Shocked At Boots Pharmacy" Today

[AleG]

I seem to remember reading Shark numbers are at an all time low and they may become an endangered species soon.

I stopped eating Shark as a result.

Correct me if I am wrong....

For what it's worth, I have around 40 logged dives in Thailand and I've only seen one single shark way out in the Andaman Sea.

The shark populations in Thai waters seem to have been decimated.

[Harcourt]

What is the difference between catching shark to eat, than catching mullet, mackerel or cod - incedently Boots sell fish oil pills as well....

The problems are many!

First, as a purely practical matter, shark populations are being depleted in many of the oceans of the world. For this environmental reason alone, sharks should not be caught for human food or medicinal consumption. There are likely to be unforeseen consequences on the oceanic food chain when the numbers of an apex predator like sharks are removed from the environment.

In addition, being a non-farmed fish species, it would be very easy for shark populations to be essentially eliminated (go extinct) from human over-fishing. On moral grounds alone, I believe most people would be against the fishing and consumption of shark for this reason as well.

Finally, the method of fishing for sharks is cruel in the extreme. Most of the demand for sharks is for their fins only (the market for shark meat itself, internal organs, or the skin is very small by comparison). Therefore, most sharks are "finned (fins cut off)" on board the boat while still alive and then tossed back into the ocean, to die a slow and painful death (or be attacked by other predators). This method of "hunting" would be equivalent to netting a deer and subduing it and then cutting off its legs and then just leaving it there to die; or to use a domestic example, cutting off the legs of a beef-cow and leaving it on the ground to die.

As for some mentioning cod (or fish) liver oils being sold as well, yes, there are serious environmental consequences to this as well...as the greatly diminished cod stocks in northern Europe attest to. At least conservation and sustainable fishing management plans can be and are in effect for this and other fish species. Unfortunately, this is not the case for sharks. In addition, at least the case can be made that in the case of cod, the whole fish is consumed so that at least there is little waste.

I agree that finning is a deplorable and extremely cruel practice that should be banned.

However, I think your outrage is misdirected when you target the pharmacy. By very definition, the boats that practice finning do not collect cartilage therefore these shark products at the pharmacy do not come from finned sharks.

You are not quite correct when you say that sharks are not part of conservation efforts. Some shark species (the endangered species) are protected. For example, even the man-eating great white is protected in South Africa and Australia.

[Brigante7]

I was in my local branch of Boots "Pharmacy" today and noticed that in amongst the vitamin and mineral supplements section were bottles of SHARK CARTILAGE capsules

It's obscene enough that we have to put up with Shark's fin soup at every Chinese restaurant in the Kingdom and many Thai places as well but to have a reputable "pharmacy" like Boots selling quack supplements like ground-up shark cartilage powder in capsule form is too much to accept. Sharks are beautiful and graceful apex predators that have been on the earth for hundreds of millions of years and are slowly being wiped-out in many of the world's oceans to supply the soup bowls of Chinese around the world and the pseudo-medicinal medicine trade.

There is no therapeutic value to taking shark supplements, and even if there were, it would not justify the taking of them from the oceans. I urge anyone who cares about the environment, our seas, and corporate social responsibility to call, email, or write to Boots in both Thailand and the UK (and to post this information on other websites and forums) to alert others to this outrage and shame Boots Thailand into removing this product from their shelves!

I am sure Boots would NEVER dare to sell such quack remedies in Europe or America (probably illegal anyway) and they should not do so in Asia as well (despite whatever the cultural meme may be over here).

I'm sorry to hear of your predicament PattayaBunLover but let me ask you this, how do you know that the capsules really contain SHARK CARTILAGE, because it says so? Never believe most of what you read or are told, I once met a lovely girl in a bar who told me that she only went there 1 or 2 nights a month, I was heartbroken when I found out she wasn't telling the truth and was there 7 nights a week.

Brigante7.

[Naam]

I dont know is the OP serious?

I think so...... .....The OP may also may be shocked to know, that that a lot of cosmetics sold in Boots in the UK and Thailand contain placenta, and they sell Cod liver Oil....!!!!...oh no.....the poor cods....stuff the sharks, they dont make good fish and chips...

Think the OP has far too much time on their hands...

[Patsycat]

My mum used to force a big spoonful of that horrible stuff down my throat every morning when I was a kid - plus malt extract. Yuck.

[onlycw]

A traveling biker photographed what I fear might be a young tiger or other endangered large cat being slaughtered.

The photo is not clear. But it got me worked up.

Not sure if that was in Thailand or Laos, probably the latter.

Hope I am not violating copyright by uploading it.

I would think anyone doing this to an endangered species in public might face years in jail!

I understand the OP. He likes sharks, I like all cats!

[LooseCannon]

........

You are not quite correct when you say that sharks are not part of conservation efforts. Some shark species (the endangered species) are protected. For example, even the man-eating great white is protected in South Africa and Australia.

I don't know about S.Africa but in Australia if a shark (& especially a Great White) attacks a human it is hunted down & killed.

[LooseCannon]

I was in my local branch of Boots "Pharmacy" today and noticed that in amongst the vitamin and mineral supplements section were bottles of SHARK CARTILAGE capsules

........

I trust when you recovered from your state of shock you immediately voiced your concerns in no uncertain terms to the 'checkout chick' & if you did not get a satisfactory response you then escalated your complaint to her supervisor & ultimately to the store manager.

[Harcourt]

........

You are not quite correct when you say that sharks are not part of conservation efforts. Some shark species (the endangered species) are protected. For example, even the man-eating great white is protected in South Africa and Australia.

I don't know about S.Africa but in Australia if a shark (& especially a Great White) attacks a human it is hunted down & killed.

I think you are wrong, especially about the "especially" part. They are a protected species. Specific man-eating individuals may fall outside the protection (but I doubt it), but I think even they have to be serial killers before anything is done.

I did a bit of googling before refuting you....interestingly for this thread, the trade in white pointer parts (including cartilage) is banned internationally...and that CITES agreement was signed in Thailand in 2004.

Edited September 20, 2009 by Harcourt

[LooseCannon]

........

You are not quite correct when you say that sharks are not part of conservation efforts. Some shark species (the endangered species) are protected. For example, even the man-eating great white is protected in South Africa and Australia.

I don't know about S.Africa but in Australia if a shark (& especially a Great White) attacks a human it is hunted down & killed.

I think you are wrong, especially about the "especially" part. They are a protected species. Specific man-eating individuals may fall outside the protection (but I doubt it), but I think even they have to be serial killers before anything is done.

I did a bit of googling before refuting you....interestingly for this thread, the trade in white pointer parts (including cartilage) is banned internationally...and that CITES agreement was signed in Thailand in 2004.

I am not saying that they are not a protected species - I am saying that they are hunted down & killed if they have attacked a human. Of course not all all are killed but this is because they manage to elude the hunters.

[JSixpack]

So here we have mean old fart trying to deprive dying cancer patients of their last hope and comfort--their placebo--under the mantle of high moral ground.

Silly politically correct brainwashing.

[bonobo]

Because it was once thought that sharks do not get cancer, their cartilage must have cancer-fighting powers.  When no studies were published in peer-reviewd studies to support this, other health claims started to pop up. (One study was done at the Mayo clinic, and the subjects who took the pills actually fared worse, possibly from the high level of mercury in sharks.) And now, cancer has been found in sharks, so that sort of takes the wind out of those sails.

The claim is that shark cartilage contains mucopolysaccharides, and those have all sorts of health benefits.  However, the same mucopolysaccharides are found in many forms of cartilage, to include the bovine.

Shark cartilage pills are found worldwide.  You can find them in WalMart in the US, for example.

Another thing to note is that the pills are not 100% cartilage.  There is a pretty small amount of cartilage in each pill.  The rest of the pill in in  binders and the like.

Regardless, the pills are almost undoubtedly a huge waste of money, and if any sharks are harvested specifically to obtain the cartilage, then that is contributing to the huge depletion in shark populations.

[pigh123]

........

You are not quite correct when you say that sharks are not part of conservation efforts. Some shark species (the endangered species) are protected. For example, even the man-eating great white is protected in South Africa and Australia.

I don't know about S.Africa but in Australia if a shark (& especially a Great White) attacks a human it is hunted down & killed.

Yes hunted by a minority of idiots

But not supported at all by the majority of Aussies

You enter into there world, you be prepared. A surfer friend of mine was attacked and almost lost his leg, he couldnt believe it when a group of people talked about hunting down the shark. And he still surfs the same beach today

[jackr]

Yep, it is pretty sick to be slaughtering these creatures for shit like this, or for anything for that matter. This place will be so much better off when we're wiped out - or at the least China, Japan and Norway.

[pigh123]

Yep, it is pretty sick to be slaughtering these creatures for shit like this, or for anything for that matter. This place will be so much better off when we're wiped out - or at the least China, Japan and Norway.

Dont mention Japan, people on here might start saying how its fine to be killing off wales

[Daewoo]

As posted above, shark finning is a disgraceful, disgusting, abomination of human decency, driven by Chinese nationals and their descendants throughout the world...

In a way not too dissimilar to things that happen in Thailand... for nothing more that a showing 'face'... rich Chinese would put very expensive Shark Fin Soup on the menu at particularly important events... now of course, with so many Chinese rich enough to afford Shark Fin Soup, even for low class families this horrible broth it is a 'must have' at every wedding... for everyone else, it is as common as chicken soup... many nationalities, not just Chinese flagged ships, de-fin and abandon live sharks (Indonesia is allegedly the worst)... Many other countries, like Australia, allow controlled fishing of shark (some species are protected, so they can't target them, or fish in certain areas where they are known the breed)... and allow the sale of the fins, as well as the rest of the animal...

Hopefully the 'common-ness' of shark fin soup will soon be it's own end, because there will no longer be any 'face' to be gained by serving it... Hopefully that is before all shark species are extinct...

Beyond shark fining, (and the resultant decimation of almost all species of sharks in wide areas of the worlds oceans, which may give the OPs desire to see shark fishing cease some weight), there is no reason sharks should receive any better status than cod... or Dolphins, or Whales... Just because something is bigger doesn't make it better (as I tell all the girls )...

At least Shark Cartilage Capsules (also freely available in Australia) provide some purportedly valid purpose (joint pain relief) and are taken as a by-product form the normal slaughter of a whole animal... not some stupid Chinese mind-f^ck of "Oh, it's very rare, it must be good for keeping your pecker up"...

My 2 satang work anyway...

Cheers,

Daewoo

[MrHammer]

Shark cartilage has no proven medical value.

However, the shark cartilage is a much different situation than shark fin.  With shark fin, sharks are netted in huge numbers, pulled aboard, and de-finned.  The still living shark is dropped off into the ocean to die.  By not harvesting the meat, the boats, almost exclusively Chinese-flagged boats, can fit more fins on board.  Shark finning is widely identified why most shark populations are at 10% of what they were even 50 years ago.

The cartilage used to make the pills come from sharks which have been harvested for their meat.  Much of this comes from Mexico where villagers hook and land sharks in small boats. Villagers have been doing this for hundreds of years without affecting shark populations, and if the cartilage was not used for pills, it would mostly be ground up as processing waste. 

The pills are most likely useless, but they also most likely have no significant environmental effect on shark populations.

The only things who have proven medical value in the West are those that can be patented.

[bonobo]

Shark cartilage has no proven medical value.

However, the shark cartilage is a much different situation than shark fin.  With shark fin, sharks are netted in huge numbers, pulled aboard, and de-finned.  The still living shark is dropped off into the ocean to die.  By not harvesting the meat, the boats, almost exclusively Chinese-flagged boats, can fit more fins on board.  Shark finning is widely identified why most shark populations are at 10% of what they were even 50 years ago.

The cartilage used to make the pills come from sharks which have been harvested for their meat.  Much of this comes from Mexico where villagers hook and land sharks in small boats. Villagers have been doing this for hundreds of years without affecting shark populations, and if the cartilage was not used for pills, it would mostly be ground up as processing waste. 

The pills are most likely useless, but they also most likely have no significant environmental effect on shark populations.

The only things who have proven medical value in the West are those that can be patented.

That is a very cynical view.  The AMA has given medical credence to many, many substances which cannot be patented, to include chicken soup, for example. And it has recommended that many patented products be taken off the market due to adverse side-effects or studies showing the products have no beneficial effect.. 

[thecas]

I was searching for Chondroitin pills. The sales girl told me they did not have any, and passed me this very shark cartilage we are talking about here. I have no idea whether the pills do in fact contain Chondroitin.

[rucus7]

I am sure Boots would NEVER dare to sell such quack remedies in Europe or America (probably illegal anyway) and they should not do so in Asia as well (despite whatever the cultural meme may be over here).

Shark cartilage has been readily available in America for at least 15 years. My understanding is that double blind testing is inconclusive

[soundman]

A study into shark farming and sustainable natural yields. Here.

For pictures of the shark farm near Koh Samet, GIYF.

[ScubaBuddha]

Do you also close your eyes as you push your shopping cart past the seafood section at Foodland?

Do they sell sharks?

[ScubaBuddha]

Wow the level of arrogant ignorance is staggering in this thread. (But what should I expect, really)

The worst thing about this is that the cartilage does nothing to prevent cancer or alleviate pain or anything. Various studies have confirmed this. It's a complete scam. Pharmaceutical companies have gotten in trouble for labeling it as an anti-cancer treatment.

And as for the finning of sharks for shark fin soup, it is believed to be the primary cause of the reduction of many species of sharks, by up to 90%. It is a HUGE problem. You won't find shark fin soup in Phuket as often as you used to, thanks partly to the actions of a few environmentally responsible expats a few years back that helped educate the restaurant owners.

Sad really, the apathy shown by some board members here. Indicative of the lack of education out there. I'm glad there seem to be a greater number of expats living here that actually give a shit about the world they live in. For the rest of you, I hear Cambodia is nice.

[Heng]

Do you also close your eyes as you push your shopping cart past the seafood section at Foodland?

Do they sell sharks?

They sell fish. Or do they not deserve the sympathy you feel 'shark fish' do just because they don't look as cool?

[Jingthing]

I am against finning but am not instead eating shark steaks (but I don't like the taste anyway). I am not clear of the relation of the cartilage to the finning. Are you?

[Flatouthruthefog]

Wow the level of arrogant ignorance is staggering in this thread. (But what should I expect, really)

The worst thing about this is that the cartilage does nothing to prevent cancer or alleviate pain or anything. Various studies have confirmed this. It's a complete scam. Pharmaceutical companies have gotten in trouble for labeling it as an anti-cancer treatment.

And as for the finning of sharks for shark fin soup, it is believed to be the primary cause of the reduction of many species of sharks, by up to 90%. It is a HUGE problem. You won't find shark fin soup in Phuket as often as you used to, thanks partly to the actions of a few environmentally responsible expats a few years back that helped educate the restaurant owners.

Sad really, the apathy shown by some board members here. Indicative of the lack of education out there. I'm glad there seem to be a greater number of expats living here that actually give a shit about the world they live in. For the rest of you, I hear Cambodia is nice.

Congrats to you and to the OP. The zero standard of debate, ignorance, apathy and general 'smart assedness' here is barely credible. (It is very SLIGHTLY credible, as almost every serious thread here on tv seems to sink to similar levels of dross after about the 4th post).

If any of the posters here who disagree with Scuba and the OP have children or grandchildren, do them a favour here and now. Start to think how you'd describe a shark to them - some years down the line after the last one has had its fins ripped off and been tossed back into the ocean.

To feed and even to breath, a shark must keep planing forwards through the ocean. They cannot swim backwards, even with all fins intact. 'Hovering' is rare. After being maimed, they will hang there in the water, suffocating, being eaten alive, very slowly, by smaller creatures.

If you want to buy this useless, profiteering rubbish, from Boots or whoever, maybe you'd give that a thought first, huh? In this context, Boots make me ashamed to be British.

Or are the world's last sharks "just fish looking for some chips"?

The decision, the attitude, and the future of the shark, rests with YOU!

[Jingthing]

profiteering rubbish

I don't think Boots is there for their health. Caveat emptor for anything you buy, there, or anywhere. Some supplements do have health benefits, but you are right, shops selling this stuff mostly care about selling the stuff.

Edited September 28, 2009 by Jingthing

[Heng]

Sounds rather dramatic. It'd be a lot be easier to just have them watch some National Geographic.

[mahtin]

Sounds rather dramatic. It'd be a lot be easier to just have them watch some National Geographic.

Good idea. Give the girls something interesting to watch.

[Heng]