Red-shirts Battle Blue-shirts In Pattaya

[Koo82]

Abhisit just been talking live, saying they are trying to get things back to normal.

Back to normal is to be back like when we had Khun Thaksin as Prime Minister.

[daboyz1]

The Red Shirts are not for democracy. They are for Thaksin's money - always have been, always will be.

100% agree with that. They are too ignorant to realize they are taking food away from their own family's mouth. They are destroying what was left of Thailand's reputation in the international community.

[terryp]

PAD leaders have asked all yellow shirts to stay at home and keep calm

[kennkate]

Allways trouble in Paradise

[ironhut]

Talking about now possibility of airlifting world leaders out...possibly only speculation by commentators on thailandoutlooktv.com.

I've been here for a few years and rarely see a helicopter - and just don't get it.

The cost of one helicopter would off-set the cost of a VIP caravan consisting of countless cars/motorcycles/etc. and further cost/inconvenience of motorists in and around Bangkok on a daily basis. And in this current case, the helicopters would come in handy for our stranded world leaders who have been invited for discussions this weekend.

I've heard from DStation that Abhisit went to Pattaya by helicopter yesterday and they used (or wanted to use) helicopter to move taxi at Victory Monument blocking traffic. It takes 30 minutes to move 1 taxi so they need 200 years to move all taxi having red drivers. These taxis will block tanks if Army wants to make a coup. Tank idea is outdated. It's not like 30 years ago. We are not afraid of tanks.

Yes, Thailand needs to get some helicopters.

Give every VIP a helicopter and save me delays in traffic (and should be much cheaper for Thailand as well as more efficient for VIPs).

Not sure that tanks would make much progress in the gridlock. Not sure that tank commanders would keep hatches shut should someone in a colored shirt want to drive it. Therefore...tanks are a bad idea.

[xminator]

Abhisit just been talking live, saying they are trying to get things back to normal.

Good luck on that. State of emergency, killed demonstrators, and now the army going live into 10000 demonstration in front of nearly as many cameras. This have potential to become a classic. They already sacrificed police leadership in Pattaya, who will be the next to bite the blamewagon?

I doubt the stringholders will allow Puppet Abhsit to do anything rational. Personally I was surprised the Red could get that kind of numbers to Pattaya.

There is a way out without further violence. Certain named persons step down. 1997 constitution back. Elections called and price swallowed to let international observers monitor the elections, and further accept the result if the observers deem the elections fair. No more meddling by various courts.

[ThaiPauly]

Surely, the summit cannot be held in Thailand . anytime in the near future.

Fisrt it wa supposed to be in Bangkok, then Chiang Mai and now the Pattaya summit has ended in tatters.

I don't think the foreign delegates will want to return here anytime soon, and the tales they will have to tell their fellow contrymen (potential tourists) willl certainly enhance Thailand's reputation .

Bang bang...another big hole in the foot

[george]

State of emergency declared

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/State-Emerge...ur-t256341.html

[h90]

Talking about now possibility of airlifting world leaders out...possibly only speculation by commentators on thailandoutlooktv.com.

I've been here for a few years and rarely see a helicopter - and just don't get it.

The cost of one helicopter would off-set the cost of a VIP caravan consisting of countless cars/motorcycles/etc. and further cost/inconvenience of motorists in and around Bangkok on a daily basis. And in this current case, the helicopters would come in handy for our stranded world leaders who have been invited for discussions this weekend.

I've heard from DStation that Abhisit went to Pattaya by helicopter yesterday and they used (or wanted to use) helicopter to move taxi at Victory Monument blocking traffic. It takes 30 minutes to move 1 taxi so they need 200 years to move all taxi having red drivers. These taxis will block tanks if Army wants to make a coup. Tank idea is outdated. It's not like 30 years ago. We are not afraid of tanks.

just want to inform you that you can´t block a tank with taxis. They drive over it without problem.

barb-wire helps if enough of it, it makes a mess in the mechanic till everything is blocked. A taxi is no problem for a 40 year old tank.

[JacknDanny]

Abhisit just been talking live, saying they are trying to get things back to normal.

Back to normal is to be back like when we had Khun Thaksin as Prime Minister.

I see you ignored my previous question

I thought you would have been out there with your brethren causing havoc

[RubbahSlippahs]

There are dozens of other beautiful, remote, and safe places in Thailand to hold a meeting.

Why on earth Pattaya of all places?

a more accurate and informative report in the Australian newspaper this morning

Protesters shut down ministers' meeting

From correspondents in Pattaya | April 11, 2009

Article from: Agence France-Presse

THE foreign ministers of China, Japan and South Korea cancelled a meeting at an Asian summit in Pattaya after Thai anti-government protesters blockaded their hotel, officials said.

Hundreds of demonstrators calling for the resignation of Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva prevented the Japanese minister's car from entering the venue in the beach resort, reports from the scene said.

The meeting, which was set to discuss North Korea's recent rocket launch and economic issues, was called off after the ministers had waited for an hour, officials from the Chinese and Japanese delegations said.

It was the first time that the red-shirted supporters of fugitive former Thai prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra had managed to disrupt the summit program since they descended on Pattaya a day earlier.

About 2000 demonstrators laid siege yesterday to the main venue of the meeting of 10 Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) leaders plus their counterparts from China, Japan, South Korea, India, Australia and New Zealand.

They had dispersed overnight but returned early this morning to block the road outside the meeting of the three east Asian nations with taxis and at least two large trucks, witnesses said.

AMAZING THAILAND.....having a Summit in a in a Russian Mafia controlled city. No to bright.

[DP25]

I've heard from DStation that Abhisit went to Pattaya by helicopter yesterday and they used (or wanted to use) helicopter to move taxi at Victory Monument blocking traffic. It takes 30 minutes to move 1 taxi so they need 200 years to move all taxi having red drivers.

Red propaganda has always been hilariously ridiculous but the idea that they're now saying the government was trying to move taxis with helicopters takes the cake.

[hammered]

Abhisit just been talking live, saying they are trying to get things back to normal.

Good luck on that. State of emergency, killed demonstrators, and now the army going live into 10000 demonstration in front of nearly as many cameras. This have potential to become a classic. They already sacrificed police leadership in Pattaya, who will be the next to bite the blamewagon?

I doubt the stringholders will allow Puppet Abhsit to do anything rational. Personally I was surprised the Red could get that kind of numbers to Pattaya.

There is a way out without further violence. Certain named persons step down. 1997 constitution back. Elections called and price swallowed to let international observers monitor the elections, and further accept the result if the observers deem the elections fair. No more meddling by various courts.

International observers and the Thai public will now expect the government to disperse this. As long as they do so with minimimal casualties they will be safe although like you I worry the casualties may be high.

The way out you note is exactly Thaksin and reds demand. It wont solve anything as other groups wont accept it and wuill take to the streets and do a red shirt. Compromise is what is needed.

[RegularReader]

People like Koo82 mightn't be able to post such criticsims when the Joker is back in power.

Just because people say they believe in "democracy" doesn't mean they do.

Remember how the media was harrassed and hounded under Thaksin ?

Remember the corruption?

Remember the killings ?

Don't be so hoodwinked becaue someone says the believe in "democracy".

The sad thing is that Thanksin used the underprivaleged and they are sadly rusted on to his bandwagon for now.

Let's see if they are any better off after another couple of years under his puyi control - whihc it will be.

[MyphuketLife]

PAD leaders have asked all yellow shirts to stay at home and keep calm

Because they don't have the funds to pay the daily fee to them...

Actually that is good advise, if the yellow come into play this would get real ugly real fast

[Livinginexile]

Talking about now possibility of airlifting world leaders out...possibly only speculation by commentators on thailandoutlooktv.com.

I've been here for a few years and rarely see a helicopter - and just don't get it.

The cost of one helicopter would off-set the cost of a VIP caravan consisting of countless cars/motorcycles/etc. and further cost/inconvenience of motorists in and around Bangkok on a daily basis. And in this current case, the helicopters would come in handy for our stranded world leaders who have been invited for discussions this weekend.

I've heard from DStation that Abhisit went to Pattaya by helicopter yesterday and they used (or wanted to use) helicopter to move taxi at Victory Monument blocking traffic. It takes 30 minutes to move 1 taxi so they need 200 years to move all taxi having red drivers. These taxis will block tanks if Army wants to make a coup. Tank idea is outdated. It's not like 30 years ago. We are not afraid of tanks.

just want to inform you that you can´t block a tank with taxis. They drive over it without problem.

barb-wire helps if enough of it, it makes a mess in the mechanic till everything is blocked. A taxi is no problem for a 40 year old tank.

Oh yeah? is that right?

What about 2,000 taxis? plus another 2,000 people?

Long live democray

[henryalleman]

Much to do about nothing compared with the riots at a G20 meeting.

In Pattaye its just a rumble of a few hooligans, there is more disruption after a European cup football.

Do you honestly believe that the participants of the ASEAN meeting are bothered with it? Its just some sideshow for them, that's all, they have seen much more worse.

This article I wrote yesterday, and nothing has changed my opinion yet.

Lets call a spade a spade.

The red shirts failed completely to organize a mass demonstration, and they did not succeeded any of their goals or targets

First they announced 1 million people, they could hardly get 100 000 and even that number came down rapidly after a few hours.

They proclaimed that they will demonstrate all over the country, also this failed.

They announced they will block the traffic in Bangkok completely by 20 000 taxis, also this failed, even that much that by standers pushed away the blocking taxis and burned red flags while the crowd was cheering GO AWAY. Did you see in YouTube how the taxis drove away to escape from the anger of the public. And I wrote PUBLIC not yellow shirts.

They announced that they will block the ASEAN meeting in Pattaya, they failed. I just saw some news covering on TV that the participants of the meeting where joking on the terrace of the hotel about the pathetic attempt of the red shirts to enter the hotel.

My wife is in Chiang Mai on a family visit, she did not see any demonstration, and not even see a red shirt. And this is in a so called stronghold of the red's.

They announced that ten thousands demonstrators from issan will come to Bangkok, where are they?

Its very clear that you didn't have the support from the Thai public nationwide, even worse they start to dislike you and showed it very clear on a few occasions.

So all red shirts fan in this forum accept your defeat with grace, lick your wounds of your shattered dreams and ego and move on. Don't blame others for your defeat, because you created your defeat by yourself.

And if you are genuine to the reforms you demanded, get rid of Thaksin and his cronies and start to work on new party with new young politicians and distance yourself from nitwits like Chalerm and Samak and do what any opposition party is doing in a democracy, oppose in the parliament and not on the streets. And use the time to the next election to reform your movement and make a decent political plan with a better future for the country you claim to love.

You learned a hard lesson so you should learn from it. And maybe this can even benefit you in the future not making the same mistakes.

So we can conclude that besides a few thousands hardcore red shirts, the public did not support you at all.

Even Thaksin, at last start to understand that his game is over, that's why he stopped his phone-ins and let his family flee the country.

THE GAME IS OVER, BECAUSE YOU PLAYED WITH THE WRONG CARDS AND LOST.

Kind regards and wish you the best

henry

[JacknDanny]

Scumbags are now leaving the hotel.

Cheering and behaving like idiots.

[terryp]

State of emergency = no crowds larger than 5 people & 30 min to totally disperse

This could have massive ramifications if people are killed in Pattaya the whole of Thailand will be on meltdown ..especially Bangkok

[Koo82]

You cant have ordinary people terrorised in their own homes by nutters with molotovs. This has gone beyond peaceful protest. It is time for the authorities to take action.

I agree but then again nothing was done when the yellows were touting Guns and being violent in Bangkok when it was there turn

they are all as bad as one another

One yellow is Foreign Minister now. So no worry for the reds.

Where is all this <deleted> about peaceful protest, Koo?

Shame on you and your fellow protesters

The reds went at midnight to Government House on 31st Jan 09 to request Abhisit to fire Kasit, to bring PAD to justice, to bring back 2540 Constitution Law or edit 2550 version and to dissolve the House calling for election.

But they did not care.

So we protested again on 24, 25, 26th Feb then went home, letting them hold ASEAN Summit, saving face for the country.

We then came back on 26th March until now with no weapon.

At the end, the blues attacked the reds in Pattaya when the reds protested according to the law. The reds had to defense. This made the reds block into the resort.

With so many reds coming to protest on 8th April, the government still does not care and made media said there were 80,000 or so. So the reds know with thick faced government and those at their back, the reds must use some type of strong actions.

The reds did not start the violence in Pattaya.

[flying]

Free and fair elections are not gonna happen in Thailand for light years so stop dreaming man.

When people give their vote to the guy that pays the most, elections are purely and simply a joke which is exactly what Thailand is in the eyes of the world.

Elections are the same the world over.

Buy votes?

Look at campaign spending in the USA & think it is any different?

Spend the most & win period.

There are no free & fair elections anywhere but a tally of votes bought or not is as close

as your going to get IMHO

[Orac]

Much to do about nothing compared with the riots at a G20 meeting.

In Pattaye its just a rumble of a few hooligans, there is more disruption after a European cup football.

Do you honestly believe that the participants of the ASEAN meeting are bothered with it? Its just some sideshow for them, that's all, they have seen much more worse.

This article I wrote yesterday, and nothing has changed my opinion yet.

Lets call a spade a spade.

The red shirts failed completely to organize a mass demonstration, and they did not succeeded any of their goals or targets

First they announced 1 million people, they could hardly get 100 000 and even that number came down rapidly after a few hours.

They proclaimed that they will demonstrate all over the country, also this failed.

They announced they will block the traffic in Bangkok completely by 20 000 taxis, also this failed, even that much that by standers pushed away the blocking taxis and burned red flags while the crowd was cheering GO AWAY. Did you see in YouTube how the taxis drove away to escape from the anger of the public. And I wrote PUBLIC not yellow shirts.

They announced that they will block the ASEAN meeting in Pattaya, they failed. I just saw some news covering on TV that the participants of the meeting where joking on the terrace of the hotel about the pathetic attempt of the red shirts to enter the hotel.

My wife is in Chiang Mai on a family visit, she did not see any demonstration, and not even see a red shirt. And this is in a so called stronghold of the red's.

They announced that ten thousands demonstrators from issan will come to Bangkok, where are they?

Its very clear that you didn't have the support from the Thai public nationwide, even worse they start to dislike you and showed it very clear on a few occasions.

So all red shirts fan in this forum accept your defeat with grace, lick your wounds of your shattered dreams and ego and move on. Don't blame others for your defeat, because you created your defeat by yourself.

And if you are genuine to the reforms you demanded, get rid of Thaksin and his cronies and start to work on new party with new young politicians and distance yourself from nitwits like Chalerm and Samak and do what any opposition party is doing in a democracy, oppose in the parliament and not on the streets. And use the time to the next election to reform your movement and make a decent political plan with a better future for the country you claim to love.

You learned a hard lesson so you should learn from it. And maybe this can even benefit you in the future not making the same mistakes.

So we can conclude that besides a few thousands hardcore red shirts, the public did not support you at all.

Even Thaksin, at last start to understand that his game is over, that's why he stopped his phone-ins and let his family flee the country.

THE GAME IS OVER, BECAUSE YOU PLAYED WITH THE WRONG CARDS AND LOST.

Kind regards and wish you the best

henry

Errr - not sure what channel you are watching but you seem to be a bit behind!

[AceCafe]

Once again total humiliation and embarassment for this country in the full glare of the worlds media. Maybe the powers that be should apply for 3rd world status and so have a good excuse?

[h90]

Free and fair elections are not gonna happen in Thailand for light years so stop dreaming man.

When people give their vote to the guy that pays the most, elections are purely and simply a joke which is exactly what Thailand is in the eyes of the world.

Elections are the same the world over.

Buy votes?

Look at campaign spending in the USA & think it is any different?

Spend the most & win period.

There are no free & fair elections anywhere but a tally of votes bought or not is as close

as your going to get IMHO

USA is not really considered as democracy by most Europeans... as there are just two parties with almost identical ideas.

[mrtoad]

Abhisit just been talking live, saying they are trying to get things back to normal.

Back to normal is to be back like when we had Khun Thaksin as Prime Minister.

So corruption, cronyism, vote buying, human rights abuses and tax evasion are all pretty normal?

[Orac]

State of emergency = no crowds larger than 5 people & 30 min to totally disperse

This could have massive ramifications if people are killed in Pattaya the whole of Thailand will be on meltdown ..especially Bangkok

with Songkran just starting - this could be interesting!

[mrtoad]

Scumbags are now leaving the hotel.

Cheering and behaving like idiots.

Yep, well done to Rent a Kwai, they have made a great impression.

[jayboy]

Scumbags are now leaving the hotel.

Cheering and behaving like idiots.

That's no way to describe our esteemed ASEAN visitors!

Joking apart isn't the political dynamite here who precisely are the blue shirts, who authorised their presence and who financed them? If it was Newin then that has serious political implications.Some have suggested Kamnan Poh's son had a hand in all this.Did Abhisit know anything about them or did a branch of government act without the PM's knowledge? This has the potential to bring the government down so let's see how it develops.What is beyond credibility is that they were a collection of Pattaya locals who came together spontaneously in reaction to the Red presence.

Edited April 11, 2009 by jayboy

[cmsally]

Thailand needs to return to democracy, in case some of you guys have forgotten what that means its; Majority rules!

If it takes a revolution to restore democracy then so be it.

"Revolution is born from the barrel of a gun"

It was all's "fair in love and war" when the yellow shirts waged a terrorist campaign.

But now the pro democracy movement is gaining momentum you are all shouting "foul"

Freedom will win in the end.

Long live democracy

Here, here. I'm totally amazed by the number of posts on here from expatriates who seem to have forgotten the definition of the word democracy.

Then again, lets not for a minute suggest that Thaksin Shinawatra was democratic leader who abided by all the principles of an open and fair democracy because that would be stretching the point to far.

At least some people seem to have kept to their senses.

So back to my original question from a couple of weeks ago.

Deal was kicked back in face (the olive branch with the empty stocking) leaving some people not happy but thinking there wasn't the impetus to act on it. Well it seems they were proved wrong on that one. We are witnessing the proof; it would not be stretching the imagination to say that stopping the Asean Summit was thrown down as a gauntlet.

My original question being where do the army stand on this?

Well polices' position fairly obvious considering they were given no back up to deal with the yellows.

PAD also seems to have backed down (Sondhi has been denouncing some of the "yellow" opposition as nothing to do with PAD).

According to rumour supposedly PAD's nose out of joint with army and coup backers, so not much of an allegiance there.

That leaves the army itself - big dilemma , as they know from the previous couple of years, not good to be seen taking power. Get someone else to do the dirty work. Presumably the "blue shirts" in Pattaya were some kind of pro govt military vigilante force. The problem is the army is perceived as having no legitimacy, a vigilante force certainly won't have legitimacy, so who can be seen to be backing the govt.?

Is there in fact the willpower within the army to provide backing let alone use force against the opposition. It would be seen as cementing the very alliance they have been keen to keep under wraps.

At the moment all I see is a govt becoming more isolated at each step along the line.

Smart move to initiate a possible crackdown when international cameras are turned on the country. Sometimes the thinking not as wacky as it looks.

[JacknDanny]

Koo, I refuse to waste any of my valuable time on you, but just so that I am clear. Are you saying that the reason the reds went into the hotel was to seek protection from the blues????????????

No intention of disrupting the summit, or of confronting Abhisit???????

You really are in cloud cuckoo land, dear.