Thai Wife Wants To Keep Uk Born Daughter In Thailand

[nigelandjan]

After this last holiday im thousands of pounds in debt and cannot return to thailand,my wife now says she in korat at her sisters house i think she left her dads house in fear of any legal proceedings i may start.The british embassy offers no help and i dont think a custody battle via uk to thailand will be great.I keep promising the earth to persuade her to come back but she is still down and angry with me.I really think that this is a fight i cannot win even though her visa to return to uk is not ready when it is im not sure if it will make any difference to her.Her money i left her is now gone and im not prepared to pay for my baby to be kept away from me in Thailand she still has her gold so she says!Im at a total loss with all this im devastated!

You poor little bugger , I feel for you mate ,,,,,, it could happen to anyone ,, trouble is if you dont take a chance you never know ,, reading between the lines I doubt she ever has any intention of coming back ,,, so you have to concentrate on your child ,,,, one hel_l of an expensive problem !! Good luck I wish I could wave a wand and make it happen for you

[Mario2008]

After this last holiday im thousands of pounds in debt and cannot return to thailand,my wife now says she in korat at her sisters house i think she left her dads house in fear of any legal proceedings i may start.The british embassy offers no help and i dont think a custody battle via uk to thailand will be great.I keep promising the earth to persuade her to come back but she is still down and angry with me.I really think that this is a fight i cannot win even though her visa to return to uk is not ready when it is im not sure if it will make any difference to her.Her money i left her is now gone and im not prepared to pay for my baby to be kept away from me in Thailand she still has her gold so she says!Im at a total loss with all this im devastated!

The Thai courts will not recognise a UK court ruling as the child is Thai. Any custody battle will have to be fought in Thailand. You might try to contact someone who can mediate bewteen you and your wife.

If it does come to a divorce she can petition for child support, determined by the court. You will have to pay that.

[Boo]

Her money i left her is now gone and im not prepared to pay for my baby to be kept away from me in Thailand

So you will leave your child with nothing? IMO what your wife is doing isn't the fault of your child, so it would be better to arrange something with her now regarding child support, even a little to cover food & clothing. It may also make her soften towards you & create a better openeing to discuss things in a couple of months.

[Flow]

Hello

The first post i make is a most sad and distressing one for me,I live in the uk with my thai wife and our 19 month old uk born daughter had a holiday in Thailand arrived 1/4/09 we submitted another settlement visa on 3/4/09 did the online application and submitted all the docs 3/4/09 tracking system states sent to uk embassy now i'm back in england wife and baby in isaan.Wife lands a bombshell and says she no longer wants to return to the uk to live with me and intends to keep our baby girl in Thailand the baby is british passport holder no dual nationality on a tourist visa valid 21/6/09.I still hope i can talk my wife round to return to uk with our baby once visa is issued but she is also talking of obtaining a thai passport also for our baby to counter any border runs and tighten her grip of custody of our baby.I realize there probably is no thai lawyers on here but i'm desperate for any help or advice.I've checked the net and seems embassy help is little to non and looks like dealing with Thai lawyers wise in family law is the other option.Though i hope i can sort our marriage out by talking with my wife i need advice.Help anyone please.

If the mother is Thai then I don't think it would be too troublesome for her to obtain Thai nationality for your daughter here in Thailand. You need a good lawyer. Interco Law Firm on Tonglor Soi 21 did a good job for a friend 10 years ago. Inexpensive too, around 25,000 Baht, but expect to pay your ex 10,000 -20,000 Baht as compensation. My friend paid 10,000 and that was it the b***h signed the docs - end of story.

[Flow]

Going back about 10 years. My wife told me on breakup of a relationship the husband can take the girls children and the wife keeps the boys. This sounds stupid to me but in her village in Caing Mai a relationship broke up in exactly the same circumstances as the OP's. The swiss husband turned up at the village with some police from Chaing Mai. He went to the wife's house and just took the daughter. The police made sure nobody stopped him. Being the father and the fact she had a Swiss passport meant he could go straight to the airport and take her home.

If you really want your daughter back the best thing is to convince your wife to return to the UK. If you cannot then, in my opinion, I would not trust the Thai legal system. Get a duplicate passport for your daughter, lie, say you lost the old one. Go straight to Thailand, pay the local police what it takes for their support, get your daughter and come straight back. Make sure you take with you pictures of your daughter and you, birth certifaicate, medical books and possibly a female to help you look after the daughter, maybe your sister or mother.

I may get flamed for this advice but that's the way things work here in Thailand!

Chris

A very good post with excellent advice methinks. If nothing else works indeed "sweeten" her up with expensive gifts for her family etc. get her back on the plane and once in the UK dump her!

Edited June 8, 2009 by Flow

[Flow]

Her money i left her is now gone and im not prepared to pay for my baby to be kept away from me in Thailand

So you will leave your child with nothing? IMO what your wife is doing isn't the fault of your child, so it would be better to arrange something with her now regarding child support, even a little to cover food & clothing. It may also make her soften towards you & create a better openeing to discuss things in a couple of months.

Agree with the above too. You're saying you got no money and you're in debt. "Soften her up", tell her how much you "love her" how much you "miss her" - promise her the earth. It'll take a few months before she's calmed down and starts "believing" but... it WILL PROBABLY WORK.

Good luck!

[Geekfreaklover]

i've been in the same situation. I got the Uk settlement for my ex wife and we went to England. I had a good job, big house all the rest of it, but she wasn't happy and I let her return to Thailand for a holiday with my two year old son and she was also pregnant with my second son. Transpired she didn;t want to come back to England.

I decided to leave my job and return to Thailand. Things didn't work out between us. She became violent and abusive. I had no option but to take her to court. I won custody of the two children. Found a job here, luckily.

In your situation I would beg borrow or steal enough money to fly to thailand. Take your daughter out for the day and get her on a flight back to england. You are still married. You have as much right to custody as you wife has.

The way I see it is that she has lied to you by saying she wanted to go on a holiday and now not agreeing to return. That, my friend is abusive behaviour. Dress it up how you like. It is wrong.

It all depends on who you feel can offer your daughter a better life.

Go to Thailand and get your daughter.

[Geekfreaklover]

Interesting dilemma.

Aside from just natural curiosity as to WHY the wife does not want to go back to the UK (seems like she had a bad enough experience and not enough love or reason to want to return), I have a few questions for the Board:

1. Since the British child is in Thailand on a tourist visa and cannot get a Thai birth certificate, what happens when the child overstays?

2. Will immigration start racking up the fines?

3. Who will be responsible for paying them - the wife?

4. What happens if she can't/doesn't?

5. Will the child have to be deported back to UK?

Very interesting dilemma...

There is no overstay fine for children. In fact, many immigration officers advise to just let children stay on overstay and not worry about getting extensions for them. Children are also not subject to deportation for this.

Therefor the overstay has no consequences.

Fair enough, BUT....what happens when the child is no longer a child...? He/She will grow up eventually...

The rule is no visa for below 7 years old.

[Geekfreaklover]

I am amazed that nobody on this forum has pointed out how damaging it will be for the child to be taken away from her mother!!!

If you can't persuade your wife to come back to the UK why don't you demonstrate your commitment to your marriage and your family by going to be in Thailand with them both? Save your marriage and then you can think about returning to the UK as a family later.

When your daughter grows up she will not thank you for separating her from her mother.

Good luck - I hope it works out.

In a perfect world a child needs to be with their natural mother. But the world is not perfect.

My kids thank me for taking them away from their mother. They now get to go to a good school, eat good wholesome meals and are taken care of everyday. The mother was an abusive parent, and it hurts them to remember.

some people are not fit to be parents. Male and female.

[charliemike11]

My brother is going through similar now ...He's in Kanchanaburi trying to get his two year old son back to Wales, His Thai wife went psycho in bangkok when they arrived 4 weeks ago after they spent six months in the UK she ran away with his passport phone money the lot then tried to make him chase her all over thailand. We sent him money and she came back to him, but she is still going psycho every other day physically attacking him threatening his life if he doesnt put his hand in his pocket and pull out more money.

She was a bar lady her parents are dead and her sisters smoke yabba drink too much and gamble these are the people she says will take care of the baby while she goes off looking for another farang with more money in the bars!! We dont know what to do my brother is out there on his own in a dangerous country promising the earth to a psycho. My brother is not perfect but he has a good job and very secure and loving family, The baby is an ATM card to his wife she has had nearly 2 million Baht out of us all in the last 2 years and nothing to show except nice bar lady clothes she drank smoked and gambled it all away.

I feel for you fella I really do, head up and do what you gotta do Read that link a few posts back its really informative has given me some hope xx

PS While she stayed in the UK she was lovely seemed happy all was well and they returned with the intention of getting a settlement visa

[Brigante7]

I am amazed that nobody on this forum has pointed out how damaging it will be for the child to be taken away from her mother!!!

If you can't persuade your wife to come back to the UK why don't you demonstrate your commitment to your marriage and your family by going to be in Thailand with them both? Save your marriage and then you can think about returning to the UK as a family later.

When your daughter grows up she will not thank you for separating her from her mother.

Good luck - I hope it works out.

And what about the damaged caused by keeping the child from her father? Or do fathers not matter and are only good for making a baby and that's it?

Brigante7.

[Mario2008]

My brother is going through similar now ...He's in Kanchanaburi trying to get his two year old son back to Wales, His Thai wife went psycho in bangkok when they arrived 4 weeks ago after they spent six months in the UK she ran away with his passport phone money the lot then tried to make him chase her all over thailand. We sent him money and she came back to him, but she is still going psycho every other day physically attacking him threatening his life if he doesnt put his hand in his pocket and pull out more money.

She was a bar lady her parents are dead and her sisters smoke yabba drink too much and gamble these are the people she says will take care of the baby while she goes off looking for another farang with more money in the bars!! We dont know what to do my brother is out there on his own in a dangerous country promising the earth to a psycho. My brother is not perfect but he has a good job and very secure and loving family, The baby is an ATM card to his wife she has had nearly 2 million Baht out of us all in the last 2 years and nothing to show except nice bar lady clothes she drank smoked and gambled it all away.

I feel for you fella I really do, head up and do what you gotta do Read that link a few posts back its really informative has given me some hope xx

PS While she stayed in the UK she was lovely seemed happy all was well and they returned with the intention of getting a settlement visa

If the mother is a danger to the child or has a psychiatric illness that prevents her from taking care of the child the father will have no problem getting sole custody. We saw an emergency case her on Thaivisa about 6 months ago where it was all arranged within a week.

A statement from a doctor she is ill and not able to take care of the child or even a danger to the child can do wonders.

[Mario2008]

I am amazed that nobody on this forum has pointed out how damaging it will be for the child to be taken away from her mother!!!

If you can't persuade your wife to come back to the UK why don't you demonstrate your commitment to your marriage and your family by going to be in Thailand with them both? Save your marriage and then you can think about returning to the UK as a family later.

When your daughter grows up she will not thank you for separating her from her mother.

Good luck - I hope it works out.

And what about the damaged caused by keeping the child from her father? Or do fathers not matter and are only good for making a baby and that's it?

Brigante7.

I don't see Lolasamui stating that it wouldn't be damaging to keep a child away from her father. I believe she suggests that the father try to works things out with the mother and maybe stay withthem both in Thailand instead of in the UK, at least for now.

[Geekfreaklover]

My brother is going through similar now ...He's in Kanchanaburi trying to get his two year old son back to Wales, His Thai wife went psycho in bangkok when they arrived 4 weeks ago after they spent six months in the UK she ran away with his passport phone money the lot then tried to make him chase her all over thailand. We sent him money and she came back to him, but she is still going psycho every other day physically attacking him threatening his life if he doesnt put his hand in his pocket and pull out more money.

She was a bar lady her parents are dead and her sisters smoke yabba drink too much and gamble these are the people she says will take care of the baby while she goes off looking for another farang with more money in the bars!! We dont know what to do my brother is out there on his own in a dangerous country promising the earth to a psycho. My brother is not perfect but he has a good job and very secure and loving family, The baby is an ATM card to his wife she has had nearly 2 million Baht out of us all in the last 2 years and nothing to show except nice bar lady clothes she drank smoked and gambled it all away.

I feel for you fella I really do, head up and do what you gotta do Read that link a few posts back its really informative has given me some hope xx

PS While she stayed in the UK she was lovely seemed happy all was well and they returned with the intention of getting a settlement visa

I have had this also. Everytime she is violent or threatens viloence he needs to go to a police station and make a report. If she inflicts wounds go to the hospital and make a report. Take photographs. print out text messages. All this can be used in court.

[muaylaosfalang]

I'm still talking to her with new options when/if she returns to the uk i'm giving her space she wants and im in big debt dont want any more just yet via flying to thailand when i only know she is in Korat somewhere if this fails,i will fly to Thailand when im sure she will be a her fathers home and i will try pay the Police for there help in getting the child and the childs passport!Whether i'll be able to leave Thailand is another matter im sure.Last option i think is the legal custody battle how hard would that be if i can really only get 6 weeks or so in thailand!As regards to the money situ i think if the mother needs cash via kidnap type methods first she can sell her gold and big diamond i bought her.We all know how the girls love their gold till there skint!

I do intend to keep talking this out for a postive outcome for all.

[charliemike11]

Cheers for the info guys,

My brother is adamant he doesn't want to cause any trouble. He's making positive headway on the talking front she appears calm today though last night was another matter, she says she want's to come back to Wales at the minute and so he's borrowed more money to extend his visa but I've spoken to the Visa office and they say there is a 2-3 month wait for all approvals at the moment so he needs to hang in there. We are trying to sell his car now to fund his stay and keep this crazy Thai girl happy. If and When she gets to the UK god knows what she will be like but the child is our main concern if she goes back to the bars what life will he have no parents at all with him.... we are devastated with all of this.

Goodluck muaylaosfalang this is really tough x

[Brigante7]

I am amazed that nobody on this forum has pointed out how damaging it will be for the child to be taken away from her mother!!!

If you can't persuade your wife to come back to the UK why don't you demonstrate your commitment to your marriage and your family by going to be in Thailand with them both? Save your marriage and then you can think about returning to the UK as a family later.

When your daughter grows up she will not thank you for separating her from her mother.

Good luck - I hope it works out.

And what about the damaged caused by keeping the child from her father? Or do fathers not matter and are only good for making a baby and that's it?

Brigante7.

I don't see Lolasamui stating that it wouldn't be damaging to keep a child away from her father. I believe she suggests that the father try to works things out with the mother and maybe stay withthem both in Thailand instead of in the UK, at least for now.

She said and I quote "I am amzed that nobody on this forum has pointed out how damaging it will be for the child to be taken away from her mother!!"

Sometimes it's not what you say but what you don't say. My understanding of the above quote is that it's ok to take the child from her dad but not her mum.

Brigante7.

[nontabury]

i've been in the same situation. I got the Uk settlement for my ex wife and we went to England. I had a good job, big house all the rest of it, but she wasn't happy and I let her return to Thailand for a holiday with my two year old son and she was also pregnant with my second son. Transpired she didn;t want to come back to England.

I decided to leave my job and return to Thailand. Things didn't work out between us. She became violent and abusive. I had no option but to take her to court. I won custody of the two children. Found a job here, luckily.

In your situation I would beg borrow or steal enough money to fly to thailand. Take your daughter out for the day and get her on a flight back to england. You are still married. You have as much right to custody as you wife has.

The way I see it is that she has lied to you by saying she wanted to go on a holiday and now not agreeing to return. That, my friend is abusive behaviour. Dress it up how you like. It is wrong.

It all depends on who you feel can offer your daughter a better life.

Go to Thailand and get your daughter.

how did you obtain custody?i don't think it's that easy anywhere for the father to gain custody and especially in thailand

[Mario2008]

Getting costudy is always a question of who is most suited to take care of the child. That is why it is advised to keep a diary about how one takes care of the child and the things that the other partner does that is damaging. Thai courts are not biased towards foreigners and will take the interest of the child at heart. When it is clear that the father is more suited to take care of the child he will get sole custody.

[isanb]

Going back about 10 years. My wife told me on breakup of a relationship the husband can take the girls children and the wife keeps the boys. This sounds stupid to me but in her village in Caing Mai a relationship broke up in exactly the same circumstances as the OP's. The swiss husband turned up at the village with some police from Chaing Mai. He went to the wife's house and just took the daughter. The police made sure nobody stopped him. Being the father and the fact she had a Swiss passport meant he could go straight to the airport and take her home.

If you really want your daughter back the best thing is to convince your wife to return to the UK. If you cannot then, in my opinion, I would not trust the Thai legal system. Get a duplicate passport for your daughter, lie, say you lost the old one. Go straight to Thailand, pay the local police what it takes for their support, get your daughter and come straight back. Make sure you take with you pictures of your daughter and you, birth certifaicate, medical books and possibly a female to help you look after the daughter, maybe your sister or mother.

I may get flamed for this advice but that's the way things work here in Thailand!

Chris

It's sad but i have to agree with the OP, we are not in europe but in thailand.

Of course the best way is to find a deal with the mother but if it's not possible and you really believe that the best for ur children is to be in the UK with you then you have to act the thai way and here "if you have the money you have the right".

Yes you can try the legal custody way but if it was me i will make everythings to be sure that my children is in a safe place first.

And to find the mother should be easy, just go to thailand and tell her that you want to see her in order to give her money (only if she come with your children because u want to be sure everythinks ok).

Anyway this is my point of view i just hope you will find the best solution for ur children as soon as possible.

Good luck

[muaylaosfalang]

Interesting dilemma.

Aside from just natural curiosity as to WHY the wife does not want to go back to the UK (seems like she had a bad enough experience and not enough love or reason to want to return), I have a few questions for the Board:

1. Since the British child is in Thailand on a tourist visa and cannot get a Thai birth certificate, what happens when the child overstays?

2. Will immigration start racking up the fines?

3. Who will be responsible for paying them - the wife?

4. What happens if she can't/doesn't?

5. Will the child have to be deported back to UK?

Very interesting dilemma...

There is no overstay fine for children. In fact, many immigration officers advise to just let children stay on overstay and not worry about getting extensions for them. Children are also not subject to deportation for this.

Therefor the overstay has no consequences.

Fair enough, BUT....what happens when the child is no longer a child...? He/She will grow up eventually...

The rule is no visa for below 7 years old.

My wife knows says she wants to return to the uk to me now,My babys visa expired 21/6/09.

Is it 100% correct that foreign children under 7 will not get fined for overstay.I dont want to book flights then have a phonecall from wife hours before the flight saying immigration wants 1000's of baht for our babys overstay!

[muaylaosfalang]

Seen this on here but is it correct?

About children i want to know?

Overstay Thursday, 14 December 2006

Do not overstay in Thailand!

The maximum overstay fine in Thailand is 20,000 baht (approx US$450). Foreign children are subject to fines for overstaying in Thailand only when over the age of seven.

You can pay your overstay fine at the airport, but if you are caught by Immigration before you reach the airport, you will be jailed and deported until you can pay your fine and show a one way ticket back to your home country.

If you overstay by one day, there is no charge but only at the airport. Land borders charge for even the first day’s overstay. After that the fine is 500B per day.

Paying the fine is simple. When going through Immigration, they will notice the overstay and take you to a desk to pay, it should take about 5 minutes in all. Fines can also often be paid in advance at any Immigration bureau. You will not be jailed it you voluntarily clear up your overstay.

Warning - Note that overstaying is technically breaking the law and while there is little problem if you 'surrender' yourself to Immigration at the airport, it can be a very different story if you are stopped by the police beforehand for whatever reason and are found to have overstayed - no matter for how long. This may well lead to you being detained in an Immigration Detention Center for a few days while your case is processed. Needless to say, this is an experience you can do without, as conditions inside have been described by Amnesty International as 'cruel and degrading' and 'seriously overcrowded'.

Though the chances of ending up in this situation are very small, you would be advised to not overstay your visa if at all possible. If you do overstay for any reason, obviously you should steer well clear of any kind of activities that might attract the attention of the authorities.

[MrHammer]

I don't understand how you can not see something like this coming up? Seriously, do you live with your eyes closed? I seriously doubt Thai women just decide one day to quit it. Either you guys were completely oblivious or you got children with bad girls.

Either way, quit whining, work your ass off for a month and go to Thailand and get your daughter. Too many people on here like to assume the farang victim position, be a freakin man and go do what you have to do.

If it was my child being taken from me you bet I would get on a plane asap.

[Jeffro008]

Well when her tourist visa expires she has to leave the country. From what you say she is farang if she doesn't leave she will be deported. speak to your embassy.

Not true. This doesn't apply for babies. I've always heard it starts to apply at age 13.

Yes i also totally believe that babies are at no penalties of overstay or deportation until a certin age.

There photo I.D's changes too quickly for official documents to be verified.

[Mario2008]

My wife knows says she wants to return to the uk to me now,My babys visa expired 21/6/09.

Is it 100% correct that foreign children under 7 will not get fined for overstay.I dont want to book flights then have a phonecall from wife hours before the flight saying immigration wants 1000's of baht for our babys overstay!

Don't worry, children are not fined for overstay. The exact age is a bit unclear, but at least till 14 years of age, maybe even to 18 years.

They probably make a notation in the passport that there was an overstay, but that is it. The notation will have no future consequences.

Hope everything will work out well between you and your wife.

[wolfmanjack]

Cheers for the info guys,

My brother is adamant he doesn't want to cause any trouble. He's making positive headway on the talking front she appears calm today though last night was another matter, she says she want's to come back to Wales at the minute and so he's borrowed more money to extend his visa but I've spoken to the Visa office and they say there is a 2-3 month wait for all approvals at the moment so he needs to hang in there. We are trying to sell his car now to fund his stay and keep this crazy Thai girl happy. If and When she gets to the UK god knows what she will be like but the child is our main concern if she goes back to the bars what life will he have no parents at all with him.... we are devastated with all of this.

Goodluck muaylaosfalang this is really tough x

Personally i would buy a pair of handcuffs and the next time she got violent I would put them on her and take her to the Psycho Hospital. She needs to get help and that is the advise the Doctors gave me when my wife was going nutso after the birth of our second child.

[muaylaosfalang]

Hammer you are a penis or a small man gobbing off via the net!

I assure you in the real world you would not shout your views at me.

Your post has nothing to do with the question i asked so shut your mouth.

[ArranP]

I don't understand how you can not see something like this coming up? Seriously, do you live with your eyes closed? I seriously doubt Thai women just decide one day to quit it. Either you guys were completely oblivious or you got children with bad girls.

Either way, quit whining, work your ass off for a month and go to Thailand and get your daughter. Too many people on here like to assume the farang victim position, be a freakin man and go do what you have to do.

If it was my child being taken from me you bet I would get on a plane asap.

Hammer I was in a similar position, however different to the OP I was acutally in Thailand.

I could'nt bring myself to prise my daughter away from her mother, as her mother was willing to hurt the daughter to physically keep hold of her where I was not. Maybe this is my failing.

Also it is not a good idea to hurt the mother physically in any way as this may lead to a one way trip to the Thai jail and how usefull would I be to my daughter in there.

Its just to mention its not as easy as one first thinks.

The positive way in these cases, is go via the solicitors then its all above board nobody getting hurt, physically that is including the child. Or as the OP has done try to talk the mother round.

[ArranP]

Well done!! muaylaosfalang, I'm pleased to hear your are all getting back together, one score for the happy camp :-)

BTW, my daughter, wife and myself have all re-united and since travelled back to the UK.

[fantaasia]

Hello

The first post i make is a most sad and distressing one for me,I live in the uk with my thai wife and our 19 month old uk born daughter..

Firstly, CONGRATULATIONS! Chockdee!

Secondly, start by using the phrase OUR child and try to remember the reasons WHY you have a child with a Thai. It is most likely cause you are over 30 and its impossible nowadays to find a female interested in having children in Europe and the US etc. Luckily we men have THAILAND! So heres the thing. Thai women are NOT happy living in a foreign country. My beautiful Thai wife of 5 years was not happy living in Europe and when she wanted to return to LOS. At first i was hesitant but quickly relented despite our daughter having duel Irish and Thai nationality. BEST thing ever! The reasons are endless, family support, happier people, better food, nicer weather, etc. (Though one nice thing about having the birth in Eu etc is the 8000 Baht monthly children allowance we get from the EU My advice to you is to FORGET THE UK (and the EU) and concentrate on creating a good life (at a fraction of the cost) for your child in LOS. Do not go down the legal route as you WILL only end up with a bunch of legal bills and endless bitterness.