Coffee Shops - Charging For Wifi

[newbie07]

I've had the experience of a couple of non-franchised coffee shops in/near the Hang Dong Rd area pointing out that after a set time period using Internet Wifi that there is now a service charge. For example, 25 baht per hour after 1 hour of Wifi use - or even if not actually connected to the Internet just for the electricity consumed. I spend a very significant amount of time on the Internet around a variety of coffee shops and it strikes me as an own goal. These places are never full when I'm there and I spend on refreshments. So it's not a case of maximising revenue per table per hour for a revolving door of constant customers. The signs seem to be in English only but I may be wrong. I don't choose to challenge their business models to extract extra revenue. It's their absolute right. This pricing is also common across the UK. The point is I just never return. There's currently so much choice around where owners are only too pleased for custom at no surcharge for extended use of Wifi. But just wondering what readers reckon and whether this type of surcharge is or might be a growing trend in Chiang Mai.

[KevinHunt]

I've had the experience of a couple of non-franchised coffee shops in/near the Hang Dong Rd area pointing out that after a set time period using Internet Wifi that there is now a service charge. For example, 25 baht per hour after 1 hour of Wifi use - or even if not actually connected to the Internet just for the electricity consumed. I spend a very significant amount of time on the Internet around a variety of coffee shops and it strikes me as an own goal. These places are never full when I'm there and I spend on refreshments. So it's not a case of maximising revenue per table per hour for a revolving door of constant customers. The signs seem to be in English only but I may be wrong. I don't choose to challenge their business models to extract extra revenue. It's their absolute right. This pricing is also common across the UK. The point is I just never return. There's currently so much choice around where owners are only too pleased for custom at no surcharge for extended use of Wifi. But just wondering what readers reckon and whether this type of surcharge is or might be a growing trend in Chiang Mai.

I'm sure there still are places where you can sit all day with your head buried in a computer, but personally, I wouldn't want those customers in my place, but that's a pub. Nothing to do with revenue, it's just that I find it irritating to have someone sitting there not socialising or interacting with anyone. Maybe that's what it is - it annoys the staff?

As rergards to the cost - who gives a monkeys about 25b per hour? Assuming you had one hour free, what are are you doing on your computer for so long? If it's work - find an office or do it at home, I say.

Edited August 4, 2009 by KevinHunt

[johnsjourney]

no idea, but let us know the best Wifi coffee shops in the Hang Dong Road area, especially down as far as Big C area if there are any.

Business models are being experimented with due to the changing times perhaps. There are more shops being built than I can understand could possibly make money, so customer's market.

It would be nice to be more sophisticated in my laziness and sit about somewhere without going as far as the Airport Plaza or city...

[Beacher]

I think the coffee shops are being generous giving you a free hour, and the 25 baht per hour after that is very reasonable.

It's exactly what I'd do to discourage the type of person that wants to sit there all day, possibly ordering a drink every couple of hours or so. I suspect they're rather happy that these type choose not to return.

Edited August 4, 2009 by Beacher

[Maccheroncini]

Wawee Coffee shops all branches always charge for all WIFI, very slow Internet connection.

[Paagai]

I've had the experience of a couple of non-franchised coffee shops in/near the Hang Dong Rd area pointing out that after a set time period using Internet Wifi that there is now a service charge. For example, 25 baht per hour after 1 hour of Wifi use - or even if not actually connected to the Internet just for the electricity consumed. I spend a very significant amount of time on the Internet around a variety of coffee shops and it strikes me as an own goal. These places are never full when I'm there and I spend on refreshments. So it's not a case of maximising revenue per table per hour for a revolving door of constant customers. The signs seem to be in English only but I may be wrong. I don't choose to challenge their business models to extract extra revenue. It's their absolute right. This pricing is also common across the UK. The point is I just never return. There's currently so much choice around where owners are only too pleased for custom at no surcharge for extended use of Wifi. But just wondering what readers reckon and whether this type of surcharge is or might be a growing trend in Chiang Mai.

Cheap Charlie

I hate it when I go with several people to a coffee shop and the only decent sized tables are taken up by single farangs with laptop and papers spread everywhere like they are there for the day, drinking a single cup of coffee Whereas customers who are gonna spend a decent amount of cash end up with four people huddled around a table for two. Seems to happen often in CM

You should take the 25Bt as a hint: "it's time to leave!"

[KevinHunt]

I've had the experience of a couple of non-franchised coffee shops in/near the Hang Dong Rd area pointing out that after a set time period using Internet Wifi that there is now a service charge. For example, 25 baht per hour after 1 hour of Wifi use - or even if not actually connected to the Internet just for the electricity consumed. I spend a very significant amount of time on the Internet around a variety of coffee shops and it strikes me as an own goal. These places are never full when I'm there and I spend on refreshments. So it's not a case of maximising revenue per table per hour for a revolving door of constant customers. The signs seem to be in English only but I may be wrong. I don't choose to challenge their business models to extract extra revenue. It's their absolute right. This pricing is also common across the UK. The point is I just never return. There's currently so much choice around where owners are only too pleased for custom at no surcharge for extended use of Wifi. But just wondering what readers reckon and whether this type of surcharge is or might be a growing trend in Chiang Mai.

If you said that you spent a very significant amount of money, it would be an own goal. As it is, it looks more like a dis-allowed goal (possibly off-side).

Just out of curiosity, how much per hour do you spend in these places, normally? Just so we know how big a loss to these businesses you are.

What is the relevance of the 'English only' satement? Are the French, Germans and Belgians(God bless 'em) excluded from this rule? 

[Maejo Man]

Coffee shops are as the name implies, there to serve coffee. Think yourself lucky they extend the courtesy of an hours free WI-Fi.

I don't go to a coffee shop to have people like you clogging up the space

[Drew Aitch]

Sometimes, especially in desperate times, a food and beverage business needs people on its premises to make the place look half way popular. I mean, how many times have you been pondering for somewhere to grab a bite to eat or get a coffee etc, and when peer through the window or stick your head in the door, the place is dead, i.e. void of anyone? It might look nice inside, but customers add a bit of atmosphere to a joint, and so can make a place more appealing, even if the cheapskates themselves aren't putting much in the till.

All that said, if I personally owned a coffee shop and the same faces came in day after day, sucking off my electricity, relaxing in my air con, while at the same time begrudgingly nurturing a single cup of coffee for hours and potentially taking up the seat of a more profitable customer, I'd probably ask them to order more or sod off! But then again, I'm not the best business brain on the planet!

My father used to own a newsagents in the center of his home town, and every day this same bloke used to come in and browse through the all the newspapers for about an hour or so and then leave without as much as a packet of chewing gum. One day, my youngest sister had had enough and went up to him and handed the cheapskate a of scrap paper. "What's this?" he grunted. "It's a simple map giving directions to the local library", she said. "What are you giving this to me for?" he snapped. She told him that he'd obviously mistaken this newsagent for the local library and said something along the lines of, "If I ever catch you taking up floor space in here again, reading what everyone else is happy to pay us for, then I'll have your guts for garters! Now BUGGER OFF and don't let me see you back in here ever again!

I guess the moral of the story is that many a business is welcoming and tolerant to a degree, but if you abuse their hospitality and take the p*ss, then you might just be made to feel unwelcome, and quite rightly so!

If it's work - find an office

If someone nurtures a café latte at 55 Baht and sits in a comfortable environment for 4 hours catching up on their work, that equates out at just 13.75 per hour. You can see the attraction of using such places as a personal office

Aitch

[toptuan]

Bangkok Starbucks shops charge anywhere from 150B to 300B per hour for Wi-Fi use.

You're spoiled!

[bojo]

Our cafe in Koh Samui has free wifi, it's a selling point and no-one has ever abused it, but the mind set of foreigners in Chiang Mai, both residents and tourists is different as are generally, their disposable incomes.

Regards Bojo

[johnsjourney]

I think we're talking out of the city where space isn't a premium. They've got to keep the flow rate high in the central areas for sure. Personally I can't remember using Wifi more than once in Chiang Mai, but it's nice to know it's there.

[KevinHunt]

....I'm not the best business brain on the planet!

 I'd probably ask them to order more or sod off!

.. my youngest sister .. said  ".. BUGGER OFF !

Aitch

Which part of Northern England are you from? What would be your policy on 'Riff Raff' and are you (or your sister) looking for a job? 

[Gonzo the Face]

What about a program like wifi is free , but there is an hourly spending minimum for food , beverage, etc, set at what you would like , say 200 baht per hour.

Sit there all day if you like and free wifi, but there is the hourly minimum charge . If you sat there for 4 hours and only consumed 500 baht for food and beer or coffee, that at the your check out at the end of 4 hours you get a bill for 800 baht. So you make sure you eat and drink to the minimum.

There are too many of the cheap charlies around milking the system for anything that is good for them and to hel_l with the business or anyone else.

the always comment..... but.... but..... but , I'm on a round the world tour for 2 years. and the answer, and I have given this answer to more than one world class CC. I'm not your father, or your family. If you cannot afford the trip, don't look to me to subsidize you. If you cannot afford it, go home and get a job.

May not be good business practice, but it sure does make you feel good inside.

Another good suggestion to the WCCC, " You see that sign out front,,,,,,, It doesn't say Salvation Army....... this is a business that is trying to be fair to all customers including you."

Edited August 4, 2009 by Gonzo the Face

[Ulysses G.]

A used bookshop in Bangkok made a big deal about having baked goods, coffee and WIFI when they first opened and got all kinds of publicity. However, the owner has a blog on his website and all he does is whine about customers coming in and setting up a computer and sitting around not buying anything (other then one cup of coffee which they usually spill all over the books that they have taken offf the shelves to peruse).

I love to read all of his complaints and rejoice that I never resorted to anything that desperate.

Edited August 4, 2009 by Ulysses G.

[KevinHunt]

What about a program like wifi is free , but there is an hourly spending minimum for food , beverage, etc, set at what you would like , say 200 baht per hour.

I do that occasionally for late night Champions league games and such. If I think it is worth staying open and risking the ire of the local BIB, I have a minimum charge of 200 baht. If you want to watch a big game, late,  and sip a small beer for the two hours it takes then it will cost you 200 baht. Two large beers will cost 220 baht, so it's up to you. But, if you aren't prepared to spend 100 baht per hour you should find somewhere else. Part of the problem was also the fact that by 2am, some people are already tanked up and don't want to drink as much.

I stayed open for the Arsenal Champions League Final a few years back and had only 4 or 5 people who ordered a small beer each and at half time one of them very reluctantly ordered a second one. Not surprisingly, I decided that it wasn't worth it, so next time the New Rules applied.

One or two didn't go along with it but most people were quite understanding. Personally, I find it hard to believe that someone would miss such a big game for such a trivial amount.

[Nash]

haha the ol' free wifi debate.

Using the internet is quite different from reading books for free in a bookstore. You aren't going to break the spine of the internet or smudge up the pages are you? You aren't going to be occupying or consuming something someone else could buy, are you?

I wonder if shop owners in Asia back in the early 1900's used to run folks out of their teahouses for reading too long...

I mean, if they were taking advantage of the electric lights, the shop owners should run those "cheap charlies" out for using too much light.

Hopefully when the fogeys who post in this forum are too senile to manage their pubs and restaurants, kicking a paying customer out for using too much internet on an open WiFi network will be as laughable for kicking a paying customer out for using too much light.

If you are that fanatical about having 1 or 2 losers camping in your establishment, spend 150 baht down at panteep plaza on the software you need to control your network. It's quite easy to set a blanket bandwidth/time allotment for your customers. If you have an open network, people are going to use it, period. Don't invest in the technology and advertise it to help boost business if you aren't going to learn how to use it... and definitely don't complain if people abuse your wide open network because you are too incompetent or lazy to stop them without resorting to being an inhospitable, fussy A-hole.

Who is really the cheap charlie?? It's a customers market, as another poster mentioned. I don't understand why any business would do anything to alienate even a single paying customer. Then again, I don't understand why there so many failed pubs for sale in CM by bitter old farangs... perhaps the two are related.

[garyh]

You should go to places in Europe where you have to pay to sit down, do you know you can get internet with you mobile phone for not much money, maybe the coffee shops want to be rid of Kee Nok Farang!

[IanForbes]

I don't see a problem charging for Wifi. If you are using a table at a coffee shop for more than an hour then you should be eating or drinking something more than just one coffee. Many MacDonalds shops in the US offer limited time Wifi with the price of a burger. That's reasonable.

[Paagai]

You should go to places in Europe where you have to pay to sit down, do you know you can get internet with you mobile phone for not much money, maybe the coffee shops want to be rid of Kee Nok Farang!

But there are coffee shops in one place in Europe that sell more than just coffee and the punters can sit there all day just staring into space

[Chunkton]

I think the coffee shops are being generous giving you a free hour, and the 25 baht per hour after that is very reasonable.

It's exactly what I'd do to discourage the type of person that wants to sit there all day, possibly ordering a drink every couple of hours or so. I suspect they're rather happy that these type choose not to return.

Would totally agree with the above post. Reasonable access is fine but not as a free alternative for people too cheap to install internet access at home.

[Chunkton]

haha the ol' free wifi debate.

Using the internet is quite different from reading books for free in a bookstore. You aren't going to break the spine of the internet or smudge up the pages are you? You aren't going to be occupying or consuming something someone else could buy, are you?

I wonder if shop owners in Asia back in the early 1900's used to run folks out of their teahouses for reading too long...

I mean, if they were taking advantage of the electric lights, the shop owners should run those "cheap charlies" out for using too much light.

Hopefully when the fogeys who post in this forum are too senile to manage their pubs and restaurants, kicking a paying customer out for using too much internet on an open WiFi network will be as laughable for kicking a paying customer out for using too much light.

If you are that fanatical about having 1 or 2 losers camping in your establishment, spend 150 baht down at panteep plaza on the software you need to control your network. It's quite easy to set a blanket bandwidth/time allotment for your customers. If you have an open network, people are going to use it, period. Don't invest in the technology and advertise it to help boost business if you aren't going to learn how to use it... and definitely don't complain if people abuse your wide open network because you are too incompetent or lazy to stop them without resorting to being an inhospitable, fussy A-hole.

Who is really the cheap charlie?? It's a customers market, as another poster mentioned. I don't understand why any business would do anything to alienate even a single paying customer. Then again, I don't understand why there so many failed pubs for sale in CM by bitter old farangs... perhaps the two are related.

One can only assume that you must run a business yourself handing out freebies to freeloaders? Or perchance are you just a tightwad "customer" looking for freebies?

[Ulysses G.]

I don't understand why there so many failed pubs for sale in CM by bitter old farangs...

We had to walk 10 miles through the snow wearing flipflops to get free WIFI when I was your age!

[fred2007]

Coffee shops are as the name implies, there to serve coffee. Think yourself lucky they extend the courtesy of an hours free WI-Fi.

I don't go to a coffee shop to have people like you clogging up the space

Absolutely right get your own PC

[Donnyboy]

I don't understand why there so many failed pubs for sale in CM by bitter old farangs...

We had to walk 10 miles through the snow wearing flipflops to get free WIFI when I was your age!

and a virus on yr floppy meant something else too

[Ulysses G.]

I don't understand why there so many failed pubs for sale in CM by bitter old farangs...

We had to walk 10 miles through the snow wearing flipflops to get free WIFI when I was your age!

and a virus on yr floppy meant something else too

Course they fixed all that when they came out with penicillin.

[venturalaw]

I've had the experience of a couple of non-franchised coffee shops in/near the Hang Dong Rd area pointing out that after a set time period using Internet Wifi that there is now a service charge. For example, 25 baht per hour after 1 hour of Wifi use - or even if not actually connected to the Internet just for the electricity consumed. I spend a very significant amount of time on the Internet around a variety of coffee shops and it strikes me as an own goal. These places are never full when I'm there and I spend on refreshments. So it's not a case of maximising revenue per table per hour for a revolving door of constant customers. The signs seem to be in English only but I may be wrong. I don't choose to challenge their business models to extract extra revenue. It's their absolute right. This pricing is also common across the UK. The point is I just never return. There's currently so much choice around where owners are only too pleased for custom at no surcharge for extended use of Wifi. But just wondering what readers reckon and whether this type of surcharge is or might be a growing trend in Chiang Mai.

Chiang Mai Coffee in the DK Bookstore center is my favorite coffee shop not for the Wifi, but for the coffee AND that Wifi is available for free if I want to use it (which happens about 1 out of 10 visits). It's an added perk as far as I'm concerned. The coffee is excellent, deserts are good, it has a nostalgic atmosphere, and if I have work I can bring my laptop.

[cmjantje]

I really love these answers... The OP is,like some told, a cheap Charly

[Paagai]

Then again, I don't understand why there so many failed pubs for sale in CM by bitter old farangs... perhaps the two are related.

It appears you don't understand much of anything

[IanForbes]

Course they fixed all that when they came out with penicillin.

Yes, but some of us were around BEFORE there even was penicillin.

Occasionally, when the so called "fast" internet service that I PAY FOR at my hotel craps out, I have to go to a cafe or one of the other internet providers. I seldom stay more than an hour and certainly don't mind paying a reasonable fee. In Pattaya it can vary between 50 baht an hour up to 250 baht and hour. Phuket is just as bad or worse. I've never paid more than 40 baht an hour in Chiang Mai.