing things 1 way & 1 way only.I have opted to put all my pipes exterior & put an expanded metal case (painted to match & look tasteful.) Within 15-20 minutes I can get access to all the pipes by removing the access cover. In the bathroom & kitchen (hidden ) all pipes will be in a channel with a grate I can lift up to access. our first house I put in a 4" pipe & ran the water 1/2 pipe through the channel easily. The contractor broke my fist line(he was a true idiot) & it only took 25 minutes to break off the 90 & install a new piece. The way he would have done it I would have needed to go through cement. My septic has a 5" pipe with the 4" pipe gong through it as well. Our first project has no crawl through & is built ground level. The best way to build will be to have easiest access points to all plumbing electrical & other assorted things you want. The new project will have a crawl through as the first structure was just to get us out of paying rent & living on the property.

Some most important things not discussed yet & are on coo-th site & the other site you will be on is the absolute importance of a very strict payment schedule. If you have a 3 or 4 different times of payment(IE: down payment- walls done- roof on-final or however you want to set up the pay schedule. Some people pay 5 payments.)

The Thai builder are unscrupulous up here & love to give an unrealistic bid. Than ask for extra draws along the way. That is a huge mistake if you give them advances. What happens soon the draw against all the available funds & when they are close to the end of the funds . They jet & let you fix the rest by yourself or pay the additional fees to have another team come in &

complete the job (at a higher rate- same as the U.S. Rework always cost more!)

It sounds like you are going about it right. The worse thing you can do up here is be an acting general contractor & hire teams a foreman .... usually nothing but problems if you are not a general contracter.

Even though I have built spec houses & refurbishing HUD houses & have my general contractor license, I would not dream of being the general as it is way different here in LOS. In the west you can have the crews do exactly the way you want & they are trained & well versed in many ways to achieve the same success in the end(That & they have to pass the certifications exams & be bonded & insured to work) Here their are no real tangible guarantees . Court is a joke!

I would realistically put away at least 25% over the amount quoted. within 2 months the prices have gone up drastically on supplies & I do not think this trend will change course. If you are going to use slate opposed to tile that will also increase your cost by up to 400+% pending on what you chose to build. The kitchen & bathroom can also drive up your cost if you o upgrade & will probably put you into a higher expense bracket. Last but not least: Look at some jobs the builder has done .

check for excessive cracks in walls. Straight walls(preferably some one who has a knowledge of T-squares & levels.)

Get at least 4 bids- Remember this is what you are going to be living in for a while, so take a little time & find out quality- any references from people in the houses you looked at. If you go 4 bids typically the first 1 or 2 will be to low & they will cost more as they are bidding to cheap. The 1 or 2 on the end will be to high as the builder is to greedy or has to pay the farang boss his cut & drive the price up. The one in the middle is your man If his work is clean & seems like he is easy to deal with. We asked owner of the house we like- how she liked the work. How easy is it to make changes(if done before walls are up) how the 2 year guarantee is. was the builder pretty much on time building completion. Does he provide the security for watching the supplies mixers. block etc. Most do, but do not take it for granted. Our house will also have 2.5 meters patio space all the way around. The roof will be extended to keep everything dry& shaded.

Remember to keep somewhat within your structured budget. Not uncommon to have a builder try to upgrade your design & drive your end cost up.

I have seen your posts on this site & you seem like you will do alright as you have the main ingredient..COMMON SENSE!

I made the mistake of building a 30 day wonder that was built by a metal worker that was not to good with metal- didn't know what square or level meant & used steel in the window enclosures. I am a wood tradesman and would have used wood enclosures or none for concrete as sliders are usually just installed into the cement. Unfortunately I was to busy taking care of the plumbing septic & landscaping to catch the steel enclosures( never hire a smithy to build a house.) LOL In the end our contractor underbid the house by 150,000 baht & Alisa & I reconstructed close to 40% of the house & it still makes a tick sound 6 times a day as the steel cools in the cement where the windows were installed. Next house I know just what to watch out for. This house was cheap to build-but the real house will cost a couple more baht as we are going for upgraded kitchen & bath as well(over the shell cost)

Good luck .....let us know how it goes.

[technocracy]

All you have to do is layout all your conduit prior to construction so they see what you want to do.

It is no more & no less trouble than chopping holes after.

Mostly it is suggested to use 2.5 mm2 wire for sockets - but you might want to run 4mm2 to allow for future upgrades. Remember to wire air cons - even if you don't buy them for years to come. Ditto kitchen stove - storage water heater - pump house etc.

You can never have too many wall outlets.

ACC blocks - are those the insulated ones?

You should never run 4mm2 for standard sockets on a radial circuit there just isn't a need since a standard radial would be protect with a 20amp breaker. The 20 amp draw is sufficient for all standard household appliances. Any high draw appliances requiring more than 20amps should be given there own radial and breaker. Ideally the kitchen should be on it's own radial due many kitchen appliances having high power consumption and also having many sockets in use.

As for installing the conduit in the cavity I sure could do this once the initial outer skin wall has been put up - however the problem would be with the boxes. Getting the brickies to put the gap for the box at the same height all around the house just wouldn't happen - not attractive. Also more importantly leaving a gap you'll end up with no way to secure your boxes to the wall since the brick would be larger than the box!

The only way around this would be to ensure you have permanent mark where the wire is any then drill a large hole in the brick to be able extract the wire THEN cut out a box space. Not easy in the slightest!

On the cutting in side of things all this work would be done as soon as the inner wall skin is up - which could built first so the work would be done very early into the build.

I cut in all cable runs and the sockets in our house over 2 days - an angle grinder with cutting disc does the job very quick it's just the chasing out with the chiesel afterwards which is slow and hard going. I think it took me around a week to complete our house - this was working alone.

[longball53098]

Hi Longball,

It sounds like your house might be similar to our 2nd house we are starting to build.

Our was modified from 154sq. mtr. to 145 sq.meters. We were quoted around 1.5- 1.6 using all the pumps wells & septic off the old structure 8 months old. I will be doing the plumbing as I do not care for the low quality of standards here.

We are using red brick instead as where we live 45 minutes from you, We have a great breeze that keeps it cool year round (with the exception of 6 weeks in the year of hot season.) When it comes to putting in the plumbing in the double wall a lot of contractors are going to tell you can do & cut the walls to shreds as they have in the last double wall projects I have seen.

If you are going to be present best get an idea of if the plumber really can do (understand-you do not want your walls cut) A lot of the problem in Thailand is they are used to doing things 1 way & 1 way only.I have opted to put all my pipes exterior & put an expanded metal case (painted to match & look tasteful.) Within 15-20 minutes I can get access to all the pipes by removing the access cover. In the bathroom & kitchen (hidden ) all pipes will be in a channel with a grate I can lift up to access. our first house I put in a 4" pipe & ran the water 1/2 pipe through the channel easily. The contractor broke my fist line(he was a true idiot) & it only took 25 minutes to break off the 90 & install a new piece. The way he would have done it I would have needed to go through cement. My septic has a 5" pipe with the 4" pipe gong through it as well. Our first project has no crawl through & is built ground level. The best way to build will be to have easiest access points to all plumbing electrical & other assorted things you want. The new project will have a crawl through as the first structure was just to get us out of paying rent & living on the property.

Some most important things not discussed yet & are on coo-th site & the other site you will be on is the absolute importance of a very strict payment schedule. If you have a 3 or 4 different times of payment(IE: down payment- walls done- roof on-final or however you want to set up the pay schedule. Some people pay 5 payments.)

The Thai builder are unscrupulous up here & love to give an unrealistic bid. Than ask for extra draws along the way. That is a huge mistake if you give them advances. What happens soon the draw against all the available funds & when they are close to the end of the funds . They jet & let you fix the rest by yourself or pay the additional fees to have another team come in &

complete the job (at a higher rate- same as the U.S. Rework always cost more!)

It sounds like you are going about it right. The worse thing you can do up here is be an acting general contractor & hire teams a foreman .... usually nothing but problems if you are not a general contracter.

Even though I have built spec houses & refurbishing HUD houses & have my general contractor license, I would not dream of being the general as it is way different here in LOS. In the west you can have the crews do exactly the way you want & they are trained & well versed in many ways to achieve the same success in the end(That & they have to pass the certifications exams & be bonded & insured to work) Here their are no real tangible guarantees . Court is a joke!

I would realistically put away at least 25% over the amount quoted. within 2 months the prices have gone up drastically on supplies & I do not think this trend will change course. If you are going to use slate opposed to tile that will also increase your cost by up to 400+% pending on what you chose to build. The kitchen & bathroom can also drive up your cost if you o upgrade & will probably put you into a higher expense bracket. Last but not least: Look at some jobs the builder has done .

check for excessive cracks in walls. Straight walls(preferably some one who has a knowledge of T-squares & levels.)

Get at least 4 bids- Remember this is what you are going to be living in for a while, so take a little time & find out quality- any references from people in the houses you looked at. If you go 4 bids typically the first 1 or 2 will be to low & they will cost more as they are bidding to cheap. The 1 or 2 on the end will be to high as the builder is to greedy or has to pay the farang boss his cut & drive the price up. The one in the middle is your man If his work is clean & seems like he is easy to deal with. We asked owner of the house we like- how she liked the work. How easy is it to make changes(if done before walls are up) how the 2 year guarantee is. was the builder pretty much on time building completion. Does he provide the security for watching the supplies mixers. block etc. Most do, but do not take it for granted. Our house will also have 2.5 meters patio space all the way around. The roof will be extended to keep everything dry& shaded.

Remember to keep somewhat within your structured budget. Not uncommon to have a builder try to upgrade your design & drive your end cost up.

I have seen your posts on this site & you seem like you will do alright as you have the main ingredient..COMMON SENSE!

I made the mistake of building a 30 day wonder that was built by a metal worker that was not to good with metal- didn't know what square or level meant & used steel in the window enclosures. I am a wood tradesman and would have used wood enclosures or none for concrete as sliders are usually just installed into the cement. Unfortunately I was to busy taking care of the plumbing septic & landscaping to catch the steel enclosures( never hire a smithy to build a house.) LOL In the end our contractor underbid the house by 150,000 baht & Alisa & I reconstructed close to 40% of the house & it still makes a tick sound 6 times a day as the steel cools in the cement where the windows were installed. Next house I know just what to watch out for. This house was cheap to build-but the real house will cost a couple more baht as we are going for upgraded kitchen & bath as well(over the shell cost)

Good luck .....let us know how it goes.

beardog,

thanks for all the valuable info and tips. We're still 3 or 4 months from any hole digging and if the US economy keeps flushing down the toilet I may postpone it for more than a few months.

I will take all you have said into consideration for my build. I live here and within 10 minutes of the build site and plan to be there daily

[dave_boo]

All you have to do is layout all your conduit prior to construction so they see what you want to do.

It is no more & no less trouble than chopping holes after.

Mostly it is suggested to use 2.5 mm2 wire for sockets - but you might want to run 4mm2 to allow for future upgrades. Remember to wire air cons - even if you don't buy them for years to come. Ditto kitchen stove - storage water heater - pump house etc.

You can never have too many wall outlets.

ACC blocks - are those the insulated ones?

I believe Thai electrical installation regulations now require 3 wire live/neutral/earth good sense chai mai?

He didn't list how many wires.....simply use 2.5 mm² (0.0984 in diameter, between 11 and 10 AWG for Americans) or 4.0 mm² (0.1575 in diameter, between 7 and 6 AWG). Even if the regulations require it, who's inspecting the new construction? AFAIK, some official came from the local amphur, took a quick look at the house we had just built and issued the house book; quite different than America!

BTW, if you are interested, at this link you can download America's National Electric Code. While I don't think it's as restrictive as what's in place in Europe, it will open your eyes when you start looking at local standards.

[petertucker48]

New House Build Plan

Will this plan succeed?

I am posting this to get some feedback from anyone who has/is/will be building a house here in LOS. I plan to post this on at least 3 forums and let the fur fly. I expect to get thrashed soundly by many of you. Oh well! I have old broad shoulders. For anyone wanting to contribute and give me words of encouragement of have better ideas/suggestions bring them on. If all you want to do is bash me well that’s your prerogative.

I am in the final planning stages for my new house. Hope to build early next year. I do not have a builder contracted yet so I have time to adjust my intentions and modify the plans.

The house will be a normal single story bungalow built on a foundation with a service/crawl space under the floor. The floor will be 90cm off the ground. The house area will be about 155 square meters or for those that use feet about 1670 square feet. Your typical 2 bed, 2 baths, combined living/dining area with an office area off the living room area and the western style kitchen.

I have this idea I can make this house for about 1.75 million baht which includes a nice covered 2 car park and an exterior pump house. I have seen similar houses being built for close to this figure.

So, with this basic information here is my idea for the construction.

All the exterior and interior walls will be made with the AAC blocks 7.5cm but in addition I will make them double walls.

Why you ask?

For a few reasons; insulation is one, noise reduction is two, no columns sticking out in the rooms but clean lines in and out with flush walls three,

And number four, I have this idea I can convince a builder and his team to install the electric piping and water piping in the wall spaces between the double blocks. In other words no cutting of walls to install any pipes. To add more to this I will try to have the water and drain lines routed down under the floor (remember my crawl space) and then under the foundation walls to the septics and drain pipes. The electric pipes will route from the wall spaces up to the ceiling and cross to the wall containing the service panel. Again the main feed from the PEA meter will come under the foundation and up the wall to the panel. With this idea there will not be any pipes buried under the tiled floors and walls that later may need service.

I have asked this question to at least 2 Thai builders and they didn’t say “no can do” or even “up to you”. One actually said oh I see you do not want to cut the walls? Ok good.

So here is the end to this first post to get your brains in gear and tell me that I am going to wake up soon from this dream or good luck, great idea and here’s what you need to do to get it done that way.

Thanks in advance or any helpful answers and good ideas. And I hope there are more of these than nay Sayers.

:D

Can I suggest www.coolthaihouse.com found it very useful whilst building my 145 sq mtr house

[harrry]

May be an idea to put some cat 6 computer cable to each room. Remember even if you do not need the computer now you may want it or the ability for security or remote control in future.

[ACMIKE]

I am in the middle of building a house in a gated development and my only advice is to ensure you allow enough money for extras. I went way overboard with kitchen and outside pool pool area and a few other things. I plan on living there 30 years so I went top of the line appliances, cabinets, etc. Whether you do this or not there will be unexpected expenses, 1.75 million does not sound to me like that leaves you much for these items.

Just my 2 cents...

Mike

[jojothai]

New House Build Plan

Will this plan succeed?

Seeing is believing. Been there and done that so to speak.

Notes and pics below Took abit of time to put together but sure will help you.

house_pics_and_notes.pdf

I will be putting a water tank in the roof as well as at ground level. Pipes supply the services from the roof tank so can go to the cavities easily.

Im just about to start internal finishing and need to think hard about putting water pipes down the cavity. Other TV comments make me consider risks of leaks.

In practise there is only one joint to make top and bottom and its the bottom joint to worry about leaks. The Top I can get to easily. Have to think how I can check bottom for leaks (probably put a small drain pipe through at bottom of wall) and how to allow for fix if necessary.

In practise I will checking the joints are well sealed at the bottom.

look at pics and read the ones with notes I trust this helps

jojo

[jojothai]

Following my last mail. I didnt include anything on the footings.

Checked my photos and i dont have any good pics, but 4 below are related.

three show holes being dug one shows water. The fourth pic shows the area where I had to put ground tie beams under the carport and at a stairway area. Here You can see the outline of the pad footings.

The footings are conventional pads 1m to 1.8 meter square width&length. 250 to 400mmm thick.

Where I built I dug 4 trial holes, one at each corner of the plot, well before we started the house so I would know if we can build readily on the ground conditions.

This was particularly important because we have a large canal very close with only a dirt road and big ditch between the new house location and the canal.

I wanted to be sure that the land in the house area was original and had not been regraded during canal construction.

You always need to check what the ground is like. Bangkok and surrounding areas have very bad ground that may need piling.

The trial holes showed we had good ground at between 1 and 1.4 meters deep and one side of the area the water table was at about 1m which had created a weak layer of muddy ground for 0.3 to 0.4 m below. It was very messy getting this layer out.

When you dig the holes you can check the ground by using a wooden peg say about 1.5 inch diameter with a pointed end not too sharp - 45 degrees is ok and see if you can push in to the ground by hand. If you can push it down without too much effort then the ground is not satisfactory. If you can push it down with some effort then it should not go down much, say up to about one inch.

Just think that you will be placing a large load on the concrete pad. If you can push the ground down easily, what do you think may happen to your house?

If you have weak ground which seems to go down along way then get a long steel pin at least 1/2 inch diameter and see how far you can push this down into the ground. if it seems to hit solid then drive it with a lump hammer to check it is not just a piece of rock or similar. Check it gives the same results in a few places.

DURING MYBUILDING, Even though the builder knew I wanted him to get down to the solid layer underneath the men still dug to only about a meter and I had to keep checking with the peg to make sure there was not the weak muddy layer below. Several times they had to dig more to get to the solid layer. If they had left any of the weak muddy layer then I would be in serious trouble with foundation settlement.

They particularly did not like digging out the muddy ground where the water was and so kept me on my toes.

When we had to dig this out deeper with the water in the base of the hole we had to dig a sump(small deeper hole) wide enough for a bucket in one corner so we could extract water to keep the hole relatively dry while we placed a lean mix concrete ( less cement) to fill the hole to the pad base level.

jojo

[longball53098]

Thanks to all for posting the tips and information

[longball53098]

Following my last mail. I didnt include anything on the footings.

Checked my photos and i dont have any good pics, but 4 below are related.

three show holes being dug one shows water. The fourth pic shows the area where I had to put ground tie beams under the carport and at a stairway area. Here You can see the outline of the pad footings.

The footings are conventional pads 1m to 1.8 meter square width&length. 250 to 400mmm thick.

Where I built I dug 4 trial holes, one at each corner of the plot, well before we started the house so I would know if we can build readily on the ground conditions.

This was particularly important because we have a large canal very close with only a dirt road and big ditch between the new house location and the canal.

I wanted to be sure that the land in the house area was original and had not been regraded during canal construction.

You always need to check what the ground is like. Bangkok and surrounding areas have very bad ground that may need piling.

The trial holes showed we had good ground at between 1 and 1.4 meters deep and one side of the area the water table was at about 1m which had created a weak layer of muddy ground for 0.3 to 0.4 m below. It was very messy getting this layer out.

When you dig the holes you can check the ground by using a wooden peg say about 1.5 inch diameter with a pointed end not too sharp - 45 degrees is ok and see if you can push in to the ground by hand. If you can push it down without too much effort then the ground is not satisfactory. If you can push it down with some effort then it should not go down much, say up to about one inch.

Just think that you will be placing a large load on the concrete pad. If you can push the ground down easily, what do you think may happen to your house?

If you have weak ground which seems to go down along way then get a long steel pin at least 1/2 inch diameter and see how far you can push this down into the ground. if it seems to hit solid then drive it with a lump hammer to check it is not just a piece of rock or similar. Check it gives the same results in a few places.

DURING MYBUILDING, Even though the builder knew I wanted him to get down to the solid layer underneath the men still dug to only about a meter and I had to keep checking with the peg to make sure there was not the weak muddy layer below. Several times they had to dig more to get to the solid layer. If they had left any of the weak muddy layer then I would be in serious trouble with foundation settlement.

They particularly did not like digging out the muddy ground where the water was and so kept me on my toes.

When we had to dig this out deeper with the water in the base of the hole we had to dig a sump(small deeper hole) wide enough for a bucket in one corner so we could extract water to keep the hole relatively dry while we placed a lean mix concrete ( less cement) to fill the hole to the pad base level.

jojo

jojo,

thanks for posting your pics and the pdf of the walls and the conduit planning. You must have quite a builder and the costs involved to get them to do this must have been quite a bit. Do you have a link to the finished product?

[jojothai]

thanks for posting your pics and the pdf of the walls and the conduit planning. You must have quite a builder and the costs involved to get them to do this must have been quite a bit. Do you have a link to the finished product?

i was putting something together to show. Now attached includes the house plan and elevations drawings. Better get it out before I hit the road back to the province. I will need to get these pics etc put into the house build photo section at some time. There are differences in the way this has been built from normal practice but the pictures and notes are going to be useful.

roof_and_elevations.pdf

The house is a bit squeezed together in terms of what it provides. I dont see a need for rooms to be too big. The lounge and porch are very important.

I liked the original plan but changed to add bedroom no 4 and the 3rd bathroom.

Original house design had large gables each end which I thought were going to be a lot of weight and looked a bit too big, so I changed it to hip ends, then I decided to add the small top gable end ventilation panel.

The roof is a bit too high at 45 degree pitch, I should have reduced it to say 35.

The original roof steelwork design was very basic as is normal and it was not very good. I had to do a lot to get it worked out properly, realized and fixed some problems as we built.

I didnt want to have reinforcing bars sticking out of the roof beams to tie down the roof rafters. The way they do it here is just not good practise at all. I designed proper brackets to bolt into the concrete so the rafters could be easily welded to the brackets. They cost a bit of money and effort, but I feel much safer having the roof properly supported.

Dont think its easy to do, you are probably better letting them get on with it the way they normally do.. You might have guessed by now that I'm a civil engineer, so i actually worked out a lot of the detail myself. The builder wasnt much help at all.

Done airports, power stations and tunnels but never did a domestic house roof before. Has been quite a bit of a challenge.

When we started the roof steelwork the builder was running up to within a couple of months of his end target time. I knew we were likely to take a few extra months to complete and was not worried. However he then messed me about all the time and he would not get on with things properly.

I ended up having to be at the house most of the time ensuring he brought men in and got some work done. It took nearly 2.5 months to do the roof steelwork when it should have only taken 1. (Mind you the small roof overhang was a pain in the neck. It looks good but aint easy to get the small truss pieces made and fitted accurately.)

I couldnot let the builder go off the job because any other builder would have ripped me off truly to finish the roof steel. So I had to bear with it until the steel was on, then finished him.

We just managed to get the tiling done as the rainy season was starting. Have had a break for acouple of months while I tried toget some other work. A new Builder is now starting the internal work and finishing. Perhaps afew months to completion. Would be nice to finish before new year (however you got to be patient in LOS).

While the builder was doing the roof steelwork I had the time to put the conduits in the wall myself. Wasnot that difficult. Worst was three places where he had left wood in the cavity and I had to cut out several patches to get the b***dy wood out.

TWO MAJOR WARNINGS

Reinforcing bars are available in substandard size. They are smaller in size than they should be and can be bought more cheaply. They are stamped with the size they should have been eg 16 mm but may be only 13 or 14 mm. Presumably factory seconds that did not meet up with what they should be, or it is just a result of how they roll the bars out. Dealers sell them at the appropriate lower price to their weight.

ALWAYS do some spot checks on deliveries. check diameter. You can also check weight by cutting a piece off and compare with the TIS standard. And check the grade is stamped into deformed bars normally SD30 or SD40. That is the practise. Still cant be sure of strength unless special tests are done but that is pushing things. Dont use any deformed bars that are not stamped with the grade.

You will still get some "FULL SIZE" bars which are slightly low in weight. DO NOT USE SMALLER size less than about 90% of the design on concrete structural members unless you know somebody or an engineer who can advise you. Safety factors in the design will cover for some variablity but dont accept anything too low.

ROOF GIRDER C CHANNELS are stamped with a size which is not correct. In fact it can be difficult to get the proper size.

The standard sections used are 100 x 50 x 20 x 2.3mm (4 Kg per meter) OR 3.2 mm. (5.5 Kg per meter)

You will see the size is stamped in quite large on the girder.

These two sizes are a fixed standard which has a fixed weight per meter.

Here they sell these sections in light, medium, heavy and full. Light is only half the thickness it should be but all of these are stamped with the full thickness code. FULL size needed to be ordered specially.

I was at one of the biggest local suppliers and trucks were coming in and out whenever I was there.

They had big stocks inside and NONE of it was full size. So, all that was being used locally would be under size compared to what designs state!! No wonder we see many roofs spreading if the rafters are not up to strength, they will deflect.

I had some sent the wrong weight and told them to take back. I then could not wait too long for some full size and had to order the "heavy" grade which they could get within a few days. this was 28 Kg per 6 m instead of spec 33kg but by the design calcs it was going to be ok.

The supplier is selling the sections at the market price for the lower weight and NOT normally cheatinganybody. This is just a standard thing, the way it works.

However the builder gets a cheaper section which costs less than the full section would.

Some bulilders will inevitably cheat but dont think they all do. He may be supplying to you at the purchase price and does not know any different. He may have costed on that basis, and thinks it is saving you money on the price.

MAKE SURE your builder knows that you want the proper size as on the design and make him know that you know there are different versions of the size. It is not easy to check the thickness precisely so you must check the weight by balancing a six meter girder on a 50 / 100kg scale.

Another thing to note is that close to the sea I believe you are supposed to use 3.2 mm thickness to allow for more potential corrosion. It did not affect me.

keep these notes they are important.

ALSO, DONT FORGET THE GOLDEN RULE - The builders here donot look at the drawings. They build what/how they think it should be. In my case I made sure he didnt make too many cock ups, but we still had a few.

jojo

[jojothai]

For your info this is the steel C section coding I referred to

these I sent back because they were only about half the weight they should have been ie about 1.2 mm thick, not 2.3.

Also you will be wondering about the brackets I mentioned.

These pics show the two types used. The standard type which had two versions one left hand and one right hand, and then the special corner piece for the double girder support.

The tape you see on the edges is to permit a clean run for welding, the tape was peeled off when we did the welding. I used epoxy paint on these brackets and it is not good to be welding on epoxy paint.

I detailed the steel so that the steel rafter was only just above the concrete so we could rest the girder on the concrete and easily pack to level then weld to the side of the bracket. Had to chip the concrete back where it was high in some places.

Far better than welding to reinforcing bars sticking out of the concrete.

jojo

[jojothai]

While the builder was doing the roof steelwork I had the time to put the conduits in the wall myself. Wasnot that difficult. Worst was three places where he had left wood in the cavity and I had to cut out several patches to get the b***dy wood out.

jojo

Sorry said that wrong. When doing the roof steelwork I was actually doing the conduit in the internal single walls then.

The conduits in the cavity obviously have to be placed before the roof beam concrete is cast, and i did an area at a time just before. As I said, it wasnt difficult - but means you have to carefully work out in advance where you want sockets,

jojo

Edited October 3, 2008 by jojothai