Moving Thai Gold Bars To Usa

[SNGLIFE]

If you have experience taking quantities of Thai gold bars (of the 5 and 10 baht variety) into the US, did you HAVE to declare or did you walk on through?

First of all, for those chomping at the bit to toss out an uneducated answer, US Customs regulations do NOT classify gold bars as currency, so the $US 10,000 rule does not apply.

Past HTSUS rulings classify gold bars under the following headings:

7108.13 - Gold unwrought or in semi-manufactured forms

7114.19.00 - Articles of goldsmiths' or silversmiths' wares of precious metal or clad with special metal

7115.90 - Other articles of precious metal or clad with precious metal

(see pages 14-18)

1. As evidenced in the link, Customs rulings vary; and often the same issue can be treated differently depending on the subjectivity of the person writing the ruling.

2. These rulings address whether or not tariffs should apply when declared, not whether or not the bars MUST be declared.

3. The HTSUS sub-sections address gold bars having in excess of 99.5% purity. Thai gold bars are 96.5% purity, and thus there appears to be a loophole for how Thai gold can be treated.

I do not have time to get a ruling myself and the Customs reps available by phone are clueless. Replies from those with actual experience are greatly appreciated in advance!

[Naam]

US Customs regulations do NOT classify gold bars as currency, so the $US 10,000 rule does not apply

the USD 10k in/out declaration rule does not apply to currency only but to any monetary instrument!. if you think your gold bars are not monetary instruments go ahead and weep.

[flying]

my understanding from previous reading is that gold coins would fall under that category of monetary instrument but bullion would not.

Considerations

# Travelers leaving or entering the U.S. with more than $10,000 are required to fill out a Report of International Transportation of Currency or Monetary Instruments (form FinCEN 105). Information on this form is reported to the IRS, which will decide whether or not these funds are considered income and whether taxes or duties are due. Gold bullion does not need to be reported on this form. You can obtain this form online in advance from the CBP or get one as you pass through Customs and Immigration.

[SNGLIFE]

US Customs regulations do NOT classify gold bars as currency, so the $US 10,000 rule does not apply

the USD 10k in/out declaration rule does not apply to currency only but to any monetary instrument!. if you think your gold bars are not monetary instruments go ahead and weep.

Sorry, but you are dead wrong with respect to gold bars. Gold coins and such are subject to the $10,000 rule. Gold has many uses. In raw (bar) form, it is classified as a precious metal. Had you read the link I provided, you would know that before posting...reading is fundamental...

[gotlost]

Since you seem not to take any advise and only want a conformation of your thoughts the only advise I can give you is from Clint Eastwood.....'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?

[Naam]

US Customs regulations do NOT classify gold bars as currency, so the $US 10,000 rule does not apply

the USD 10k in/out declaration rule does not apply to currency only but to any monetary instrument!. if you think your gold bars are not monetary instruments go ahead and weep.

Sorry, but you are dead wrong with respect to gold bars. Gold coins and such are subject to the $10,000 rule. Gold has many uses. In raw (bar) form, it is classified as a precious metal. Had you read the link I provided, you would know that before posting...reading is fundamental...

and so is logical thinking if you are so sure that gold bars are not monetary/negotiable instruments why did you ask the question in your opening posting?

[jazzbo]

If you have experience taking quantities of Thai gold bars (of the 5 and 10 baht variety) into the US, did you HAVE to declare or did you walk on through?

If Baht gold Bars not required to be declared as currency, then, from the standard U.S. Customs and Border Protection Declaration Form 6059B:

Each individual arriving into the United States must complete the CBP

Declaration

Form 6059B.

15. If you are a U.S. resident, print the total value of all goods (including commercial merchandise) you or any family members traveling with you have purchased or acquired abroad (including gifts for someone else, but not items mailed to the United States) and are bringing into the United States.

Note: U.S. residents are normally entitled to a duty-free exemption of $800 on items accompanying them.

[Tywais]

Question

What constitutes "Negotiable Monetary Instruments" for currency reporting requirements?

Answer

Negotiable monetary instruments that must be reported by travelers or persons sending or receiving them (other then by electronic means by a banking concern) are:

1. Coin or currency from the U.S. and/or other countries, including gold coins;

2. Travelers Checks;

3. Checks, promissary notes or money orders that can be cashed by the bearer. This includes checks or money orders made out to someone other than the bearer that are endorsed without restriction(i.e. for deposit only.), and incomplete checks, money orders, promissary notes that are signed but on which the name of the payee has been omitted (the "To" line is left blank);

4. Securities or stocks in bearer form.

Monetary instruments that are made payable to a named person but are not endorsed or which bear restrictive endorsements are not subject to reporting requirements, nor are credit cards with credit lines of over $10,000.

Gold Bullion is not a monetary instrument for purposes of this requirement. You can obtain the currency reporting form FinCEN 105 for more information.

Source: CPB.Gov

[lannarebirth]

So, as the bars are not subject to currency restrictions, the question remains, if purchased outside the US, is duty levied, and if so at what rate?

[jazzbo]

http://www.usitc.gov/publications/docs/tat...ter/0911C71.pdf

7108 Gold (including gold plated with platinum) unwrought or in

semimanufactured forms, or in powder form:

[flying]

So, as the bars are not subject to currency restrictions, the question remains, if purchased outside the US, is duty levied, and if so at what rate?

Interesting thought since none ever claim jewelry.

[gregb]

SNGLIFE is correct. Bullion is not treated as money in the US. Gold must be clearly marked with a face value in order to be considered currency.

Otherwise, it is treated just like jewellery and must be declared at full value.

However, there is no duty on gold, so it is just a matter of letting the US government know that you are a terrorist and don't like their fiat notes. Aside from a possible cavity search, it shouldn't create any problem and you shouldn't be charged anything. Don't be surprised if you find yourself on the no fly list next time you head to the airport though.

You can try writing "100 baht" on the bar in permanent black marker and claim it is currency, but somehow I don't think anyone will be fooled. Those customs guys are pretty smart. They all got at least 2 months of learnin' from their uncle Cletus.

[jazzbo]

However, there is no duty on gold

The HTS 2009 7108.13.55 says that there is no tariff on 99.5 per cent (or higher %) gold rectangular bar...it says OTHER (96.5 per cent ?) is 4.1% with 682 pages of interpretations that I have not read.

[jazzbo]

Of course, for the movie lovers amongst us interested in moving gold, there is always The Lavender Hill Mob with Sir Alec Guinness

[hhgz]

"chomping at the bit"

The word is "CHAMPING". Unlike you, I don't see a bunch of farangs champing at the bit to export Thai gold bars to the US.

[OriginalPoster]

So, as the bars are not subject to currency restrictions, the question remains, if purchased outside the US, is duty levied, and if so at what rate?

Interesting thought since none ever claim jewelry.

I've declared jewelry before that I had bought in Thailand and was bringing back to the US. It never occurred to me that they might be exempt from the requirement that items purchased abroad be declared.

But to the original question - if it's a large amount of gold that you are talking about, do you really want to chance not declaring it? If you put it in the wrong category, most likely the customs agent will just correct the error for you. But if you don't declare it at all and they find your a million dollars worth of bullion in you luggage, then you're probably going to be in for a very bad day.

BTW, what happens if Thai customs finds the gold bullion on the way out of the Kingdom -- would they confiscate it?

Edited November 11, 2009 by OriginalPoster

[ryladie99]

US Customs regulations do NOT classify gold bars as currency, so the $US 10,000 rule does not apply

the USD 10k in/out declaration rule does not apply to currency only but to any monetary instrument!. if you think your gold bars are not monetary instruments go ahead and weep.

[/quote ]

Thanks for posting and I agree with you 100%. Please make sure you declare everythings when you enter US. You do not want to sent back or have to call a lawyer to bail you out. Right now the mood of this country is not so cool...there are so many problems in US. I urge you contacting the US Embassy and ask more questions before you travel..check the State Department web site as well..Good luck... ( just use google.com )

Nothing is free in US and you have to know the way around. Any money that you do not declare can interpret as drug income...

Remember Americans use Plastic money...my take.