"up To You"

[jbowman1993]

I love the way everyone relates my initial statement to their own life experiences and relationships, giving me a sobering and painful look at the harshness of humanity for the less intelligent and wealthy.

LOL - are you really this much of a prick?

[Thai at Heart]

In my house it tends to be also along the lines of you decide, if it goes wrong it is entirely my fault and is often spoken with the tiniest hint of exasperation. I have grown very wary of the context and timing of when "up to you" appears and has a completely different meaning to "if you want to", which I have worked out means yes.

I am toying with either buying a second hand 2 year old imported car or a new Toyota. I would love to get the import, but after a few discussions, it has reached the "Up to you, but" which is then followed with a hundred reasons why not to do it.

Edited January 3, 2009 by Thai at Heart

[MZurf]

I love the way everyone relates my initial statement to their own life experiences and relationships, giving me a sobering and painful look at the harshness of humanity for the less intelligent and wealthy.

LOL - are you really this much of a prick?

Wouldn't say "much of a pr##k". Maybe a small part of one 

Anyway; Up to him! (sorry, couldn't resist)

[fnprop]

The phrase is a major component of Thai traffic laws.

Policeman not looking? Up to you.

Policeman looking and motivated? 200 baht.

[Chaimai]

I thought about it the same way you did initially silverhawk, but I have really come to appreciate the "up to you" mentality as it puts me in the drivers seat of the relationship. the longer you stay in the relationship, the easier it will be to read her subtle hints at what she wants, likes and dislikes. Thai women are very subconscious about nagging and being the typical soap drama 'dtua-ma' wife. They also subconsciously view their worth in relation to their ability to make their male partner happy (i love Thailand). these facts seem to be cemented into thai society.

some ways that you can figure out your gf is to simply question her before these decisions are brought up on her likes and dislikes. just talk to her. ask her of her opinions, etc. she will let you know what she wants if you are paying attention, but will remain firmly in the passenger seat.

And you really believe this ?

You have not sussed out the response for every occasion ? Subtle hints chai mai ?

"Up to you" puts you between a rock and hard place - a classic no win situation. Driver's seat - you really are Joe King

[groper]

I love the way everyone relates my initial statement to their own life experiences and relationships, giving me a sobering and painful look at the harshness of humanity for the less intelligent and wealthy.

'Up to you' can simply be a response to "What movie do you want to see?" but from the majority of replies, it seems that you sad lot immediately relate this statement to your wife being confrontational.

"She always says that when I get drunk".

"She is trying to trick me!'

"She wants me to guess the wrong answer and blame me!"

Sad, sad, sad.

My two satangs are thus:

"Up to you", probably comes from the expression ตามใจชอบ (dtam jai chaap), which literally translates as "follow what your heart likes".

I hear both these expressions (English and Thai) used in many situations interchangably to give the listener free choice of available options...

... but maybe you already knew that and felt like a bit of devils advocate;-)

Edited January 4, 2009 by groper

[yosithezet]

This is one of the most maddening things, to me, about dealing with Thais. While I am fully capable of making a decision, sometimes I want to cede that to someone else, or sometimes I really am ambivilent.

For example, I wanted to take a woman out to eat on her birthday recently. It was her birthday, and I wanted the dinner to be to her liking, so I asked her where she wanted to go.  "Up to you."  I tried to press her as I wanted it to be where she wanted, not where I felt like eating.  Finally, I was able to manage to extract that Japanese would be "OK," so I picked a Japanese restaurant.

I know this is minor on the overall scale of things, but it does get to me.

Yeah, this is quite common and minor but I also find it quite annoying. It actually makes me go passive aggressive.

[eggomaniac]

Or Thai wives bashing Farang husbands

If there has ever been a Post by a Thai wife, I have yet to see it; let alone a whole Thread bashing farang husbands??? Though it might make for some good reading.

suggest!!! >>> "I bad luck, he live here, not take me to Western like my frend." ...pfffttt'''

As for the OP's question, it might have something to do with the Thai Custom of never having seperate checks. The Planner is the Payer.

up to you, in most instances means 'it's your money, you decide.'

When my wife plans an event, nothing is 'up to me'. Now that you have me thinking, I seem to be hearing a lot more of 'up to me' lately and very little of 'up to you.' hmmmm

[Mosha]

Actually I mean't bashing in a more physical aspect. Where I'm from it relates to fighting, as in "I'm gonna bash you."

[Chaimai]

This is one of the most maddening things, to me, about dealing with Thais. While I am fully capable of making a decision, sometimes I want to cede that to someone else, or sometimes I really am ambivilent.

For example, I wanted to take a woman out to eat on her birthday recently. It was her birthday, and I wanted the dinner to be to her liking, so I asked her where she wanted to go. "Up to you." I tried to press her as I wanted it to be where she wanted, not where I felt like eating. Finally, I was able to manage to extract that Japanese would be "OK," so I picked a Japanese restaurant.

I know this is minor on the overall scale of things, but it does get to me.

Yeah, this is quite common and minor but I also find it quite annoying. It actually makes me go passive aggressive.

Frustrating as well because was the Japanese "OK" or would greng jai prevent her saying that is was otherwise. It would be nice sometimes to get an enthusiastic response - wither before or after. "Hmmm, OK" seems a common response.

[Shotime]

It reminds me of the Johnny Brasco movie. "Forget about it." Sometimes it just means, up to you. Usually, it means just the opposite. It can be the biggest lie in Thailand. It depends on how, when, and where it"s used.

I still can't believe you can't buy a T-shirt that says "Up To You," "Up To Me," "Up To Her," etc.

Edited January 5, 2009 by Shotime

[Neeranam]

I love the way everyone relates my initial statement to their own life experiences and relationships, giving me a sobering and painful look at the harshness of humanity for the less intelligent and wealthy.

'Up to you' can simply be a response to "What movie do you want to see?" but from the majority of replies, it seems that you sad lot immediately relate this statement to your wife being confrontational.

"She always says that when I get drunk".

"She is trying to trick me!'

"She wants me to guess the wrong answer and blame me!"

Sad, sad, sad.

My two satangs are thus:

"Up to you", probably comes from the expression ตามใจชอบ (dtam jai chaap), which literally translates as "follow what your heart likes".

I hear both these expressions (English and Thai) used in many situations interchangably to give the listener free choice of available options...

... but maybe you already knew that and felt like a bit of devils advocate;-)

I'd say that ตามใจชอบ (dtam jai chaap) translates better as "as you please", "whatever pleases you" Similar is เอาใจ ao jai.

Laew Taeแล้วแต่ is "up to you - don't give me the responsibility of making a decision"

One of the reasons many relationships fail here is that the Western man tries to please the women too much. Do what you want guys and give the woman a break.

A saying I like is

คุณสามารถทำให้คนบางคนพอใจได้ในบางเวลา แต่ไม่สามารถทำให้ทุกคนพอใจได้ตลอดเวลา

koon săa-mâat tám hâi kon baang kon por jai dâai nai baang way-laa dtàe mâi săa-mâat tám hâi tóok kon por jai dâai dtà-lòt way-laa

You really need to understand the Thai language to be able to understand the culture.

[Neeranam]

It reminds me of the Johnny Brasco movie. "Forget about it."

I like that guy on Cartoon Network - didn't know there was an actual movie.

[Shotime]

It reminds me of the Johnny Brasco movie. "Forget about it."

I like that guy on Cartoon Network - didn't know there was an actual movie.

Sorry. It's Donnie Brasco with Johnny Depp. Great movie.

[Samuian]

...........edited......

You really need to understand the Thai language to be able to understand the culture.

Why, would a western educated human wish to "understand", going through the process of learning an entire language, one can't use ANYWHERE else, to "understand" what is claimed to be a "culture", which fabric is very much woven from ingredients like iniquities, blatant injustices, ignorance, weird distorted national superiority, irresponsibility, not-me-them attitude....why would one try to understand this?

I think this probably is highly overrated, as a necessity, living here, it is surely enough to be able to converse in simple ways!

It is as is - I am afraid!

If there ever was a Thai Culture, with values as such it's genuinenessand core values are rapidly disappearing if it hasn't already.

Edited January 5, 2009 by Samuian

[Jimjim]

It's like "you decide." This is used by women all over the world, I'm afraid. Don't see why it's a Thai thing or not. It's a woman thing. It's a horrible thing to be told by a woman, "up to you," or "you decide." When told that, you are likely to get it wrong in the woman's view.

[Moonrakers]

Me: What shall we eat today?

Wife: Up to you.

Me: Pizza then?

Wife: No

Me: Pub Lunch?

Wife: No

Me: Well what do you want then?

Wife: Up to you

[sbk]

Hmm... so, someone who lives in Thailand sees no reason to understand the language or the culture because you can't use it anywhere else in the world. Wow. Well, there happen to be 65 million people in this particular country that do use it. If you can't understand the language and don't want to understand the culture then I really fail to grasp why you are here.

Regardless, back to the whole "up to you" thing. I never hear it from my Thai husband. But then, he also knows if he asks my opinion (and if I have one about the particular subject) then he will hear it. So, likewise, he does the same with me.

Now, there are times he's asked me what I want for dinner and if I really have no particular preference I will say, 'whatever you feel like, I am fine.'

No quiz, no test, no sullenness afterward if he doesn't choose what I want.

So, no, its not necessarily a woman thing. Just some women.

[davyboy]

Me: What shall we eat today?

Wife: Up to you.

Me: Pizza then?

Wife: No

Me: Pub Lunch?

Wife: No

Me: Well what do you want then?

Wife: Up to you

Yes sir, that rings a bell!!

[bonobo]

Hmm... so, someone who lives in Thailand sees no reason to understand the language or the culture because you can't use it anywhere else in the world. Wow. Well, there happen to be 65 million people in this particular country that do use it. If you can't understand the language and don't want to understand the culture then I really fail to grasp why you are here.

Regardless, back to the whole "up to you" thing. I never hear it from my Thai husband. But then, he also knows if he asks my opinion (and if I have one about the particular subject) then he will hear it. So, likewise, he does the same with me.

Now, there are times he's asked me what I want for dinner and if I really have no particular preference I will say, 'whatever you feel like, I am fine.'

No quiz, no test, no sullenness afterward if he doesn't choose what I want.

So, no, its not necessarily a woman thing. Just some women.

There are times when someone just doesn't have a strong opinion one way or the other, male or female, Thai or not. But, in my personal experience, far more Thai women use the "up to you" response than any other demographic group worldwide with which I have had any experience.

And sometimes, I know they do have a strong opinion. You can see it in their expression. So I guess, and if I guess wrong, I can see that in their expression as well.

[Birdman]

Me: What shall we eat today? Translation:

Wife: Up to you. why ask, you know what I like and what you like to eat

Me: Pizza then?

Wife: No I would not ask you to eat ant eggs or chicken claws

Me: Pub Lunch?

Wife: No or eels at the market

Me: Well what do you want then?

Wife: Up to you I have told you just right now

[warfie]

btw it is clear that Thai Wives seem to wear the pants in most of their relationships with farang males, hence the responses in this thread! So no, I do not have it wrong, I am just not being ruled like you are! Best keep those payments coming less you want to test out your flying skills off your balcony.

That will ring to home to a lot ! , . no, im adamant it means, " up to you, your paying " usually said when an alternative answer cant be thought of ( often ) or when they really dont care ,.

... or simply don't understand the question in the first place...

[torrenova]

It has so many meanings at so many times and in so many circumstances. I basically associate it with the desire not to cause offence or conflict and thus they remove themselves from the decision making process. Consequently, any problems cannot be their fault and thus, they avoid confrontation.

For sure it can mean "no" but again, they do not wish to say "no" but want to show their apparent disinterest in whatever decision you make. They may have a deep desire for a particular outcome but if they cannot be bothered to voice an opinion then that is their fault. A mixed relationship is exactly that, mixed. That means both parties accepting that the other person has different methods of communication. I'll be damned if I am beating around the bush 100 times to try and extract information from someone if all they can say is "up to you".

In my early days here I worried over things like this far too much. Now I require the Thais in my family life to understand that I am not Thai and if they desire something other than my choice, then they will have to shout up. No good just just keep bleating "up to you" and then complain later.

[warfie]

When I first came here, I found it rather annoying. One incident in particular sticks in my mind.

Thai Wife: "tip the porter!"

me: "how much?"

Thai Wife: "it up to you..."

me (already frustrated with the phrase): "so is 1 Baht ok? or should it be 1000?"

...

[warfie]

And it's not just Thais and not just women. This situation with a Singaporean ex...

Me: What to have for dinner?

Her: Whatever...

Me: Why not we have steamboat?

Her: Don't want la, eat steamboat later got pimples in my face

Me: Alright, why not we have Si Chuan cuisine

Her: Yesterday eat Si Chuan, today eat again?

Me: Hmm... then I suggest we have seafood

Her: Seafood no good la, later I got diarrhoea

Me: Then what you suggest?

Her: Whatever...

Me: So... what should we do now?

Her: Anything...

Me: How about watching a movie? Long time we haven't watch a movie.

Her: Watching movie no good la, waste time only.

Me: How about we go bowling, do some exercises?

Her: Exercise on such hot day? You not feel tired meh?

Me: Then find a cafe and have a drink.

Her: Drinking coffee will affect my sleep.

Me: Then what you suggest?

Her: Anything...

Me: Then we just go home lo

Her: You decide...

Me: Let's take a bus .

Her: Bus is dirty and crowded. Don't want la

Me: Ok we will take taxi then.

Her: Not worth it la... for such a short distance

Me: Alright, then we walk lo. Take a slow walk.

Her: How to walk with empty stomach?

Me: Then what you suggest?

Her: You decide...

Me: Let's have dinner first.

Her: Whatever...

Me: Eat what?

Her: Anything...

(Me looks around... no one here.. gonna kill her...)

good thing they're cute...