Red-shirt Tactics

[ThNiner]

...In that ceremony, Chaisit claimed that Thaksin was the reincarnataion of a Lanna King whose name was Moon Mueang...who later was proved that he never existed. Must a redshirt trait...telling things which never existed. Funny thing is the literal translation of Moon Muang is city feces. Thanks! I needed a good laugh today!

You're welcome.

[HagenvonTronje]

Spitting in a Thai mans face in public is a sure route to loss of face for him and enragement.

again, there is no evidence that proof that claim.

but as long it's a red shirted woman, no problem to justify with what ever that little bit hair pulling, right?

The proof is in the acknowledgment of the MPs themselves and how they responded to the accusation.

If someone manages to post the clip of it, will you leave the forum, never to return and troll again?

Showing what?

And why aren't they on Youtube?

so the proof is your bias that red shirts are the bad ones? and even if they are the bad ones, why don't stick to facts only instead of blah, spin and mud throwing?

i wrote a long entry to that incident.

i include a couple of different videos from the incident. i gave a link to the parliamentarian debate where suthep came up with his video and also the video that was shown by the PTP, so you can judge yourself if they edited something out.

i gave also a link to a video from that press conference. i gave a link to the hi5 profile of the hair puller, there is that incident discussed as well. i gave links to webboards

[TAWP]

P_D: We have the full video above and we can now see that your account was flawed and bias. Thank you.

[HagenvonTronje]

uppps, and sorry that was only half tranffered. internet is slow at the moment.

i gave also a link to a video from that press conference. i gave a link to the hi5 profile of the hair puller, there is that incident discussed as well. i gave links to webboards, where is discussed how story was reported in the thai media.

i offered material for everybody to look at. material that is beknowns to me and that i used to make my own conclusion. a couple of different angles to that story, that are only parts of the sig saw, of course, thats why i invited others to add more if they know more. like the story that she spit on his face. or if someone have more from that parliamentarian debate, i would be interested to.

why does make me to a troll, if i ask such a question? if someone bring such a video, fine. i don't see reasons to leave after that.

will you go if nobody can come with a proof that the woman spit on the mans face, and will you go forever until you can come up with such a video by yourself. and will you tell to animatic to go as well, because he is a troll, in your definition.

final question, do you think it's justified that the woman got pulled on her hair and dragged over the street.

i think thats a sad story in what for a state this society is. there is a lot of blame and stupid mock attemps forward that woman, you can find on comments in youtube or other places. and no surprise, some of this comments are coming from yellow shirt supporter, same as the hair puller is a avid yellow fan. no shame. there are many other stories, you could use to mock and blame the reds, but spin and twisting that hair pulling incident to a very one sided view isn't a fine example of humanity.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Red-shirt-Ta...t&p=2691940

so long, permanent_disorder...

Mark the time of death as 2:12 on the video...

no, no. mr. john. the point is, was the woman that get her hair pulled spitting on the man or even spitting on his face, as other claim. i can't see that on this video.

the other woman, the short hair woman spits. but it looks like more that she is spitting on the ground.

i never dienied that, and i posted diffrent videos of that incident before. even ones of better quality that shows also the the spitting.

but where is the scene that the woman got pulled on her hair is spitting on that man. she dienied such action on the press conference (because it was not her who spat) and got called a liar.

the man in the green shirt, he is a yellow PAD. so now somebody could say he just came there and wanted to create a scene, make some more drama and all.

[HagenvonTronje]

P_D: We have the full video above and we can now see that your account was flawed and bias. Thank you.

do we really have a video, that shows that the woman spit in the mans face? or only a video how an other woman spit on the ground, max, on his feet.

for me isn't that a video that shows the Spitting in a Thai mans face in public is a sure route to loss of face for him and enragement.

i was asking for that scene. is it that scene?

some other videos here.

please look and read http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Red-shirt-Ta...40#entry2691940

and tell me exactly where i am flawed and bias en detail. thank you.

[HagenvonTronje]

The audio wasn't exactly clear, I'll try to summarize what was goin on. At first, the photographer (the guy who was later seen pulling a woman's hair) was saying "Enough already!. Enough!" Then the two women yelled "You've killed the civilians! Come to the gov't house to see the evidence (which stragely to these days still can't be found or substantiated by anyone on the planet)...you slave dogs serving the military! etc etc." The photographer replied, "why the hel_l do I have to go the gov't house? I'm not stupid." Then one of the woman jumped on the guy.

it's more the woman shouting "enough", enough!, enough!" "people died" at the sodiers. and he steps in and teased them ans ask smirking "enough, already???"

then it's about that they claim the press reports wrong about the reds. that boy isn't a photographer for the press at all, or a journalist. anyway, funny thing is that exactly about this incident the reports in the thai media, print and TV, were false and incorrect. and on a video from another angle it looks like he is spitting at them as well, just before the short haired woman spits on the ground.

here he is, your brave citizen:

the yellow hero, man of the year. yellow proud.

he grabs here from behind, drag her on the ground and over the street.

if you like him, and you have hi5, you can add him as a friend.

[TAWP]

P_D, you are boring and your main aim always seem to be to prohibit any form of sensible arguments. And unfortunately we fall for it way too often.

And added: And since the woman attacked she got what was coming to her. What is your problem exactly, that the red's wasn't allowed to attack whoever they wanted without them defending themselves?

Edited April 27, 2009 by TAWP

[HagenvonTronje]

you are boring and your main aim always seem to be to prohibit any form of sensible arguments. And unfortunately we fall for it way too often.

And added: And since the woman attacked she got what was coming to her. What is your problem exactly, that the red's wasn't allowed to attack whoever they wanted without them defending themselves?

you are boring too.

and no, my problem is that someone claim that the woman spit on the mens face. and that the woman later lie about that. or that the PTP edited the video and cut out the spitting scene with intention.

for this i can't still see any evidence. i didn't do it before, but now is say it's a lie and who claims that is a liar. or a troll. a boring liar.

i don't want to make here red propaganda. how that woman got her hair pulled, i have seen the videos many days ago, as it was fresh news. how the thai media misleading and false reported that incident. i read about days ago on bangkok pundit, i didn't bother to bring that here to the forum.

but at the moment, the woman was an object to mock about, i thought i add some more information here. and because there is the fine difference that it was an other woman that spit on the ground and not the woman that got her hair pulled. thats is the FACT.

that she spit on the mans face and blah, blah isn't true, it's propanganda spin, mud throwing, BS, but not that what happend.

if i wanted to do i could expose that hair pulling hero much more earlier as yellow shirt. i didn't do it.

but when i have to read here other BS, like the woman have been send to create a scene and all that, to make soldiers look back and so on. blames without proof, and still no evidence that she spit on the mans face. okay i can play the same. and i have the pictures. i inform myself before i claim something.

can you forget all that diffent colours involved for a moment?:

i honestly think, that the women went to that soldier line, to express their sorrow. they have been under the impression that other reds got killed. they are sad, desperate, in emotional stress. calling the soldiers that is enough, stop it. i am sure those women didn't burnt down the buses.

i posted a picture in panorama view, before the both of them reach the army line, there is nothing between them, those two women and the soldiers. all the journalist are coming later, standing before on the side. the women walking across the battle field, to the trench of the heavy armed enemy to beg for peace or truce. they take each other by the hand and walk down that line.

yeah and than that hero man steps in, feeling himself so strong with the army behind him, mocks them. makes sheep noises and ask "why enough already"?

that is how i see the scene. can you follow me there? did i got it so wrong?

what that man did is ugly, i can not justify that that and i can not understand why someone is trying to do that.

[hammered]

Seriously if this hair pulling incident is the best the reds can do after Thaksin claimed loads of dead this is really grasping at straws. In how many countries has the military dispersed violent rioters threatening ordinary people's lives and biggest complaint is someone had their hair pulled?

I wonder if anyone is spending as much time trawling you tube etc to try and identify the red shirt mob at Din Daeng that had to be driven off by the local men after they threatened to immolate the poor working class neighbourhood. I didnt get that from any news source but by talking to residents, which anyone else can do too if they are in Thailand.

[animatic]

P_D, you are boring and your main aim always seem to be to prohibit any form of sensible arguments. And unfortunately we fall for it way too often.

And added: And since the woman attacked she got what was coming to her. What is your problem exactly, that the red's wasn't allowed to attack whoever they wanted without them defending themselves?

It really is a ridiculous arguement to try and defend these two women.

They purposely went up and started trouble in front of as many cameras and videos as possible.

Then they got violent and lost the match of strength.

They weren't beaten or hit with batons or punched in face breasts or uterus.

If this happend in a normal situation then the aprobrium rightly goes onto the male,

But she clearly was the aggressor and picked the fight and got her comeupance.

This is not the smoking gun to bring down a government.

Pretty_Dismal attempt at at discrediting anybody except these two women for their own actions.

[LawnGnome]

P_D, you are boring and your main aim always seem to be to prohibit any form of sensible arguments. And unfortunately we fall for it way too often.

And added: And since the woman attacked she got what was coming to her. What is your problem exactly, that the red's wasn't allowed to attack whoever they wanted without them defending themselves?

It really is a ridiculous arguement to try and defend these two women.

They purposely went up and started trouble in front of as many cameras and videos as possible.

Then they got violent and lost the match of strength.

They weren't beaten or hit with batons or punched in face breasts or uterus.

If this happend in a normal situation then the aprobrium rightly goes onto the male,

But she clearly was the aggressor and picked the fight and got her comeupance.

This is not the smoking gun to bring down a government.

Pretty_Dismal attempt at at discrediting anybody except these two women for their own actions.

Frankly, every attempt I've seen from the Reds and PTP have been pretty dismal.... Anyone who supports them is a clown.

[samgrowth]

you are boring and your main aim always seem to be to prohibit any form of sensible arguments. And unfortunately we fall for it way too often.

And added: And since the woman attacked she got what was coming to her. What is your problem exactly, that the red's wasn't allowed to attack whoever they wanted without them defending themselves?

you are boring too.

and no, my problem is that someone claim that the woman spit on the mens face. and that the woman later lie about that. or that the PTP edited the video and cut out the spitting scene with intention.

for this i can't still see any evidence. i didn't do it before, but now is say it's a lie and who claims that is a liar. or a troll. a boring liar.

i don't want to make here red propaganda. how that woman got her hair pulled, i have seen the videos many days ago, as it was fresh news. how the thai media misleading and false reported that incident. i read about days ago on bangkok pundit, i didn't bother to bring that here to the forum.

but at the moment, the woman was an object to mock about, i thought i add some more information here. and because there is the fine difference that it was an other woman that spit on the ground and not the woman that got her hair pulled. thats is the FACT.

that she spit on the mans face and blah, blah isn't true, it's propanganda spin, mud throwing, BS, but not that what happend.

if i wanted to do i could expose that hair pulling hero much more earlier as yellow shirt. i didn't do it.

but when i have to read here other BS, like the woman have been send to create a scene and all that, to make soldiers look back and so on. blames without proof, and still no evidence that she spit on the mans face. okay i can play the same. and i have the pictures. i inform myself before i claim something.

can you forget all that diffent colours involved for a moment?:

i honestly think, that the women went to that soldier line, to express their sorrow. they have been under the impression that other reds got killed. they are sad, desperate, in emotional stress. calling the soldiers that is enough, stop it. i am sure those women didn't burnt down the buses.

i posted a picture in panorama view, before the both of them reach the army line, there is nothing between them, those two women and the soldiers. all the journalist are coming later, standing before on the side. the women walking across the battle field, to the trench of the heavy armed enemy to beg for peace or truce. they take each other by the hand and walk down that line.

yeah and than that hero man steps in, feeling himself so strong with the army behind him, mocks them. makes sheep noises and ask "why enough already"?

that is how i see the scene. can you follow me there? did i got it so wrong?

what that man did is ugly, i can not justify that that and i can not understand why someone is trying to do that.

Thanks. I agree with you.

Thanks for posting a clear photo of the PAD boy.

Now I know how he looks like.

[LawnGnome]

Thanks. I agree with you.

Thanks for posting a clear photo of the PAD boy.

Now I know how he looks like, if I ever met him, I'd do nothing at all because I'm basically all talk.

Here, let me help you with that...

[bertlamar]

It is such a relief to know that having not been able to make the story of 300 killed and a massive cover up, that finally the red shirts deliver a knock out blow with a woman whose hair was pulled by a yellow shirt supporting reporter.

Clearly, I don't know about you, but for me that means we should probably engage in a complete revolution possibly where dogs and cats live together, I'm with Peemai and Chalerm takes over in a new title and constitution as 'the big potato'.

After all, in a country where you can park your cousin's LPG trucks anywhere, it must surely be completely unacceptable for someone's hair, anywhere, to be pulled slightly.

The shame and the damage....dear oh dear.

No real democracy has a bit of hair pulling between an efeminate yellow shirt wearing journo, and a foul mouthed 40 year woman with questionable attention to shampoo and conditioning.

[samgrowth]

Thanks. I agree with you.

Thanks for posting a clear photo of the PAD boy.

Now I know how he looks like, if I ever met him, I'd do nothing at all because I'm basically all talk.

Here, let me help you with that...

That's right. Thank LawnGnome. Afterall, I rather deal with bg that kt.

[LawnGnome]

Thanks. I agree with you.

Thanks for posting a clear photo of the PAD boy.

Now I know how he looks like, if I ever met him, I'd do nothing at all because I'm basically all talk.

Here, let me help you with that...

That's right. Thank LawnGnome. Afterall, I rather deal with bg that kt.

"Excuse me, sir. Seeing as how the VP is such a VIP, shouldn't we keep the PC on the QT? 'Cause if it leaks to the VC he could end up MIA, and then we'd all be put on KP" Adrian Cronauer from Good Morning Vietnam

[mc2]

here he is, your brave citizen:

the yellow hero, man of the year. yellow proud.

he grabs here from behind, drag her on the ground and over the street.

if you like him, and you have hi5, you can add him as a friend.

that was really ugly what he did.

took her from behind, he should be proud of that

he better watch his back, now that his photo is out.

anything can happen in this culture of retribution.

btw, the lady should have grabed his feet when she went to the ground. that would have stopped him

Edited April 27, 2009 by mc2

[HagenvonTronje]

that was really ugly what he did.

took her from behind, he should be proud of that

he better watch his back, now that his photo is out.

anything can happen in this culture of retribution.

btw, the lady should have grabed his feet when she went to the ground. that would have stopped him

how about that the units deployed to restore order would had give him a treatment like in the video below instead of doing nothing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sxabqsxj4Cs

[ThNiner]

It is such a relief to know that having not been able to make the story of 300 killed and a massive cover up, that finally the red shirts deliver a knock out blow with a woman whose hair was pulled by a yellow shirt supporting reporter.

Clearly, I don't know about you, but for me that means we should probably engage in a complete revolution possibly where dogs and cats live together, I'm with Peemai and Chalerm takes over in a new title and constitution as 'the big potato'.

After all, in a country where you can park your cousin's LPG trucks anywhere, it must surely be completely unacceptable for someone's hair, anywhere, to be pulled slightly.

The shame and the damage....dear oh dear.

No real democracy has a bit of hair pulling between an efeminate yellow shirt wearing journo, and a foul mouthed 40 year woman with questionable attention to shampoo and conditioning.

[dkt]

Same trait of these thugs, lie, lie, lie..... revenge, revenge, revenge....

Cursing and spitting at others - peaceful .................pulling their hair - evil

Shooting residents at nangleang - peaceful................ kicking them - evil

Closing several roads - peaceful................................... dispersing them - evil

Attacking PM and others - peaceful.................................... arresting them - evil

Invading the summit - peaceful...................................arresting them - undemocracy

Instigaing people to kill others - peaceful......................... controlling their madness - evil

Any country controls these behaviors without violence?

Bin Ladin is terrorist but he doesn't attack his own country, what about these thugs?

[LawnGnome]

Same trait of these thugs, lie, lie, lie..... revenge, revenge, revenge....

Cursing and spitting at others - peaceful .................pulling their hair - evil

Shooting residents at nangleang - peaceful................ kicking them - evil

Closing several roads - peaceful................................... dispersing them - evil

Attacking PM and others - peaceful.................................... arresting them - evil

Invading the summit - peaceful...................................arresting them - undemocracy

Instigaing people to kill others - peaceful......................... controlling their madness - evil

Any country controls these behaviors without violence?

Bin Ladin is terrorist but he doesn't attack his own country, what about these thugs?

The Red Shirt crowd are true believers. No use trying to reason with unreasonable people.

[Cayenne]

Bin Ladin is terrorist but he doesn't attack his own country, what about these thugs?

Oh wait, I know what the response will be- "These thugs aren't real red shirts". Pretty pathetic considering the lies they will believe to prove their point of view.

[sriracha john]

UDD threat to use violence

The red-shirt United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship will use new tactics to topple the Democrat-led coalition government and they may include violence using weapons, fugitive UDD core member Jakrapob Penkair said.

Jakrapob, who went into hiding to evade an arrest warrant for inciting unrest in mid-April, made the threat in a telephone interview from an undisclosed location to a foreign news agency. The red-shirts wanted a fresh general election so a democratically elected government could be put in place, he said. They would use violent methods if necessary to achieve this.

Defence Minister Prawit Wongsuwan said before leaving for Phnom Penh for talks on Tuesday that he would not raise the rumour that outlawed former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra has been issued a Cambodian passport.

Continued:

-- Bangkok Post 2009-04-28

[sriracha john]

http://www.siamgas.com/Executive.php

GEN.CHAISIT SHINAWATRA

CHAIRMAN

not a post... but a whole thread... The Thaksin Cousin Voodoo Thread...

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Thaksin-s-Su...el-t243744.html

and yes, retired Army General Chaisit... the former Supreme Commander In Chief Of All The Military.... fled the scene along with many other of the Shin clan...

Reporters were trying to locate the last remaining members of the "Shinawatra" clan after Thaksin Shinawatra's ex-wife Pojaman, their three children, his cousin Chaisit Shinawatra and brother-in-law Somchai Wongsawat had left the country.

Chaisit to file suit against Suthep

The Chairman of Siam Gas and Petrochemicals (SGP), former Supreme Commander General Chaisit Shinawatra, says he will sue Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban for accusing him of allowing SGP liquefied-gas tankers to be placed in urban areas of Din Daeng during the anti-government riots on April 13.

General Chaisit, who is former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's older brother, denied the accusation.

He said he would take legal action over the claims by Mr Suthep and other officials that he gave a green light for red-shirt protesters to drive LPG tankers to the Din Daeng intersection.

Continued:

-- Bangkok Post 2009-04-28

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Note: Chaisit is Thaksin's older cousin, not older brother.

[hammered]

UDD threat to use violence

The red-shirt United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship will use new tactics to topple the Democrat-led coalition government and they may include violence using weapons, fugitive UDD core member Jakrapob Penkair said.

Jakrapob, who went into hiding to evade an arrest warrant for inciting unrest in mid-April, made the threat in a telephone interview from an undisclosed location to a foreign news agency. The red-shirts wanted a fresh general election so a democratically elected government could be put in place, he said. They would use violent methods if necessary to achieve this.

Defence Minister Prawit Wongsuwan said before leaving for Phnom Penh for talks on Tuesday that he would not raise the rumour that outlawed former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra has been issued a Cambodian passport.

Continued:

-- Bangkok Post 2009-04-28

The Thaksin wing of red cannot allow negotiations to suceed or they lose. They need more violence and instability at any cost.

[chrislarsson]

P_D, you are boring and your main aim always seem to be to prohibit any form of sensible arguments. And unfortunately we fall for it way too often.

And added: And since the woman attacked she got what was coming to her. What is your problem exactly, that the red's wasn't allowed to attack whoever they wanted without them defending themselves?

It really is a ridiculous arguement to try and defend these two women.

They purposely went up and started trouble in front of as many cameras and videos as possible.

Then they got violent and lost the match of strength.

They weren't beaten or hit with batons or punched in face breasts or uterus.

If this happend in a normal situation then the aprobrium rightly goes onto the male,

But she clearly was the aggressor and picked the fight and got her comeupance.

This is not the smoking gun to bring down a government.

Pretty_Dismal attempt at at discrediting anybody except these two women for their own actions.

Frankly, every attempt I've seen from the Reds and PTP have been pretty dismal.... Anyone who supports them is a clown.

How can it be so difficult to see that PTP is now using exactly the same tactics as PAD did last fall? Supporters of both the reds and yellows are clowns.

[ThNiner]

The Thaksin wing of red cannot allow negotiations to suceed or they lose. They need more violence and instability at any cost.

However when (not if) this incited violence results in injuries and deaths, it will be claimed as work of others. The red shirts will never use such violence to achieve what they want, you know. Thaksin was repeatedly compared to Nelson Mandela and Gandhi by the red shirts for a reason...you know.

[animatic]

Same trait of these thugs, lie, lie, lie..... revenge, revenge, revenge....

Cursing and spitting at others - peaceful .................pulling their hair - evil

Shooting residents at nangleang - peaceful................ kicking them - evil

Closing several roads - peaceful................................... dispersing them - evil

Attacking PM and others - peaceful.................................... arresting them - evil

Invading the summit - peaceful...................................arresting them - undemocracy

Instigaing people to kill others - peaceful......................... controlling their madness - evil

Any country controls these behaviors without violence?

Bin Ladin is terrorist but he doesn't attack his own country, what about these thugs?

The Red Shirt crowd are true believers. No use trying to reason with unreasonable people.

Both spot on.

It is the same strategy that pits Thais against their cousins to the east and west of them.

Demonize 'the others' and then they are less than you and yours,

and so can be mistreated and stolen from.

Pathetically hypocritical route to power,

sometimes to power, sometimes to the block.

Edited April 28, 2009 by animatic

[sriracha john]

Red Shirt Leader: Protesters May Use Guerilla Srategy to Push for Election

A key member of the red-shirt group has said from abroad that the red-shirt group will fight against the government using many strategies, which may include guerrilla strategies, to force a new election.

Jakrapob Penkair , a key member of the red-shirt group, who is accused of lese majeste and is currently hiding in a foreign country, said in an interview with BBC reporter, Jonathan Head, that from now on, the red-shirts will fight against the government using many strategies, and they may use weapons to push for a new general election, which they believe will bring democracy for the people.

The red-shirt key leader said the red-shirt group loves democracy and will continue to attempt to drive the government out but will not use old strategies that take a lot of time. He added that the government’s declaration of a state of emergency has pushed people to go underground.

Other red-shirt leaders in Thailand have turned themselves in to the police already. Another red-shirt leader Jatuporn Prompan told the media he has not heard from Jakrapob, nor does he know where he is hiding out.

-- Tan Network 2009-04-28

[hammered]

The Thaksin wing of red cannot allow negotiations to suceed or they lose. They need more violence and instability at any cost.

However when (not if) this incited violence results in injuries and deaths, it will be claimed as work of others. The red shirts will never use such violence to achieve what they want, you know. Thaksin was repeatedly compared to Nelson Mandela and Gandhi by the red shirts for a reason...you know.

In a Bloomberg report Charan a red leader admitted the red violence was a mistake. Guess he wont be on Mr. Thaksin's good list. The red denials are embarrassing quite honetly. They are inventing a conspiracy far beyond any of the conspiracies they mock the Nation over.

I recognize that there are some peaceful and good pro-democracy people involved in the red shirts, and I am sure they are shocked and horrified at the violence and find it hard to accept that it came form their side. However, it undeniably did and these good people need to move on and not allow a natural initial denail to allow them to be further manipulated by those whose goal is pure power. There is an opportunity for reconcilliation now. However, for it to be grasped the extreme reds and extreme yellows need to be sidelined and not allowed to derail things.

It will be interesting to see whether people basically good on both sides can triumph over the raw power games of the very powerful on both sides.