Udon Thani Governor And Other Officials Face Probe Over Red Shirt Clash

[sriracha john]

Authorities face disciplinary probe over Udon Thani clashes

The Police Chief, the provincial Governor, and three senior officers from Udon Thani face a disciplinary probe after the National Anti-Corruption Commission said in a report Wednesday that it suspected foul play in the clash between red and yellow shirts last July.

The NACC has found cause to suspect serious violations involving provincial Police Chief Major-General Permsak Paradonsak, NACC member Klanarong Chantik said.

Udon Thani Governor Supoj Laowansiri, his Assistant Yuthana Wiriyakitti, and Permsak's two Deputies, Colonel Pattrawut Uamsasithorn and Colonel Boonlue Kobangyang, are the others suspected of committing disciplinary offences, he said.

The Nation / 2009-02-18

[sriracha john]

An article at the time...

Rights group calls on Thai government to protect protestors from attack

BANGKOK - A leading rights group on Saturday called for Thailand's authorities to protect political protesters from attacks by pro-government groups after several were hurt in violent clashes.

New York-based Human Rights Watch said pro-government groups have clashed with supporters of the anti-government People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) at about a dozen rallies across Thailand since May. On Thursday, about 40 protesters were reportedly injured in the northeastern Udon Thani province in the most serious incident so far.

Human Rights Watch said police stood idly by while the attacks occurred.

"Thai authorities have failed to protect their citizens' basic right to peaceful assembly," said Elaine Pearson, Deputy Asia Director at Human Rights Watch.

"By allowing pro-government thugs free rein to unleash violence, the authorities are putting Thailand's fragile democracy at risk," she said, calling on the violence to be investigated and its perpetrators prosecuted.

Some 1,000 members of the pro-government Khon Rak Udon Club broke up a peaceful PAD rally in a park in Muang district of Udon Thani on Thursday.

A local radio station, 97.5FM, reportedly incited the pro-government supporters who were said to be armed with swords, axes, knives, iron clubs, wooden clubs, and slingshots, Human Rights Watch said.

Witnesses said some 500 police and local defence volunteers made no effort to stop the violence or make arrests.

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej has faced street protests across the country since May. The PAD accuses the government of abuse of power as well as acting as a proxy for deposed premier Thaksin Shinawatra, who is on trial for corruption.

- AFP / 2008-07-27

[jdinasia]

Does Police Chief Major-General Permsak Paradonsak have any substantial history with Pol Lt Col Thaksin?

[justanothercybertosser]

Authorities face disciplinary probe over Udon Thani clashes

Good.

I just hope the the army will have to face similar probes for the airport sieges.

[sriracha john]

Does Police Chief Major-General Permsak Paradonsak have any substantial history with Pol Lt Col Thaksin?

Police Wait for Anti-Graft Panel's Document on Udon Thani Police Chief

The Deputy National Police Chief has said there will be no order to force the Udon Thani police commander to cease duty, unless the anti-graft body submits a letter of indictment against the police involved in a violent clash made by local red-shirt protesters against supporters of the People's Alliance for Democracy last year.

Deputy National Police Chief Lieutenant-General Watcharapol Prasarnratchakij gave an interview regarding the National Anti-Corruption Commission launching a harsh disciplinary offence against Udon Thani Police Commander Major-General Permsak Paradoensak for negligence of duty that caused severe damage to the government.

On July 24th, 2008, a group of red-shirt protesters in the northeastern province of Udon Thani, led by a famous local radio presenter Kwanchai Praipana and Uthai Saenkaew, a younger brother of former Deputy Agriculture Minister Theerachai Saenkaew, along with activists from the red-shirt group encircled Nongprachak Public Park in Udon Thani city municipality area and attacked the People's Alliance for Democracy or PAD supporters who attended the group's activity inside.

The incident resulted in injuries among PAD supporters.

Police Lieutenant-General Watcharapol said the National Police Office has not received any documents from the anti-graft panel, so the Udon Thani Police Commander can perform his duty as usual at this time. However, he said the police are ready to follow the process if a letter of indictment is submitted.

Meanwhile, Udon Thani Police Commander Major-General Permsak refused to give an interview on the matter.

- TOC / 2009-02-18

========================================================================

former Deputy Agriculture Minister Theerachai Saenkaew of now-banned former PM Somchai's Cabinet

radio presenter Kwanchai Praipana (left) and an unidentified rabble-rouser

Deputy National Police Chief Lieutenant-General Watcharapol Prasarnratchakij

and but, of course...

Udon Thani Police Commander Major-General Permsak Paradoensak

[sriracha john]

He was an actual paid member of Samak's official government at the time he led a bleeding carnage attack... who quit in order to take to his violence full-time...

Udon Thani group Leader resigns from government post, promises to pursue PAD to fullest

Leader of the Udon Thani Enthusiasts group Kwanchai Phraipana has declared his resignation from his government post as an employee of the Office of the Secretary-General of the Prime Minister.

Kwanchai received the position 2 months ago from a Cabinet decision, but stated today that he will resign from the post so that his activity with the Udon Thani Enthusiasts will not affect his job.

Kwanchai's resignation follows his receiving of charges from police based on a violent clash between his group and the People's Alliance for Democracy. He said that his resignation will allow him to fully pursue the PAD and deal with them on equal terms. Kwanchai was one of 12 employees of the Office.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 29 July 2008

Edited February 18, 2009 by sriracha john

[hammered]

Of course Thaksin and his proxiers stuffed every province, the police, the DSI, the bureacracy etc with every hand chosen yes man and supporter they could. Now the Dems are trying although a tadslowly and less brutally to do the same.

The reality is that is the only way you can make sure you can govern. Leaving the enemy in place maens at best for you obstructionism and at worst outrgith campaigns against.

It is no surprise that state officails appointed by Samak and Somchai would assist in and even organize actions to help government supporters.

If the Dems want to see their asbility to govern improve they now need to brutally replace all Thaksin sympathisers. And if PTP were to return to power they would then brutally replace all Dem sympathisers.....

Real Politik in Thailand.

[hardy1943]

Of course Thaksin and his proxiers stuffed every province, the police, the DSI, the bureacracy etc with every hand chosen yes man and supporter they could. Now the Dems are trying although a tadslowly and less brutally to do the same.

The reality is that is the only way you can make sure you can govern. Leaving the enemy in place maens at best for you obstructionism and at worst outrgith campaigns against.

It is no surprise that state officails appointed by Samak and Somchai would assist in and even organize actions to help government supporters.

If the Dems want to see their asbility to govern improve they now need to brutally replace all Thaksin sympathisers. And if PTP were to return to power they would then brutally replace all Dem sympathisers.....

Real Politik in Thailand.

You must also think the yellow shirt did a patriotic thing by taking over the airport.

I think your handle fits you well.

[Roadman]

Of course Thaksin and his proxiers stuffed every province, the police, the DSI, the bureacracy etc with every hand chosen yes man and supporter they could. Now the Dems are trying although a tadslowly and less brutally to do the same.

The reality is that is the only way you can make sure you can govern. Leaving the enemy in place maens at best for you obstructionism and at worst outrgith campaigns against.

It is no surprise that state officails appointed by Samak and Somchai would assist in and even organize actions to help government supporters.

If the Dems want to see their asbility to govern improve they now need to brutally replace all Thaksin sympathisers. And if PTP were to return to power they would then brutally replace all Dem sympathisers.....

Real Politik in Thailand.

Well said that person.

And it is never going to change. TIT

[sriracha john]

One of the more significant posts from the time regarding amongst other issues, the co-leader Uthai Saenkaew, a younger brother of former Deputy Agriculture Minister Theerachai Saenkaew...

)-->

QUOTE ( @ 2008-07-25 13:27:35) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

All from the News today.

TPBS did a phone interview with one of the police chief this afternoon regarding the mob clash in Udon Thani. The Police Chief clarified that they did not react to try to stop the attacking mob because they weren't armed and furthermore out-numbered; hence they just watched.

(they weren't allowed to be armed because it might provoke even more serious consequences if used inappropriately)

ASTV shown a footage where the leader of the attacking mob (the brother of an PPP MP) shouting instructions through a microphone on top of a pickup truck ordering his mob to attack the PADs. Could be heard clearly on the video footage that the order was "go after him", "Kill him", "he's getting away...go after him...", etc.

The reporter added that the mob leader also openly announced over his microphone that "get 500 baht per injury imposed on the PADs" & "get 20,000 baht if killed a PAD leader/guard."

(I wonder how could this mob leader still walking the street...no arrest warrant...nothing)

TPBS shown a footage where Suthep Thepsuban was interviewed by a group of reporter this morning. Suthep said that he has received information that an amount of 30 Million Baht was paid to see to it that the mob clashes. Suthep also said that Charlerm made a phone call to show his support for the attacking mob in Udon Thani after the clash is inappropriate and should resign.

[hammered]

Of course Thaksin and his proxiers stuffed every province, the police, the DSI, the bureacracy etc with every hand chosen yes man and supporter they could. Now the Dems are trying although a tadslowly and less brutally to do the same.

The reality is that is the only way you can make sure you can govern. Leaving the enemy in place maens at best for you obstructionism and at worst outrgith campaigns against.

It is no surprise that state officails appointed by Samak and Somchai would assist in and even organize actions to help government supporters.

If the Dems want to see their asbility to govern improve they now need to brutally replace all Thaksin sympathisers. And if PTP were to return to power they would then brutally replace all Dem sympathisers.....

Real Politik in Thailand.

You must also think the yellow shirt did a patriotic thing by taking over the airport.

I think your handle fits you well.

What does that have to do with realpolitk in Thailand where every government stuffs every state agency with its people and orders them to do what the government wants?

My comment was intended as a neutral analysis of what really happens in government regardless of party although TRT/PPP/PTP do seem to actually be better at doing it which is a comment on efficiency

[Briggsy]

Good analysis, hammered.

[sunsamourai]

Good analysis, hammered.

Yes : +1 with Hammered

[petaling]

Authorities face disciplinary probe over Udon Thani clashes

The Police Chief, the provincial Governor, and three senior officers from Udon Thani face a disciplinary probe after the National Anti-Corruption Commission said in a report Wednesday that it suspected foul play in the clash between red and yellow shirts last July.

The NACC has found cause to suspect serious violations involving provincial Police Chief Major-General Permsak Paradonsak, NACC member Klanarong Chantik said.

Police Major-General Permsak Paradonsak was fired from the police force yesterday for his involvement in this mayhem.

[h90]

Authorities face disciplinary probe over Udon Thani clashes

Good.

I just hope the the army will have to face similar probes for the airport sieges.

What did the army on the airport????

[animatic]

Of course Thaksin and his proxiers stuffed every province, the police, the DSI, the bureacracy etc with every hand chosen yes man and supporter they could. Now the Dems are trying although a tadslowly and less brutally to do the same.

The reality is that is the only way you can make sure you can govern. Leaving the enemy in place maens at best for you obstructionism and at worst outrgith campaigns against.

It is no surprise that state officails appointed by Samak and Somchai would assist in and even organize actions to help government supporters.

If the Dems want to see their asbility to govern improve they now need to brutally replace all Thaksin sympathisers. And if PTP were to return to power they would then brutally replace all Dem sympathisers.....

Real Politik in Thailand.

You must also think the yellow shirt did a patriotic thing by taking over the airport.

I think your handle fits you well.

What does that have to do with realpolitk in Thailand where every government stuffs every state agency with its people and orders them to do what the government wants?

My comment was intended as a neutral analysis of what really happens in government regardless of party although TRT/PPP/PTP do seem to actually be better at doing it which is a comment on efficiency

Yes, a neutral analysis,

and nothing to do with the Airport.

If you want the airport issues added, why not ALSO charge Sae Daeng and his redshirt attack team

for throwing hand grenades at PAD encampment at GH, which coupled with the viciousness of Oct 7th

essentially forced PAD's hand into seeking a larger target, and more disruption to force PPP out

earlier if possible. Would you be content to leave people who did Oct 7th and night grenadings of grannies,

in power of you could change that? Again PPP/Redshirts mis-read PAD's resolve and fortitude in a grand way.

Who came first chicken or egg.

Is it patriotic or high treason?

Who knows at this point in time. That determination is totally dependent

on who has actually done the 'long term best thing' for Thailand.

Which can not be judged till all the pieces fall into place, maybe years from now.

Certainly Thaksin and gang were trying to stack the deck for total control come a certain sad day.

And certain others clearly saw that happening and put a stop to it.

If we consider how little consideration Thaksin has for ALL of Thailand by words and actions internationally,

There is little reason to believe he would be doing good for Thailand, well before doing good for himself and his minions.

If a 'big event' happens sadly sooner than later, some may look at the short term disruption of

the airport and associated commerce, as a smaller price to pay than the alternative as it appeared,

and still appears, to have been falling into place as one of the logical end games...

None of this means PAD's legal cases should not proceed towards resolution in open court.

Of course this whole GH and Airport debacle is a continuation of Udon Thani troubles.

Essentially Thaksin's planted men stopping ALL discussion of other political alternatives

in their areas of their control.

So, since democracy is also based on open discussion, and not just 'votes by the public'.

TRT, Thaksins street thugs, and police network were/are clearly showing a pattern of

denial of a basic tenet of Democracy that allows for INFORMED electorate,

along with those free and fair elections.

Udon Thai was not the 1st excessive violence by the TRT street army soon to be called the 'Red shirts',

Chaingami has been several times a black eye for Thai Democracy, unequivocally the Reshirt roots in history

have nothing to do with the basic elements of Democracy, but suppression of those elements that

didn't support their leaders control of the nation.

Realpolitic = hands on, feet on the ground, power acquisition and maintenance of those levers of power.

[Publicus]

If you want the airport issues added, why not ALSO charge Sae Daeng and his redshirt attack team

for throwing hand grenades at PAD encampment at GH, which coupled with the viciousness of Oct 7th

essentially forced PAD's hand into seeking a larger target, and more disruption to force PPP out

earlier if possible. Would you be content to leave people who did Oct 7th and night grenadings of grannies,

in power of you could change that? Again PPP/Redshirts mis-read PAD's resolve and fortitude in a grand way.

Who came first chicken or egg.

Is it patriotic or high treason?

Who knows at this point in time. That determination is totally dependent

on who has actually done the 'long term best thing' for Thailand.

Which can not be judged till all the pieces fall into place, maybe years from now.

Certainly Thaksin and gang were trying to stack the deck for total control come a certain sad day.

And certain others clearly saw that happening and put a stop to it.

If we consider how little consideration Thaksin has for ALL of Thailand by words and actions internationally,

There is little reason to believe he would be doing good for Thailand, well before doing good for himself and his minions.

If a 'big event' happens sadly sooner than later, some may look at the short term disruption of

the airport and associated commerce, as a smaller price to pay than the alternative as it appeared,

and still appears, to have been falling into place as one of the logical end games...

None of this means PAD's legal cases should not proceed towards resolution in open court.

Of course this whole GH and Airport debacle is a continuation of Udon Thani troubles.

Essentially Thaksin's planted men stopping ALL discussion of other political alternatives

in their areas of their control.

So, since democracy is also based on open discussion, and not just 'votes by the public'.

TRT, Thaksins street thugs, and police network were/are clearly showing a pattern of

denial of a basic tenet of Democracy that allows for INFORMED electorate,

along with those free and fair elections.

Udon Thai was not the 1st excessive violence by the TRT street army soon to be called the 'Red shirts',

Chaingami has been several times a black eye for Thai Democracy, unequivocally the Reshirt roots in history

have nothing to do with the basic elements of Democracy, but suppression of those elements that

didn't support their leaders control of the nation.

Realpolitic = hands on, feet on the ground, power acquisition and maintenance of those levers of power.

Yes, indeed. It's not difficult to connect easily to this presentation of the events of recent years.

The actions of each of the several groups of players in the Shakespearean tragedy known as contemporary Thailand are interconnected and sequential, action-reaction, cause effect developments that occur in a context rather than in isolation or without purpose.

There also is the cost-benefit calculation and analysis in the action of each group as each organization pursues its own agenda and reacts to the actions of other groups in their pursuit of their particular agendas. The cost-benefit of the airport occupation was calculated, as was the cost-benefit of the Songkran riots. One can argue which was the better calculation, but one would have a weak argument if one claimed the two are unrelated and not connected or that there isn't a cause-effect relationship between the two (and many other) events.

So it could seem that none of the groups in the ongoing tragedy of the past several years have the short term interests of the country on their various agendas, but rather are anticipating the inevitable sad day and period, and its aftermath both short and long term, which will lead to a still in the balance reconfiguration and realignment of politics, society and government. The long prelude of these past several years is the country's present burden, a burden which seems unavoidable so must be endured in the hope of better afterward whether afterward means a sooner or later afterward.

Discussions and analyses such as the recent posts to this thread reflect that it is entirely possible and indeed is the case that an advocate of either side, or one who is aligned but not an advocate, can make a resonably 'neutral' observation or analysis pertaining to either side or to all sides. It's possible and indeed doable to step back occasionally to offer a somewhat detached perspective regardless of one's known and acknowledged leanings. A cooler analysis not only is always welcome, but the more of it the better.

Edited October 31, 2009 by Publicus

[Steve2UK]

,<snip> If you want the airport issues added, why not ALSO charge Sae Daeng and his redshirt attack team

for throwing hand grenades at PAD encampment at GH <snip>

Perhaps because no-one has produced any evidence that would make the charges stick - least of all you......... no matter how many times you repeat the categorical statement and get asked for your evidence.

[animatic]

There is more than adequate circumstancial and anecdotal evidence

in the public sphere to believe this is what happened.

Maybe not for a conviction at this point in time,

but where has been the investigations?

FACTS:

He announced it would happen publicly.

He publicly trained Red Shirt groups for the task.

And then the EXACT actions, that he proposed and trained thugs to do, happened.

And people died.

People died, and their families deserve to know why,

and not have it swept under the rug, because it is a

so much smaller occurrence than the following weeks events.

[petaling]

Additional information on the firing of Police Major-General Permsak the other day:

The disciplinary committee also acted to dismiss Udon Thani provincial police commissioner Pol Maj-Gen Permsak Paradonsak from service, in a separate incident, for failing to stop the Red Shirt protesters of the United Front for Democracy Against Dictatorship (UDD) from attacking PAD protesters who were protesting in Udon on July 24 last year, injuring several dozen protesters.

The disciplinary committee's decision came after the NACC found that he had committed a grave disciplinary offence for failing to prevent the clash between the two rival groups of protesters.

Gen Priewpan said that based on the NACC rulings there are only two disciplinary options for the national police bureau to bring against for the two commissioners, dismissal with benefits or dismissal without benefits.

The ‘softest’ action the board can take is dismissal with benefits, said Gen Priewpan, as the board recognised they had done their best to control their respective situations.

The committee decisions were also made in comparison with the punishment meted out against ex-police chief Pol Gen Patcharawat Wongsuwan on his role in the October 7 incident.

Gen Priewpan said that the meeting resolutions will be forwarded to acting national police chief Pol Gen Patheep Tanprasert for his endorsement.

If the two officers feel that they have been treated unfairly, said the deputy police chief, they can file complaints at the Criminal and Administrative Courts.

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva signed the dismissal order for Gen Patcharawat retroactively on October 16 although he retired on October 1, as suggested by a joint meeting of the Office of the Council of State, the Prime Minister's Office, the Office of the Police Commission and the Office of the Civil Service Commission (OCSC). (TNA)

http://enews.mcot.net/view.php?id=12533&t=2