Thaksin And Pojaman Apply For Asylum In England

[sriracha john]

This appears to be the best SIMPLIFIED definition I could find from UNHCR for a reason to consider political asylum.

"Unjustly exiled from their home country, refugees are persons forced to migrate to a new country for security and protection. The United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (the UN refugee agency) legally defines refugees as “people who are outside their countries because of a well-founded fear of persecution based on their race, religion, nationality, political opinion or social group.”"

UK Immigration also say:

"While many come to UK in the hope of finding sanctuary, others realise only after arrival that circumstances in their country have changed and that it would not be safe for them or their families to return."

from a different thread of Pokemon's....

Pojaman flies out amid asylum reports

Pojaman Shinawatra, the wife of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, flew to China with her adopted brother and secretary amid rumours that they would seek political asylum abroad.

Pojaman, Bhannapot Damapong, and Kanchanapa Honghern left Thailand at 10.40 AM from Suvarnabhumi Airport in Bangkok to Beijing. They were seen to carry several luggages with them. Some of her three children broke down into tears as they saw her off.

The report has been rife that they would seek political asylum after the Criminal Court sentenced the three to three years in jail after finding them guilty of tax evasion worth 546 Million Baht for the transactions of Shinawatra Computer and Communications shares.

The Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Political Office Holders summoned both Thaksin and Pojaman, the defendants in the Rachadapisek land purchase case to give their last testimony on August 22.

Thaksin has been expected to return from China to Thailand on August 10. He left Thailand to Japan on August 1 to give a special lecture.

- The Nation

Might I ask on what grounds they would seek Political Asylum? Or is it something one can buy nowadays? Convicted criminals are allowed to flee the country while rumours fly that they are going for good? Mind boggles although we should all be used to it by now.

Here's the choices...

The United Nations 1967 Protocol Relating to the Status of Refugees guides national legislation concerning political asylum. Under these agreements, a refugee is a person who is outside their own country's territory owing to fear of persecution on protected grounds.

Protected grounds include:

1. race

2. nationality

3. religion

4. political opinions

5. membership and/or participation in any particular social group or social activities.

==============================================

Perhaps she'll go with #5 and claim she needs protection based upon her membership in the Hi-So social group and her participation in various social activities connected to that group.

Edited October 6, 2008 by sriracha john

[auserb]

They let everybody else live in the UK,Terrorists,etc,so why not two on the run as well.

I am sure our stupid government will give them a British Passport,and of course 24 hour Police protection,not forgetting they will be able too claim every State Benefit going,all at our taxpayers expense.

Send them both back to Thailand too face the music.

What is wrong with Mr. Taksin??? I ask you he is well off, has family well respected in Thailand but not with PAD. geeee I love him.

But for England . huh, they sure love him coz he has money (am I wrong or am I wrong ) England will take anybody , sure as long as they can benefit from them. Ask yourself would Mr. Taksin be welcome if he was broke???? haaaaaaaaaaaa. nopeee

Get your facts right auserb. Britain do not only take people that they can benefit from.

Funny you never mentioned Pinochet....

We are all aware of Pinochet so why mention him. I simply stated the laws on political asylum and the rights of those who wish to apply. Maybe the British Government will deport the Taksins to Australia as they have done with so many in the past.

Cheers, Rick

My dear friend..... if we are talking about depportation ???? England, to my recolection never depported rich people......Firstly they will grant Mr. Taksin visa.....I guaranty you milion to one..........later, they are going to deport him back to Thailan when they know there is no more use of him.....no pain no gaim.... About Australia, my friend Mr. Taksin was welcome to Australia and Australian people was sorry to see him go..

Chears,

auserb

Silly old me thinking that Australian people respected the idea of rule of law and all that goes with it, and believed in fair play and all that kind of nonsense. I stand corrected, auserb, that the Australian people actually support extra-judicial execution on a mass scale as practiced by that hero of Australia ex-Thai PM Thaksin.

I think not.

yeah, you might be right too, but please read Mr, Einstains last repport

chears,

auserb

[citizen33]

the Ghurkhas who died for the UK get treated like crap - I dont trust potiticians.

(Partially off topic)

It is true that the UK government hasn't treated the Ghurkhas well in the past and that there was a setback last year re pensions. But did you miss the story last week that a group of pre-1997 retirees won their test case for the right to stay in the UK? A piece of good news in a difficult week!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7644441.stm

Edited October 6, 2008 by citizen33

[Springman]

Oh dear here we go again. England = Britain = UK. England = England.

Sad that English people are the only nationality in the world who do not know their own country's name or borders.

Off-topic, but what is the name of the island? Britain? Great Britain? If the latter, is there a non-great Britain, too?

This can be very complicated to explain to people that are not from the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. But here goes.

The Republic of Ireland and the United Kingdom are the only two sovereign states. Ireland and Great Britain are both islands. England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are constituent countries of the United Kingdom.

You have the basic idea. There are many other islands in the British Isles. Most of these are politically part of England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland or the Republic of Ireland, with the exceptions of the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands, which are British crown dependencies and not part of the UK (or ROI) at all.

Complications

The UK's full name is "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland". Citizens of the UK are called "British". One British person is called a Briton.

The ROI's full name is "The Republic of Ireland" (if you are speaking English) or "Éire" (if you are speaking Irish). Citizens of the ROI are called "Irish".

Irish citizens are not British citizens. British citizens are not Irish citizens. God help you if you forget this when you encounter an Irishman.

Ethnically:

People from England are called English.

People from Scotland are called Scottish.

People from Wales are called Welsh.

People from Northern Ireland are called Northern Irish.

People from Ireland are called Irish.

There is no such thing as English, Scottish, Welsh or Northern Irish citizenship. English, Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish people almost always hold British citizenships. Of course, anybody, living anywhere in the British Isles, can have any ethnicity, and hold any citizenship.

Many people living in Northern Ireland (which is part of the UK) are Irish citizens. Some British citizens living in Northern Ireland (which is part of the UK) classify themselves as Irish-ethnic. Some people living in Northern Ireland would even like Northern Ireland itself classified as Irish i.e. made part of the ROI instead of the UK. This is a contentious point.

The ROI is not British. However, the "British Isles" include both the UK and ROI. Irish citizens and Irish-ethnic people hate this, but there is no consensus on what to call it instead.

So where is Taksin appyling for Asylum. LOL

Cheers, Rick

[Samuian]

I'll publicly burn my UK passport outside the Bangkok Embassy if they are granted asylum.

Good, I personally give them my thumbs up when they give him exile. He has done a lot good for the people of Thailand, unlike Chuan, Chavalit, Banharn and lots of others who only filled their pockets. Best joke of it all is that the son of Thailand most corrupt prime minister ever Choonhavan, is lecturing people like you about being an honest politician. I suppose only you believe in them. But never w=mind have a good dream and go for the people of the PAD who are the biggest undemocratic criminals of all.

Dead man talking?

Chuan "the ditherer" never had the guts to pocket one Satang!

[Thai at Heart]

a great scenario would be - asylum on the condition that his diplomatic passport is surrended - then see how far he can travel - most countries in the western world require Thai's to have a visa to enter - and they won't grant visa's if you are on the run from the law or are a convicted crim who has skipped bail (pokeman) so they may be stuck in dreary old UK for the rest of their days or come back to Thailand and face the music - oh how the wheel turns.

You are assuming he doesn't have a British passport already.

[neverdie]

This will officially make him a POME (Prison of mother england). That place is full of them trying to escape....I can't imagine theres many people kicking the entry door down.

[Artisi]

a great scenario would be - asylum on the condition that his diplomatic passport is surrended - then see how far he can travel - most countries in the western world require Thai's to have a visa to enter - and they won't grant visa's if you are on the run from the law or are a convicted crim who has skipped bail (pokeman) so they may be stuck in dreary old UK for the rest of their days or come back to Thailand and face the music - oh how the wheel turns.

You are assuming he doesn't have a British passport already.

That's a horrible thought.

[PeaceBlondie]

Last month, I was visited by friends who attend church with my daughter. He works in Texas where the Taksin was awarded or sold a Ph.D, probably in criminal justice, of all things. My friend is a political asylum lawyer, and many of his clients are refugees from the State of Chin, in westernmost Myanmar. Now, what would Jesus do? What would the Buddha do, or the governor of Texas, or a judge in a hearing for political asylum of a citizen of Myanmar, who could not live in Thailand? We could put the Thaksins in a nice internment camp in Texas (much nicer than the camp at Guantanamo Bay) while they await the decision. Always glad to help you, we're from the government; the check is not in the mail.

[phuketrichard]

we all saw this one coming

I agree;

They are criminals and should be treated as such. What kind of goverment would grant them this EXCEPT for the fact he is buying his way in.

Now with his Brother in law in power all charges will be thrown out anyway

Shame on the UK

and please stop with the uk/british/ireland thing

we all know where he is and where he is applying

Edited October 6, 2008 by phuketrichard

[Sunderland]

I'll help you burn it ...

I'll publicly burn my UK passport outside the Bangkok Embassy if they are granted asylum.

[Samuian]

Now with his Brother in law in power all charges will be thrown out anyway

Exactly this may face the utmost resistance ever seen! because everyone involved knows very well what this charade is all about!

[george]

Update:

Thai PM: No problem on extradition of ex-premier Thaksin

BANGKOK: -- Thai Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat said here Monday he would not obstruct any plan on extraditing ousted, fugitive prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra from Britain to stand trial in court on graft and corruption charges.

Mr. Somchai, also defence minister, said he still had no knowledge of Mr. Thaksin and his wife Pojaman having applied for political asylum in Britain as reported by the press.

Asked whether the Thai government would request extradition of the former prime minister from the British government as the court has issued arrest warrants for the couple, Mr. Somchai, a brother-in-law of Mr. Thaksin, said everything has to follow judicial process and that he would not obstruct or help anybody. The couple fled to Britain after attending the opening ceremony of Beijing Olympic Games in early August.

In reference to the revocation of the diplomatic passport of Mr. Thaksin, a sensitive issue for the Thai government in which Deputy Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Sompong Amornwiwat said earlier that the matter is rested with the prime minister's decision, Mr. Somchai said he would ask the secretariat to the prime minister about its progress.

Mr. Somchai, however, denied accusations that his government had adopted a double standard on taking legal actions against Mr. Thaksin and retired Maj-Gen. Chamlong Srimuang, a core leader of the anti-government People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD), who was arrested Sunday on several charges including insurrection.

He said Gen. Chamlong was apprehended in line with an arrest warrant issued by the court. Gen. Chamlong is among the nine PAD core leaders charged with insurrection after the group's members and supporters seized Government House, the office of the prime minister, as well as several ministries and state agencies on August 26 in a bid to oust the government which it accused of being a proxy of Mr. Thaksin.

Police on August 27 issued arrest warrants for nine of the group's leaders on charges of insurrection, conspiracy, and illegal assembly on the part of more than 10 persons and refusing orders to disperse. The warrants imposed on the nine leaders spelled out serious criminal charges punishable by death or life imprisonment. To date, two of the nine leaders have been arrested by police.

-- TNA 2008-10-06

[animatic]

They let everybody else live in the UK,Terrorists,etc,so why not two on the run as well.

I am sure our stupid government will give them a British Passport,and of course 24 hour Police protection,not forgetting they will be able too claim every State Benefit going,all at our taxpayers expense.

Send them both back to Thailand too face the music.

What is wrong with Mr. Taksin??? I ask you he is well off, has family well respected in Thailand but not with PAD. geeee I love him.

But for England . huh, they sure love him coz he has money (am I wrong or am I wrong ) England will take anybody , sure as long as they can benefit from them. Ask yourself would Mr. Taksin be welcome if he was broke????haaaaaaaaaaaa. nopeee

Get your facts right auserb. Britain do not only take people that they can benefit from.

Funny you never mentioned Pinochet....

Asylum applications to the UK

Under UK immigration rules, asylum is granted only in cases where refugees can prove that if they return to their country of origin they will be persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular group, or political opinion. This is in accordance with the 1951 United Nations (UN) convention relating to the status of refugees (and its 1967 protocol), and article three of the European convention on human rights. The rules exclude the vast majority of refugees currently allowed to stay in the UK under exceptional leave.

During 1999 there were 71,000 applications for political asylum in the UK, involving chiefly Kosovar refugees from the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia, and, in fewer numbers, Somalis, Sri Lankan Tamils, Afghans, Turkish and Iraqi Kurds, Albanians, and Chinese. By January 2000, there were 105,000 asylum seekers (not counting dependants) who were awaiting a decision on their status or who were appealing expulsion orders. Home Office statistics suggested that 36% of asylum applicants processed in 1999 were genuine refugees, but a further 11% were allowed to remain in the UK on compassionate grounds. Other figures suggested that fewer than 10% of those refused permission to stay had actually been deported (left the country), the remainder having disappeared into the population. New legislation came into effect in the UK on 1 April 2000, which, among other changes, provided for the 'fast track' processing of non‐complex cases, replaced welfare benefits with a food voucher system, worth £35 a week for an adult, and allowed asylum seekers to be forcibly dispersed into accommodation around the UK. The new measures enabled the numbers awaiting a decision to fall to around 90,000 by May 2000. However, the indirect and direct cost to the UK of supporting asylum seekers soared to £900 million in the 1999–2000 financial year.

Not too many rich people here. Also Taksin has the right to apply on the grounds that he stated that he has had threats on his life in Thailand, be it true or not.

By the way i think that he should be sent back to Thailand for trial.

Cheers, Rick

Yes Ricky, as I sai ....Funny you never mentioned Pinochet and in this dialog we are talking about individuals not the whole of the nation my dear friend.. I love Taksin and his govrnment.. I am most probably only individual who supports people from remote Thailand and Isan

So you are saying the ONLY way to support Issan remote Thailand people is

to support Thaksin, no matter what he steals fro the country?

NOT.

I support Issan people, I have been paying several recurrently for building work,

and better than the prevailing wage too. Even gave them a satalite TV for 2 years.

That is direct support not trickle down Reagan-omics support.

If Thaksin had paid his taxes on the Temasek deal

by doing some REAL projects in Issan tthat benifited the people there,

ALL the people there, not just the puyais, he would STILL be PM.

And the country would love him, even as he was elbows deep in the trough...

But he was too greedy by half again and wanted to KEEP IT ALL.

We now see his hubris playing out it's end game.

I feel I can support Issan people BETTER

by getting him and his proxies off their backs.

[Frotting]

Oh dear here we go again. England = Britain = UK. England = England.

Sad that English people are the only nationality in the world who do not know their own country's name or borders.

Oh Dear Indeed! I would imagine the Family Taksin arrived in London, which when I was last over that way was in England. So England, UK, Britain, etc, in this case are all having the same meaning, i.e. that's where the man has gone. He has a place in London, which is in England and also in the United Kingdom (by default).

All I can think of is that you are one of those complaining individuals we call FRISPS, south of Hadrian's Wall. Note interestingly that when Scots speak of Gas, it's British Gas, but when they speak of Oil, it's Scottish Oil. So you're not totally innocent of nationalism yourself. By the way, the capital of Gt Britain happens to be in England. Get over it.

Back to the original topic, Taksin and family should have been turned around at the airport. The fact they weren't implies that the UK Government might just be equally as corrupt as their counterpart in Thailand (or maybe a little more). I can't imagine any other country allowing entry to convicted felons - this is definitely not a refugee case. As another poster commented, Thailand wouldn't even let Garry Glitter in (a time-served lawbreaker and no longer wanted for anything!). Seems the worse you are the better you get treated, and if you kill 20,000 plus they get out the red carpet.

[mich]

Uk passport? No problem, they give UK passports and all benefits to anybody, as long as they are not british, a criminal and on the run. No wonder no real brits want to live there anymore.

[davylad]

your third paragraph is totally inaccurate. the act of union was between england and wales only. scotland and northern ireland are countries within the uk.

the original post got it spot on.

Oh dear here we go again. England = Britain = UK. England = England.

Sad that English people are the only nationality in the world who do not know their own country's name or borders.

Bulls**t.....I'm British and know it. I was born in England of a half English, half Scottish father and a half English, half Irish mother.

My passport is issued by "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland" commonly known as "The UK" and inside it says Nationality: British Citizen.

The United Kingdom of Great Britain consists of a Union between England, Scotland and Wales plus some outlying islands making up the geographical area "British Isles", "Britain" or "Great Britain".

You are always British first, English, Scottish or Welsh etc. second.....

But why we don't have a national British football team beats me and sadly here in Thailand most Thais only seem to know names of countries football teams hence the use of "I'm English" or "I'm Scottish" and never "I'm British". And if I'm getting my history timeline correct "The English" aka Angrit came to Thailand before the forming of the United Kingdom.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_United_Kingdom states:

The history of the United Kingdom—British history— as an unified sovereign

state begins with the legistlative union between the kingdoms of England and

Scotland on 1 May 1707. England and Wales and Scotland had been in personal

union since the Union of the Crowns in 1603, when James VI of Scotland succeeded

his cousin Elizabeth I as James I of England. In the ensuing century powerful

sectarian and political differences divided the kingdoms, however under the Acts

of Union 1707 England and Scotland were unified as the Kingdom of Great Britain,

sharing a single constitutional monarch and parliament at Westminster.

There was a UNION between England and Scotland in 1707 as well as a prior UNION between England, Wales and Scotland in 1603. There never was a separate England and Wales only union. And are you trying to say Wales is not a country? I'm sure a few million Welsh would disagree with that.....

So you are wrong........

Wales isn't a country it's a principality

[APACHE3101]

I'll publicly burn my UK passport outside the Bangkok Embassy if they are granted asylum.

Cool, and after you'll ask a new one in same embassy!

[SamuiJens]

I'll publicly burn my UK passport outside the Bangkok Embassy if they are granted asylum.

Cool, and after you'll ask a new one in same embassy!

Why, you work there?

[mrtoad]

Toxin and Pokaman should never have been given entry to the UK in the first place, when it was so bloody clear that his wife had jumped bail. An easy, sorry entry denied, would have saved a lot of hassle, and probably embarrasment for the UK government, who I am sure will not feel comfortable with granting asylums to a convicted criminal and a suspected human rights violator. The sad and shameful thing is that he will probably get what he wants.

[APACHE3101]

I'll publicly burn my UK passport outside the Bangkok Embassy if they are granted asylum.

Cool, and after you'll ask a new one in same embassy!

Why, you work there?

Because the passport is something that goverment give us to travel, not all country give this right to their citizens. You can burn your pass if you want but please remember that.

[phaethon]

Cool, and after you'll ask a new one in same embassy!

BUSINESS OPPORTUITY: Selling imitation British passports outside the embassy for people to symbolically burn

[animatic]

This appears to be the best SIMPLIFIED definition I could find from UNHCR for a reason to consider political asylum.

"Unjustly exiled from their home country, refugees are persons forced to migrate to a new country for security and protection. The United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (the UN refugee agency) legally defines refugees as “people who are outside their countries because of a well-founded fear of persecution based on their race, religion, nationality, political opinion or social group.”"

UK Immigration also say:

"While many come to UK in the hope of finding sanctuary, others realise only after arrival that circumstances in their country have changed and that it would not be safe for them or their families to return."

from a different thread of Pokemon's....

Pojaman flies out amid asylum reports

Pojaman Shinawatra, the wife of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, flew to China with her adopted brother and secretary amid rumours that they would seek political asylum abroad.

I think they should be bodily ejected a la Gary Glitter,

just on the basis of her horrendous hairstyles.

And affront to bad taste, let alone GOOD taste.

[Bruce1]

Once he's allowed into the UK and becomes a permanent resident, won;t it be easier for Thailand to seek his extradition?

[MyFriend You]

I'll publicly burn my UK passport outside the Bangkok Embassy if they are granted asylum.

Hope its an expired one, you may need a real one if it gets any worse.............

[Gravelrash]

So when you Pomms here the term Pommie B*stard next, which for most of you won't be a long wait, know that it also refers to your countryman and mate Taksin.

In fact let me start it off "That Pommie B*stard Taksin made a real mess of things in Thailand". If Thailand was never colonised why did it have a Pomm running things for a few years?

[BlackJack]

buy this man a drink

conversation with UK visas...

"yes sir, I understand you want a visa. Exactly what type of visa would you like.If you want a tourist visa I must ask have you visited here 3 times in the last 6 months? Oh well, that's no good. I know that's ridiculous, sir. Shall we try a business visa? Ok. You need to return to your country to get the correct visa to start the process. You're not keen on going back there at the moment. Ok. Maybe we can start the visa from here. Do you have partners in your business? Oh, you don't need any because you are rich. Well, your business will have to be owned 51% by British Nationals. You don't trust any British Nationals and why would you want other people owning more than half of your business. Don't ask me sir, I only work here. Marriage visa maybe? Have you had 80,000 pounds sat in a British bank for the last 3 months and never allowed it to go less than that amount. Note, sir, that money will need to stay in the bank for an undetermined length of time because we want to check if you borrowed of one of your friends. Oh, you don't have any friends now.OK. Please don't shout sir, it is considered rude. What about an investment visa? Ah, you like the sound of that. Good. Do you have any property in this country sir? Excellent. Are more than half the people who live in you street British? Not sure.OK, well they would need to be. I imagine you could knock all their doors to find out , sir. I'm not certain how poplular that would be. You did buy the property new, did you sir? Oh, secondhand.Ah. Oh wait i forgot ,they have cancelled the investment visa. Yes sir, I do know what I am doing. May I suggest you nip on a cheap flight to Singapore,but they can be tricky, or KL, but they can also ask for a lot of paperwork,or possibly Penang, and get a single entry there.Once you get over there is an airline called Air Asia, I doubt you have heard of it. Oh you have heard of it. Please stop swearing, sir. Well they are a bit cheap and nasty, but you can bounce round on them until you find a way back. Thank you sir, but I will not do that to myself. Thank you and goodbye."

i put this up a couple of years ago in http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Thaksin-requ...ml&p=941332

seems to have come round again..asylum this time tho...

[JetsetBkk]

My dear friend..... if we are talking about depportation ???? England, to my recolection never depported rich people......Firstly they will grant Mr. Taksin visa.....I guaranty you milion to one........

Do you mean they will guarantee him asylum? I'll have some of that action - 10 baht.

Have you got 10,000,000 ?

[paully]

1. How does one claim political persecution when one's own party controls the government and one's brother-in-law is prime minister???

Too true! Part of me would love to see their application just to laugh at the lies their expensive lawyers have come up with. 'Well-founded fear of persecution', indeed.

But, let's face it, the odds of this slippery and unlovely pair actually being removed from the UK are so slim they might as well be zero. That's when the laughter stops and the sense of outrage boils over.

Edited October 6, 2008 by paully

[snuggzzz]

Thaksin has sold Manchester City making in excess of £50 million (GBP). That amount will undoubtedly be enough to ensure his self sufficiency in the UK.

Last year he was allowed entry, the allegations had already been made, however, the UK admitted him. I think any application will be treated sympathetically by the UK Govt.