Battered Tourism Sector Seeks Urgent Government Help

[animatic]

A word for those thinking about coming to Thailand, come and stay well away from tourists areas. Don't go to Phucket, view the less centric areas of Bangkok, avoid Samui and specially Pattaya. Beat the less travelled paths and you'll find the real, wonderful Thailand.

What utter garbage. If you listen to this, don't even bother coming to Thailand because you will be bored silly. Tourists usually head for the prettiest, most interesting places in any country - even if they might screw it up a bit.

Avoid all tourist areas. What a bunch of politically correct malarkey.

I apologize, when I said tourist areas I was refering to the heavy weights, the places one hears about when is outside the country. Those places have become tourist traps, better to be avoided, in my opinion, of course. There are plenty of other tourist destinations in the country that don't bear that stigma.

I've enjoyed visiting a couple of lethargic temples up North in Mae Chaem more than the tourist hive at the Emeral Buddha Temple in BKK, for example. More relaxing, no entry fees and real Thai atmosphere, with actual monks going around their chores and chickens running around.

On the other hand if you are here for hookers, booze and the like, you'd be fine in my blacklist of places to avoid.

The people that come to Samui, round one, now, love it.

The old backpackers, coming back after 5 years,

decry the loss of non-services and isolation no longer available.

But to say "avoid Samui" is just an idiotic statement.

Sure there are girlie bars, but this place has also become a Spa center,

and also a just pure relaxation boutique resort center.

Sea play is available over and under the sea.

Many people come and stay several days and thus lower the per day cost of the over-charged air flight.

You need not stay in the Dance Club/Girlie bar areas at all, there are still totally tranquil corners.

Just had a friend here who hadn't been in 5 years, he said: "It's changed a lot." But no frown when he said it.

Then he had the best time he's had in years and will bring his grown son back next month for a week or more.

Edited June 19, 2009 by animatic

[GungaDin]

"Normal" <deleted> is "Normal"? Scams, murders of Expats & tourists an ineffective & corrupt police force, et al....... "Normal"

People do not forget negatives. It will take many years for tourism to recover in Thailand.

You're thinking like the TAT staff.

scams, murders of expats and police forces do not register on the radar of the average tourist who wants two weeks on a beautiful island. they're irrelevant.

Ahh, you must be referring to the rich tourists who live in caves and with no contact with the Internet or TV, radio, or newspapers.

Irrelevant , my arse.

no, i'm referring to the tourists who are more than aware that scams, murders and dodgy police are present in every country on earth. what has put them off coming to thailand this year is the possiblity of airports shutting down, riots in the streets of the capital and potentially a coup d'etat while they're here.

"et al" covered "airports shutting down, riots in the streets of the capital and potentially a coup d'etat while they're here"

Apologies for the use of big words.........

[catmac]

The best holidays I've had in Thailand is when I hardly saw a foreigner at all. Unfortunately, tourists bring money, and money attracts greed; before you know it a once nice spot turns into a place crawling with scamming, price gouging, bad mannered individuals and facilities.

Sums up the demise of Phuket pretty well! Went there a few years ago with my Thai b/f, and it was the only place we've ever been where I could actually feel the hostility from some people. Give me the North any day, great people who treat us with the same good nature that we show to them.

[imjustagirl]

If you have made it this far congrads. you seen 16 pages of pent up frustrated foriegners who the majority don't work here in thailand and dont even work along the thai people.

For the whole flu issue scaring tourists away from thailand, the last time I checked USA, Japan, Mexico, and various other countries have it to. Caucan is almost a ghost town, this is a useless excuse as why tourists are not coming to thailand. If this flu hits a global pandamic scale in which we start seeing millions of people dieing in less than a month then the tourism industry or anything else won't matter period for any country.

Poor farang blame all the thai's. all thai's bad bad bad, blame the majority for the fraction of a few minority, If thailand has become this bad for you quit your whining and leave already.

Let me help most of you out with this, the majority of thai's don't have the insight, knowledge, depth, on most serious issues not because there dumb its because failure of educational standards, corruption, and the system period, most i know here just survive, work, eat, have fun. Most thais to don't like the fact of everything going on especially with government. but most of you would not know this anyway since I guess you dont ever talk with any thai people

hotel prices being inflated, a few hotels that I've stayed in singapore, hong kong, have raised their prices by 75 -100 USD in a matter of 3 years, but no no no thailand bad prices high. HAVE most of you just never traveled outside of thailand in the last 5 years or more.

Thailand has problems I GET IT. WHAT COUNTRY doesn't spain has 18% unemployment, the last time i saw eurozone, usa, japan, china, and boats loads more places have unemployment going up along with crime.

For the few who work here, have wife or kids, life in general is never easy or truly stable. Every country at some point in time has problems ranging from serious to down right dangerious. Flee, fight, run, whatever, do what you have to do, but I have to do the best I've got, keep my business going. got nothing to go back to my home country for anymore.

erm who rattled your cage. the point of this thread i thought was that tourism is down massively and thailand is worried and doesn't have a clear grasp of why....and you are telling us farangs to put up, shut up or get out? Isn't that just adding to thailands seriously collapsing foreign income

I think most of the posts are dead on and we are allowed an opinion as to what would be the cause of the drop and how thailand could improve its situation...or did free speech in forums just get banned in Thailand too...... the cry of put up with it or get out is hardly constructive in regards to the entire point of this thread

[bungy007]

If you have made it this far congrads. you seen 16 pages of pent up frustrated foriegners who the majority don't work here in thailand and dont even work along the thai people.

For the whole flu issue scaring tourists away from thailand, the last time I checked USA, Japan, Mexico, and various other countries have it to. Caucan is almost a ghost town, this is a useless excuse as why tourists are not coming to thailand. If this flu hits a global pandamic scale in which we start seeing millions of people dieing in less than a month then the tourism industry or anything else won't matter period for any country.

Poor farang blame all the thai's. all thai's bad bad bad, blame the majority for the fraction of a few minority, If thailand has become this bad for you quit your whining and leave already.

Let me help most of you out with this, the majority of thai's don't have the insight, knowledge, depth, on most serious issues not because there dumb its because failure of educational standards, corruption, and the system period, most i know here just survive, work, eat, have fun. Most thais to don't like the fact of everything going on especially with government. but most of you would not know this anyway since I guess you dont ever talk with any thai people

hotel prices being inflated, a few hotels that I've stayed in singapore, hong kong, have raised their prices by 75 -100 USD in a matter of 3 years, but no no no thailand bad prices high. HAVE most of you just never traveled outside of thailand in the last 5 years or more.

Thailand has problems I GET IT. WHAT COUNTRY doesn't spain has 18% unemployment, the last time i saw eurozone, usa, japan, china, and boats loads more places have unemployment going up along with crime.

For the few who work here, have wife or kids, life in general is never easy or truly stable. Every country at some point in time has problems ranging from serious to down right dangerious. Flee, fight, run, whatever, do what you have to do, but I have to do the best I've got, keep my business going. got nothing to go back to my home country for anymore.

erm who rattled your cage. the point of this thread i thought was that tourism is down massively and thailand is worried and doesn't have a clear grasp of why....and you are telling us farangs to put up, shut up or get out? Isn't that just adding to thailands seriously collapsing foreign income

I think most of the posts are dead on and we are allowed an opinion as to what would be the cause of the drop and how thailand could improve its situation...or did free speech in forums just get banned in Thailand too...... the cry of put up with it or get out is hardly constructive in regards to the entire point of this thread

Indeed. From what we can see people aren't putting up with it anymore and they are getting out or not even coming in the first place - a preference for a destination on more of an even keel with a warmer, more genuine welcome, perhaps. The age on the internet is here and Siam is in deep trouble because it has been exposed to scrutiny and in the eyes of more and more it simply doesn't make the grade. Jackanory - end of story

[deprogrammed]

If a copy of the PattayaPeople Newspaper were to be read by anyone thinking of holidaying in Pattaya then I think they would give it a complete miss - scary!

[SurfRider]

"This would be a very bad idea . . . Would you really want to sit with the great unwashed and dodgy English teachers for hours . . . Most of these people are doing their best to circumvent the visa system by becoming (illegal) perpetual tourists"

Your elitist condescending attitude toward your fellow Expats, and everyone who is not as wonderful and fortunate as you, is duly noted.

Briefly, when I first arrived in Siam, I was one of the despicable "them" that you refer to, and have known many other border-runners since then who don't fit your "great unwashed" catch-all category, but are good honest people who are caught up in an archaic draconian immigration system that should have been modernized many years ago -- as other competing Asian countries such as Cambodia, Malaysia, and Vietnam have done.

If less restrictive immigration policies work well in other neighboring Asian countries, why would you assume the same policies would not work here?

I traveled to the Philippines for 17 years, lived there for 1.5 years, and had a business there -- I never once stepped foot into their immigration office and don't even know where it's located.

Renewing your Visa simply required going to a travel agent once every six months, dropping off your passport, paying a small fee, and your passport would be returned the next day with your 6 month renewal stamp.

For an additional 50 Pesos ( US $2 ), they would deliver it to your residence.

As a retiree in "Amazing Thailand", I have to pay 6 visits to the Immigration office each year and cough up tons of intrusive personal data just to stay "legal".

.

Edited June 19, 2009 by SurfTrader

[loong]

modern tourism is like a swarm of grasshoppers They find a nice and authentic place, overwhelming it and destroy the authenticity of it and than complain the place lost his attraction and than move on to some other place and leave the once so nice place completely destroyed.

IMHO there are just too much tourist and not enough travelers. I you know what I mean.

I do know what you mean, but you're not quite right.

I've never seen a tourist arrive with a cement mixer with the intention to smother the greenery with grey. It's actually the locals. They want to make money and can't recognise that tourist come because they like the place as it is. The locals change it into something that they think the tourists want. Sometimes they are right - sometimes wrong.

[sprocket]

... thailand will learn a hard lesson. they need dollars or they wont have rice.

Um, don't you have that backwards??? Isn't Thailand (one of) the biggest rice (and shrimp) exporters in the world? It would be more accurate to say that if YOU don't have dollars YOU won't have rice. Agriculture remains the backbone of the Thai economy. The Thais will always have rice and will never starve. In difficult times like these the laid off factory workers just go home to their families in the country. Life goes on. Tourism only makes up 6% of Thai GDP. Even if tourism collapses completely the Thais will adapt and life will go on.

Exactly. The reality is that the government has more important things to worry about than tourism and expats.

[JR Texas]

"This would be a very bad idea . . . Would you really want to sit with the great unwashed and dodgy English teachers for hours . . . Most of these people are doing their best to circumvent the visa system by becoming (illegal) perpetual tourists"

Your elitist condescending attitude toward your fellow Expats, and everyone who is not as wonderful and fortunate as you, is duly noted.

Briefly, when I first arrived in Siam, I was one of the despicable "them" that you refer to, and have known many other border-runners since then who don't fit your "great unwashed" catch-all category, but are good honest people who are caught up in an archaic draconian immigration system that should have been modernized many years ago -- as other competing Asian countries such as Cambodia, Malaysia, and Vietnam have done.

If less restrictive immigration policies work well in other neighboring Asian countries, why would you assume the same policies would not work here?

I traveled to the Philippines for 17 years, lived there for 1.5 years, and had a business there -- I never once stepped foot into their immigration office and don't even know where it's located.

Renewing your Visa simply required going to a travel agent once every six months, dropping off your passport, paying a small fee, and your passport would be returned the next day with your 6 month renewal stamp.

For an additional 50 Pesos ( US $2 ), they would deliver it to your residence.

As a retiree in "Amazing Thailand", I have to pay 6 visits to the Immigration office each year and cough up tons of intrusive personal data just to stay "legal".

.

The social engineering project targeting foreigners in Thailand has been a dismal failure.

The "visa/immigration system" in Thailand is the worst in Southeast Asia.....specifically designed to cause problems for resident tourists/expats (mainly reflected in the changes over the past 9 years).

Thailand has lost valuable foreign dollars to regional competitors because they allowed certain individuals to base the system on xenophobia and a misguided notion that good people are rich and bad people are middle-class/poor.

On a different note, another poster pointed out, yet again, that tourism is not significant to the Thai economy because it only makes up 6%.

6% of GDP is actually a relevant percentage of any economy. I doubt any economist on the planet would say that was small and insignificant.

6% does not account for all of the businesses that are impacted by tourism, so the figure is much higher than 6%.

There are many ways of looking at an "economy." It can mean, global, regional, national, local, micro, etc.

In Thailand, there are local economies that are HEAVILY DEPENDENT ON TOURISM. In these local economies tourism comprises far more than 6% of the economy.

Pattaya-Jomtien is a good example of a local economy heavily dependent on tourism. And, not surprisingly, it is really taking an economic beating at the moment.

Phuket is another.........there are even sections of Bangkok that are extremely dependent on tourism (e.g., Khao San Road).

When tourism numbers decline, these local economies feel it.

Like it or not, tourism is important to Thailand's economy.

[rinpoche]

not to be funny but they must have seen this coming? and i'd imagine that swine 'flu has sod all to do with it.

I entirely agree, its like their vision is limited to the next meal,.

having lived in LOS for more than a year now i'm still struggling to get used to the short-termist thinking of the government.

But aren't these the measures and policies that will satisfy the average Thai? Any government that tries to make the people take bitter medicine for a better future is sure to be ousted by manoeuvres we are all too familiar with.

[Pawpcorn]

How does 165000 to 27000 equate to a 33.45% drop? Even if this statistic was meant to be a drop "OF" 27000, it does not add up. This is wildly wrong or else I an misinterpreting "year on year".......

Anyone?

Hmmm my math... a drop of 611%, in as 27000 goes into 165000 6.11 times....

OR... this year is 16.3 % of what the previous year was...

Airport closures, riots, global economic recession, and now H1N1.... What's next???

Uh hum... you can't lose more than 100% (Not even thai tourism...its mathematically impossible).

165000 to 27000 is a 83.6% loss.

(1-27/165)*100

Yeah, I feel a little stupid, having made that stupid mistake... guess I've never been that great at math! I should have subtracted 16.3 from 100, to come up with the correct figure. However, I think the correct numbers are in the range of a 39% reduction in tourists this year, and the big numbers in the report just got jumbled up in the process of "reporting" if you can call it that...

I visited the http://www.thaiwebsites.com/tourism.asp website mentioned above... and found MUCH of the information to be a real reality check of the real significance of tourism to Thailand, anyway... Tourism only accounts for about 6.5% of Thailand's GDP... so in the big picture, even a 50% loss of tourism isn't such a big deal, except in the communities that try to be holiday destinations... So how would the expression go...? "We should all just get over ourselves!" or something like that.

Myself, I'm in for the long haul, at the present time... got a steady reliable job (teaching English, OK, I know, but I've learned to love it!), good income, savings, comfortable living quarters, and the best relationship I've had my entire life... so I'm not complaining... for this 59 year old, Thailand is a pretty kick-back, relaxed attitude kind of place to live... While I wait for my social security to kick in. I think surviving the economic slowdown is significantly a lot easier here, than it would be my old home town of Los Angeles, California (RIP).

I think, as Farangs, we're taught to question everything, and complain up a storm as a right and an obligation in being a citizen... but living here teaches you a LOT about how to live life at a slower pace, and with greater patience, sensitivity, and understanding. It's not always an easy thing to do, but, again, we have to "get over ourselves". It's the Thai's country and it's their history and it's their culture, and things are just the way they are for those reasons...

and yes, it usually DOES defy farang logic.

[Pawpcorn]

"The causes of the sharp drop in tourist arrivals are attributed to the closure of Suvarnabhumi Airport by the People’s Alliance for Democracy (PAD) in November and December, and recent domestic political turmoil, combined with the current outbreak of the H1N1 flu,” Mr. Tosaporn said.

When looking at foreign news reporting, the soldiers shooting ont he streets were a much bigger story than the airport closure, I think just to be fair he should have simply said:"...are attributed to foreigners being affraid to get caught up in our continuous political turmoil combined with the H1N1 flu outbreak".

Also, June aint over yet, how can he speak of "June" and compare it with last years numbers...

It's interesting that he does not mention at all the fact that everything is getting way to expensive in Thailand (One reason being the strong Baht, the other the real prices - things aint cheap here anymore), and there are other countries in the immediate vicinity that are now becoming more interesting. Look at Vietnam for example, they have improved a lot in being a nice place to visit and they now have A LOT more visitors than Thailand, even though their numbers have dropped (due to the H1N1 flu) compared to last year, too.

http://www.vietnamtourism.com/e_pages/news...amp;chucnang=07

If Thailand doesn't get it's act together soon, they can smile as much as they want, people will stop coming more and more. So, he is right... the TAT need to pull the rabbit out of the hat and put all it can into saving Thailand's face as a top tourist destination in the world.

I think it IS an interesting statistic, by comparison, to note, from the above web page, that Vietnam's tourism has been declining in the double digits, worse and worse, every month, in 2009:

International visitors to Vietnam in May and first 5 months of year 2009

International visitors to Vietnam in May estimated 292,842 arrivals. Totally, international visitors in first 5 months reached 1,614,455 arrivals, 18.8% lower than those in the same period of year 2008.(Detail)

International visitors to Vietnam in April and first 4 months of year 2009

International visitors to Vietnam in April estimated 305,430 arrivals. Totally, international visitors in first quarter reached 1,297,672 arrivals, 17.8% lower than those in the same period of year 2008.(Detail)

International visitors to Vietnam in March and first 3 months of year 2009

International visitors to Vietnam in March estimated 303,489 arrivals. Totally, international visitors in first quarter reached 992,242 arrivals, 16.1% lower than those in the same period of year 2008.(Detail)

International visitors to Vietnam in February and first 2 months of year 2009

International visitors to Vietnam in February estimated 342,913 arrivals. Totally, international visitors in first 2 months of year 2009 reached 688,753 arrivals, 10% lower than those in the same period of year 2008.(Detail)

International visitors to Vietnam in January 2009

International visitors to Vietnam in January 2009 estimated 370,000 arrivals, decreasing by 11.9% in comparison with the same period last year.(Detail)

I don't think Thailand is quite as candid about publishing the raw numbers... as pointed out by the http://www.thaiwebsites.com/tourism.asp web site:

"Both the Office of Tourism Development and the National Economic and Social Development Board (NSDB) provide poor or very difficult to access statistics. Possibly it is considered wise not to broadcast a significant downturn to widely. Maybe negative publicity is viewed as turning possible visitors away."

[rippedoff]

Like I keep saying when are we all going to learn. They need us MORE THEN WE NEED THEM. The visa runs the land ownership and so on BULL..IT. We all need to get together and stop all there unfairness towards us.Lets start a green shirt parade.That will show them. And will really hurt there tourism. ripped off

[sprocket]

No large country (based on population) wants to be too reliant on tourism.

2005 tourism GDP:

Thailand 7.14%

Spain 4.70

Australia 2.81

Sweden 2.39

Italy 2.17

UK 1.79

China 1.42

Germany 1.37

South Korea 1.03

USA 0.99

Russia 0.96

Japan 0.34

Non-citizens should not expect to have the same privileges as a country's own citizens.

Edited June 20, 2009 by sprocket

[vahack]

Eventually she realized and said, "we're not going to see any waterfalls, are we?" Nope -- all the Thai waterfalls are just inside the entrances to national parks -- "som nam na" for being Thai and thinking that it's ok to price like this.

i feel sorry for your wife.

u think u made an impact with your little revolt

on the 10-20 baht an hour ticket stand workers?

the only one u affected was your wife

who spent 4 days in a car with you hoping

to see some waterfalls.

dont think of farang price

as a price hike for the farangs.

its a discount for the poor Thais

who would like to see the wonders

of their country.

[Jimjim]

Wow, it sounds like 90% of you hate it in Thailand. If I followed your advice, why would I ever want to go back? You make it sound like hel_l on earth.

[spidermike007]

I do not believe that the current government does not understand the importance of tourism, and foreign capital

for thailand. And I also believe that Abhisit represents the absolute pinnacle of Thai leadership. Part of the problem

is the nature of Thai politics. It is a COMPLETELY dysfunctional system. . There are so many competing

parties, and they all have their base of support, and completely different agendas. Some are more xenophobic

than others. Some are more nationalist (the fabulously ignorant yellows and reds) than others. Some have more

awareness of the world than others. Certainly, as the tourism industry erodes, as more and more hotels,

restaurants, and tourism related businesses (such as Thai Airlines) start to fail, or continue to lose huge amounts

of money, even the nationalists will come to their senses. But, that may take awhile. One of the hardest things

for Thais to do is admit that they were wrong, or did not understand. Eventually, they may soften these silly

and ridiculous policies related to visas, land ownership, foreign ownership of businesses, etc. But, it will take

a major crisis, to force that change in policy. At this time, arrogance and an extreme lack of humility,

is Thailand's chief enemy.

[spidermike007]

Spalpeen is right on the money. If Thailand really worked hard t improve it's educational system, the country

would really see some improvement over time. I also know well educated Thai's, who have no idea what or

where Poland is. No idea about World War II. No idea about the fact that the world has seven continents. The

extreme lack of geography skills, knowledge of world history, geopolitical awareness is a huge impediment

for this nation, and contributes greatly to xenophobia, and fear of foreigners.

[bungy007]

Eventually she realized and said, "we're not going to see any waterfalls, are we?" Nope -- all the Thai waterfalls are just inside the entrances to national parks -- "som nam na" for being Thai and thinking that it's ok to price like this.

i feel sorry for your wife.

u think u made an impact with your little revolt

on the 10-20 baht an hour ticket stand workers?

the only one u affected was your wife

who spent 4 days in a car with you hoping

to see some waterfalls.

dont think of farang price

as a price hike for the farangs.

its a discount for the poor Thais

who would like to see the wonders

of their country.

Wow! Impressive spin. Thought about taking a job to bail out Gordon Brown? You are right - such a boycott would have had no impression on the muppets who control the park monopolies. They wouldn't even know where to begin to do the maths on how much revenue they loose by such myopic policies. I very much doubt if the point was missed by the Mrs. She can now see for her own eyes the barriers placed infront of her husband by her fellow Thais. It starts with education and now she has been educated she maywell pass it on.

Glad you feel sorry for his wife - perhaps your sorrow may push you to think about being more active/vocal in damming such blatant rascism

[judgedredd]

Well, I can only observe that the sort of behavior by the Thai Police (That I have just now witnessed today) is not helping the "battered tourist sector" - - I have just now witnessed some sort of special unit shake down today, Saturday, 20-June-2009, 11:30am, at the Siam BTS interchange station, of all places. They police were stopping every white-faced Falang and demanding to see his or her passport. (Japanese and other "ASEAN" visitors seemed to get a pass, with no problem) If the Falang victim was not carrying a passport, then he or she was apparently permitted to pay a "fine" and then go on their way. This is only my assumption, based on what I observed.

Police were stationed near the turnstile and ticketing area at the first level entrance into the Siam BTS sky train, at the end of the station that is immediately adjacent to Siam Paragon. I stood for approximately 30 minutes just outside the 7-11 kiosk and watched them work. In two cases I saw foreigners, who could not produce their passport, escorted into Paragon with one of the Police. In both cases, the foreigner and the cop walked back out from the building about ten minutes later, and the foreigner went on his way. We need not speculate what transpired during those 10 minutes or how much Thai baht changed hands.

I can only observe, that as the tourist-driven Thai economy spirals down into chaos, the Boys in Brown are scamming tourists even more than before. This sort of behavior used to be limited to street cons run by the Thonglor Police between Asoke and Phrom Phong, now I have just witnessed it up on a BTS platform.

I suppose that at the very least you should carry a photocopy of the photo page of your passport as well as copies of your current entry page and entry card, but you are probably safer if you carry your real original passport with you at all times.

Respectfully submitted,

Judge Dredd

[webfact]

Well, I can only observe that the sort of behavior by the Thai Police (That I have just now witnessed today) is not helping the "battered tourist sector" - - I have just now witnessed some sort of special unit shake down today, Saturday, 20-June-2009, 11:30am, at the Siam BTS interchange station, of all places. They police were stopping every white-faced Falang and demanding to see his or her passport. (Japanese and other "ASEAN" visitors seemed to get a pass, with no problem) If the Falang victim was not carrying a passport, then he or she was apparently permitted to pay a "fine" and then go on their way. This is only my assumption, based on what I observed.

Police were stationed near the turnstile and ticketing area at the first level entrance into the Siam BTS sky train, at the end of the station that is immediately adjacent to Siam Paragon. I stood for approximately 30 minutes just outside the 7-11 kiosk and watched them work. In two cases I saw foreigners, who could not produce their passport, escorted into Paragon with one of the Police. In both cases, the foreigner and the cop walked back out from the building about ten minutes later, and the foreigner went on his way. We need not speculate what transpired during those 10 minutes or how much Thai baht changed hands.

I can only observe, that as the tourist-driven Thai economy spirals down into chaos, the Boys in Brown are scamming tourists even more than before. This sort of behavior used to be limited to street cons run by the Thonglor Police between Asoke and Phrom Phong, now I have just witnessed it up on a BTS platform.

I suppose that at the very least you should carry a photocopy of the photo page of your passport as well as copies of your current entry page and entry card, but you are probably safer if you carry your real original passport with you at all times.

Respectfully submitted,

Judge Dredd

Maybe they were looking for somebody? BTS has a special branch police assigned. Random ID check is not uncommon!

/sentence deleted by webfact

Edited June 20, 2009 by webfact

[Somtamnication]

Big difference between random checks in the west and farang only checks at the BTS.

[Busy]

It appears that the figures are proving that you can't keep changing rules against the things that attract tourists. Lets have a look at some examples.

Bars are closed at 12 midnight instead of virtual open slather.

Bars are closed every time there is an election for anything.

Sales of liquor are restricted in Supermarkets and even shops at Bus stations for some unknown reason.

There is local prices and Farang prices (the mentality is that farangs have money???...I wonder if farang prices apply to all the rich Thais that drive around in Mercedes and BMW's etc??)...I don't think so.

Visa /extensions of stay rules are gradually being restrictive....compare Thai rules to Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore etc. where 3 month on arrival is the norm....they want people to stay in their countries and spend their holiday cash!!

The political unrest may have had a slight disruptive effect on some tourists but a lot of other countries have had similar.

It appears the Thai attitude is they don't like foreigners....they won't allow foreign land ownership..not much incentive for people to come and live here in Thailand!! well said.I'm not sticking around for the next thing to happen.I spend about 3-5 thousand BHT a day in Thailand on average and i know lots of people that spend more.It's not so much about the changes it's how they go about making the changes without any notice what so ever.For me it is just the principle of the matters.I opened a bussines on a marrage o visa.To get a work permit i needed 40,000 per month between my wife and i,and now this year without anynotice they told me i now need 4 thai worker and now need to pay tax on 50,000 not between my wife and i,but me alone has to pay tax on this amount.It's not to much about the money again, it's the principle.What is it going to be like the next time i renew my work permit.Everytime i go to the lawyers office for them to sort everthing out for me for my work permit it's like sitting in a hospital waiting for the bad news.

[Busy]

No large country (based on population) wants to be too reliant on tourism.

2005 tourism GDP:

Thailand 7.14%

Spain 4.70

Australia 2.81

Sweden 2.39

Italy 2.17

UK 1.79

China 1.42

Germany 1.37

South Korea 1.03

USA 0.99

Russia 0.96

Japan 0.34

Non-citizens should not expect to have the same privileges as a country's own citizens.

Well first of all if you are married to a citizen in the UK you are aloud citizenship.And in Thailand you have to apply for one that costs over 100,000BHT and it is only about a 5% chance you will get it.And you don't get your money back.

Eveybody in the world should be aloud equal right,who want to be a second class citizen or even a third class citizen.

And another thing you can own property in the counties above and land apart from Thailand.

You sound like a *** liberty taker!

You notice i put wrote stars, it must be a bad word.

[GungaDin]

The passport scam with the Thai police has been going on since 2003, some ask for 2000 bt. !!!

Webfact....... not today. It's a 100% scam!

[beechguy]

Amid all the many problems this country faces now it has also added an additional requrement to work visas. Previous work visas required a 2 minute visit with a doctor and if you looked healthy this was enough. Now a check for syphillis is requied. Not that it may not be a bad idea, but there seems to be a general unfriendly attitude to foreign workers with montains of paperwork even if like me, you are married to a Thai. Why make things even more difficult to work in a school in Thailand that needs English speakers to improve the communication skills of its citizens so it can be a more tourist friendly country? Is there a fear a farand will give a coworker VD?

It may be something they are enforcing more often, but I'm not sure it's a new requirement. There are some regulations concerning seven conditions or diseases, if I remember correctly.

Perhaps they should be concerned about the level of English we teach them.

[amerioca]

I have lived and worked in this confusing place for 30 months, and are coming here for years and will come for years to come, however, it is pretty obvious, if the authorities do not wake up and accept the fact that the numbers of visitors going down not only because of a mixture of political turbulence, global recession and the outbreak of global epidemics (even though these may be the most vital facts at the moment) but also out of the fact that they simply ignore the fact, that other countries , like the Phils, Vietnam and Indonesia also do have good service and most likely better cared of hotels, they will undoubtedly fall into an even bigger hole. I have taken part in one similar crisis in South America years ago and it took years to recover for the industry.

Little nonsense, like trying to throw a tipsy tourist into one of their hel_l holes for years for allegedly steeling a beer map, petty rip offs all over the place, specially in tourist areas, total lack of language capacities at even the largest hotels, lack of adequate transport facilities (still no decent taxis available in Pattaya or Phuket), overpricing tourists at street bars in Bangkok, 150THB charges on credit card withdrawals from public ATM's, complicated and expensive visa procedures for long term residents, etc. etc, etc. ....does the rest.

Not even talking about the fact that Thailand is far away from being a cheap tourist destination anymore. The price increases during the last recent years were obvious even for anyone only coming once per year. No country has to be cheap, in order to attract tourists, but if you charge, you have to deliver.

All these facts are supported by a far better information structure like internet, email, online newspapers, forums, bloggs etc. so that it takes physically only minutes to roll another screw up around the world.

The authorities have to wake up. We live in a globalized environment and also Thailand cannot exclude itself from it. (look at Iran!!!)You can not hide no more. Not only technology plays against you but also your own acts (or non acting or reacting).

Please....this is only facts, so I don't want to hear any bs like: Stay away if you don't like it. I have dealt with it in the past and are able deal with it in the future, but I am financially and otherwise prepared for impacts like this.

[beechguy]

Bad economy is the main reason.

Closing the airport is the other big reason. The persons who arranged for closing the airport should be put on trial, including the pooyai.

Visa problems are a big reason also. I can give one example. I know three people who earn a good living in Alaska. They have spent about 3-4 months in Thailand each year for the last 10 years or so. I was talking to one of them recently. He said now the entry visa (people on this website will know a lot more about it) is only for fifteen days!! Is that true?! He spends a ton of money on extended vacation in Thailand each year. Now he spends most of his time in Vietnam. His friends who used to go to Thailand are traveling elsewhere also.

Not exactly true, a U.S. citizen, along with about 39 other nationalities, can enter by air, an unlimited number of times, and receive free, 30 day "visa exempt" entries. Tourist visas are available by mail in the U.S., for $35 per entry, each entry 60 days, plus 30 day extensions are available for 1900 Baht. Also, tourist visas are available in neighboring countries, 1000 Baht per entry. It is true, without a visa, they would only receive 15 days when entering by land, limited to 4 entries between entries by air. That doesn't have anything to do with land entries with a visa.

That's part of the problem, people can't be bothered to check the facts.

Edited June 20, 2009 by beechguy

[Jingthing]

That's part of the problem, people can't be bothered to check the facts.

No, the problem is its too restrictive, complicated, and fast changing for average tourists. Countries that SINCERELY wish to welcome tourist from first world countries offer 3 or 6 month visa free tourist entries, no questions asked. The fact that Thailand doesn't is another proof of its inherit xenophobia.