Obama's Bank Rescue Measures And Us Recovery

[thailandlover]

Given that the US is one of the largest economies in the world and that Thailand's economic recovery will be, in large part, tied in with that of the US I ask, do you expect the Obama Administration's bank rescue measures to work and when do you expect the US economy to recover?

If not, why not?

[H2oDunc]

It will work! Its just at the end of it you will have a communist, socialist USA where you will no longer be the land of the free. You have voted in your own Tony Blair. Talks a good fight but look what he gave the UK! Be warned! Check the figures they are talking about in the USA Trillions upon Trillions of DEBT all going to a private bank namely the FED!!

[JimsKnight]

Duncs right. The writing's been on the wall since the Barack man won the election.

The US is not going to come out of this better than she went in.

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

Eventually the US will recover, but you are looking at a long long time.

One big concern is that China is talking about a supper currency to replace the USD, if that happens the US will go down the tubes rapidly.

What happens to the US economy will impact Thailand and most of the world. I think everyone is going to have to tighten their belt for a few years. But I think Thailand is better situated than most countries to handle the bad times.

As far is the stimulation packages, they just give money to the rich and transfer debt to the tax payer. The politicians have to look like they are doing something even if it is wrong, or they will not be voted in again.

There is no easy solution. Whatever they do is going to be painful to most of the world, it is mostly a matter of how long.

[Jake1]

No..you can't spent your way out of a problem that was created by over spending and cheap money. The Government needs to shrink and not grow. We need to save and not spend. Listen to the Austrians and boot the Keynesians.

[quiksilva]

The problem with China's special reserve currency, is that it would be issued by the IMF which gets most of its support from the USA, so what's the difference?

Does every nation on Earth contribute to it? Can it ever be a truly global bank of last reserve... Somehow I cant see Thailand liking that proposal.

[samuibeachcomber]

I would n't mind betting the USA would go to war if others tried to replace the dollar as the world's reserve currency,in fact the USA's difficulties would be well sorted with an international incident that led to a war,its happened in the past.building industries,munition industries,auto makers,food production and clothing would all benefit,and the money thr FED prints to fund it would actually be used constructively to get production going again,instead of being consumed down a black hole which is happening now.my 2 cents worth.

[dotcom]

It will work! Its just at the end of it you will have a communist, socialist USA where you will no longer be the land of the free. You have voted in your own Tony Blair. Talks a good fight but look what he gave the UK! Be warned! Check the figures they are talking about in the USA Trillions upon Trillions of DEBT all going to a private bank namely the FED!!

Just like to add one more item to the outcome - a worthless dollar.

But we did know nobama was a Marxist going in (several years ago).

[Alwaysright]

I would n't mind betting the USA would go to war if others tried to replace the dollar as the world's reserve currency,in fact the USA's difficulties would be well sorted with an international incident that led to a war,its happened in the past.building industries,munition industries,auto makers,food production and clothing would all benefit,and the money thr FED prints to fund it would actually be used constructively to get production going again,instead of being consumed down a black hole which is happening now.my 2 cents worth.

They already have two wars.

[Jingthing]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

Edited March 26, 2009 by Jingthing

[Wrong Turn]

No..you can't spent your way out of a problem that was created by over spending and cheap money. The Government needs to shrink and not grow. We need to save and not spend. Listen to the Austrians and boot the Keynesians.

Obama is doing very heavy Kenynesian actions. Unprecdented.

Is all of this "stimulus" necesarry? Much of the money is wasted.

Or, do Obama, Summers, and Geithner have numbers that we the public, don't know about.

Yes, over-borrowing, and over-spending was the problem. Also, greed with the Credit Default Swaps.

I like the Austrian School of Economic thought, and Ludwig Von Mises. There is a home website with good article, there. Google it.

What will happen in the US? I think in December we'll know if it's a long recession, that will take a long time to recover, or it's worse, and will take a long time to recover.

We have to wait and see. Strange times, indeed.

[midas]

Eventually the US will recover, but you are looking at a long long time.

BEENTHERE when you say " recover " what does recovery mean to you?

It almost implies a return to previous standards.................

I always thought it sounded strange that the largest component of the biggest economy in the world

was consumption.

Surely with less credit available in the foreseeable future USA could never go back to its old ways?

[Jingthing]

Good point, Midas. I think many Americans have not yet fully internalized that the bubble years were built on a completely unsustainable foundation. Those days are OVER for good. People are also looking for a scapegoat to blame. In my view, most ALL Americans are to blame, we all went along for the crazy ride and didn't ask any questions when the going was good.

Edited March 26, 2009 by Jingthing

[neverdie]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

Global Traitors . Are you suggesting that anyone that disagrees with Obama's actions is a Traitor? Seems a bit harsh Jingthing.

[OriginalPoster]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

Global Traitors . Are you suggesting that anyone that disagrees with Obama's actions is a Traitor? Seems a bit harsh Jingthing.

When the Left is in power, they don't like dissent any more than the Right does when they are in power. The real Left, though, seems to be calling Obama himself a traitor for handling the financial mess much in the same way that they imagine that Bush would have.

Edited March 26, 2009 by OriginalPoster

[Naam]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

i have to agree with Jingthing. most of my close american friends (they are all republicans) cheer when any alleged mistake of Obama surfaces or the dozens of Rush Limbaughs invent one. what they don't realise is that Obama has taken over AFTER the shit hit the fan economically as well as the utmost shitty situation the warmongers left for him. this inspite of the fact that they are all negatively affected if the efforts of the present administration are without success.

a couple of days ago i got a bit upset during a phone conversation with a dear old friend and asked him when the republicans will start to blame Obama for World War II and global warming

[Jingthing]

Yes. they care more about their narrow IDEOLOGY than the human pain and damage that will occur if Obama totally fails. Dam_n them! The absolute worst kind of SORE LOSERS.

Edited March 26, 2009 by Jingthing

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

Eventually the US will recover, but you are looking at a long long time.

BEENTHERE when you say " recover " what does recovery mean to you?

It almost implies a return to previous standards.................

I always thought it sounded strange that the largest component of the biggest economy in the world

was consumption.

Surely with less credit available in the foreseeable future USA could never go back to its old ways?

Midas that is a good question and I must admit I never considered what recovery means. But since you ask, I've given it a little thought and after 78 years of consumption I think getting back to the 50's life style would be a great recovery. Don't think they had credit cards then and to borrow money for a mortgage required a sizable down payment and steady income.

But to be honest to me those were the good old days. So back to one car per family, one bathroom per house and one TV would be a good start.

Back to where it was in the early 2000 I don't think we will see again, certainly not in my lifetime.

[lannarebirth]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

i have to agree with Jingthing. most of my close american friends (they are all republicans) cheer when any alleged mistake of Obama surfaces or the dozens of Rush Limbaughs invent one. what they don't realise is that Obama has taken over AFTER the shit hit the fan economically as well as the utmost shitty situation the warmongers left for him. this inspite of the fact that they are all negatively affected if the efforts of the present administration are without success.

a couple of days ago i got a bit upset during a phone conversation with a dear old friend and asked him when the republicans will start to blame Obama for World War II and global warming

I am neither a Republican nor a Democrat and am sympathetic to neither. I see very little involvement by any presidents in this global financial crisis. Whether it be Clinton, Bush, or Obama. All have done just as they have been instructed by their "handlers", the Fed Chairman and Treasury officials of their time. THOSE persons, the Rubins, the Paulsons, the Greenspans, the Geithners and dozens of other lesser Goldman Sachs operatives are the chief architects of this fiasco and are the "go to" guys for cleaning up the mess.

That these stimulus measures are going to be gamed by the banks and hedge funds to the tune of umpteen trillions goes without saying at this point. The only thing I would hold Obama personally responsible for is that he didn't shut down his congress from loading the spending bills with hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars worth of superfluous pork.

Edited March 26, 2009 by lannarebirth

[BygonKeaw]

why are you all talking about obama?? he is just a puppet, get real!

The real leaders are invisible to most, behind the not so well hidden curtain(if u look) are the FED pulling the strings and getting closer and closer to there goal 1 world goverment.

Expect war, expect western ecomonies to collapse, this is all part of the plan.

The only way you change the future is by educating people and opening the minds to the truth.

Is suggest this will help you.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7535755025025800195

Also just to give u a idea of what a trillion dollars looks like click below

http://www.pagetutor.com/trillion/index.html

Ps im not any prophet or conspirecy theorists, im just a ordinary guy who has found out the real truth.

Edited March 26, 2009 by BygonKeaw

[midas]

Midas that is a good question and I must admit I never considered what recovery means. But since you ask, I've given it a little thought and after 78 years of consumption I think getting back to the 50's life style would be a great recovery. Don't think they had credit cards then and to borrow money for a mortgage required a sizable down payment and steady income.

But to be honest to me those were the good old days. So back to one car per family, one bathroom per house and one TV would be a good start.

Back to where it was in the early 2000 I don't think we will see again, certainly not in my lifetime.

Yes I most certainly share your nostalgia for the past but just reverting to

one car per family, one bathroom per house and one TV etc wouldn't even begin

to fix the problem. Surely a big component of appeal the days that you are referring to was

the way people treated each other. There was discipline in the home,

and a code of ethics in the workplace but things have now deteriorated so much.

I was reading an article talking about how many more people are now visiting

psychiatrists and popping antidepressant pills because they feel a tremendous

loss for those old days. But many people still don't realise we have permanently

left the old world we used to know and it does stir up some emotional feelings.

[sendbaht]

Hard as we may find it to conceive, capitalism offers more things to believe in than any system that has come before. President Obama's team is on the right track.

[AlexLah]

The Geitner plan will work very well, but not for the taxpayers.

Big piles of money will again flow to the big investors, yep those banks again.

Remember they want to get rid of all these toxic assets legacy assets, basically almost non performing loans and stuff.

They will most likely do something like the following:

1. Bank sets up Private entity

2. Private entity bids $100 for an asset that is only worth $50

3. Bank therefore has a windfall of $50

4. Asset returns to its real value of $50 after being transferred, a 50% fall.

5. Private entity looses 50% of its $7.50. Namely $3.75

6. Net the combined Private entity and Bank make $46.25 ($50-$3.75). And obviously the tax payer looses the same

The FDIC and the treassury (Taxpayers) take the biggest part of the risk, more than 90%

The biggest looting operation in the history of the world is taking place right under our eyes and the taxpayers can't do a thing about it.

Happy changing......

»

[dotcom]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

nobama is spending trillions. He calls it stimulus. Because he is a liar. He is spending trillions on his socialist agenda.

That have outlawed terms like war or terror & terrorist. They are weak on homeland security.

They are all about amnesty & other left wing causes. Abortion on demand etc. Eric Holder said we might have to release some gitmo detainess into the USA. What a good idea!!!!!

[lannarebirth]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

i have to agree with Jingthing. most of my close american friends (they are all republicans) cheer when any alleged mistake of Obama surfaces or the dozens of Rush Limbaughs invent one. what they don't realise is that Obama has taken over AFTER the shit hit the fan economically as well as the utmost shitty situation the warmongers left for him. this inspite of the fact that they are all negatively affected if the efforts of the present administration are without success.

a couple of days ago i got a bit upset during a phone conversation with a dear old friend and asked him when the republicans will start to blame Obama for World War II and global warming

Getting away from the Obama angle for a minute Doctor. You know as well as I do that these common shareholders of many of these insolvent financials should be wiped out. The bondholders should be begging for scraps after a receivership, nationalization or reorginization. None of that precludes the government stepping in to bolster these businesses and distressed assets. So what gives? Is this some new kind of economic market theory?

Edited March 26, 2009 by lannarebirth

[Jake1]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

His policies steal from the tax payers and it hands money over to the Rich. I do not want our debt to increase $2 Trillion a year, I do not want my $'s to lose value, and I do not want my constituion to be shreaded in the name of "personal safety" His policies are built to fail. I want the FED Abolished, I don't want the Government telling me what I can eat, and I want Sound Money restored. It's not about left wing or right wing it's about the Politicians destroying our Country, Politicians from both sides.

And I'm in Iraq <deleted>.

[lannarebirth]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

His policies steal from the tax payers and it hands money over to the Rich. I do not want our debt to increase $2 Trillion a year, I do not want my $'s to lose value, and I do not want my constituion to be shreaded in the name of "personal safety" His policies are built to fail. I want the FED Abolished, I don't want the Government telling me what I can eat, and I want Sound Money restored. It's not about left wing or right wing it's about the Politicians destroying our Country, Politicians from both sides.

And I'm in Iraq <deleted>.

Yes, but it might make the stocks go up, and that's all important isn't it?

[dotcom]

I am neither a Republican nor a Democrat and am sympathetic to neither. I see very little involvement by any presidents in this global financial crisis. Whether it be Clinton, Bush, or Obama. All have done just as they have been instructed by their "handlers", the Fed Chairman and Treasury officials of their time. THOSE persons, the Rubins, the Paulsons, the Greenspans, the Geithners and dozens of other lesser Goldman Sachs operatives are the chief architects of this fiasco and are the "go to" guys for cleaning up the mess.

That these stimulus measures are going to be gamed by the banks and hedge funds to the tune of umpteen trillions goes without saying at this point. The only thing I would hold Obama personally responsible for is that he didn't shut down his congress from loading the spending bills with hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars worth of superfluous pork.

well spotted lannarebirth. This video explains what you are saying:

Follow the money. Who is the fed? Whose money do they use?

[BygonKeaw]

I am neither a Republican nor a Democrat and am sympathetic to neither. I see very little involvement by any presidents in this global financial crisis. Whether it be Clinton, Bush, or Obama. All have done just as they have been instructed by their "handlers", the Fed Chairman and Treasury officials of their time. THOSE persons, the Rubins, the Paulsons, the Greenspans, the Geithners and dozens of other lesser Goldman Sachs operatives are the chief architects of this fiasco and are the "go to" guys for cleaning up the mess.

That these stimulus measures are going to be gamed by the banks and hedge funds to the tune of umpteen trillions goes without saying at this point. The only thing I would hold Obama personally responsible for is that he didn't shut down his congress from loading the spending bills with hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars worth of superfluous pork.

well spotted lannarebirth. This video explains what you are saying:

Follow the money. Who is the fed? Whose money do they use?

Yes exactly. That's the video i posted in post #20.

Im hoping i brought your attention to it. If not im happy you are open minded enough to seek the truth.

The truth however doesnt look good

[Misty]

Nobody knows whether it will work or not. However, some of you who hate Obama are hoping it does not work. American left wingers opposed the invasion of Iraq but we did NOT want America to lose the war. Yet American right wingers cheer for the failure of Obama's fight to save our economy (and in many ways the global economy). Traitors.

i have to agree with Jingthing. most of my close american friends (they are all republicans) cheer when any alleged mistake of Obama surfaces or the dozens of Rush Limbaughs invent one. what they don't realise is that Obama has taken over AFTER the shit hit the fan economically as well as the utmost shitty situation the warmongers left for him. this inspite of the fact that they are all negatively affected if the efforts of the present administration are without success.

a couple of days ago i got a bit upset during a phone conversation with a dear old friend and asked him when the republicans will start to blame Obama for World War II and global warming

I'm with you Naam and Jingthing.

What separates countries that prosper and thrive and those that do not may be two things: 1) the freedom of their respective markets, and 2) the quality, fairness, and enforcement of their legal and regulatory systems. Both are required, and it's perhaps the lack of the second that has had a hand in the current mess.

Sadly history shows us that those that clean up economic messes are rarely thanked for it, at least by those that benefit directly. You only need look at Thailand 1997-2000 to see that, and how the Democrats, former FM Tarrin Nimmanhaeminda (sp?) and former BOT Gov MR Chatu Mongkol were treated for their heroic efforts in addressing Thailand's imbalances that built up during the period 1994-1997.

My views tend towards fiscal conservatism, and I used to identify perhaps more with the Republican party in the US. While I still believe free-markets can work, realistically they do need some oversight. For political parties I'm now an independent--I'll go with whatever works and makes sense. You can certainly find plenty of narrow-mindedness and self-interest in either party. But what's interesting to me is that many so-called Republicans are really just populists in disguise--almost a flip-flop from what I had used to think the Republican party represented.

As for those who criticize Obama's policies, I'm sure the policies are not perfect, but they are likely to work. Anyone doubting the mess is unprecedented and requires serious action or it will get worse is seriously naive or uninformed. The reality is that free markets take time to work (in the long run we are all dead), and even then are unlikely to produce the optimum solution for most people. Any populist Republican that thinks letting free-markets reign will maximize his individual situation frankly deserves the personal outcome he'd would actually get, and is extremely lucky there are smarter people running the show now.

Given the size of the problems, it'd be hard to come up with a perfect solution in a time-constrained environment. I certainly haven't heard anything convincing or sensible being presented as an alternative, although there's no end to the talking heads that want to give their two cents on TV, or overseas Republicans that have absolutely no clue what they are really asking for.

Cheers, Misty