Windows Vs Linux

[joncl]

Wine sucks and leaves much to be desired. Two programs I use often are AutoCad and Garmin Map Source. I can see no advantage for Linux unless it is the fact that it is free.

www.osalt.com provides a list of opensource options for your windows apps, i.e. autoCad can be seen here

Wine does its job but is not windows and in some cases I have to use win7 in a VM to run some tools (read 1 of them but this is more to do with being to lazy to learn the Linux versions which there are many) I can not do in Linux, but the same applied to the MAC so I have to it in a VM for 3 apps I use, but all run from Linux not the other way around and with dual screens on the notebook here it is great to have one OS on one screen and native linux on the other.

[raro]

Why a Apple need a program named Parallels? And Linux as well just different name(forget the name and tired to search)? I mean for to run software which didn't exist for that OS's, standard software!

Because that OS's are not standard?!

Windows don't need such software because the programs which can exactly do what the Apple or Linux programs do existing in Windows.

Unix is excellent, no doubt! As OS for Mainframes pp!

Apple are excellent not doubt either! For that what they can do!

Linux are excellent as well, even no doubt!And again: for that what that OS can do!

Windows maybe not excellent in your eye's! But: it can do what all the other can do as well on an PC (not a Mainframe)! And can do even more!

Windows are not perfect, no doubt with that!

But: Linux and Apple are perfect? I doubt that!

The truth is that if someone want to work with Linux, need to start to learn again! But is that enough? I don't think so! And final that human will come back to Windows, because of the need to get work done!

Take you own post's here, I mean you, the linux guy's and see how many of you need to have Windows run as 2. system. Why, if everything is so perfect? And the same applies fir the Apple User's!

If you think that the nubers of running systems are incorrect, I really suggest you to go in offices, not one, a lot of them and start to count the systems running separated by OS and create your own statistic. Go to other user, but not to those you know, unknown users and check what they are running!

And after that you restart to think about the perfect system you runing! And also think about why so less humans using that perfect system because that systems ar not that perfect?

Cheers

Name one Windows only app that doesn't have an Open Source equivalent......granted there's interia from simpletons who can't relearn the apps from Windows, but with a few exceptions there's little that the closed source world offers that isn't matched or exceeded by Open Source.

Microsoft Money. If you can point to an open source equivalent that's localised for the UK tax system, understand ISAs, OIECS and VAT and that will connect to the Nationwide Building Society and download all my transactions into itself I'll give it a go.

Outlook 2007 combined with syncing.net. Synchronizes my contacts via LAN or internet across several computers without the need of a server. Does the same for my calendar entries. I can invite people to my meetings via e-mail and it shows in the calendar who accepted to join. Reminder functions and a notes fields in the contacts makes it a basic CRM system. And it syncs with my windows phone. I am not aware of any Linux phone around.

[Plus]

Couldn't find any usenet programs on that osalt.com, they don't list nor windows nor open source clients.

[RKASA]

"Outlook 2007 combined with syncing.net. Synchronizes my contacts via LAN or internet across several computers without the need of a server. Does the same for my calendar entries. I can invite people to my meetings via e-mail and it shows in the calendar who accepted to join. Reminder functions and a notes fields in the contacts makes it a basic CRM system. And it syncs with my windows phone. I am not aware of any Linux phone around."

I am not ranking on it.  It sounds vary nice, but avg user (the topic be that i.e. whom is using) not which is best.  is not paying out 149.95 the list price of that product.  The home edition is limited to 3 PC and not more then 100 folders.  Would be fine for most users, but again this is still vary nich as 98% or maybe more don't sync mail.  Most don't even have it on their PC. and they don't even use an app like outlook.  So why would they need an OS like windows just for yahoo mail.  Its a ? don't be offended.  In fact many would be happy using a kiosk of linux and would never know its not windows.  If I wanted to spend lots of money I would get all kinds of windows stuff and have someone else maintain it under contract, its a write off.  Problem is to many users are told that they need stuff they don't need and are paying out a ton of money for no reason.  You are not an avg user, and thats why it cost so much, its a low volume product.  If everybody needed it, it would cost 14.95 and the DEV's would have made one by now.

I use an email app thunderbird,  its installed in my laptop only.  I can take it with me and use it on my local network.  I don't need to have copies on the other PC's, but I am just a user.

It reminds me of all the 4 wheel drive trucks running around bangkok,  its amazing what can be done with advertizing.  How many really use it or need it.  Vary few.

[joncl]

Couldn't find any usenet programs on that osalt.com, they don't list nor windows nor open source clients.

why would you want it to when things like Evolution / thunderbird and many more are already included in many Linux distros (read most of them).

[Plus]

Couldn't find any usenet programs on that osalt.com, they don't list nor windows nor open source clients.

why would you want it to when things like Evolution / thunderbird and many more are already included in many Linux distros (read most of them).

Because they are not meant for downloading binaries via mutliple SSL connections and .nzb files, or repairing broken downloads with .pars.

A few apps were mentioned here already, but not on that site.

I installed latest Ubuntu, btw. So far for Compiz working but not much else.

Noticed that there's no GUI for editing Grub, or I couldn't find it.

[raro]

"Outlook 2007 combined with syncing.net. Synchronizes my contacts via LAN or internet across several computers without the need of a server. Does the same for my calendar entries. I can invite people to my meetings via e-mail and it shows in the calendar who accepted to join. Reminder functions and a notes fields in the contacts makes it a basic CRM system. And it syncs with my windows phone. I am not aware of any Linux phone around."

I am not ranking on it. It sounds vary nice, but avg user (the topic be that i.e. whom is using) not which is best. is not paying out 149.95 the list price of that product. The home edition is limited to 3 PC and not more then 100 folders. Would be fine for most users, but again this is still vary nich as 98% or maybe more don't sync mail. Most don't even have it on their PC. and they don't even use an app like outlook. So why would they need an OS like windows just for yahoo mail. Its a ? don't be offended. In fact many would be happy using a kiosk of linux and would never know its not windows. If I wanted to spend lots of money I would get all kinds of windows stuff and have someone else maintain it under contract, its a write off. Problem is to many users are told that they need stuff they don't need and are paying out a ton of money for no reason. You are not an avg user, and thats why it cost so much, its a low volume product. If everybody needed it, it would cost 14.95 and the DEV's would have made one by now.

I use an email app thunderbird, its installed in my laptop only. I can take it with me and use it on my local network. I don't need to have copies on the other PC's, but I am just a user.

It reminds me of all the 4 wheel drive trucks running around bangkok, its amazing what can be done with advertizing. How many really use it or need it. Vary few.

agree, it is not what a private user would need. If it was for me at home, I might actually go for linux and probably will as it is free and does what I need on my comp at home: Watching movies and browsing the internet.

what we actually sync is the contacts so that all staff has access to the same contacts which comes in handy. It also syncs the files we are working with (pretty similar to dropbox, but with unlimited volume as far as I understand) without the need of a file server. And that SAVES me money

[Plus]

Second day on Ubuntu, no big problems so far.

Wine is working, Grabit was downloading at 4mbps, then it started disappearing. Once I switch to another desktop in cube, wine window with Grabit in it disappears. System monitor says the grabit process is running but in sleeping mode. Terminate, start grabit again, flick the cube to another desktop, and it's gone. Odd.

Also spent hours trying to set graphical grub menu with gfx-grub only to find that it won't work on Ubuntu since Intrepid version - they've made some changes to "base names" to "256-bit" whatever that means, and gfx-grub can't read files from the disk at all. Found "startup manager" instead and it even has the option of blowing up the resolution beyond 640x480 set in original grub.

The reason for tweaking it was that default grub menu was way off the screen to the left, trunkating the entries. So far off that Windows was completely out of the display, I had to guess which one was it.

Also the file manager doesn't have address field to type in, navigate only by clicking around through folders. Strange.

Overall it was a very pleasant experience, even Ubuntu colors have grown on me, and Gnome's simplicity has it's own advantages.

[dave_boo]

There's undoubtedly a lot or progress. Any Linux guide from three years ago would go on and on about using terminal.

These days users have GUI for everything, terminal is not needed at all (assuming GUIs are working properly).

My own problems are all related to deep system bowels, something that will hopefully be fixed in upcoming releases.

However, new releases means that programs not in the repos will not work at all, and I think that should be worrying, as it puts extra burden on developers.

In one case I saw someone berating the developer for not providing .rpm/.deb packages, saying that users are not supposed to compile anything themselves anymore. Valid point - Linux distros out of the box do not even have tools requires to install anything from the source - compile, make, install - those common terminal commands do not work anymore, you have to manually install things like gcc+ first, and no one tells your what exactly do you need to make this or that program or driver installed and working.

On the other hand, the developer must release dozens of different versions of the same program or driver and keep adding new versions few months to keep up with Linux updates, and they often are working on something else already, I suppose.

This has to be sorted out. Are we going to have more Open Source programs, or just a few but well maintained?

FUD much? make still works just fine. Never hear of compile, perhaps you're talking about 'configure'. None-the-less, all distros have 'development' packages that allow you to put them in there in one fell swoop. That person berating was being stupid; if he wanted a common packaging system he can go work on Windows.....oh wait, you have a lot of installable software that won't install on newer Windows OS because developers are lazy....

Furthermore you don't need to release dozens of different versions; consider Nvidia's driver; AFAIK there's two versions, one for the older cards and one for the newer cards. But if you have an older card it doesn't matter what distro you're on; it just installs. And furthermore, ever try and use a non-approved driver for an Nvidia laptop GPU? Not pretty and takes some hacking. However on Linux the same driver that's on my desktop is the one that's on the laptop.

[RKASA]

I know all the tools are in the repo and some are installed.  I have read about what they do and how to do.  I read Rute cover to cover.  But in all the time I have been using Linux never once did I ever use any of it.  Nor have I compiled a kernal.  Packages are in the repo for the distro ported and tested.  Why do it?  Its for the packagers to use.  We get new packages near everyday and they use these tools so I can only assume they work well if your a packager and use them all the time.  At many forums you can give the site info for a program you like or see thats not in the repo and they will test then package it.  They seem to have a good number a people doing it because many requested get added right away.  Thats pretty good stuff.

[dave_boo]

I know all the tools are in the repo and some are installed. I have read about what they do and how to do. I read Rute cover to cover. But in all the time I have been using Linux never once did I ever use any of it. Nor have I compiled a kernal. Packages are in the repo for the distro ported and tested. Why do it? Its for the packagers to use. We get new packages near everyday and they use these tools so I can only assume they work well if your a packager and use them all the time. At many forums you can give the site info for a program you like or see thats not in the repo and they will test then package it. They seem to have a good number a people doing it because many requested get added right away. Thats pretty good stuff.

Well, one of the few reasons I need those 'develop' packages is to install the latest Nvidia driver. I occasionally compile my own driver; waiting for SuSE to get the latest and greatest in their repository is a pain. Furthermore Ubuntu freaks out on my lappie unless I have a 2.6.29* kernel installed. Not Linux fault, MSI decided to pass bad DSDT tables and other nasty little tricks. I wouldn't dare try and create my own BIOS to fix that.....

But you're quite correct; there's a lot of good souls out there that take the time and create a package for 'regular' users. I still prefer to compile certain packages due to that speed boost you'll get (as real or imperceptible as it is). And there's of course older packages that I stick with (K3B being an example) just due to the familiarity of the program or the fact that the old version is stable and I don't see the reason to mess with it.

[Plus]

I still prefer to compile certain packages

That's an example of where I heard compile. The actual commands, afaik, are configure, make, install. "Make" is not supported on a fresh install.

And if a new user needs to get it all working just to install a mouse theme - there is a reason to berate the developer.

Repos are a great way to install things, far better than MS, but not everything is in there.Opera, for example, is not in Ubuntu's repos, you have to download the .deb from their site, install via right click menu

And Pclos didn't have a menu entry to install .rpms, btw.

[RKASA]

.rpm by default are installed by synaptic and PClos likes people to stay in the repo.  Also to save cd space on the live cd the Kpackage has to be install from synaptic after install.  Then it becomes a item in your browser just right click the rpm and install.  After that the package will show even in the synaptic lists.  This is a commen form of installing for the virtualbox because the repo version can never keep up with the near weekly upgrades from sun.  

PClos also keeps the up to date Opera in the repo as well as all the video drivers. old and new.  They have the Nvidia drivers in the livecd. With the option at install to remove the ones that are not used the save space. 

If you like to make your own packages and install from outside the repo then you need to go to the    http://hackmy.pclosbe.org/index.php     for support and visit with other advanced users.  Many of them have built their own local repos out of packages they make for themself.  

The main PClos site is for normal users and its been doing a great job of getting avg users into linux.  In fact they like to keep posts about advanced issues on the other boards so as not to confuse the noobs.  (like me)  And they love anyone that can package and would love it if you would do some packaging for the repo.

[Plus]

I just installed Ubuntu over Pclos. Most of my problems are gone. Last thing left to set is home workgroup.

Everything else I need just works.

As for .rpm, I tried installing my usenet client and there was no right click menu entry and double clicking on it didn't produce anything. I installed from terminal, in the end. Though that wasn't trouble free either - I got it finally working by downloading .deb and then converting it to .rpm as the original rpm refused to install.

Opera was in their repos, but it isn't in Ubuntu's. Installed from their website, .deb, works like a clock.

Now networking is tricky. Samba wasn't installed form liveCD, but some other network tool was, and now I can't find the way to change ubuntu's workgroup without installing Samba. Weird. Win7, on its own end, doesn't allow to browse all workgroups, so Samba, here I come.