Use Of ที่หนึ่ง

[eek]

Please excuse my Thai script if not clear, i am still at baby steps. If not clear I will ask for help

Would like to better understand the use of ที่หนึ่ง when ordering an item.

ie: ขอ กาแฟเย็น ที่หนึ่ง ค่ะ

Is this used only if going to be asking for more than one item? Or if in company? Or, can it be used when ordering a single item and alone?

I have been told that it is a very nice and polite way to order, but not given a clear reason as to why or when best to use it.

Thanks!

(Sorry if been asked before)

[teacup]

Please excuse my Thai script if not clear, i am still at baby steps. If not clear I will ask for help

Would like to better understand the use of ที่หนึ่ง when ordering an item.

ie: ขอ กาแฟเย็น ที่หนึ่ง ค่ะ

Is this used only if going to be asking for more than one item? Or if in company? Or, can it be used when ordering a single item and alone?

I have been told that it is a very nice and polite way to order, but not given a clear reason as to why or when best to use it.

Thanks!

(Sorry if been asked before)

try......หนึ่งที่.....when ordering

a bit more understandable for the thais

[aanon]

Please excuse my Thai script if not clear, i am still at baby steps. If not clear I will ask for help

Would like to better understand the use of ที่หนึ่ง when ordering an item.

ie: ขอ กาแฟเย็น ที่หนึ่ง ค่ะ

Is this used only if going to be asking for more than one item? Or if in company? Or, can it be used when ordering a single item and alone?

I have been told that it is a very nice and polite way to order, but not given a clear reason as to why or when best to use it.

Thanks!

(Sorry if been asked before)

try......หนึ่งที่.....when ordering

a bit more understandable for the thais

in this usage, it just means 'for one person', or 'one place', if that makes sense. you can also use แก้วหนึ่ง, ถ้วยหนึ่ง, ถุงหนึ่ง if you know the specific classifier, but ที่หนึ่ง/หนึ่งที่ is a good all-round solution. i wouldn't call it particularly polite or impolite, just neutral. note that you can also use สองที่, สามที่ etc. in this latter case you can't switch the words around; the order is fixed.

[CSS]

Please excuse my Thai script if not clear, i am still at baby steps. If not clear I will ask for help

Would like to better understand the use of ที่หนึ่ง when ordering an item.

ie: ขอ กาแฟเย็น ที่หนึ่ง ค่ะ

Is this used only if going to be asking for more than one item? Or if in company? Or, can it be used when ordering a single item and alone?

I have been told that it is a very nice and polite way to order, but not given a clear reason as to why or when best to use it.

Thanks!

(Sorry if been asked before)

try......หนึ่งที่.....when ordering

a bit more understandable for the thais

When adding หนึ่งที่ into your order request you are clarifying that you only need one serving/order of that item. So the times when you would use it are times when clarification might be necessary, like when you are in company, as you mentioned. For example, if you are in company and ordering for the whole table you might have to clarify that you only need one of that dish or one serving of rice, then you would use หนึ่งที่. If you were by yourself but were ordering multiples of some items then you might also add หนึ่งที่ for the items of which you only wanted one, just for clarification.

Edit: I see that Aanon posted while I was composing. My message really isn't necessary after his helpful post but I'll leave it as it is anyway.

Edited February 25, 2009 by CSS

[teacup]

When adding หนึ่งที่ into your order request you are clarifying that you only need one serving/order of that item.

I know....

Yea....my friends can order for themselves....haha

Edited February 25, 2009 by teacup

[DavidHouston]

When adding หนึ่งที่ into your order request you are clarifying that you only need one serving/order of that item.

I know....

Yea....my friends can order for themselves....haha

Then, order for all three of them and say, "สามที่.

[teacup]

When adding หนึ่งที่ into your order request you are clarifying that you only need one serving/order of that item.

I know....

Yea....my friends can order for themselves....haha

Then, order for all three of them and say, "สามที่.

noo way....what if I have to pay for all สามที่ ????

Next time we go with you, you order for us

[dotcom]

Does nueng tee & tee nueng mean the same thing?

[eek]

Really appreciate such clear and detailed explanations. Thank you all.

Does nueng tee & tee nueng mean the same thing?

I personally havent heard it said the other way around. Curious about this too now!

[aanon]

Really appreciate such clear and detailed explanations. Thank you all.

Does nueng tee & tee nueng mean the same thing?

I personally havent heard it said the other way around. Curious about this too now!

yes, thee nueng/neung thee mean the same thing (in this context).

[dvc]

The difference between ที่หนึ่ง and หนึ่งที่ was explained to me thus: ที่หนึ่ง is equivalent to the English indefinite article 'a', and can be translated as, "a set". Whereas หนึ่งที่ is part of a precise request for exactly 'one' set. 'Set' in this sense means 'order'. I use ที่หนึ่ง if there is no chance that my request will be misinterpreted as anything other than an order for one of whatever item it is I'm requesting. I'll use หนึ่งที่ if there's a chance that the request might be interpreted as more than one, or if I'm ordering multiple items, each of different quantity. I do get the sense, (from Thai friends), that this method of ordering is somewhat more genteel than using the container/classifier as the ordering unit. For example: หนึ่งแก้ว or แก้วหนึ่ง จานหนึ่ง or หนึ่งจาน

[tgeezer]

Does anybody know why ที่หนึ่ง จานหนึ่ง and หนึ่งที่ หนึ่งจาน can it be both?

My dictionaries classes หนึ่ง as an adjective but สอง สาม สี่ ฯ as nouns, so I was happy with that, decided ที่หนึ่ง and สองที่ were correct, until I read that they are taught as adjectives also. Being in the same class หนึ่ง, สอง สาม สี่ ฯ should be able to be used in the same way as หนึ่ง should they not?

Edited February 27, 2009 by tgeezer

[CSS]

Does anybody know why ที่หนึ่ง จานหนึ่ง and หนึ่งที่ หนึ่งจาน can it be both?

My dictionaries classes หนึ่ง as an adjective but สอง สาม สี่ ฯ as nouns, so I was happy with that, decided ที่หนึ่ง and สองที่ were correct, until I read that they are taught as adjectives also. Being in the same class หนึ่ง, สอง สาม สี่ ฯ should be able to be used in the same way as หนึ่ง should they not?

Your analysis is correct. ที่หนึง จานหนึง are simply exceptions. There may be a broader set of rules that explain this that I don't know but what I do know is that any number greater than 1 cannot be used after the classifier the way หนึ่ง can.

[appleman]

tee nueng = first (ex. first in your class)

nueng tee = one (serving, item)

tee diew = one (serving, item)

I would use tee diew if I wanted to order one coffee - Khaw kafae tee diew.

[appleman]

Opps!

I did some further checking.

tee nueng is OK but is sometimes confused with first or best

tee diew is more often used as an answer to how many do you want, "only one"

nueng tee is usually the best.

But I have been advised that saying khaw kafae nueng is OK too.

[Rionoir]

Isn't it หนึ่งที่ ...but if you put ที่ first the second word is not หนึ่ง it is นึง ... it is not pronounced the same. So you would say ที่นึง with level tone. Small difference but can be noticeable.

Edited March 12, 2009 by Rionoir

[eek]

Personally, I have usually heard ที่หนึ่ง being used most often (just my personal experience though).

Interested to know others viewpoints on Rionoir's post

Can I just clarify too, that it isnt something you would really use if ordering one item, and on your own. Only if you are ordering other things and you wish to clarify that you only need one of that item. Right? Sorry if it sounds dumb of me, i just wish to be 100% sure!

[tgeezer]

Personally, I have usually heard ที่หนึ่ง being used most often (just my personal experience though).

Interested to know others viewpoints on Rionoir's post

Can I just clarify too, that it isnt something you would really use if ordering one item, and on your own. Only if you are ordering other things and you wish to clarify that you only need one of that item. Right? Sorry if it sounds dumb of me, i just wish to be 100% sure!

It is not dumb at all, I am also confused, I resort to the dictionary.

Here is what I think it is, in หนึ่งที่ : เอาข้าวแกงหนึ่งจาน เอา + ข้าวแกง are assumed so หนึ่งจาน, however จาน has been replaced by ที่ as a classifier. สอง,สาม,ที่ etc. What it is grammatically I don't know.

In ที่หนึ่ง : unfortunately, ที่ has several more meanings, here, it is 'position', so ที่หนึ่ง means 'position one' or 'first', The context precludes that so it means what the waiter and customer agree it means, commonly that is หนึ่งจาน. Everybody says ที่หนึ่ง or หนึ่งที่ interchangeably and there is no problem, there is certainly no difference in meaning.

I have never heard of ที่นึง although I have probably said it many times, I have no reason to suppose it doesn't work. นึง is obselete Thai for the eleventh son apparently.

[Rionoir]

I just checked with a couple Thai friends on MSN... if you spell it out, you would write ที่หนึ่ง ... but it is usually pronounced นึง (level tone)... I know it was written phonetically in my textbook as the spoken version (นึง), but I bet if I go back and look the thai next to it probably was หนึ่ง.

[eek]

Ok, well im feeling a bit sheepish, because apparently what i first thought i was hearing, isnt correct. Apparently its a totally different tone and what ive been hearing doesnt mean "the first", but means something along the lines of "just one". Its a softer sound. I have no idea how to try write it in Thai script.

Anyone have any idea what I mean?

[mangkorn]

อย่างเดียว

[eek]

I guess im not being clear enough. It sounds like ที่หนึ่ง but is not หนึ่ง. Its something like ที่ - Neun (no idea how to try write what the sound in Thai script). It has nothing to do with หนึ่ง. It means something like "Just a cup of coffee" or "coffee only".

[Rionoir]

eek... it's what I posted right above your question. It's written like 1, but it is just pronounced with siang saaman.

[DavidHouston]

I guess im not being clear enough. It sounds like ที่หนึ่ง but is not หนึ่ง. Its something like ที่ - Neun (no idea how to try write what the sound in Thai script). It has nothing to do with หนึ่ง. It means something like "Just a cup of coffee" or "coffee only".

I wonder if you are over-thinking this question. The RID says,

"หนึ่งน. ตัวเลขตัวแรกของจำนวนนับ; จำนวนเดียว, คนเดียว, สิ่งเดียว, เช่น

หนึ่งในดวงใจ. ว. เดี่ยว; เป็นเอก, เป็นเลิศ, เช่น เพื่อน ๆ ยกให้เขาเป็น

หนึ่งในรุ่น."

Doesn't ". . . จำนวนเดียว, คนเดียว, สิ่งเดียว . . ." indicate that "ที่หนึ่ง" is a perfectly logical extension of the RID definition?

[eek]

eek... it's what I posted right above your question. It's written like 1, but it is just pronounced with siang saaman.

Oh! Yes, maybe thats it. The problem is too that im very (and I mean VERY slow) at reading Thai (and even slower at writing it)! I will take a look into what you wrote, thank you!

---------

Thanks too DavidHouston for your reply, although I have to admit im really struggling to understand your post clearly, sorry. Im not at all advanced enough!

-------

Well, looks like i have some research to do!

[DavidHouston]

eek... it's what I posted right above your question. It's written like 1, but it is just pronounced with siang saaman.

Oh! Yes, maybe thats it. The problem is too that im very (and I mean VERY slow) at reading Thai (and even slower at writing it)! I will take a look into what you wrote, thank you!

---------

Thanks too DavidHouston for your reply, although I have to admit im really struggling to understand your post clearly, sorry. Im not at all advanced enough!

-------

Well, looks like i have some research to do!

Perhaps I should provide my interpretation of the RID definition:

"หนึ่ง น. ตัวเลขตัวแรกของจำนวนนับ; จำนวนเดียว, คนเดียว, สิ่งเดียว, เช่น

หนึ่งในดวงใจ. ว. เดี่ยว; เป็นเอก, เป็นเลิศ, เช่น เพื่อน ๆ ยกให้เขาเป็น

หนึ่งในรุ่น."

One (noun) the first counting numeral; one number, one person only, a single thing; for example, 'the only one in my heart'; (modifier) single; unanimous; excellent, superb; for example, 'his friends chose him as being the top of his class'.

I would appreciate suggestions for corrections or augmentations to the translation.

[eek]

Bit of an old bump. Just something happened just now that was quite bizarre. A new use for ที่หนึ่ง maybe? Crank pervy caller. Ive had them before, but usually cant understand their raspy bletherings. This guy however, said two times, slowly, in a raspy evil sounding voice, this (well, i believe it was this):

สิบแปด (then what sounded like "sabdee?". could have been นาที maybe?) เย็ดที่หนึ่ง

If you are interested in discussing this with him, id be happy to pass on his mobile number. LOL.

Edited April 19, 2012 by eek