Thaksin Gets More Time To Fight Assets Seizure Case

[Artisi]

If he wants to fight the case, he should return to TH and do it in person

....... and face a corrupt legal system that has already made up its mind......

….. just read the recent articles written by the economist newspaper and you can see what is really going in thailand… and why Thaksin is being persecuted….. unfortunately these comments are not allowed to be published in thailand or on this forum... but a quick google will help!

And is the Economist biased in any way - seems they like to gloss-over thaksins misdeeds by playing it down and sharing the responsibility to all and sundry.

[sriracha john]

No one of significance. Just unidentifiable attendees of the What The New World Wants? conference.

That girl in the white has really really scary eyes, is she one of Sonthi's khmer ghosts?

No, I believe it's someone who's transfixed by the notion that Thaksin thinks he is What The New World Wants....

[geriatrickid]

Not providing evidence at "discovery" is grounds for dismissal of the charges ...

It's not prosecutors' job to provide the evidence to the defence. Defence has to ask the court.

Your comment is valid in part because I was inexact in my terminology. I also didn't explain myself properly. Apologies. Thailand does not have a Discovery process as known to people that grew up in most English speaking western countries. However, in this case, my understanding was that the defense did request the documents and followed the procedure of filing a subpoena asking that the information be provided. What I did not know is that there are few if any sanctions applied for non compliance with a subpoena for evidence. (I shouldn't be surprised since TiT applies.) I have the impression that the judge acted to ensure there was fairness. I still believe that had the judge not intervened, any guilty verdict ensuing would have been portrayed as tainted.

It must be incredibly hard to defend oneself under the Thai system and I don't envy those with legal problems.

[wayfarer108]

You should ask in a more topic-specific thread.

You're right, I should try but I'm not holding my breath regarding the success of such a thread.

I'm asking about a guy who hold a nation hostage for what I believe to be no more that a personal vendetta and what answer do I get ? A wonderful tactical move from Plus to switch the focus of the people to the scary eyes of a girl in the background of a picture of very doubtful information value. I have to be realistic, we’re not playing in the same league.

Pierrot, the Pad is not such Sondhi, although it may sometimes appear that way with the media grabbing onto his demagoguery (yes, he's a liability to the Pad at this point and yes he obviously has a personal dislike for Thaksin).

Over a hundred groups make up the PAD coalition, all of them NGOs representing labour, students, farmers, academics, journalists, social workers and marginalized populations. Some of the more prominent NGO members of the alliance include the Student Federation of Thailand (SFT), Thai Labour Solidarity Committee (TLSC), Campaign for Popular Media Reform (CPMR), Campaign for Popular Democracy (CPD), 14 October Foundation, Young People for Democracy Movement (YPD), Peace Progressive Woman Network (PPWN) and Thai Labour Campaign (TLC). Plus every state enterprise union, I believe, via the Government Enterprise Labour Confederation.

[permanent_disorder]

Apart from the fact that the Economist is not a "newspaper" but a magazine,...

FYI The Economist is a newspaper.

everybody knows that.

[ratcatcher]

It happened in Taiwan, it should happen in Thailand. The similarities are remarkable.

Former Taiwan president indicted

Advertisement

Prosecutors in Taiwan have formally indicted ex-President Chen Shui-bian and his wife on corruption charges.

The charges include forgery and money laundering, a spokesman for the prosecutors said.

The 57-year-old former leader, held in a Taipei jail since 12 November while prosecutors probed his affairs, was later released on bail.

Mr Chen has denied any wrongdoing, saying he is being persecuted by his successors for his anti-China stance.

He has been a vocal and persistent critic of the new government's China policies since he left office in May, at the end of eight years in the presidency.

His accusations have been denied by both the Chinese government and Taiwan's current President Ma Ying-jeou, of the Nationalist Kuomingtang party (KMT).

'Severest punishment'

Mr Chen, his wife, and 12 others were indicted on charges of corruption, money laundering, embezzlement and document forgery charges, a spokesman for the prosecutors' office said.

The couple stand accused of embezzling millions of dollars in public funds and accepting a huge bribe in a land purchase deal.

More here:http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7778960.stm

[ratcatcher]

No one of significance. Just unidentifiable attendees of the What The New World Wants? conference.

That girl in the white has really really scary eyes, is she one of Sonthi's khmer ghosts?

No, I believe it's someone who's transfixed by the notion that Thaksin thinks he is What The New World Wants....

Perhaps that was a tongue in cheek comment, but Lakshmi Mittal,( the tall man looking at Thaksin's back), is the 5th richest man in the world according to Forbes. He is head of Mittal Steel, the world's largest steel company . Thaksin by comparison is a mere pauper, basking in the glow of other industrialists and dreaming of the day he will save Thailand and the world.

[animatic]

Apart from the fact that the Economist is not a "newspaper" but a magazine,...

FYI The Economist is a newspaper.

everybody knows that.

And which The Economist are you reading then?

Certainly NOT the periodical that owns the name.

Sure Googling it says newspaper, but that's Google.

There is a parent company 'Economist Newspaper'. Once it was.

but look on your browser at the top of the scroll bar of the PRINT edition page.

http://www.economist.com/printedition/

<title>The Economist magazine: contents page | The Economist</title>

The Magazine is the one with world circulation.

The King and Them is in the MAGAZINE.

Roll call and Around the Hill and European Voice are broadsheet formats.

Edited in London since 1843, The Economist is a weekly international news and business publication, offering clear reporting, commentary and analysis on world current affairs, business, finance, science and technology, culture, society, media and the arts. As noted on its contents page, The Economist's goal is to "take part in a severe contest between intelligence, which presses forward, and an unworthy, timid ignorance obstructing our progress." Printed in five countries, worldwide circulation is now over one million, and The Economist is read by more of the world's political and business leaders than any other magazine.

[LaoPo]

Apart from the fact that the Economist is not a "newspaper" but a magazine,...

FYI The Economist is a newspaper.

everybody knows that.

It's all in the game of what one wants to read or call it:

"While The Economist calls itself a "newspaper", each (weekly, LP) issue appears on glossy paper, like a newsmagazine." from Wiki.

It's interesting to learn which, opposite of what some claimed, articles were "most commented" (#2 and 4 over past five days) and which articles were "most recommended" (past seven days: #1 and 2)

http://www.economist.com/

LaoPo

[Koo82]

Pierrot, the Pad is not such Sondhi

Somkiat Pongpaiboon, a Sor Sor memmber from Democrat Party, was a leader in PAD.

[Plus]

Dems took on Somkiyat during junta days, when PAD was inactive and its former leaders went their own ways - some to the Senate, others to AEC, like Kaewsan, who's running for Bangkok governor now, with support of Ad Karabao who is a known Thaksin supporter.

In short - Somkiyat is not an evidence of Democrats hand in PAD, though they certainy share many common goals.

[old wanderer]

maybe you are living in a state of dilusion

i said read the economist comments and you can really see what is going on in thailand - i never said thaksin is innocent, but the judges elected by whom convicted him? what a joke....

he is certainly not a common criminal no matter what you may think, he still commands the vote of the vast majority of the population of thailand.... yes the common people who are not worthy of a vote....

if only you had 1% of his wealth....

the military and the "special" establishment of thailand want him out - because he is a real threat.... i cant beleive any foreigner with a brain in his head could support the terrorism of PADm military coups and so on..... but for some reason they do.... perhaps just following the honey....

anyway you are welcome to your opinion as i am welcome to mine....

Well here is a news flash for you......

1. In Thailand Judges are not elected...they are appointed and answer to only one person..Each verdict was carefully framed in observance of the law of Thailand.

2. Thaskin has numerous charges pending, and the proceeding have stalled because they require his physical presence in court to hear the charges.....If found guilty on only 50% he would spend the rest of his life in jail.

3. The PAD were far from terrorist, as you portray them...but really patriots fighting for the Kingdom of Thailand, and not to be taken over by the Thaskin Clan, and turned into his personal fiefdom. They are not a political party, or personality looking for political position, riches, or fame. I applaud their efforts.

4. My brain works quite well, and my wife and I have substantial investments in Thailand, and we gave both financial and moral support to the PAD. If you will recall what precipitated this peaceful protest is the attempt to amend the Constitution that would have irrevocably changed the whole culture of Thailand.

5. If you have ever listened to convicted criminals, and compared them to the Thaskin song and dance, they sound very similar. (Everybody is wrong, I am right, the courts are corrupt, the police are corrupt, I was doing a good thing...etc).

So as you state, you have your opinion, but get a grip, and look at the reality of a country...You can hardly put the future of the country in the hands of un-educated people with out any skill set to judge the probable outcome of any set of proposals that are put forth for the country.

In my wife's village most of the people their believe Thaskin personally paid to have the roads paved. And yes he paid them more than anyone in history just to vote for him....

Common Criminal....not far from Eide Amine. He has a lot of blood on his hands....So you are right he was not a Common Criminal,,,he is an extraordinary criminal.

And that is my opinion. (Plus hundreds of Thais I know personally)

[TAWP]

Thanks for your comments. I only stated the fact that a false statement was being made regarding the Thai law. I don't want to speculate on whether any particular case will follow the law. If Thailand expects international respect they must follow their laws. When people falsely state the laws as factual they must be called out so that their attempt to confuse people in hope of subverting the law for their personal preferences will fail.

I will leave to others to speculate on whether the court will follow the law.

I think his question is if it actually is a Thai law. Do you know?

Would be good to know.

Assuming it works here like back home is dangerous.

[samgrowth]

No one of significance. Just unidentifiable attendees of the What The New World Wants? conference.

That girl in the white has really really scary eyes, is she one of Sonthi's khmer ghosts?

Unless he change his sex, Sondhi's khmer ghosts is Newin.

[sriracha john]

Assets case in March

The Supreme Court yesterday rejected a request by former premier Thaksin Shinawatra and his relatives for more time to submit testimony in a 76 Billion Baht case involving the sale of telecom giant Shin Corp to Singapore's Temasek Holding.

In scheduling March 26 for the start of the trial, the court said the deadlines were reasonable, given the petitioners had the opportunity to provide proof while the Assets Examination Committee was investigating the case several months ago.

Thaksin was given until January 20 and the others until January 3 to defend their frozen assets.

The AEC probe led to the Attorney-General's Office in August indicting Thaksin for being unusually wealthy and demanding the seizure of 76 Billion Baht of his family's assets.

The money was earned from the sale of the Thaksin family's Shin shares.

- The Nation / 2008-12-27

[sriracha john]

Court denies Thaksin another extension

The Supreme Court has rejected a request by former PM Thaksin for further time to present his case against the seizure of 76-Billion-Baht of his assets by the Office of the Attorney-General (OAG). Thaksin is still a fugitive overseas and the request was delivered by his lawyer. The Criminal Division for Holders of Political Positions said yesterday it had previously allowed a postponement and there was no reason to approve a further delay. Thaksin has until Jan 20 to present his defence statement. The OAG decided to seek confiscation of the assets as it believes Thaksin gained the money by abusing his authority in the sale of his Shin Corp shares. The 76 Billion Baht is the estimated return from the controversial sale of the shares to Singapore's Temasek Holdings in 2006. The court said Thaksin had been given the chance to put forward evidence to prove his innocence by the now-disbanded Assets Scrutiny Committee. The court has set March 26, 27, and 30 as the dates for prosecutors and Thaksin to cross-examine witnesses and examine defence statements. Both parties must deliver to the court their lists of witnesses at least seven days prior to the first examination day. Seksan Bangsomboon, chief public prosecutor for special cases, said the prosecution has about 100 witnesses prepared to testify. Thaksin fled

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/politics/8...other-extension

[permanent_disorder]

Apart from the fact that the Economist is not a "newspaper" but a magazine,...

FYI The Economist is a newspaper.

everybody knows that.

And which The Economist are you reading then?

Certainly NOT the periodical that owns the name.

Sure Googling it says newspaper, but that's Google.

There is a parent company 'Economist Newspaper'. Once it was.

but look on your browser at the top of the scroll bar of the PRINT edition page.

http://www.economist.com/printedition/

<title>The Economist magazine: contents page | The Economist</title>

The Magazine is the one with world circulation.

The King and Them is in the MAGAZINE.

Roll call and Around the Hill and European Voice are broadsheet formats.

Edited in London since 1843, The Economist is a weekly international news and business publication, offering clear reporting, commentary and analysis on world current affairs, business, finance, science and technology, culture, society, media and the arts. As noted on its contents page, The Economist's goal is to "take part in a severe contest between intelligence, which presses forward, and an unworthy, timid ignorance obstructing our progress." Printed in five countries, worldwide circulation is now over one million, and The Economist is read by more of the world's political and business leaders than any other magazine.

i don't know where you got you quote from. it's not from the 'The Economist' website. why you don't give the source for it?

and i don't see here any points to argue about if the Economist a Newspaper or not. it's of course a Newspaper. at least Economist readers know that. that is the funny thing about The Economist, looks like a magazine, smells like a magazine, is glossy like a magazine, but it's a newspaper.

About The Economist

It is not only The Economist's name that people find baffling. Here are some other

common questions.

First, why does it call itself a newspaper? Even when The Economist incorporated

the Bankers' Gazette and Railway Monitor from 1845 to 1932, it also described

itself as "a political, literary and general newspaper".

It still does so because, in addition to offering analysis and opinion, it tries in each

issue to cover the main events—business and political—of the week. It goes to

press on Thursdays and, printed simultaneously in six countries, is available in

most of the world's main cities the following day or soon after.

...

from the

About us

page at Economist.com

i wouldn't blame anyone who call The Economist also a magazine, but the big mouth who jumps on others with "Apart from the fact that the Economist is not a "newspaper" but a magazine,..." got it total wrong and make a fool of himself. and, FYI, you too, disgrace yourself.

[VegasVic]

Not providing evidence at "discovery" is grounds for dismissal of the charges ...

It's not prosecutors' job to provide the evidence to the defence. Defence has to ask the court.

This is false. During "Discovery" the prosecutor is required to turn over any exculpatory evidence in their possession. Failure to do so is grounds for dismissal of charges and is prosecutorial misconduct for which the judge can punish the prosecutors for contempt of the court.

Your are entitled to your own personal opinions and biases but you are not entitled to change the laws for your convenience.

Khunjames, You are correct! Apparently plus does not have much of a backround in the legal system Of course I also feel the need to add that this is Thailand we are talking about after all and perhaps the "legal system" in Thailand may be going the same way as the government, that is they are both becoming puppets of the military

[A_Traveller]

^ Though from memory, I believe that VV and co are in error. There is no equivalent 'discovery' process within the Thai system, which is also based upon judicial rendering, not a juristic process.

Regards

/edit Mad typist strikes again.

Edited December 26, 2008 by A_Traveller

[VegasVic]

No one of significance. Just unidentifiable attendees of the What The New World Wants? conference.

That girl in the white has really really scary eyes, is she one of Sonthi's khmer ghosts?

No, I believe it's someone who's transfixed by the notion that Thaksin thinks he is What The New World Wants....

Or pehaps she is peering through the camera lens into the future and wondering why are <snip> spending so much time posting about what I am thinking about

Edited December 26, 2008 by soundman
Removed un-necessary flame.

[VegasVic]

If he wants to fight the case, he should return to TH and do it in person

....... and face a corrupt legal system that has already made up its mind......

Point well taken Amarka! If I were Thaksin I wouldn't return until I knew that I would be able to get something approaching a fair trial Of course given the current situation in Thailand the chance that Thaksin gets a fair trial is somewhere between slim and none!!!

[Artisi]

If he wants to fight the case, he should return to TH and do it in person

....... and face a corrupt legal system that has already made up its mind......

Point well taken Amarka! If I were Thaksin I wouldn't return until I knew that I would be able to get something approaching a fair trial Of course given the current situation in Thailand the chance that Thaksin gets a fair trial is somewhere between slim and none!!!

isn't it ironic what when thaksin has a win in court it is a fair and just decision but when he looks like losing the courts are suddendly corrupt.

[Plus]

Khunjames, You are correct! Apparently plus does not have much of a backround in the legal system Of course I also feel the need to add that this is Thailand we are talking about after all and perhaps the "legal system" in Thailand may be going the same way as the government, that is they are both becoming puppets of the military

Ok, legal wiz, tell me if in the US prosecution is obliged to supply evidence directly to the defence bypassing the judge?

Because that's all that they said here - want the evidence? Ask the court, we sent everything there.

And what kind of proof can you supply yourself in support of the claim that courts here are puppets of the military?

[Ricardo]

If he wants to fight the case, he should return to TH and do it in person

....... and face a corrupt legal system that has already made up its mind......

Point well taken Amarka! If I were Thaksin I wouldn't return until I knew that I would be able to get something approaching a fair trial Of course given the current situation in Thailand the chance that Thaksin gets a fair trial is somewhere between slim and none!!!

my highlight above.

Interestingly it was when the country was being run by his own brother-in-law that Thaksin decided to visit the Olympics, and then to not return, couldn't he get a fair trial when his own family were in charge ? Even with the lunch-box bribe being deployed to assist his case ??

Or was it the risk of actually getting a fair verdict, which he found so frightening, that he decided that he had to flee ?

Personally I regard it as progress, that a poo-yai like Thaksin might ever be found guilty of something, in a Thai court !

Edited December 27, 2008 by Ricardo

[Briggsy]

You may well find with this case that the courts having deliberately procrastinated, delayed, deferred and generally time-wasted suddenly get their skates on now.

The reason of course is obvious. The courts have been colluding with the 'elite'. If they had authorised the confiscation of the 76 Billion Baht when PPP was in power, it would have been tantamount to handing the money back to Thaksin. Now the Dems are in power, now might be a very good time to snaffle the cash from the point of view of the 'elites'.

However, knowing Thailand, you'll probably see the case drag on for years 'cos nobody will want to make a decision as whatever decision is made, somebody won't like it and who wants powerful enemies in this country.

[jdinasia]

Briggsy ... who are "the 'elite'" you mention in your post?

[sriracha john]

Court to rule on frozen assets of Thaksin's children

The Central Administrative Court will this afternoon hand down its verdict whether to release Bt12 billion held in impounded bank accounts of Panthongtae and Pinthongta, son and daughter of ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

The gist of the litigation is that the Assets Examination Committee invoked the graft law to freeze the bank accounts but the Revenue Department cited the tax law to demand the funds to pay for tax liabilities.

Siam Commercial Bank is the complainant seeking the judicial review on how to comply with conflicting instructions relating to the accounts held at the bank.

The Nation / 2009-01-15

[samgrowth]

What has the children asset got to do with Thaksin.

This is not France 220 years ago, when the heads of the whole family could roll because of just one man.

[sriracha john]

Thailand, 2009.

Any assets of Thaksin's children are Thaksin's assets.

Edited January 15, 2009 by sriracha john

[chowder]

What has the children asset got to do with Thaksin.

This is not France 220 years ago, when the heads of the whole family could roll because of just one man.