Realistic Job Expectations; Software Engineer

[cdrrck24]

Hello,

I’m here to get some input on realistic job expectations and advice as an Expat in Thailand. High level overview:

B.S. Computer Science

Certs:

MCPD EA 3.5

MCTS: WPF

Work experience:

2 years consulting in .NET 1.1/2.0/3.5 technologies.

Age: 26

Personal situation: I’m married to the greatest Thai girl ever (sorry girl/guys, might be true). We live in Los Angeles, CA and currently need to relocate to Bangkok for a year. She is my wife and I will do what it takes to be with her. Also, I always had great experiences while in Thailand, the culture is just exceptional compared to other countries I have lived in.

Current Salary: I currently make around 150,000 baht a month.

How would I go about finding a career in Bangkok in the Software Engineering (Web) industry? What kind of realistic job salary should I be looking at?

Does anyone have any suggestions? Interesting points to make? Brutal slaps of reality?

I’m familiar with the Thai work culture to a point, where I have worked with offshore teams based in Thailand.

Edited December 28, 2008 by cdrrck24

[12DrinkMore]

How would I go about finding a career in Bangkok in the Software Engineering (Web) industry? What kind of realistic job salary should I be looking at?

Does anyone have any suggestions? Interesting points to make? Brutal slaps of reality?

I’m familiar with the Thai work culture to a point, where I have worked with offshore teams based in Thailand.

Join the long list of wannabees....

Salary? Hmm, maybe you can start looking at 25,000/month.

Career? You'll be on the sidelines, whilst Thais with connection are promoted past you.

Work Culture? Forget about democracy and "having a say", the boss is always right and there is no argument. Be prepared to compensate for the idleness, incompetence, carelessness and then get frustrated as the culprits head on up the ladder.

Without connections/language skills (EXCELLENT reading/writing/typing/speaking in THAI) you stand very little chance of finding employment in a Thai company. How else are you going to communicate inside a project environment?

If you have already worked with offshore teams based in Thailand, I suggest that is your best way of finding a job. Or try to find contract work which allows you to live in Thailand but deliver abroad at rates far below the going rate. Say 50,000 Baht/month compared to the 150,000 you are currently earning. If they like your work, then maybe they will keep you on.

[think_too_mut]

How would I go about finding a career in Bangkok in the Software Engineering (Web) industry? What kind of realistic job salary should I be looking at

If, somehow, tourism picks up, foreign web developers with 2 years experience might be in demand.

But only those skilled in saying "Would sir want fries with that?" in Arabic, Mandarin and Hindu.

[britmaveric]

Always teach english if you have to find a job.

[kiakaha]

Hello,

I’m here to get some input on realistic job expectations and advice as an Expat in Thailand. High level overview:

B.S. Computer Science

Certs:

MCPD EA 3.5

MCTS: WPF

Work experience:

2 years consulting in .NET 1.1/2.0/3.5 technologies.

Age: 26

Personal situation: I’m married to the greatest Thai girl ever (sorry girl/guys, might be true). We live in Los Angeles, CA and currently need to relocate to Bangkok for a year. She is my wife and I will do what it takes to be with her. Also, I always had great experiences while in Thailand, the culture is just exceptional compared to other countries I have lived in.

Current Salary: I currently make around 150,000 baht a month.

How would I go about finding a career in Bangkok in the Software Engineering (Web) industry? What kind of realistic job salary should I be looking at?

Does anyone have any suggestions? Interesting points to make? Brutal slaps of reality?

I’m familiar with the Thai work culture to a point, where I have worked with offshore teams based in Thailand.

basic degree and 2 years experience ? nothing that distinguishes you from the 1000's of thai technical graduates i'm afraid.

for a technical role come back with at least 15 years experience and PROVEN industry leading expertise and technical authority, why else would you be needed.

the alternatives...get lucky by knowing the right person at the right time or start your own business or work for a multinational and get transferred in.

if you just wanna come for a year, put 20K USD in the bank, take a sabattical.

[gregb]

Work experience:

2 years consulting in .NET 1.1/2.0/3.5 technologies.

Age: 26

It will be difficult (not necessarily impossible) to find a job over here with those qualifications. A big problem will be the overhead a company will need to take on for your work permit, and the fact that you aren't senior makes this dubious.

You will certainly have to sell yourself very well to a prospective employer, and offer them a deal they can't refuse. I wouldn't expect to get more than 30k if you can get a job at all. Be prepared for a rough ride. My suggestion to improve your chances would be to develop a specific skill set before you come, and then try and get a job in that area. You may have to send your wife over here first and follow later.

Get a job in the West in telecom, or video game development, or a specialized ERP application in Oracle or SAP. It's going to have to be very specific knowledge that you just can't find in Thailand, but is in demand. There are lots of Thais who are .NET programmers, but few who have experience developing under Oracle Financials for example.

Yes, the very specific nature of this experience will limit the number of companies you can work for, but in your case, it's a choice between trying to be a big fish in a small pond, or just generally being a small fish and getting eaten. Now, if you had 20 years experience and were a manager, you'd be in a different situation. But at 26 and only 2 years in a very generic field your options are extremely limited. It really just doesn't matter if you are the greatest programmer in the world. You have to offer a company something they can't get locally if you expect to get a job, and despite what you may think, a foreginer is viewed as a liability in a Thai environment.

I can't think of anyone who would hire you with what you told us above. Sorry I can't tell you what you want to hear, but don't give up. You'll just need to work harder.

[james002]

I agree with GregB. Try to find something in video game development. I have a few friends that are doing it over there.

[JSixpack]

Forget it. Why waste your future and so much income potential by condemning yourself to poverty and indignity?

Only thing to do is work remotely on USA contracts or have your own web-based business. Otherwise, stay there.

[think_too_mut]

Work experience:

2 years consulting in .NET 1.1/2.0/3.5 technologies.

Age: 26

My suggestion to improve your chances would be to develop a specific skill set before you come, and then try and get a job in that area.

Providing he gets a job in the US in some specialist area (on what basis would that happen? on his desire to be marketable in Thailand? nobody will hire him for that reason) how long would it take him to become an irresistable specialist?

Say, in device drivers development, even microcode for washing machines?

Mickey mouse skills that have their books "xxx for dummies" or "teach urself xxxx in 21 days" do not count as portable, at least not for good money.

[cdrrck24]

Thank you all for your great input. Everyone's reply I looked into and found some great information. Video Game Development stands out, I have done XNA development (with actual work experience) and maybe I will have luck with that since its new and hopefully hot. Another great one which I heard from a lot of my friends also was consulting for US companies. Im curious if that is an advantage since Im a US citizen and it makes it easier to contract work to me? Not sure, something I will look up. In a 160 hour work month, consulting at 15$ an hour, which is a steal (not saying im great, but thats pretty good deal), that would be around 2400 dollars which is like 80,000 baht.

Someone pointed out that just save money and live off that while Im here, I agree, but since Im so young in my career, I think its important that I do something while Im not working

You guys have been extremely helpfull.

Thank you.

[bobthedog]

Let's say thread-starter had a Master of Science (M.Sc) instead of a Bachelor? Would that make his job chances in Thailand significantly better or about the same?

Edited November 11, 2009 by bobthedog

[khunjake]

Brutal slap of reality is all that I can offer you mate.... But seriously...

Stick it out in the states for at least 10yrs, build up some rock solid work experience with a name brand company if you can. .NET or XML or Java, etc. is not that specialized. Look into doing IT programming for the energy or financial sector. specialization and experience is key, differentiate your skill set..

[stevehaigh]

look for something you can do on the net. there are many sites where you can bid on projects and work anywhere. alternately, start your own company like i did, 2112design.com

steve

[Orion76]

You are probably best off getting freelance jobs.

Try elance.com and rentacoder.com

It will be hard to get your first few gigs but with time and effort, with repeat business from satisfied clients you can make a living from this.

In the meantime if you are serious about getting an IT job in Thailand, learn to speak Thai, get your masters degree and a PMP certification. Some software companies do recruit farangs for management jobs but they'll be looking for MSc. with project management skills.