Financial Crisis

[midas]

I hope there is vegan ulcer medication for you... you're all wound up. Bullsh-t the doomsayers hope they are wrong... they have to be right or the other kids will make fun of them...

jazzbo take a look at yourself

Isn't it you that has the childlike attitude of pretending the money hasn't run out ?

[jazzbo]

Isn't it you that has the childlike attitude of pretending the money hasn't run out ? No.

[teletiger]

I hope there is vegan ulcer medication for you... you're all wound up. Bullsh-t the doomsayers hope they are wrong... they have to be right or the other kids will make fun of them...

I'm not sure where to start here Jman. Vegans don't get ulcers, would be a start. You've obviously been trawling through my previous posts...... hey did you come across the ones about a year ago that said that pensions and 401k's were the ultimate goal? 'Ain't I the clever one. Guess what? I read it on a blogspot (ZeroHedge, as it happens).....it sounded logical....so I repeated it.

You're showing signs of instability, Jman......therefore this will be our last discourse.

Have a great life and stay well. Seriously.

Best regards.

[jazzbo]

Ain't I the clever one ... If it makes you happy to think that, sure.

You're showing signs of instability ... only for the last 40 years or so.

[siamamerican]

I'm afraid the whole pension fund system will, at a certain point, not function anymore since there are more and more greying countries whereby a less number of young people have t work to "feed" the elderly.

That counts for most European countries bu other countries like Japan also.

One better takes care for his own "old days" but I know, easier said than done for many elderly

LaoPo

The system in the USA is fixable but it is destined to implode. With the greying "Baby Boomers" unable to accept sacrificing some of their distributions to benefit future generations( their children). They didn't contribute enough and are in part responsible for creating our ponzi scheme pension structure. It is as if social security recipients forgot simple grade school math but at the same time grasp they are arguably the most powerful voting block.

[flying]

......therefore this will be our last discourse.

Total Members

108,171

Total I ignore = 1

[jazzbo]

That's OK ... I do not reciprocate and put Kuhn F. on 'Ignore' because he is often good for a laugh ... Like his commando buddy at Tora Bora who saw OBL being killed or America's 'jailers' ...

There was an article a few days ago in The New York Times about an online eyeglass vendor who got to the top of the Google search page for various eye-wear brands because he had the most online complaints and threats of retaliation for fraud etc. ... but that's how the spiders work.

[BlackJack]

That's OK ... I do not reciprocate and put Kuhn F. on 'Ignore' because he is often good for a laugh ... Like his commando buddy at Tora Bora who saw OBL being killed or America's 'jailers' ...

There was an article a few days ago in The New York Times about an online eyeglass vendor who got to the top of the Google search page for various eye-wear brands because he had the most online complaints and threats of retaliation for fraud etc. ... but that's how the spiders work.

first up i think youre on the wrong thread

from the daily reckoner Australia

'On the other hand, experienced people seem to be saying that something very important - unprecedented even - is occurring in the emergence of very large countries like China and India. If the steel intensity of China's GDP stays where it is already, and China's growth rate remains at 7 or 8 per cent for some years to come, which appears to be the intention of Chinese policy-makers, then the demand for iron ore and metallurgical coal will rise a long way over the next couple of decades.'

I would be looking into the Uranium traded funds too as there are plenty of reactors being built and coming online

[jazzbo]

OK, so this is not the Gold topic mea culpa. Uranium will come from Afghanistan which the Unob-uranium guy will tell you is why th US Government is running the hoax that OBL is still alive ... No wonder the guy who doesn't even live in Thailand likes to post here instead of something closer to home -- there is no pre-posting moderation on ThaiVisa... probably has dreams at night of Ron Paul having been elected President in 2008 instead of you-know-who.

Edited November 30, 2010 by jazzbo

[BlackJack]

This thread unfortunately seems to be attracting some dead heads now

Anyway back on track

http://www.taipanpublishinggroup.com/images/web/taipandaily/charts/td-112910-chart.jpg?sub=TD

looks like the US public service is over weight

haircut needed

posted in Thailand

[midas]

Anyone banking with the " big names " that havent

yet decided to join the world bank run day next

Tuesday ( 7th December ) should watch this video and maybe

it will help you decide

Foreclosure Cover-Up or The Great MERS Whitewash Bill

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=votgh-sMOcs&feature=player_embedded

[jazzbo]

That's OK. ... Usually this topic is for a bunch of guys to tell each other how smart they are how stupid is anyone in a position to have some real impact on the world macro economy.... Maybe some day you will get to post somewhere you can actually make a difference.

[flying]

This thread unfortunately seems to be attracting some dead heads now

Anyway back on track

http://www.taipanpublishinggroup.com/images/web/taipandaily/charts/td-112910-chart.jpg?sub=TD

looks like the US public service is over weight

haircut needed

posted in Thailand

Govt pays well dont they?

Makes the folks who tout GDP as a reason their is no debt problem wake up...or not

[12DrinkMore]

Picked this up, maybe we have the solution?

"It is a slow day in a damp little Irish town. The rain is beating down and the streets are deserted. Times are tough, everybody is in debt, and everybody lives on credit. On this particular day a rich German tourist is driving through the town, stops at the local hotel and lays a €100 note on the desk, telling the hotel owner he wants to inspect the rooms upstairs in order to pick one to spend the night. The owner gives him some keys and, as soon as the visitor has walked upstairs, the hotelier grabs the €100 note and runs next door to pay his debt to the butcher. The butcher takes the €100 note and runs down the street to repay his debt to the pig farmer. The pig farmer takes the €100 note and heads off to pay his bill at the supplier of feed and fuel. The guy at the Farmers' Co-op takes the €100 note and runs to pay his drinks bill at the pub. The publican slips the money along to the local prostitute drinking at the bar, who has also been facing hard times and has had to offer him "services" on credit. The hooker then rushes to the hotel and pays off her room bill to the hotel owner with the €100 note. The hotel proprietor then places the €100 note back on the counter so the rich traveller will not suspect anything. At that moment the traveller comes down the stairs, picks up the €100 note, states that the rooms are not satisfactory, pockets the money, and leaves town. No one produced anything. No one earned anything. However, the whole town is now out of debt and looking to the future with a lot more optimism. And that, Gentlemen, is how the bailout package works."

Hmm, I am sure there is a fault in the reasoning somewhere.

There does seem to be a lot of vicarious pleasure running around over the Euro-Mess. But if the whole thing collapses then it will take us all further down the pan into financial oblivion. The UK will certainly not escape from the ensuing massive write-offs, which will possibly make the current pile look like peanuts.

There are an increasing number of voices calling for fundamental monetary reform. In particular

1. Governments should simply issue their own currency debt free and not have to borrow it from banks. There is a whole bunch of information on this, for example there is this UK based site

http://www.positivemoney.org.uk/

This concept has been around for a very long time, and, to be honest, I cannot find any fault with it. An example

http://query.nytimes...FB467838A639EDE

The current banking system, or rather, money issuing system, has been adopted all around the world, but so far I cannot find any counter arguments saying why this system should be preferred over countries issuing their own debt-free cash. The only argument I have come across is that if governments could simply issue the money, they would not stop issuing it, leading to hyperinflation. But under the current system they are simply borrowing and spending vast amounts anyway.

It is surely ludicrous that the government is borrowing huge amounts of cash from the banks to bail out the dam_n banks, leaving the tax payers to pick up the ever spiralling upwards tab.

2. Fractional reserve banking should be banned. In this case I don't think it should be banned, but there should not be the inherent moral hazard of tax payers bailing the bastards out.

Whilst we are on the topic of bastards, I see that Fred the Shred got off scot-free, so to speak. No surprise at all.

At least the UK population is doing what it does best.

http://www.telegraph...-more-debt.html

Almost seven million Britons are living beyond their means and refuse to alter their lifestyle despite the recession, according to latest research

No hope is there?

Edited December 3, 2010 by 12DrinkMore

[12DrinkMore]

Young Tim will be busy for the next twelve months. Maybe it will keep him from swanning around the globe and complaining about the Chinese using "unfair" tactics in their economic policy. As if the US was an innocent party.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=az7AcisnxsCA

Senator Bernie Sanders, a Vermont independent, would give Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner 90 days to come up with a list of banks, hedge funds and insurance companies deemed "too big to fail." Geithner would have one year to break them up.

Hmm, sounds like the US is doing something to fix the problems, unlike the UK wimps, who bend over backwards and take it right up the bum in order to keep the precious UK wanke_rs, sorry, bankers, in business. They will probably offer tax concessions to the "too big to fail" banks if they move across to London.

I hope the bill gets passed.

[BlackJack]

what i want to know is where all the money went

ie if your playing musical chairs in the end there is only one chair left that one gets to sit on

so if all the banks were playing musical chairs which one gets the chair

[12DrinkMore]

what i want to know is where all the money went

It hasn't gone anywhere, I believe it is all still with us in the form of debt, which we now owe in massive amounts to the bankers, who created the stuff out of thin air. Why can't we give them back the same thin air?

ie if your playing musical chairs in the end there is only one chair left that one gets to sit on

so if all the banks were playing musical chairs which one gets the chair

The chair belongs to the bankers.

Edited December 3, 2010 by 12DrinkMore

[flying]

The unemployment rate edged up to 9.8 percent in November, and nonfarm payroll

employment was little changed (+39,000), the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

reported today.

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm

Edited December 3, 2010 by flying

[flying]

Gerald Celente Q4 trends research

Right click & save as ...... 1mb

2010-Q4-TrendsJournal.pdf

Edited December 3, 2010 by flying

[BlackJack]

what i want to know is where all the money went

It hasn't gone anywhere, I believe it is all still with us in the form of debt, which we now owe in massive amounts to the bankers, who created the stuff out of thin air. Why can't we give them back the same thin air?

ie if your playing musical chairs in the end there is only one chair left that one gets to sit on

so if all the banks were playing musical chairs which one gets the chair

The chair belongs to the bankers.

no

we are talking trillions of dollars

call it debt

but someone owns it

tax payers have to pay for it

the money goes somewhere

but where?

[flying]

no

we are talking trillions of dollars

call it debt

but someone owns it

tax payers have to pay for it

the money goes somewhere

but where?

Well much of it is now spent on Treasury Coupon purchases

http://www.ny.frb.org/markets/tot_operation_schedule.html

Or I should say now openly spent on coupons. Straw men were probably always a part of the auctions

Much of the original 700 Billion bailout/TARP was given to banks supposedly to lend & kick start the economy.

We know now that did not happen. Many think the majority was put back into the casino/stock market

Also now we are becoming aware that the bailout was pocket change compared to what the FED gave out & previously

claimed they did not as yet have any numbers for...

Fed made $9 trillion in emergency overnight loans

So in some ways yes the money/digital credit went somewhere...But perhaps a lot of it was more of a white out for certain TBTF debit sheets/Toxic debt

I wonder if it is toxic because it was worthless in many instances due to MERS fraud & in that way was akin to passing counterfeit when it was sold worldwide?

Anyway to your original question I am guessing

1- it was not physical in as much as an eraser...so yes those that benefited by the erasing profited immensely

2- it is used to purchase the newly created treasury coupons ....by-product of their printing spree...which use to be purchased by the likes of China & Japan before they woke up.....Not that even they could purchase the amounts now being auctioned...again due to the printing spree

The fact that they the FED now purchase their own coupons with more of their own printed fodder sounds like a great gig...while it lasts

Edited December 4, 2010 by flying

[BlackJack]

no

we are talking trillions of dollars

call it debt

but someone owns it

tax payers have to pay for it

the money goes somewhere

but where?

Well much of it is now spent on Treasury Coupon purchases

http://www.ny.frb.org/markets/tot_operation_schedule.html

Or I should say now openly spent on coupons. Straw men were probably always a part of the auctions

Much of the original 700 Billion bailout/TARP was given to banks supposedly to lend & kick start the economy.

We know now that did not happen. Many think the majority was put back into the casino/stock market

Also now we are becoming aware that the bailout was pocket change compared to what the FED gave out & previously

claimed they did not as yet have any numbers for...

Fed made $9 trillion in emergency overnight loans

So in some ways yes the money/digital credit went somewhere...But perhaps a lot of it was more of a white out for certain TBTF debit sheets/Toxic debt

I wonder if it is toxic because it was worthless in many instances due to MERS fraud & in that way was akin to passing counterfeit when it was sold worldwide?

Anyway to your original question I am guessing

1- it was not physical in as much as an eraser...so yes those that benefited by the erasing profited immensely

2- it is used to purchase the newly created treasury coupons ....by-product of their printing spree...which use to be purchased by the likes of China & Japan before they woke up.....Not that even they could purchase the amounts now being auctioned...again due to the printing spree

The fact that they the FED now purchase their own coupons with more of their own printed fodder sounds like a great gig...while it lasts

Yes

we have kicked this around a long time now and we know the mechanics of it - banks loans lender taxes excuses

however its like a roulette wheel and the ball must drop on a number and I pose the question at the end of the day where will the money end up?

In years to come when people are paying massive taxes and working until 75 years old with little or no pensions we may finally get some answers.

[BlackJack]

Fed made $9 trillion in emergency overnight loans

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/money/2010/12/01/news/economy/fed_reserve_data_release/chart_fed_loans.top.jpg

SO now I know where the money went to the Government.

[BlackJack]

Fed made $9 trillion in emergency overnight loans

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/money/2010/12/01/news/economy/fed_reserve_data_release/chart_fed_loans.top.jpg

SO now I know where the money went to the Government.

cant wait for wikileaks to post the dirt on the banks Q1 2011

thats if they dont rub him out first

[12DrinkMore]

Yes

we have kicked this around a long time now and we know the mechanics of it - banks loans lender taxes excuses

however its like a roulette wheel and the ball must drop on a number and I pose the question at the end of the day where will the money end up?

In years to come when people are paying massive taxes and working until 75 years old with little or no pensions we may finally get some answers.

The question is a bit wide-ranging. Anyway, lets start with

1. the US housing stock

http://www.ritholtz....lar-question-2/

In 2006 the US housing stock was around $23 trillion now its value has slumped to $16 trillion. That is a cool USD's 7,000,000,000 which have simply disappeared into thin air, leaving just the debts behind. But the picture is not that simple, because a load of financial instruments were brought into existence in order to "hedge the risks". Well, instead of all the good apples in the barrel compensation for the odd bad apple, it was the bad apples that turned everything else rotten.

and

2. the pension promises

there have simply been too many promises made which cannot be funded by past, present or future contributions. So the pension age has to increase, in the hope we all die off before drawing a pension. My pension scheme has just proudly announced that they have a shortfall of 10% in assets to cover future liabilities......

and

3. high taxes

are levied to pay for part of the government spending, which in the UK accounts for over 50% of the GDP. However a large and increasing percentage of government spending is repaying interest on spiraling debt. The question here is, why don't the governments simply issue debt free money to pay for the government spending? A question I asked a few posts ago.

In fact, to a certain degree this is now happening with the QE. The BoE is buying UK bonds with "new" money, the interest on these bonds is paid by the Treasury to the BoE, which is then returned to the Treasury. It just needs a brave person with a vision to cut out the BoE and let the Treasury simply pay the bills directly with new debt free money, brought into existence by the UK government and not by the bankers with debt and interest attached to it. Over time, as the existing bonds mature, they could be paid off, leaving NO future interest payments and NO need to let the quantity of money be controlled by the bankers.

[AlexLah]

I told many times.

Are you people ready to understand what is really going on?

Alex

[BlackJack]

this cycle of money it reminds me of my dad

dad would get his pension

pay for his groceries plus tax

pay for his electricity plus tax

pay for his land, trash collection, registration for car, petrol, gas to heat the house, telephone plus tax

go to the club to eat and play the slot machines and the club is taxed on all takings

dad gets 200 dollars and the government gets 150 dollars back

yes we know whats going on

[midas]

this cycle of money it reminds me of my dad

dad would get his pension

pay for his groceries plus tax

pay for his electricity plus tax

pay for his land, trash collection, registration for car, petrol, gas to heat the house, telephone plus tax

go to the club to eat and play the slot machines and the club is taxed on all takings

dad gets 200 dollars and the government gets 150 dollars back

yes we know whats going on

yes well on that note we shouldn't be surprised to learn this then:-

As Europeans face the uncertainty of swingeing government cuts, the European Union continues to spend. Its structural fund programme distributes €347bn of European taxpayers’ money across 271 regions in 27 countries.Yet a web of bureaucracy has hidden this spending. Even MEPs have not had a truly transparent view of the organisations getting the funds.

Over eight months the Bureau and the FT have collected data relating to billions of euros to reveal, for the first time, the 646,000 recipients that have received the funds.

esearch reveals:

* How Italy’s most dangerous mafia, the ndrangheta, has become an expert at getting its hands on these funds

* A decentralised, cumbersome and weak system allows, and rarely punishes, fraud and misuse

* Millions of euros are going to multinational companies to help them move factories within the union despite guidelines discouraging this practice

* Funds have been used to finance a hotel building boom on protected nature reserves in Spain

* The lack of thorough checks means money is being wasted

* Some of the world’s largest companies are receiving funding despite the programme being aimed at small and medium-sized companies

http://thebureauinvestigates.com/2010/11/29/top-story-4/

[lannarebirth]

This isn't some rare goof-up by a low-level cubicle slave: Virtually every case of foreclosure in this country involves some form of screwed-up paperwork. "I would say it's pretty close to 100 percent," says Kowalski. An attorney for Jacksonville Area Legal Aid tells me that out of the hundreds of cases she has handled, fewer than five involved no phony paperwork. "The fraud is the norm," she says.

Kowalski's current case before Judge Soud is a perfect example. The Jacksonville couple he represents are being sued for delinquent payments, but the case against them has already been dismissed once before. The first time around, the plaintiff, Bank of New York Mellon, wrote in Paragraph 8 that "plaintiff owns and holds the note" on the house belonging to the couple. But in Paragraph 3 of the same complaint, the bank reported that the note was "lost or destroyed," while in Paragraph 4 it attests that "plaintiff cannot reasonably obtain possession of the promissory note because its whereabouts cannot be determined."

The bank, in other words, tried to claim on paper, in court, that it both lost the note and had it, at the same time. Moreover, it claimed that it had included a copy of the note in the file, which it did — the only problem being that the note (a) was not properly endorsed, and ( was payable not to Bank of New York but to someone else, a company called Novastar.

Now, months after its first pass at foreclosure was dismissed, the bank has refiled the case — and what do you know, it suddenly found the note. And this time, somehow, the note has the proper stamps. "There's a stamp that did not appear on the note that was originally filed," Kowalski tells the judge. (This business about the stamps is hilarious. "You can get them very cheap online," says Chip Parker, an attorney who defends homeowners in Jacksonville.)

The bank's new set of papers also traces ownership of the loan from the original lender, Novastar, to JP Morgan and then to Bank of New York. The bank, in other words, is trying to push through a completely new set of documents in its attempts to foreclose on Kowalski's clients.

There's only one problem: The dates of the transfers are completely fuc_ked. According to the documents, JP Morgan transferred the mortgage to Bank of New York on December 9th, 2008. But according to the same documents, JP Morgan didn't even receive the mortgage from Novastar until February 2nd, 2009 — two months after it had supposedly passed the note along to Bank of New York. Such rank incompetence at doctoring legal paperwork is typical of foreclosure actions, where the fraud is laid out in ink in ways that make it impossible for anyone but an overburdened, half-asleep judge to miss. "That's my point about all of this," Kowalski tells me later. "If you're going to lie to me, at least lie well."

The dates aren't the only thing screwy about the new documents submitted by Bank of New York. Having failed in its earlier attempt to claim that it actually had the mortgage note, the bank now tries an all-of-the-above tactic. "Plaintiff owns and holds the note," it claims, "or is a person entitled to enforce the note."

Soud sighs. For Kessler, the plaintiff's lawyer, to come before him with such sloppy documents and make this preposterous argument — that his client either is or is not the note-holder — well, that puts His Honor in a tough spot. The entire concept is a legal absurdity, and he can't sign off on it. With an expression of something very like regret, the judge tells Kessler, "I'm going to have to go ahead and accept [Kowalski's] argument."

Now, one might think that after a bank makes multiple attempts to push phony documents through a courtroom, a judge might be pissed off enough to simply rule against that plaintiff for good. As I witness in court all morning, the defense never gets more than one chance to screw up. But the banks get to keep filing their foreclosures over and over again, no matter how atrocious and deceitful their paperwork is.

Thus, when Soud tells Kessler that he's dismissing the case, he hastens to add: "Of course, I'm not going to dismiss with prejudice." With an emphasis on the words "of course."

Instead, Soud gives Kessler 25 days to come up with better paperwork. Kowalski fully expects the bank to come back with new documents telling a whole new story of the note's ownership. "What they're going to do, I would predict, is produce a note and say Bank of New York is not the original note-holder, but merely the servicer," he says.

This is the dirty secret of the rocket docket: The whole system is set up to enable lenders to commit fraud over and over again, until they figure out a way to reduce the stink enough so some judge like Soud can sign off on the scam. "If the court finds for the defendant, the plaintiffs just refile," says Parker, the local attorney. "The only way for the caseload to get reduced is to give it to the plaintiff. The entire process is designed with that result in mind."

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/17390/232611?RS_show_page=0

[flying]

This is the dirty secret of the rocket docket: The whole system is set up to enable lenders to commit fraud over and over again, until they figure out a way to reduce the stink enough so some judge like Soud can sign off on the scam. "If the court finds for the defendant, the plaintiffs just refile," says Parker, the local attorney. "The only way for the caseload to get reduced is to give it to the plaintiff. The entire process is designed with that result in mind."

FUBAR

Totally true also what they said about the judges giving the banks repeated chances to correct/alter their lies yet normal defendants are tossed out on their ear on their first mistake.